Invitational 10: 2005-2006. Game over! before 624

[elvis_knits]

Also, talk about giving someone a free pass.

This is MBL we're talking about. He's playing a perfect townie game.

I'd have to disagree.

What do you make of MBL's convenient chopping of people's quotes?

[Patrick]

You are being underhanded here. She make it clear in the first post that her pressure on dgb was there because she wasn't being productive. Its clear then that it was dgbs analysis that convinced ether to vote elvis what I imagine her post meant however was that dgb didn't make ether suspect elvis more then dgb but dgb less then elivis.

DGB's analysis would be the obvious thing to spring to my mind as well, except she said in that post that it wasn't influenced by that, and the addition of the word "anyway" reinforces that in my mind. Your interpretation is possible (although I don't get why you needed to offer it before she even said anything). I dislike the suggestion that I'm being underhanded; even if your interpretation is correct, I don't see how that could work as any kind of deliberate trickery on my part.

I'll say more on other recent stuff tomorrow.

[DrippingGoofball]

Alright. chamber.

chamber starts with votes for bluesoul and patrick, none of which seem to be part of the elvis axis of evil. Then chatters with MBL and Patrick, blah blah, votes bluesoul again.

Then, elvis pokes chamber a little too much, and chamber reacts: "The amount of explanation I've been giving this game is already over the top, I don't feel like giving any more. In short figure it out for yourself, and/or vote me. Either way its up to you." I sense genuine exasperation through the fog of the wording.

chamber is torn, insecure, unsure, hesitant, wavering... here's another one that tries very hard to be neither hot, not cold. He uses words like "perceive" and "feel" a lot. Also, wimpy lowercase "I".

Nothing here jumps at me as being overly scummy here. But I will make an effort to NOTICE chamber in the future. Maybe I should drink real coffee instead of decaf.

[DrippingGoofball]

What do you make of MBL's convenient chopping of people's quotes?

I do that all the time myself for the sake of brevity and increasing the chances that people will actually read the quote. If I remove something I'll usually replace with with the [...] convention. I don't see that as scummy, sorry. If you find anything else scummy about MBL, I'm all ears, though.

[DrippingGoofball]

PJ:

Sarcastro wrote "PJ, please stop trying to blind us with logic."

Elvis votes me for the same stupid reason as PJ, starting a fresh wagon on a player that will be easier to lynch than MBL, which was Sarcastro's initial call.

In post 81 PJ was successful in putting Ether on the defensive.

As an aside, IH wrote: "PJ- After all of those large posts I also think it's slightly strange that you instantly switch your vote to DGB for her buttering three people up. Was your vote just not that deep (as I felt it was implied), or do you consider that a much larger scumtell than what you had found?" Which I find to be a townie reaction to PJ's actions.

Elvis is VERY defensive throughout with suggestions that she might be connected with PJ.

This is what elvis says about PJ: "I don't have a problem with him. I haven't played with him in a long time, so there I'm not really going on meta at all. I just haven't read any of his posts and thought it was BS, or thought he was trying to be manipulative."

But now, THIS is the post that nails the whole PJ contribution better than I ever could:
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 32#1181932

Here, PJ analyses 3 players. IH (the lurker), OGML and Sarc, two that keep ignoring elvis.

Methinks PJ is another candidate for the axis of evil.

[DrippingGoofball]

I don't think I did Patrick yet. He doesn't strike me as urgently scummy, but I will take a close look, I might have missed something. His pursuing of elvis re-assures me. But I shouldn't let that blind me.

[bluesoul]

This is MBL we're talking about. He's playing a perfect townie game.

I disagree and I think he would too.

Fake edit: Didn't see page 18, glad elvis agrees with me on this.

[MrBuddyLee]

bluesoul, you've seemed to support a DGB lynch for weeks now, and in fact really wanted to hurry it along. Can you please list your specific reasons for wanting her dead instead of elvis or Ether?

[bluesoul]

I'm going to bed, tomorrow's going to be about as bad as it gets at work; I probably won't be able to give a full explanation until Wednesday but suffice it to say that DGB's play has been consistently scummy, Ether's been pretty ambivalent and elvis has only recently started appearing scummy, though not to the extent of DGB.

I want to hurry it along because we could be deadlined at any time; however, the activity is much better than it's been before. I still think we could talk until we're blue in the face and not get a damn thing done with this list of players so yes I was being a bit more forceful in pursuit of a lynch just to progress the game, and I think it's fair to say that that was no more than a day or two off too.

I'm a bit alarmed at the speed of Elvis's wagon, votes were placed in posts 401, 402, and 404 to go from 1 to 4. Granted, MBL was already starting to push that way, and one of them is DGB. Patrick's jumps out at me moreso than Ether's because Ether already admitted she was on the DGB wagon because it was more protown than fighting it. Patrick's vote occurred with precious little explanation behind it. That would be the first possibility of a pairing I've contemplated thus far in the game (DGB-Patrick). For the record, I do

not

go actively looking for scum partners on Day One. Day 2 all bets are off though.

I need more time to read elvis's posts before committing a vote, I don't know how much I like DGB's attempts to tie every player in the game to e_k but what the hell, it's content.

Goodnight. Back Wednesday.

[DrippingGoofball]

Are we reading the same game? Patrick's is among the players calling out of elvis' scummy actions the most. He's practically been after her all game... why would he need an explanation now? Just read his posts, it's all there.

You may not like how I tie in elvis with other players, but what jumps at me is how some players are after her quite aggressively (Patrick and MBL) but others completely ignore the issues that the two are bringing up. It's unusual, I noticed it, I have to include the data in my calculations.

[elvis_knits]

What do you make of MBL's convenient chopping of people's quotes?

I do that all the time myself for the sake of brevity and increasing the chances that people will actually read the quote. If I remove something I'll usually replace with with the [...] convention. I don't see that as scummy, sorry. If you find anything else scummy about MBL, I'm all ears, though.

You're missing the point. It's not that he chopped quotes to make it easier to read. He chopped quotes, taking out the most important part of the quote, and misunderstood what people were saying in a way that he could not have misunderstood had he quoted everything. It was very convenient.

[MrBuddyLee]

You're grasping at straws, elvis. Perhaps because I'm the driving force behind your wagon and you really need to discredit me before anyone else hops on?

Here's my question after "snipping" Patrick:

Is this over the top or for real, Patrick? What exactly has never failed you before?

I wanted a clarification from him--he was talking about his gut never failing him, which sounded like a pretty big stretch to me. He replied that it was specifically his gut on Ether, not his gut in general, that had never failed him.

So how exactly is asking that kind of question a brilliant scum strategy on my part? Oh gee, I almost had him there...

[elvis_knits]

I don't see how you're the driving force behind my wagon. DGB's regurgitated case got my wagon going, not you. I really don't think the consensus in this game is "MBL is townie town town" for anyone but DGB.

Also, please see the way you snipped bluesoul to misunderstand him.

[Patrick]

Elvis, I don't think you answered the main question. What do you think MBL's scummy motive was behind doing that? I still don't get why he'd deliberately misunderstand what bluesoul was saying.

[MrBuddyLee]

Elvis, DGB said I was townie town town because I am. And she smells it. (Or knows it.) Unfortunately, when I'm scum, I'm also something similar but not identical to townie town town. And that's what she was trying to get across--not that she thinks I'm town, but that she thinks I'd appear town regardless.

She's actually given a ton of opinions on people in the past week. None of which you've commented on. Instead, you attack people for not finding her inherently scummy:

It just seems like you are assuming she is town, and trying to bring her round to being a more helpful townie. Which is an odd stance to take on someone I deem scummy.

That's a sketch post by you.. but I can't tell whether it feels sketch cause you know DGB is town and are pissed that I'm leaning that way, or if you know DGB is scum and you're setting me up to look bad if she gets lynched, or if you're actually an innocent who finds DGB irrevocably scummy and you can't fathom that anyone else could be hoodwinked and trying to make her into a better townie.

For the record, I strongly believe you're scum, and I'm still up in the air about your relationship to DGB. You've avoided analyzing her recent posts, which is something that would help us all figure you out.

[MrBuddyLee]

Elias camp is over in 2.5 weeks. While I am really grumbling and upset by the situation, I think the best plan, as a mod, is to wait for him to be finished with it, provided he promises to step up his production on the weekends.

I don't think wasting one of our replacements on a slot which will become fully productive in 2.5 weeks is in our best interests

I think Elias and IH deserve massive wedgies. I nominate DGB to administer.

[Patrick]

I'm a bit alarmed at the speed of Elvis's wagon, votes were placed in posts 401, 402, and 404 to go from 1 to 4. Granted, MBL was already starting to push that way, and one of them is DGB. Patrick's jumps out at me moreso than Ether's because Ether already admitted she was on the DGB wagon because it was more protown than fighting it. Patrick's vote occurred with precious little explanation behind it. That would be the first possibility of a pairing I've contemplated thus far in the game (DGB-Patrick). For the record, I do not go actively looking for scum partners on Day One. Day 2 all bets are off though.

For reasoning as to why I find elvis scummy, I'd refer you to DGB's last post, which refers to my posts throughout the game. If you're questioning the specific timing of the switch, I did it because DBG came back and at least seems to be making an effort to analyse the game. I'm still leery of the claim situation, but don't feel right voting DBG over elvis at this point. I'd like you to give a little more detail as to what you find scummy about elvis's recent posts, because your suspicion of her seems to have occurred with precious little explanation behind it

[MrBuddyLee]

bluesoul's also promised to tell us why he suspects DGB, beyond "she's acted scummy all game".

[Sarcastro]

Why haven't we killed DGB yet?

[MrBuddyLee]

For starters:

Players Sarc hasn't commented on alignment-wise

at all

:
Ether, Patrick, elvis(!!!), elias, IH, PJ, pablito, chamber

Players Sarc's listed as somewhat scummy:
MBL, bluesoul (not really), OGML

Players Sarc's listed as obvscum but not given any reasons

at all

:
DGB

The schtick is old. Or you're really lazy scum. Fortunately for you there are plenty of lazy players to conceal yourself amongst. (IH, OGML, Ether, elias).

Sarc, please give us your top and bottom three, with some reasoning. Also, what did you think of DGB's 7 suspicions posts?

Til then, this day's not ready to go anywhere. Thanks.

[Sarcastro]

MBL, the problem is that I haven't even read the last two weeks or so of the game and I'm feeling too sick of mafia to do so right now, so I'm simply basing my suspicion on the memory that I had a good reason for suspecting DGB. I'm currently contemplating simply asking for replacement in both of my games, but I'm not sure that's the right course of action. To be clear, it has nothing to do with my alignment.

[MrBuddyLee]

Understood. Guess it's the same across the board--PJ, OGML, IH, elias, Sarc. This is my only game and I've only been in one game at a time all this year, so I don't feel the summer burnout that a lot of you feel.

Hopefully things will pick up, and we won't be stuck lynching only the people who talk.

[DrippingGoofball]

[pablito]

DGB, where did I ever say that I agreed with your analysis on e_k? Just because I unvote you, how am I obligated now to go against e_k? I'm not. And I'm still too lazy to read up on e_k at the moment because I have to pack up for my week long trip.

I must disagree with elvis that the environment of the game has changed. I think she feels so because it comes from her viewpoint, but I think if someone is afraid of participating, that's their own damn fault. However,

e_k

, if you feel that this is the case, then who is the most responsible for creating such an environment?

Patrick, did my last answer suffice or did you want more extrapolation. Just want to check in with you about that since I failed to answer you right away last time.

[DrippingGoofball]

DGB, where did I ever say that I agreed with your analysis on e_k?

Uh? I said that???