Die, scum!
Mafia v. Wolves Redux: Finally Over!
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The show is horrid.OverTheUnder wrote:<3 Tom goes to the mayor
Thrilling.XReyoX wrote:Vote : Kisonnow you've got the wagon.
I'd have thought a BattleMage head-to-head with someone would have been more entertaining. He can "find scum" on a bar of soap using an 800 year old invention that he calls "scumdar".DrippingGoofball wrote:I am going tovote:Kisonand put XreyoX head to head with Kison. Let's see how it goes.
Ok, let's hear the first legit scum-theory and get this game rolling.-
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What is this, putting words in my mouth? Just because IIH wrote:You just don't lynch someone for "being a nuisance". Thats a horrible reason/excuse.calledhim a nuisance doesNOTmean that I said we should lynch himforbeing one. I think it is quite obvious why I'm currently voting for him. If it's not, you should go back and look at how he's been acting. Not only do his actions not benefit the town, but they are legit scum tells.
Show me where my newfound targeting of you is. If I were to target you, I'd probably be voting for you right now.BattleMage wrote: Kison, by targetting me all the time you not only make yourself a less valuable townie, but you look very much like scum who really wants to attack someone else.-
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A scum tell is somethingXReyoX wrote:Legit scum tells? So you're sure that I'm a scum then.indicativeof scum. So no, that does not mean that I'm certain.
Typical "you will be sorry when you realize I'm innocent" threat.XReyoX wrote:Even if I do die, we have enough people to cast vote to lynch you when my alignment is revealed.-
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Ok, so you can just say "end of story" and expect that everyone takes your word for it and moves on?Raffles wrote:What do I need to drive a point home? A sledgehammer?
Raffles wrote:Whether you believe it or not, I did it with full intention of catching a scum.End of story.
Horrible rebuttal.
Unvote
Vote : Raffles-
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It's rather hypocritical for you to try to get on my case when you switched votes every other post a few pages back.XReyoX wrote:Hm... Kison, the way you lay your votes are a bit strange to me..
At first you vote me saying you've got legit reasons which include I'm trying to do trend thing, for scummy logic, and pretend to be innocent..etc..
Kison wrote:1) I used random.org
2) Although unusual, how does the "trend" look scummy?
3)FoS : XReyoXfor BattleMage logic.
But now you've moved your vote onto raffles where the reason is:Kison wrote:Typical "you will be sorry when you realize I'm innocent" threat.
Comparing the two, there is more sense to stick with your original vote rather than moving it onto raffles. You really should put your vote on sumeone you think is making the most serious scumtells and not who make the newest scumtell.Kison wrote:
Ok, so you can just say "end of story" and expect that everyone takes your word for it and moves on?Raffles wrote:What do I need to drive a point home? A sledgehammer?
Raffles wrote:Whether you believe it or not, I did it with full intention of catching a scum.End of story.
Horrible rebuttal.
Unvote
Vote : Raffles
Raffles is a better candidate simply because he's more experienced and therefore would act more like scum in a traditional sense, wheras in your case, I have to factor in the fact that you're a new player and probably don't know how to act in whatever role you may be placed in.
Additionally, since you're a new player, lynching you is somewhat unlikely even if I was sure you were scum, as it'd be harder for others to pass up the same assessment which I described.
Maybe he has nothing more to say. But spammingXReyoX wrote:The second point is that there isn't any point pushing raffles for making more explanation of his vote or challenge the post he made about L-6 and the halfway line.END OF STORYonly makes him look desperate to end the discussion.
Wrong. I never called you a scum. I said you've been giving off scum-tells. There's a huge difference.XReyoX wrote:You were constantly bashing me for being a scum since the very start of the game.
First of all, I never said "get rid of reyoXReyoX wrote:After "the trap" thing, the tide clearly shifted its side on OTU and people were starting to unvote me. You gave me a feeling that since I no long have the wagon, you were trying to divert the attention onto someone else since you made the initial "get rid of Reyo cos he's annoying" post which is going to draw more and more attention.because he's annoying", so this is entirely incorrect. Go back and read what I actually said.
Secondly, were I really going for a bandwagon, I would have hopped on OTU's. However, I am weighing Raffles' and OTU's poor reasoning for voting, and I have to say that I find Raffles' response to dislike of his vote to be scummier than OTU's.
It is always a good idea to give reason for your votes, especially in the case of a bandwagon. Regardless, he gave one.XReyoX wrote:In addition, i believe that raffles dun have to give an explaination to his vote in the first place-
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Yes it is. I never said to rid of him because he is a nuisance. I simply said he was one. My reasons for voting for him were already stated prior to that post.Akbar wrote:
Is this the phrase in question?Kison wrote:First of all, I never said "get rid of reyobecause he's annoying", so this is entirely incorrect. Go back and read what I actually said.Kison wrote:May we please rid ourselves of this nuisance?
A scum-tell is something you do that is indicative towards you being scum. It is by no means certainty that you're scum.XReyoX wrote:
What is the difference. I see them as exactly the same.Kison wrote: Wrong. I never called you a scum. I said you've been giving off scum-tells. There's a huge difference.
See my response to Akbar.XReyoX wrote:
you said " May usKison wrote: First of all, I never said "get rid of reyobecause he's annoying", so this is entirely incorrect. Go back and read what I actually said.ridourselves of thisnuisance" I think thenuisance= me. andrid= lynch . I can't think of any other way to get rid of someone other than killing him. so i'm still a lil confused.
Is that the nice way of saying you think I'm his scum-buddy?XReyoX wrote:
I was thinking about this while writing my post but i forgot to mention it when i was working through it. I was also trying to say you were diverting the attention to somewhere else and was avoiding to comment on OTU's vote.Kison wrote: Secondly, were I really going for a bandwagon, I would have hopped on OTU's. However, I am weighing Raffles' and OTU's poor reasoning for voting, and I have to say that I find Raffles' response to dislike of his vote to be scummier than OTU's.-
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I assumed nothing.Raffles wrote:That's a mostridiculousassumption.
Two days of play time is a LOT more than starting fresh as a newbie. You've had the opportunity to interact with scum while XReyoX has not. That's plenty of reason to think that you'd have a better idea of how to act as scum than someone like him who's going to have no idea at all what to do.Raffles wrote:Sure, I was/am in 5 games, but my cumulutive day count amounts to the grand total of2days. How the heck would I know how to act a scum "traditionally", assuming there is such a thing.-
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He'd act more scummy "in a traditional sense" meaning that he would act more like scumXReyoX wrote:
I'm not sure why do you think that raffle, being more experienced, would act more like scum. I thought being a noobie scum would act more scummy than an experienced scum.Kison wrote: Raffles is a better candidate simply because he's more experienced and therefore would act more like scum in a traditional sense, wheras in your case, I have to factor in the fact that you're a new player and probably don't know how to act in whatever role you may be placed in.as we would expect. My point is that newbies DO act scummy, but they do so even if they're townies. That is why I am unsure of you, XReyoX. You act scummy, true, but since you're brand new here, I can't be sure if you're from newbieville, scumville or both.
And Raffles, by claiming that your experience is near non-existant means you want a "get a newbie out of jail" card. Sorry, but I think I saw Raffles and BattleMage looting the Chance and Community Chest cards.-
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Or maybe he's scared of my avatar.OverTheUnder wrote:But did anyone else notice Battle Mage is posting enough toseemactive, but not really adding anything to the conversation seems sorta odd, Battle Mage seems in his other games to be aggressive but in this one it's different maybe he's hiding something?-
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Akbar, if you really think that you have to be 100% sure(AKA certain) that the person you're pushing to lynch(at the time) is scum, then you may as well claim cop or scum.
Secondly, no, my entire case is not surrounding the bandwagon trap. However, that is a large contributor. His flawed and redundant arguments were the other contributor.
Any "grammar nitpicking" is to clarify his false interpretation of some of the things that I said.-
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Quoted for beautiful truth.Mastermind of Sin wrote:
The funny thing about this is, if putting an early or late vote on someone is scummy, why would town want to do it? And if the middle is the most protown place, and therefore the most likely place for scum, what's to prevent scum from WIFOMing back into the beginning and end of the wagon?Raffles wrote:Mr. Flay, I've answered both of your questions. I'm not trying to avoid anything. :/
I take it you acknowledged the answer to question 1
Answer to question 2:
Raffles wrote: Probably the most crucial. 6 (or 4) scums do not know who each other are. They know their scum buddies, but they have no knowleddge of the other group. This makes it far more likely that a scum is going to turn up and push the wagon, especially if it is half way through (i.e. false sense of security that it would be okay to vote since it is not putting Reyo on lynch -1 or 2 or whatever).
Looking back, I concede that these takes a fair amount of assumption. But I do honestly believe that a scum would prefer this timing rather than beginning or the end. For that reason.Raffles wrote: It's simple, it's a halfway house. In a big game like this, if someone has got half the vote required then the person's orbiting on event horizon. Not many would question a possibility of lynch of someone who has built that many votes. This creates an ideal situation for scum who hasn't voted on that person yet. The lynchee has clearly done something questionable so placing a vote wouldn't look suspicious, but it's not placing the person on lynch -1 or 2. A safe vote.-
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Raffles wrote:WIFOM where? Explain.
If you were scum, you would put a vote in the middle so you seem to be going along with the flow. However, scumRaffles wrote:No that's not it, my feeling is that anyone can put the vote at the beginning or the end. It's just that if I were a scum, I would feel safer by doing what I said. Also, the reason the guy gives gotta be rubbish. That's where OTU fitted in.mightput it at the end because they know you're thinking along those lines. Or maybe they know you know that they would put it at the end or beginning because you know someone who is scummy would try to slip it in the middle. Or maybe they know that you know that they know that you know that they know that...
You completely speculate where a scum would put their vote. Yet if they know that the middle looks "most protown", and you therefore know that a scum may try to slip in under the radar, then they may put their vote at beginning or end because they know you're looking. But it's completely speculative, yet its the foundation of your supposed trap.-
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Any time I want to lynch you is because I don't feel we have any other leads to go on. So you're normally next on the list for being near useless, yet still holding the possibility of being scum. So losing you would be no devastating loss of contribution while still holding the possibility that a scum-lynch would be yielded.Battle Mage wrote:wow. This post strikes me as VERY odd. Never before have i seen Kison pass up an opportunity to get me lynched. Either hes finally get the gist of my play, or he is scum trying to suck up to me. For the sole reason that i want to believe it, im going to assume he is the former. My vote also stands.
Kison wrote:I'm not feeling the Battle Mage wagon at all. My vote stays where it is for now.
Since you act like scum 95% of the time, it's impossible to ever really be sure about you. I don't even mean to be harsh, but just look at what you just said right there. Perfect example.-
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I did read his points. And he said that he wasremussaidow wrote:Read his points again Kison, he's suspicious of both of you.alreadysuspicious of me before he noticed any voting patterns.
My question is, why go after PBuG when I'd be the stronger case?Akbar wrote:I had suspicions of Kison on page 8.-
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Well, you answered my question, even if you didn't understand what I was trying to ask.Akbar wrote:
If you and PBug are a scum team, it doesn't matter who gets lynched first. PBug has OTU's vote on him. Perhaps OTU saw something else in PBug that I haven't. Either way, 2 votes on 1 scum is better than 1 vote on 2 scum.Kison wrote:If you were suspicious of me regardless of the voting patterns, then why did you choose to hop onto PBuG?
Remus: Mind providing a list of who you think is scum, neutral, town, and why?-
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That's a hammer, IH. Honestly, it doesn't make a difference to me. My bets would have gone on OTU not responding.
Code: Select all
OverTheUnder (11): Battle Mage, DrippingGoofball, Fuldu, Mastermind of Sin, Mr Flay, remussaidow, PBuG, Scarecrow, al4x, theopor_COD, IH PBuG (2) : Akbar, OverTheUnder remussaidow (2) : Kison, theopor_COD
Goodnight, town...-
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You should probably hold off on that kind of speculation. We don't even know if OTU was scum or not.Battle Mage wrote:so you say, however this makes little sense considering your high activity in other games.
Zindaras wrote:
I only started actually reading the thread yesterday.Battle Mage wrote:FOS: Zindy. After OTU has had a big wagon for ages, which stuttered and started more than any other i have seen, you made a conscious decision not to vote. Now the decision has been made without your help, you claim to support it, in the hope that you wont be suspected tomorrow. Its a commendable plan-far more subtle than bussing your scumbuddy, but if OTU comes up scum, i will be keeping a very close eye on you tomorrow.-
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First of all, I agree with you here, XReyoX. No-lynch basically sets us back, primarily because we have very little to go on the next day. In OTU's case, he was participating less and less, and even as a town, that's not a huge loss to us in comparison to someone who had been participating more, while the case against him wasn't necessarily weak.XReyoX wrote:
Getting a town lynch is not always worse than no lynch i think. If we didn't lynch anyone, the doc might not be able to work out what to do last night. Ending up with 2 townie NK with nothing to go on today would be worse than the situation we are at atm.Raffles wrote:Well given either no lynch or OTU, which one would you want? I know which one I would go for.-
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I'm not quite following you. You say that an OTU lynch is better than no lynch. Yet why would you not re-vote if you were for the lynch?Raffles wrote: OTU on verge of lynch for very long time.
Maybe he is not worth the lynch?
Unvote
Realize the deadline
Given no lynch or OTU lynch, OTU lynch is better than nothing[/i]
Should I revote? No I shouldn't (for reasons above)
to his being town.
In any event, what you say does not match up.
At this point, you[Raffles] are more confident than not that OTU is scum. Yet you go on later to say that his prolonged wagon makes him look more innocent. That's a pretty sudden shift of opinion with a near baseless reason.XReyoX wrote:#404 raffles answered, "3. I would say much more likely than others, maybe a nudge below 70. "
Vote : Raffles
Inconsistency.-
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Raffles' story does not match up.
This is equivilent to Monday, April 9th - 12:00 noon EDT(all time stamps from here on out are EDT).Phoebus wrote:Deadline 1: Monday the 9th - 1700 GMT
Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 1:39 pmRaffles wrote:I'm not there to place the hammer when the deadline comes I'm afraid, someone else needs to do that.
Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:23 pmIH wrote:Vote:OTU
Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:01 pmKison wrote:That's a hammer, IH.
After this has been announced, and BEFORE the deadline even actually hit, who shows up when they said they wouldn't?
Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 5:06 pmRaffles wrote:Okay I'm going to have a restricted access starting immediate until 16th. I may or may not be able to post once a day. I hope you don't find a need to replace me.
I find the above scenario possible in that Raffles may have known ahead of time that he wouldn't be there on the 9th, but that he would be there on the 8th. Seems a bit fishy to me, nontheless.
Secondly, I seem to recall Phoebus stating that we only neededhalfthe majority in order to lynch OTU. We had well over that number when Raffles made these posts, so I'm not really sure why he wanted someone else to do the deed when it would have been nearly inevitable anyway.-
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That's the thing. His unvoting could very well have been the result of knowing that his vote didn't matter at that point, despite his claim that he did not know of the minimum requirement to lynch.XReyoX wrote:If he so wanted to hammer otu. One day before the deadline doesn't really make a different. Even if he claims, scum would just act as if they are not here and let the deadline come. otu will die anyway.
On the subject of Mastermind of Sin. I agree his reaction to a single vote is pretty overly defensive, however, I fail to see where DrippingGoofball's theory that he is multitasking his votes is coming from, especially in XReyoX's case.-
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Not scummy? Well, look at it through our eyes. You pick up a bunch of votes rather quickly, and DGB tries to make a case against MoS with faulty information. My initial reaction was that he was trying to sidetrack a wagon on you, though I personally believe that he did a very bad job at it. His argument has thus far been unconvincing, and continued aggression towards MoS with lack of support only reinforcing to that sentiment.Raffles wrote:If I'm a scum, MoS will hound your ass. If I'm a townie, I'm sure MoS will find a way to go after you for crap reason non-the-less. I don't think it's a scummy play what you did, a scum would quite happily join my wagon saying "oh I 100% agree with MoS". MoS hounding Reyo I believe is rather misplaced. But I don't think it's scummy.-
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Why would they feel need to sidetrack it? Possibly to save you? Because if, let's say, you are ESE, having you die today would be a second member lost. If you do indeed come up scum, DGB's actions wouldRaffles wrote:Why would a scum feel the need to sidetrack a wagon? You know, as much as Idolook scummy, I'm not proven so just yet, so you can't go about saying she is my scumbuddy.looklike he was trying to move votes over to MoS in attempt to save you.-
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And I also noticed the over-reaction, but MoS is almost always irritable from my experience with him. However, what was with the idea that he is going after Raffles & XReyoX simultaneously when he seems to be focusing only on Raffles while workingDrippingGoofball wrote:
Continued aggression? Haha. Read again. It's not aggression, you will see clearly, but an expression of surprise at MoS's over-reaction. I am merely wondering why he gets his knickers in a twist for so very little pressure. Hardly what I'd call "building a case." One person, one vote. I merely felt that his actions were opportunistic, and worth a little poke. I didn't expect MoS to get all defensive.Kison wrote:[DGB's] argument has thus far been unconvincing, and continued aggression towards MoS with lack of support only reinforcing to that sentiment.
He may or may not be scum, but he's on my watch list, for sure.withXReyoX? Maybe it's not a case -yet- but it looks like the beginning stages of one, and with what seems to me to be an untrue statement.-
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*gives MoS a ritalin* I tire of reading your sporadic condescending posts. I've yet to see another player get so worked up over thesegames.
Back on topic, I accept DGB's answer about MoS hounding XReyoX, although I disagree.
I hate this kind of logic from the Battle Mage. It really irks me because of how WIFOM it is(he tried pulling this on me in another game). There's a profound difference between what MoS is doing, and what DGB was suspected of doing. If Raffles came up scum, there'd be no proof that MoS was scum BUSing his partner. He could very well be scum, however, in DGB's case, there's plenty of proof that heBattle Mage wrote:OR, in light of this comment, it makes you look bad, for blatantly bussing your buddy.
Mastermind of Sin wrote:
Because DGB is trying to stir up suspicion against the person that is most proactively attacking Raffles. If Raffles is scum, this makes DGB look pretty bad tomorrow.XReyoX wrote:@MoS. How does raffles being a scum makes DGB oneas well?didattempt to sidetrack the Raffles wagon, although we would still be unsure of why, that is where the concern of his reasoning comes in.-
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- .GIFted
- .GIFted
- Posts: 6714
- Joined: January 22, 2007
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