Mafia 86 - mafia.gif - Game Over!
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armlx Most JDTay-like
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populartajo Alpaca Caliente
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1. I explained my vote on Sierra. Its not horrible. I explained that the things he suspected arent scumtells.Tarhalindur wrote:poptajo: Horrible Sierra vote + really bad vanilla claim + defending Stef w/ newbie card
2. My vanilla claim was because I was bored and I wanted to generate discussion. Null tell, IMO.
3. I didnt defend Stef. All I am asking is why are people so sure about scumtells. Yes, I know they are indicative of more probable alignment, but didnt I just say that this guy could be inexperienced?
My question is why CANT he be a newbie? Im not saying he is not scum. My point is why are people so sure of his allignment in page 6? This may be related with experience with scumtells and such but I just watched three games in a row where a dumb townie was lynched because he was full of scumtells.
FOS : Thar and Armlx.They should know this.Call me Tajo.
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12894
Coming summer 2010: Tajo's Starcraft Mafia.
Tajo's MagictheGathering Mafia-
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armlx Most JDTay-like
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No, it was 100% anti-town at the least, and I don't see any reason its also not scummy.2. My vanilla claim was because I was bored and I wanted to generate discussion. Null tell, IMO.
You said that, you didn't explain how they aren't.1. I explained my vote on Sierra. Its not horrible. I explained that the things he suspected arent scumtells.
And I said I would expect that kind of reaction even more from someone who is less experienced. Didn't you say earlier you weren't using the "too newbie to be scum" excuse?3. I didnt defend Stef. All I am asking is why are people so sure about scumtells. Yes, I know they are indicative of more probable alignment, but didnt I just say that this guy could be inexperienced?Away Wednesday the 24th through the 31st-
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populartajo Alpaca Caliente
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My question is why CANT he be a newbie? Im not saying he is not scum. My point is why are people so sure of his allignment in page 6? This may be related with experience with scumtells and such but I just watched three games in a row where a dumb townie was lynched because he was full of scumtells.Call me Tajo.
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12894
Coming summer 2010: Tajo's Starcraft Mafia.
Tajo's MagictheGathering Mafia-
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armlx Most JDTay-like
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skitzer Mafia Scum
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armlx: I'm agreeing with Cybele here about the vote, and if the voted feels this way, then I don't think it's anything to worry about.
Rush: If your speaking about this Mafia day, then you better get used to it, because I'd say we still have another 2-3 weeks left in the day. If you are talking about real-life days, those comments really aren't appreciated unless the cause you to have Limited Access.
armlx in 123: that comma on the end...seems like you had more to say.
Sierra: I'm not sure pressure on Stef is really the best thing. It seems like he'll just crack into more newbie antics, which really bugs me. Also, I don't think you needed to place a vote on Seraphim until the random voting was completely finished and we had something to suspect.
Ku_F: the fake sarcasm tags seem as though you are trying to cover all your bases. I'm not sure what to think of it though.
Stef: Sadly, people on this site are commonly insulted, and it is usually worse than "dumb". You'll learn to adapt.
ShadowGirl: In relation to the above, you know what your saying when you talk about avatars.
Tarhalindur: What is stopping you from FoSing Empking? His vote had way less reason than populartajo did.
armlx in 172: So wouldn't it make more sense to go after Stef and then if he turns up scum, then look at populartajo? Or are you just noting this for later?
The most convincing case I'm seeing is populartajo, even without the defending of Stef being calculated into it. It's not very powerful, and I could also see Ku_F as suspicious from what little she has posted.-
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armlx Most JDTay-like
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Noting for later. See where my vote still isarmlx in 172: So wouldn't it make more sense to go after Stef and then if he turns up scum, then look at populartajo? Or are you just noting this for later?
No, just a typo.armlx in 123: that comma on the end...seems like you had more to say.
Who is "the" voted referring to? CKD or Cybele? If the former, I'm pretty sure he agrees with me....armlx: I'm agreeing with Cybele here about the vote, and if the voted feels this way, then I don't think it's anything to worry about.Away Wednesday the 24th through the 31st-
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skitzer Mafia Scum
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armlx Most JDTay-like
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skitzer Mafia Scum
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Tarhalindur Mod Screw
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Perhaps I misspoke when I referred to your vote on Sierra as horrible. The more appropriate phrasing would be "scummy as all hell", and this is BECAUSE of the explanation you provided (which, as far as I can tell, fundamentally amounted to "I want to hop on to this bandwagon".populartajo wrote:
1. I explained my vote on Sierra. Its not horrible. I explained that the things he suspected arent scumtells.Tarhalindur wrote:poptajo: Horrible Sierra vote + really bad vanilla claim + defending Stef w/ newbie card
Just because you are bored does not mean you should do things that are detrimental to the town. Next question?2. My vanilla claim was because I was bored and I wanted to generate discussion. Null tell, IMO.
OBJECTION! Your asking why people were so sure about scumtells IS defending Stef by using the newbie card (you are trying to blunt other players' attacks on Stef). Your attempt to spin/disguise it otherwise is noteworthy.3. I didnt defend Stef. All I am asking is why are people so sure about scumtells. Yes, I know they are indicative of more probable alignment, but didnt I just say that this guy could be inexperienced?
Also, just because someone is a newb doesn't mean that I am going to refrain from calling them out when they act like scum.
First: as previously noted, just because someone is new doesn't mean we should ignore them when they act like scum.My question is why CANT he be a newbie? Im not saying he is not scum. My point is why are people so sure of his allignment in page 6? This may be related with experience with scumtells and such but I just watched three games in a row where a dumb townie was lynched because he was full of scumtells.
FOS : Thar and Armlx.They should know this.
Second: I can't be sure about Stef's alignment. The fact remains that Stef is, with the information currently available, one of the players I think is MOST LIKELY to be scum - which is exactly the criterion I use to pressure/FoS/vote in a Mafia game.
Third: Your attempt to inject WIFOM into scumtells is noted. As for your anecdote: If townies are getting lynched for committing lots of scumtells, then that means that townies are getting lynchedFOR BEING SCUMMY. The solution to this problem is not to excuse players who commit scumtells - the solution is to get townies to STOP MAKING SCUMTELLS.
Now, thank you for making it very clear where the scum in populartajo/Sierra is.
Vote: populartajoUser out of ambit.
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Tarhalindur Mod Screw
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Two closely related factors: 1) there are bigger fish to fry (read: poptajo), and 2) at the moment I'm only FoS'ing players who I am likely to vote in the near future (Empking is nowhere near as scummy as tajo or Stef are right now, IMO.)skitzer wrote:<snip>
Tarhalindur: What is stopping you from FoSing Empking? His vote had way less reason than populartajo did.
<snip>
Now, skitzer: Who do you think is most likely to be scum at this time, and why? (Please note that "most convincing case I'm seeing" doesn't cut it for me - I want to see you make your own case here.)User out of ambit.
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Haschel Cedricson Mr. Know It All
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skitzer Mafia Scum
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massive Mafia Scum
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My favorite part came when tajo defended against his random out-of-the-blue role claim by informing us that it was actually a null tell. I wish I had that "these aren't the droids you're looking for" power. Or, at least, if I was tajo, I'd wish I had one that worked.
vote populartajo"1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
"unvote mlaker; vote massive; It's like MeMe/mneme and Corsato/Cadmium" - Dragon Phoenix, Newbie 38
PLEASE NOTE: I actively avoid being online on weekends! Don't replace me just because of this!-
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Rush Townie
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curiouskarmadog This Space for Rant
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curiouskarmadog This Space for Rant
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armlx Most JDTay-like
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ShadowGirl Mafia Scum
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Unvote.Since my vote on Seraphim was placed during the random vote stage and we are past that now.
QFT. If he's town and playing scummy, then we should call him on it. We learn from our mistakes, and if we just let it slide he's never going to learn.armlx wrote:He can be a newbie. He can also be newbie scum.
@Skitzer: Ha ha, yes indeed. Though, I suppose if he's not used to that sort of thing that it isn't that strange for him to be a tad hostile.
Anyway, I'm taking Tajo's 'vanilla claim' and Seraphim not wanting to participate in random voting as null tells, as is Stef's joking statement of wanting to be lynched or a very weak scumtell.
Still, I find Tajo defending him rather odd and slightly scummy.-
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armlx Most JDTay-like
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populartajo Alpaca Caliente
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- Location: Arequipa, Peru Profession: Scumhunter
Regarding my vanilla claim.
This isnt WIFOM. Its common sense. If I were scum, why would I bring unnecessary attention to myself with that claim? I WAS BORED. I hate the random stage. I wanted discussion. Yes, its antitown but it doesnt suggest allignment in the context it was used : random stage. Thats why its null.
I dont have problems when people attack me but please, think before you post.
Regarding Stef's case.
The only thing Im saying is that since he's a newbie then he's more prone to make scumtells. I NEVER SAID HE WASNT SCUM. What worries me is that some experienced players think that scumtells are infalible and that they are the ultimate truth and that if I dont agree with them that makes me OBVIOUS scum.
This is the logic used : Stef could be scum, Tajo says he could be a newbie, then Tajo is his scumpartner. WTF??!!
I even said that its like the third time that I see "experienced ones" lynching a newbie townie for being a bag of scumtells. Stef could be scum but ITS TOO EARLY to be so sure about that.
Thar and Armlx are taking this argument further than Id like.
Now look for a better target. Ill analyse reactions later. Kthxbay.Call me Tajo.
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12894
Coming summer 2010: Tajo's Starcraft Mafia.
Tajo's MagictheGathering Mafia-
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ShadowGirl Mafia Scum
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armlx Most JDTay-like
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Orly?This isnt WIFOM.
I thought so...If I were scum, why would I bring unnecessary attention to myself with that claim?
That's kinda the issue here with your claim....think before you post.
They still are scum tells, and you can't assume everything is a newbie slip.The only thing Im saying is that since he's a newbie then he's more prone to make scumtells.
Fixed.This is the logic used : Stef could be scum, Tajo sayshe could be a newbiehe isn't scummy and its just newbie behavior, then Tajo is his scumpartner. WTF??!!
I'm interested what makes this wagon so different from a normal page 6 wagon, where you call someone scum and vote on it.Stef could be scum but ITS TOO EARLY to be so sure about that.
How far would you want to take it? Only to the point where you say something, then no one can respond?Thar and Armlx are taking this argument further than Id like.
Uhhh.... yeah...... about that......Now look for a better target.Away Wednesday the 24th through the 31st-
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Sierra Goon
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To answer some questions directed at me:
In short: yes and yes.TheSweatpantsNinja wrote:
So, its sort of a lurking scumtell, you're saying? Do you find lurkers are more often scum?sierra wrote: By not participating in the random voting phase you are denying other players from getting any kind of read on you. Just because someone doesn't like that stage of the game, doesn't mean he should be allowed to get off not participating in it.
Checking back, there are actually several others who didn't vote or only posted once in the random voting stage. Seraphim got my vote, because he happened to be the one who caught my eye and because he gave a reason for not contributing that I didn't agree with.sekinj wrote:
I didn't place a random vote... why isn't that suspicious?sierra wrote: By not participating in the random voting phase you are denying other players from getting any kind of read on you. Just because someone doesn't like that stage of the game, doesn't mean he should be allowed to get off not participating in it.
I see how you could interpret it as such. The reason for me supporting the pressure on Stef but voting and FOSsing other players, was because I don't think it's a good idea to focus the entirety of the town's attention on one person. At that moment, the lead on Stef was the only lead that was being pursued, while I found Seraphim and Tajo also deserved some of that attention. That's why I didn't vote Stef.Tarhalindur wrote:1) Please phrase your questions better. It's not so much that I don't like your sentence as that I find said sentence very, very scummy.
2) What is so scummy about your sentence? That would be your approval of the Stef wagon without actually placing a vote or FoS on him. It gave me the strong impression that you were trying to push along a wagon without actually committing to said wagon, which I generally find to be a sign of scum who either don't want to be tied to a bad wagon or scum who don't want to draw the attention of a well-known town player.
I notice that Stef's posting doesn't look newbish at all. Stef, if you don't mind me asking: how much experience do you have with mafia on other forums?
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