Micro 407: Jurassic Park Mafia - Game Over

[Scripten]

Hood doesn't have daytalk. She allegedly watched me both nights because I was the only claimed PR.

[Scripten]

So scum!Pine makes a lot of sense considering that claim.

[Scripten]

Not to mention that watcher/tracker are parallel roles, so one of them makes a ton of sense as a fakeclaim.

[Scripten]

Why would scum keep Scripten alive without the knowledge of their being a watcher?

Probably thought there were bigger fish than a neighborizer? Beats me.

[Scripten]

Scripten, if fferyllt had a watcher fakeclaim (which is a very powerful claim), wouldn't it make sense to keep you alive so she'd have an excuse as to why she had no results?

Beck was also part of the hood and couldn't add more people to it.

[Scripten]

I don't see how that's relevant. Point is just that the fact that fferyllt's been watching you and scum just happened to tiptoe around killing you seems a bit convenient.

Everyone knew that Beck and I were in the hood. They also knew that I have the neighborizer power. So why Beck and not the guy with the ability to grow the hood?

[Scripten]

Do you think scum had any reason to think that you'd be able to neighborize again?

I was very surprised to find I'd been neighborized last night.

Is it usually a 1-shot role? I wasn't aware of that.

[Scripten]

Fferyllt:

Who would you like to lynch the most atm?

[Scripten]

Scripten: Can you target players who are already in the neighbourhood? Can you self target?

If scum decide to kill me tonight, I have a plan that might work. Flip a coin between targeting me and fferyllt, and have Pine track you. If he gets it wrong, he's scum.

I have no idea if I can target players in the hood or myself. Also, I'm not too sure about lynching BBT right now. Either Fferyllt or Pine is scum, but not both. BBT seems a lot like scum to me, but I'm also not discounting that you are part of the scumteam, Mathdino. From my standpoint, it could be any of the following:

{Pine, BBT} - Pine pushes for a BBT lynch, but doesn't expect two townies to jump on his claim. Lets his townie supporter get lynched for a scum win.

{Pine, Mathdino} - Pine and Mathdino make a really blatant attempt to get town!BBT lynched. Risky, but Pine has a fakeclaim to use.

{Pine, Fferyllt} - Both scum fakeclaim and drive to have town!BBT lynched via town "certainty."

{Fferyllt, BBT/Mathdino} - Fferyllt fakeclaims in the hood, then kills Beck because she expects me to take her claims at face value. Partner isn't particularly discernable in this case for me.

[Scripten]

You're still assuming we lynch BBT today, Math. I'm not sure I like that.

I also am becoming more and more unhappy with being buddied this hard.

[Scripten]

This one is predicated on you being the only PR in the game. Aside from knowing you're wrong because I can read my role PM, it's hard to see why you'd advance a case that requires you to be the only town PR.

If you're just spinning paranoid wheels, I get that. But try to keep it in the realm of what makes sense set-up wise.

I'm not very happy with that case, for sure. I'd like to think you're town. But I also did not die last night. It's WIFOM to an extent, but it worries me.

Actually, wait, you're right, Mathdino. If Pine is town, then the scumteam is Fferyllt/BBT. It HAS to be, since Pine would have that guilty. Scum!Pine is the tough nut to crack.

Buddying as in thinking you're town, or trying to appeal to you? The former I already explained: I want to believe this game is not terrible. The latter, well, yeah I'm assuming we lynch BBT because it's over if we don't. No harm in planning tomorrow and I kind of need you for the tracker plan.

A Pine/Mathdino scumteam is reasonable, though.


Some thoughts...

If Mathdino is town, then BBT is scum, and vice versa. They must be unaligned, due to the fakeclaims requiring scum in {Pine, Fferyllt}
If Pine is town, the scumteam is undeniably Fferyllt/BBT.

[Scripten]

I noticed, Mathdino.

Fferyllt:

What are you trying to accomplish with this ninja discussion. There's no scum ninja.

[Scripten]

I'm highly bothered by Fferyllt's tactics right now, considering she knows why I didn't die last night. This does not smell like town-motivated scumhunting to me.

Fferyllt:

I'm not actually a bulletproof Neighborizer. I lied. Apologies to you and beck, since I dislike doing so, but it was necessary.

Now, let us all collectively lose our minds.

[Scripten]

To clarify, I am a Neighborizer. I am not, however, bulletproof.

[Scripten]

There was no way for me to ensure that I did not have scum in my hood. I used my claim to protect myself. With Beck, it wasn't necessary. I'm starting to wonder about last night, though.

There're three possible scumteams, from my POV:

Pine/Mathdino
Pine/BBT
Fferyllt/BBT

PEDIT: Yeah, what Mathdino said. God I hate responsibility.

Also, NO TOWNIE VOTES PLS. Scum can easily jump on a wagon without a second thought.

I have to go, but I don't want to come back to a town loss.

[Scripten]

Pine and BBT should really show up shortly to help wade through all this. I want to see more than just 3/5's of the remaining players' thoughts.

[Scripten]

Sorry, been in classes all morning, so I've been distracted from the game.

Here's a summary of what happened last night:

- Fferyllt appears. She says that she considers the game PoE and that she considers BBT town and wants to make as sure as she can that she is right. She says that she considers Beck to be town. She speculates a weak scum team and no protective roles. (Due to my being allegedly BP.)

- I speculate that I am the only PR and that I am scumreading Pine with BBT or Mathdino as his partner.

- Ffferyllt claims watcher, having watched me on N1 and that she had actioned to watch me N2.

- Beck mentions that watcher and BP are a strange combo. He doesn't have any real reasons besides gut. (Beck, if you're reading this, good call on that. )

- We all three discuss this a little.

- Fferyllt says that scum may have a strongman to counter. She also says that she didn't realize that Beck would still have hood access and that she would have kept quiet about her role if she had known two players were in the hood. She says that if she is dead tomorrow (today) then one of us is scum.

It's kind of hard to get much of a read from all this. It's a little suspicious, BUT that may just be subconscious paranoia that I can't quite shake.

[Scripten]

Of course, if Pine is scum and BBT is not, we will have already lost the game. Even better, the only scumteam possible with that configuration would be Pine/Mathdino.

[Scripten]

Mostly it was that your main goal was to cement your town read of BBT. You've seemed slightly protective of him, which is minor, but at this point in the game, I'm at my most paranoid.

[Scripten]

That makes sense. It's just also very concerning that BBT is the only possible partner you could have as scum. Either you or Pine is scum for sure, and BBT is guilty if Pine is town, like I've said before.

So Pine's whole guilty claim on BBT is supah serious for me.

[Scripten]

Are you still townreading BBT now that Grib has flipped town?

[Scripten]

Pine:

If you're town, now is the time to be active. I am displeased that the town decided to go apathetic at this point in the game. Come on, things are tense and exciting! Everyone should be joining in.

[Scripten]

I don't see a BP claim from Scripten?

In a 9-player game, two weak investigators is just too much Town power, though I suppose a full Ninja could mitigate it by making scum effectively immune until Ninja is eliminated. Hmm. A question for D4, after BBT flips. I'm willing to lower suspicion of ffery from 99.9% to 90%, given that remote possibility

I fakeclaimed BP in my hood. It is possible that I am alive only because of this, but that would require Fferyllt to be scum.

There's no ninja. There's me, a Neighborizer, and either you or Fferyllt as Tracker/Watcher respectively. That's the only setup that makes any sense.

BBT is scum if Fferyllt is scum. He's 50% likely to be scum if you are scum. Your play is currently anti-town and you're not paying much attention to this game right now. You seem convinced that BBT will flip, so I'm beginning to hedge toward a Pine/Mathdino scumteam. There has been new information since you "made your case" so I would enjoy it if you would make an attempt to play in a pro-town manner.

Alternatively, keep playing as you are if you are scum and I'll be glad to see you lynched.

or town loses if I'm wrong and you're hammered. I feel like you wouldn't be pushing me for that as town.

Either you or Pine is scum. Therefore, I see no problem with you having your votes on one another, as long as no one else is voting. Frankly, though, we don't really need votes on anyone right now and I'd appreciate people stop pushing others to vote in LyLo with discussion happening.

__________________________________________________________________

Also, just had another thought. Pine and BBT are crossvoting, but nobody has yet quickhammered. That means that at least one of those two is not town. If they were both town, scum would have quickhammered and won the game. Maddeningly, this doesn't rule out any of the three possible scumteams, (scum crossvoting in LyLo isn't unheard of) but it is a thought to consider nonetheless.

Current Desired Lynches

Pine: BBT
Mathdino: BBT
BBT: Pine
Fferyllt: Pine

[Scripten]

I'm trying to nail scum instead of letting you antagonizing me into voting, so the strong language is unnecessary. Your methods are definitely making me want to vote you, but I'm holding back because you might just be trying to strongarm me because that's your town play. Tempted to meta you. We have time before deadline and I don't feel like losing.

[Scripten]

You won't find meta. I've never been in the position of having a guilty in LYLO, much less two effective guilties. It's incredibly frustrating

Try to see it from my point of view, then. Currently, I have a confirmed guilty on one of two players and I have to essentially guess which one.

Also, plenty easy enough to search your posts to see how you play as town.

[Scripten]

Alright, I'm relatively convinced that BBT is scum.

I'm going to sleep on this and come back in once BBT and the other players have had time to weigh in. I'll most likely be voting tomorrow. If there's no discussion, I'll be assuming that a BBT lynch is copacetic with the town.

[Scripten]

Actually, Fferyllt does not get notified of my actions in the hood. If nobody posts, nobody knows.

[Scripten]

Ah, damn, I was wrong. Nevermind that, then.

[Scripten]

Hey, no problem, BBT. Take your time. We have days until the deadline.

[Scripten]

Scripten, can you PM the mod asking the questions I just asked? Want to make the tracker test optimal just in case you end up not dying.

I'm not sure if I'm going to get an answer in PM if she doesn't want to tell us.

[Scripten]

This is part of what I was talking about. You know this game is over after I'm lynched, the discussions you're trying to engage in are simply for town-cred. Which doesn't make sense, because, you know, why would you let scum know exactly what you're thinking and how you're planning on proceeding the following day?

The game is basically solved after today. Either I hammer scum and we know the scumteam come tomorrow, or I hammer town and we lose immediately. Unless you are

significantly

better at being scum than I have ever seen the likes of, you are not aligned with Pine.

So right now the scumteams are either Pine/Mathdino or Fferyllt/BBT.

Fferyllt:

You said something along the lines of having kept quiet if you had known Beck was in the hood. You said you were townreading him but that two players knowing your role would have been undesirable. Can you go into that a bit more? Why would you have been bothered by two players you are townreading knowing your role in a private setting?

[Scripten]

You're also unable to see Pine/BBT?

How come?

BBT's interaction with Pine during LyLo does not feel like scum-scum, unless they are the bravest scum I've ever seen in my time playing mafia.

[Scripten]

I never bus if I can help it. I feel it's anti-wincon

Can you provide proof of this? Just a scum game or two of yours will suffice.

BBT:

Almost forgot that you'd asked about my meta read on Pine. I found his play to be fairly erratic, as he'd said. Didn't find anything that really supported my argument.

[Scripten]

Ugh, tapped submit before my thought was done. We can discuss the topic post game, when you don't have reason to suspect that I might be lying

I don't normally bus, either, so it's fine.

What I was more interested in was the way you think as scum. Found something interesting in your self-meta. You mentioned something along the lines of "ignoring your scumbuddies is good scum play, because people don't look for links that aren't there." So on a hunch I went through and ISO'd you, looking for explicit mentions or interactions with Mathdino.

I found all of MAYBE two.

During my journey, I came back across this:

Scripten again

: BBTs move away from Grib makes perfect sense, when you consider that BBT is a relatively new player. He's either Grib's scumbuddy trying to bail out his mate, or he's an investigative role with an inno. Guess what? He hasn't defended Grib enough for it to be the latter. Get on board

That REALLY bugs me. Especially in light of a few conversations of yours that I read dealing with Tracker fakeclaims.

[Scripten]

Mathdino, if you're town, you really shouldn't have your vote on anyone. Scum!BBT will just be waiting for Pine to post, then they will quickhammer within seconds on one another.

You should remove your vote.

[Scripten]

If you're able to, I'd recommend doing everything you can to unvote ASAP if you see Pine lay down a vote on Fferyllt. Refresh the page every minute or so if you must. It's possible that I'm wrong about Pine/BBT.

[Scripten]

Mathdino:

I recently meta'd you. Have you ever played scum before this game?

[Scripten]

Fferyllt, something came up while I was doing meta on you. You said that, for one of your scum games, you won because a player misread your fatalistic mindset as a towntell when it was really a scumtell. Considering you've reused that wording here a few times, I'm a little curious about that.

[Scripten]

What?

What the hell just happened?

O.o

I need a minute. Jesus. I just went to wash some clothes. One sec.

[Scripten]

Okay, so Pine is 100% scum. Scumbuddy #2 is down to Mathdino or BBT.

Glad to know we can clear Fferyllt.

I really want to lynch Pine today, in that case. Math, can you vote Pine so we can end today?

[Scripten]

Math, can you vote Pine so we can end today?

Pine can't hammer if he isn't at L-1.

[Scripten]

Your reaction test with Fferyllt gave me town-vibes, especially considering that you were okay with confirming Pine as scum. I also was exaggerating a bit to try to get some reactions from a positive-reinforcement reaction test with BBT. (His scum game is better than his town game, by his own meter.)

I'm pretty sure I'm going to die tonight, since the scumteam now know I'm not BP. I'd rather lynch confirmed scum and figure my thoughts out overnight. There's also Fferyllt's ability and the hood to consider. It will be a difficult day for scum tomorrow.

[Scripten]

Hm...

You know, I'm actually kind of alright with a BBT lynch again in that case. Fferyllt, what's your opinion on all this?

[Scripten]

Fferyllt, what's your opinion on all this?

By all this, I actually mean BBT getting lynched. Because I like to be overly general, apparently.

[Scripten]

Sounds good to me.

If the scumteam has not responded by tomorrow or so, I'll offer to hammer again. Hopefully we get some measure of a response.

[Scripten]

Wtf? Mathdino, that's not how that works.

Obviously, scum has been really, really cautious around reaction tests. Also, the "would have hammered Pine" from D2 need to be discarded, we weren't at LYLO there

No, Fferyllt refused to hammer you when you were at L-1 last page. There's absolutely no way that scum!Fferyllt would not have lynched town!Pine in that situation.

[Scripten]

I mean, shit, your proposal is that I killed Beck, who was rabid for BBT, then came out with a guilty on him, all while bussing him? That's just really, really bad scumplay

You had no way of knowing that Fferyllt had claimed in the hood. Even if BBT is your partner, a "true" guilty claim that leads to his lynch would confirm you as town come Day 4, and you could have easily staked your claim as the real town PR and won if Fferyllt had claimed after you in the thread, since you would have an accurate guilty on mafia.

[Scripten]

BBT-Mathdino makes no fecking sense.

We do not have a neighborizer/watcher/tracker town team, especially if you were able to get a guilty on BBT. A Ninja, like Fferyllt said, would be the most reasonable scum role to balance this game. It would make absolutely no sense for the scumteam NOT to send their Ninja every night until they were lynched.

Pine is scum. Either Mathdino or BBT is scumbuddy. Pine has been trying to bus/fakebus both of them to cover which is his actual scumbuddy.

P-Edit: The only reason your guilty claim didn't work was because Fferyllt had claimed in the hood. If she'd claimed in-thread, we could have just lynched BBT, proven your "guilty" and gone on to lose LyLo by lynching the "fakeclaimed" watcher Fferyllt. Your actions are perfectly consistent with scum.

[Scripten]

Or we have a Neighborizer and a Watcher, which would make perfect sense with a vanilla scumteam.

[Scripten]

BBT:

You're active in our other game. Why aren't you participating here? I know Pine is scum, but you should be helping us figure out if you or Mathdino is his scumbuddy.

[Scripten]

VOTE: Pine

I'm ready for the day to end, but I'm curious to see who hammers when it's not me.

[Scripten]

Someone's going to hammer, and I'd like to see who it is. Pine doesn't seem likely to, at this juncture.

If scum no-kill, then we're in MyLo and not LyLo. Even if they don't, at least we will have a little more information going into LyLo about you and BBT.

[Scripten]

Looking purely at multiday behaviors, the stuff that concerns me about scripten come down to "why is he alive?"

This right here is why I was so suspicious of you, Fferyllt. With Beck's townflip, I just couldn't see a reason for scum to have not killed me. I hinted a few times in thread that I was BP, but it was more for consistency than to protect myself outside the hood.

[Scripten]

I had no way to know if I was the only power role in the game nor whether I had recruited scum or not. I apologize for the misinformation, but I wasn't wholly ready to just claim and be killed immediately thereafter.

[Scripten]

Gorram it, if this is what it's going to take to end this goddamn day...

UNVOTE: Mathdino

Congrats. GG guys. Goodnight.

[Scripten]

Because unvoting me after not voting me while I'm at L-3 with 0 votes will end the day.

Ssh.

I'm hoping I can end the day by making it look like I'm randomly throwing my vote around while not actually doing so.

[Scripten]

Lynching Pine doesnt move us forward, onlt kills a townie

Weren't you saying that scum might no-kill?

Today has just been a big ball of WIFOM. Ugh.

[Scripten]

Pine, can you just hammer yourself so we can all get a good night's sleep? I don't think we're getting anything else out of this discussion.

[Scripten]

Not scum

I just don't get it. Who are you thinking you'll be fooling? We've completely and utterly proved that you're scum. There are no scumteams that make any sense without you in them. I guess you can try to provide WIFOM about your scumbuddy? Is just weird. And tiring.

Are you just trying to outlast us?

Mathdino:

I do apologize. I'm just so tired of this day. I want something new in my life. Something new and Jurassic. Like Day 4. -_-

[Scripten]

And I'm just not sure enough between you and BBT to want to vote you yet. Hood talks and flips will be useful regardless. Maybe they'll NK me so I won't have to be in LyLo racking my brain trying to decide.

[Scripten]

Why's Mathdino cut out of the options again, Pine?

[Scripten]

If Mathdino was a Governor, he would have kept his vote on Fferyllt and let you and BBT quickhammer. There's no Governor. This setup spec is completely asinine.

Here's a better alternative: Fferyllt and I are the town PRs, and the scum were given a similar fakeclaim to counter watcher. Something really similar to watcher. Any idea what that might be?

[Scripten]

I'm getting more and more sure of BBT being your scumbuddy. If he was town, he'd be tunneling you into the ground right now for pushing a fakeclaim on him.

[Scripten]

Why is Math clear to you, Scripten? He should be just as questionable as anyone else to you

Mathdino isn't clear to me. You're misrepping what I said, which was that I was moving toward BBT being your scumbuddy.

For that matter, you've been quiet and coasting all damn day. Explain that

Bullshit. Mathdino is the only player more active than me, you lying scum.

PE: No, he's caught scum. Your assertion preassumes that I'm scum, and that makes it false

That's all predicated on us believing your claim. I don't, because it stinks of a LyLo fakeclaim for towncred. You bus BBT and then all you need to do is build a case tomorrow to pull a scum win.

I know why Math and ffery have to be Town from my perspective. Defend your position

I haven't hammered for multiple players during LyLo.

[Scripten]

No. Over the course of the whole game, you and Math may have a lot of posts, but during Day 3, the only player less active than you has been BBT, and that's a wide margin

Postcount doesn't equal activity. All it takes is a casual read of the day to see my contributions to the game state.

Also, you have all of five more posts than I do. Whoop-dee-fuckin-doo. Doesn't mean jack shit.

As for the rest, bullshit. You were hesitant or cautious or didn't realize the opportunity or whatever. I don't know why people haven't been hammering, but scum passed up opportunities regardless of who BBT's partner is. BBT, ffery, and I have all been within striking distance of being quick hammered, and they all were passed up. The only one that has been consistent is the one we're in now, which proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that they're Town

Fferyllt was only within striking distance when Mathdino was available, and he unvoted as soon as you showed up with that wonky-ass post of yours. Or did you forget that?

Fuck this, the question isn't about BBT any more, he's caught scum. The question boils down to me vs Scripten, and we're at a greater advantage debating it today, without our numbers cut further

Ballsy move, but it's worthless. It's obvious that you're scum.

[Scripten]

Hey, Pine, is there anyone you haven't tried putting your vote on today?

[Scripten]

Ooooh, right. Fferyllt.

Went something like this:

Fuck it. fferyllt's getting lynched tomorrow if BBT flips scum. As flip-floppy as I've been, self-prediction says I'm probably gonna decide on fferyllt.

VOTE: fferyllt

Let's see what happens.

This is me not wildly leaping onto this. Your Pine + BBT spec is off target

Three pages popped and I'm on a lunch break. Lots to respond to, this was the only thing that demanded an immediate reply

I'm on for the next 15 minutes or so Math, anything urgent you want?

Do you think your scummy ass is covered enough?

[Scripten]

Selective quoting. I had a fifteen minute lunch break, and I could tell he was online. I also announced five minutes left after he unvoted. It was simply the truth, not a signal. Like I said, trying to get a two-person quick hammer going when the other was offline and both Math and ffery were watching me like a hawk would be just asinine stupid

So add misrepresentation to selective quoting

Check the timestamps.

Wait shit wtf with the "I'm on for x amount of time"

UNVOTE: ffery

Edit: Yep.

Lolno. Signaling scum partner with you two both ninjaing posts would be tantamount to suicide

I've got six minutes left, anything else you need? The ninja thing doesn't convince me, btw. It's a risk either way

You were backpedaling like a fiend and covering your ass, like I said.

You've been throwing your vote around all day, hoping it'll stick somewhere and catch you a mislynch.

[Scripten]

So far you've voted two out of three townies and nobody's hammered.

Seems pretty obvious to me.

[Scripten]

I had very good, thoroughly-explained reasons for my evolving reads throughout the day. Math and ffery have both reacted very Townishly to being voted, you and BBT haven't

hah

I was citing my time left regardless of the vote on ffery, and the notion that I was trying to circumvent online players over a very short time span with an offline player is nuts. As I said before, it would have been tantamount to suicide, and I'm simply not that dumb

Which you only did AFTER you got called out for signaling your buddy. It's just as likely that you were using that post to check if anyone was online beside the scumteam, then when you got caught, you hastily did it again like that guy who keeps sliding his chair to cover up that he just let one rip in an auditorium.

[Scripten]

Not to mention Fferyllt is doing a meta read, which can take a while. I'm basically just waiting for her to finish and report on that.

[Scripten]

content coming later today.

Any luck on this front?

[Scripten]

Pre-prod dodge.

I hope we can get some content soon. Feeling so burnt out on this game and we have another day ahead of us after this, assuming we end up lynching Pine or the scum in Mathdino/BBT. Ugh...

[Scripten]

So... uhh... are we just gonna deadline lynch? Because that's getting pretty likely now.

[Scripten]

So it looks like we have one more lynch before LyLo.

Beck was fairly unanimously considered town, so his flip isn't particularly useful.

Anyone have any flashes of intuition overnight? I'm currently in the mood for a Pine lynch.

Interesting.

Yes, I know I made a mistake. I miscounted and made a dum-dum.

VOTE: Pine

Nope. Don't believe that claim.

I thought you were suspicious of my n2 neighborhood claim.

I was for a while. When Pine first claimed, though, it looked exactly like the sort of fakeclaim AA9 would give scum to counter a Watcher, so I acted quickly. Later on, I examined the game and made myself unsure over and over. It wasn't until I was sure you were town that I became sure that Pine was scum. When I voted him the second time and nobody hammered, it really was no surprise to me. There's no way he could be town.

[Scripten]

So, if you were right, Fferyllt, we've won the game. If you are not, we've lost.

Woot.

[Scripten]

So, if you were right, Fferyllt, we've won the game. If you are not, we've lost.

Woot.

not following the if I was right part .

If it's Pine/Mathdino and you hammered, then we've already lost. If your vote didn't count, then Pine is hammered and we're good until tomorrow.

We'll find out when the mod shows up.

[Scripten]

It's either Pine/BBT or Pine/Mathdino, though. Unless you think it's me/BBT, which just doesn't make sense.

[Scripten]

I have nothing. I'm up for either a Pine lynch or a no-lynch if we must. I imagine he's given up at this point and I have nothing to really contribute.

[Scripten]

I'm here. Gonna leave this.

VOTE: Pine

Whenever you're ready, Fferyllt. Or maybe Pine will just do us a favor and self-vote once he realizes town's got him.

[Scripten]

GG Pine. You fought hard but you probably should have NK'd me before I turned my hood into a mason hood.

Now vote yourself so we can bloody win already pls.

[Scripten]

Actually, I've been acutely aware that my role is not a Masonizer. Why do you think I fakeclaimed bulletproof in the hood? Anyway, Math and Fferyllt are conftown to everyone. I'm conftown to myself. Pretty useful for me, tbh.

See, what's interesting is that last night, we turned this game on its head by making the one nearly universal element of mafia (scum are the informed minority) invert. Now the scum are the uninformed minority. We already figured out that you're scum, Pine. We reduced the game into each option you had and figured out how to check you. Your desperate "I'm fakeclaiming town!" act is really just icing on the cake.

And yes, I'm basically treating this game as over. It's pretty obvious where the game state is at.

[Scripten]

I want to read Pine's Scripten case.

Wait, is this something that exists or are we going to have to wait for Pine to fabricate something?

[Scripten]

Did you not read the post-snip that I quoted?

Apparently not. >.> I'm going to go make some tea and return when my brain is back online.

I suppose I can make a case on Pine, too, since we have the time.

[Scripten]

I was very suspicious of Scripten at the end of day 3 and in the neighborhood. I almost didn't post my action in there because I didn't want Scripten to know what I'd do.

I kind of wish you hadn't, honestly.

Can you describe those actions of mine that were suspicious?

[Scripten]

It was a tone thing. I felt like you were putting minimal content into the game on day 3, just enough to coast along. And I remembered that I didn't like your late day 1 reaction tests.

I don't really like to post just for the sake of posting. If I can contribute, I will, but a high noise ratio isn't really a part of my play as either alignment. (You can independently verify this, though meta is a slippery slope and I hardly expect you to find it that useful in this case.)

Though, to move onto that topic a bit more, my reaction tests are generally a town tactic. I don't think I've ever even brought up the concept in my scum games so far. (Either to fake scumhunting or to excuse a scumslip of some sort.) Again, though, self-meta, so you can take it or leave it.

Unfortunately, there's not a whole hell of a lot I can do to alleviate suspicions based on tone.

But, like I said. The game balance makes no sense to me if town has only one PR.

This right here. Two town PRs was about all I could fathom.

Also, pretty sure the whole scum Ninja idea is bunk. I mean, it would have been super easy for Pine to have killed either you or Mathdino last night and gotten away with it if he were a Ninja.

And furthermore, doesn't it make you a

tad

suspicious that Pine's fakeclaim was a Tracker, when you're a Watcher? Especially seeing as how he claimed before knowing what was said in the hood?

[Scripten]

Ninja or something like that made sense with two town investigative roles in a 9 player game. It doesn't make sense with one investigative because the likelihood of town getting anything useful out of the role would plummet from so-so to remote.

Precisely. I suppose I could start coming up with hypotheticals based around what a scum me would be doing, but I don't think that's useful. What do you think would be the scum motivation for my use of my power? Especially in light of your role being revealed to me for two nights?

I just am having trouble understanding how a scum!Scripten would make sense when you're the obvious choice for a night kill, especially since you outed your actions in the hood. Math has had me as town for a while, and we all knew you were the other PR. In LyLo, all I'd have to do would be to convince Mathdino to vote Pine. It seems way too easy to pass up.

It does make me suspicious. I'm just curious why I would have been targeted. I think I dropped one pr tell on day 2. Not a crumb. A tell. And IME MS players as a general rule aren't that good at spotting PR tells. Probably because crumbing is so common.

Targeted as a neighbor? I convened with Beck the night before and we both agreed that you were a strong player who would be useful in the hood.

[Scripten]

I thought your comments assumed a role cop or some such. That's what I meant by targeted.

But, if scum-Pine thought I might be a PR and rolecopped me, why in the fuck wouldn't they just kill me instead of Beck. ESPECIALLY if he was going to bus BBT anyway?

I'll be interested to hear why Beck was killed in endgame. He was town-read, sure, but maybe Pine thought that he was getting too suspicious of him? I'll have to read back and see what Beck said in this topic alongside the hood.

Honestly, I'm amazed that neither you nor myself have died yet. I wasn't expecting to make it past the second night.

But, I'd like to hear why you decided to neighborize me now that you bring it up?

You're a strong town player and I had a suspicion that you might end up being killed in the night. Your entrance was incredibly town, so I felt pretty safe with you in the hood. Didn't expect you to be a PR as well. Missed whatever tells you left.

[Scripten]

Eh, shit happens. Most of the people scumreading you I had in my null or scum piles, and a lot of that had to do with RL stuff anyway.

Pine's hard push on Grib under the guise of "he's fishing for a Governor" smelled really fishy. I was waffling on BBT, but he felt more scummy than not at that point. Math was the other potential candidate, but I was less happy with him than with you.

Plus, someone needed to be neighborized, since at that point I thought I was the only PR. Even if scum showed up, I had my fake BP claim in the hood. (In hindsight, I probably attributed me surviving at all more to that claim than I should have.) If Beck was alive Day 3, I would have started to convince myself that he was scum, probably, just on account of me still being alive.

[Scripten]

Honestly, I think the Beck kill only makes sense coming from Scripten. Scripten would know that he'd never get anyone other than his buddy lynched Day 3 with Beck around pushing, and I can see him deciding that he'd outlived his usefulness. It kind of all makes sense in that context

Beck was significantly less tunnel-y in the hood thread. Fferyllt and Mathdino can confirm this. He had been scumreading you/Grib before Day 2's start, and that read was not changing after Grib was lynched, considering your and BBT's actions. Were I scum, he would have been easy enough to move onto your wagon. But thank you for explaining your motivations for killing Beck. It helps a lot of things make sense.

If you'd left Beck and BBT together, Beck would have seen you busing and would have been okay with lynching either of you. You would have had to rely on the rest of the town following Beck's pushing, which would have been unlikely, and you wouldn't get the towncred for busing your partner. You were so excited to bus that you were willing to make a fake-claim that would bite you in the ass later, or missed that it would do so. That explains the backpedaling today.

A little simple, but I suppose it was a solid enough plan. Nice try, but you're still caught.

[Scripten]

So the case against me consists primarily that I bussed BBT so hard that I made a fake bad scum gambit, in LYLO, while getting rid of the one person who could really make that gambit go off without a hitch, and then ADMITTED to that gambit, all while actually scumhunting and posting.

The only reason you admitted to it was because you caught your scumslip, which Mathdino pointed out in (2402). If Beck stayed on, as I explained, you wouldn't have been able to pull that gambit off. He was scumreading you hard and would have come to the same conclusion Math and I have come to, which is that you bused BBT.

Also, you weren't scumhunting worth shit. You were coasting and trying to discredit every other player in the game. You literally did it to all three of us. I'm amazed Fferyllt hasn't lynched you for that in and of itself. You threw shit at everyone and latched onto what stuck.

You, on the other hand, have been manipulating the Neighborhood, using it to advance fake Masonry, got rid of the one person most likely to push for your partner's lynch, and have been lurking and posting selectively since the end of D2

Sorry, Pine, but did you forget where my vote was when day 2 ended or how hard I pushed for BBT's lynch over Grib's? Of course you did. You keep missing the little things, which I brought up during Day 3. You're not paying very close attention to the game and you're losing the contextual meaning of a lot of goings-on. If you were town, you'd be paying better attention because you'd care about more than just saving your hide.

So here's a question: Let's assume you're town. What was your motivation for fake claiming to get BBT lynched? Why didn't you trust in the read you apparently had on him to push his lynch?

!Case on Pine Incoming!

[Scripten]

Pine's fakeclaim makes too much sense to be made up by him. I refuse to believe AA9 didn't write that.

fferyllt, whatcha waitin on? Scrip's case on Pine?

I am still working on it, but at this point I keep feeling "why bother?"

[Scripten]

If I were going to fakeclaim, I'd at least say something like Apatosaurus, not fucking T Rex

And I'm Brachiosaurus, which would make the fakeclaim that much more obvious. As I've said, you haven't really been paying attention to the small things.

[Scripten]

I attended a lecture by paleontologist Jack Horner when I was nine, and he talked a lot about how T Rex was a scavenger. I thought it was cool, and couldn't resist shoehorning it into this game when the opportunity arose. I also feel a little offended that you feel I'm incapable of making something like that up

I need to meta Pine to see if him taking faux-offense is a good scumtell for him. Later. Gotta be up in only a few hours for work.

PE Shut up Scripten. I just said I didn't fake my Dino name. I'd have gone with something innocuous instead of a predator. What, do you stomp your victims or something?

Oh, I believe you that you didn't fake your claim. AA9 did.

And nah, my strength is my great height and I recruit my fellow dinosaurs into my neighborhood because I want to protect my island so badly. Also, I remembered something I left behind. (1741) I recall that I'd changed a few words to make it out like my role was BP like I'd claimed in the hood thread. Perhaps that explains why I'm still alive.

Because Apatosaurus is definitely a tracker.

lol.

I am suddenly reminded of your (1701). I recall that it made me slightly suspicious that you had a fakeclaim you were using before you were outed as town. Damn good reasoning there.

[Scripten]

I need to meta Pine to see if him taking faux-offense is a good scumtell for him. Later. Gotta be up in only a few hours for work.

So who are you reconsidering?

By later I mean probably postgame. Because you seriously should be hammering now. Pine has scumslipped multiple times already.

Actually, that's an excellent point.

HOW WOULD AA9 COMPLEMENT PINE ON A FAKECLAIM?

There's no reason to message the mod when he was

making up a fakeclaim

without writing up a fake role PM.

Nay.

Pine is actually a T. Rex.

He wrote himself a fakeclaim in the scum thread. A good one, I might add.

AA9 complemented him on his dinosaur research.

We got this.

Great points.

This game needs to end. Fferyllt pls?

[Scripten]

Wow, the dead QT figured out the scumteam SO FAST.

Also, great game, guys. The apathy and gambits were a little crazy, but this was one of my favorite games on the site so far.

[Scripten]

Meh. Just read the dead thread and Beck wasn't as ranty as AA9's PM led me to believe.

This. After neighborizing him and playing the rest of the game, I got into a sort of groove with his playstyle. It doesn't mesh with mine as easily as other players', but he came across as hardcore town.

Also, talking to Beck in the hood really illustrated the differences between his playstyle and his personality, so out-of-game I'm glad I picked him.

-"I am not a tracker" was a genuine, honest-to-God scumslip. I mixed up which claim I'd gone with. I was initially going to go with Watcher, but realized at the last minute that it was too easy to disprove. I'm super proud that I managed to successfully recover from it

I knew it!

-Framing Mathdino as my buddy was not part of the plan...until he accused me of it. Then it was

This was actually your downfall, IMO. You went after every single other player, even though you were so sure of BBT being scum. If you'd only stuck with one of us, it might have worked a little better, but I understand why you didn't.

-I didn't give up on D4. The no kill was calculated. If I'd killed Mathdino, I was concerned that my only lifeline (ffery) might catch me in the act and end it without any room for negotiation. With a 4-person MYLO, everyone had to be unanimous, and I had a toehold to forestall it

We actually reasoned this out in the hood. Math and I spent most of D3/N3 just coming up with the various circumstances that were possible and hypothesizing on them. I think it saved us a couple of times.

AA9:

Can we share the hood PT? I feel like it's only fair to Pine and BBT.

-I really did make up every aspect of the Tracker fakeclaim. AA9 supplied none of it

I believed you, actually. I just try to put people off-balance when I know I'm unaligned with them. Also, I'm actually curious, since your play seems similar to mine in a few ways. Do you feign offense at people as part of your play or was that all genuine?

I do the former, so if I was actually being a dick, I apologize and would like to say that it was all in-game posturing.

This was a shitty scumgame for me (I usually do really well, recent examples notwithstanding) but very fun. I liked the elements of paranoia and doubt in D3

Having played scum with BBT before, I kept seeing little things between you guys that set off red flags. I kind of wish they were more quantifiable, since I can get a feel for where BBT's alignment is but I can't make it explicit to other players. I actually had a much stronger scumread than I ever let on, but I was paranoid enough about Math that until BBT flipped, I couldn't choose between them. Since it was down to you or me, I just kept on your case.

Also, a few notes:
- I honestly think that Mathdino's gambits paid off during D3, but my jaw dropped when I saw what he'd done. (Also, I was online for a few things that I said I wasn't. I just didn't want to post until other reactions were out there.)
- I picked Beck for a couple of reasons: 1) He just wasn't going to be NK'd. There were at least two or three townier players to go first. 2) His reversal on his read on me would be the most blatant and, even though he couldn't confirm my alignment, I trusted him to be honest about the likelihood of my being scum.
- I tried my damnedest to make myself out to be a BP, and it almost backfired I see. Still, I'm glad I did so.

Any thoughts on my play, peeps? I'm especially curious about my play regarding my role.

[Scripten]

Any thoughts on my play, peeps? I'm especially curious about my play regarding my role.

your play was fine until you went into lurk mode

I actually had no idea I was even lurking until I looked at post counts. I guess I'm just quieter during LyLo than I should be.

[Scripten]

@AA9:

Why was N2 extended?

That was because of me!

AA9 needed to give me and Fferyllt time during night to talk in the hood.

PEDIT: Nvm Pine got it first.

[Scripten]

I wonder how things would have worked out if I hadn't claimed watcher to Scripten on Night 2.

I'm glad you did! If you hadn't, I probably would have town-read Pine a lot harder.

Pine, did you come up with the role part of your fakeclaim as well as flavor? If you had claimed something like a cop, I might have been less suspicious of your claim.

[Scripten]

Beck - An excellent player I must say. If he once make his mind about someone, there is no go back for him. In most cases, this kind of play works very well for town. And this is the reason why he was chosen to be killed because Scum team thought it will be hard to convince beck over anyone.

But as pointed out, people don't listen to me because I get into tunnel mode. Not sure why though cause my points are usually solid, even if the person is town.

It's kind of a double-edged sword. Your tunneling gets you towncred pretty easily, and you might be able to push a lynch on another player, but it's also likely to backfire and result in a mislynch if your target can't fight back well enough. I've been finding that tunneling is more often town than scum, at least in my experience, so when I'm tunneled upon I'll often give that player town points, but that's not a surefire tactic, either.