/in-vitational 12: Mafia in #YOLOville - All wrapped up!

[Vi]

He's (kind of) forgiven for #YOLOville.

As with most particularly :whimsy:cal things around the site, that's something you can blame me for.

I still object to this theme, though. I have a track record of living twice, and feel horribly constrained.

It's so...

Normal

.

[Vi]

It says "The Lonely Island" in the title; it's your own fault for clicking it.

Granted, someone should still shoot Empire for Cerulean's sig.

[Vi]

Okay, true confession. I hadn't watched the video until you brought it up. What are you talking about, that was entirely tolerable.

I do not intend to tiptoe through life only to safely arrive at death.

~Bumper sticker

[Vi]

I am honestly kind of afraid to post here because I'm worried that my avatar isn't reddish enough to match everyone else's.

Vote: CrashTestDummie

(L-7) #YOLO

And how does Benmage come across as pro-town at this point for you?

[Vi]

Why so emo, Shaniwéh?

[Vi]

u._.u
:o #RAOOOOOOOW*

Unvote: CrashTextDummie
Vote: Llamarble

(L-4)



*"RAOOOOOOOW" is dog (roughly translated) for "YOLO". Unlike in Internet, it is not the other half of "cow" in cão.

Cut by Llamarble and I do not care.

[Vi]

Shaniwéh sounds like if I wanted a porno name. >_>

Good thing I have a fallback option!

[Vi]

I lost a lot of my confidence after Castle Zar: even though I correctly nailed all three scum via a 5 person PoE list, I ended up lynching the two townies in that group which led me to second guess everything pretty hardcore.

And yet you still won.

[Vi]

That's me in the corner
That's me in the spot-light
Losing my religion
Trying to keep--a--view
And I don't know if I can do it

[Vi]

Tierce is Town. By posting this contentful sentence I am therefore Town. Therefore by hypothetical syllogism I am Town because Tierce is Town.

[Vi]

Vi,

what's your angle here?

Acute. And obtuse. Ideally right as well.

UNVOTE: Llamarble

Do go on.

Get back on.

[Vi]

This is going to be one of those games where I get ignored until people want to lynch me again isn't it. >_>

You've said something important?

(if it's not a vote for Llamarble then etc.)

@Wetfox: See above.

[Vi]

Says the person posting in dogspeak? You have eyes, you're fully capable of reading what I've been saying.

I apologize; I was harsher than I intended.

That said, you would be better off pursuing Llamarble.

trolly, unreadable Vi

For a brief moment I had hoped you had typod the first word. Rice-a-RoVi - the #YOLOville treat!

[Vi]

What do you mean?

I don't think I'm being anti-town, because I think looking back it should be clear where I was going with it.

Johhog is comfortable / assertive.
"Whoa why did you get a different impression from mine" is town because town expect others to agree with them whereas mafia realize they have a different perspective.

VOTE: DeasVail

[Vi]

Vi, either you explain 'marblescum (and I agree this feels somewhat like the annoyed Llamarble-Town in Abarat, though that is an easy attitude to have as either alignment and doesn't hinder his play as scum/Town), or I'm out. N and Konowa are looking far worse than him.

I just did.
I'll freely admit that he's very much like Sherlock in what I hear in the subtext of what he posts, but that contradiction is dubious.

[Vi]

Vi, how anti-town is your scum play?

I'm never scum. You can even check my wiki win stats.

[Vi]

Vi,

what

contradiction? Explain it to me like I'm a scatterbrained puppyhalf.

Why is Llamarble giving Johhog a pass for

"Whoa why did you get a different impression from mine" is town because town expect others to agree with them whereas mafia realize they have a different perspective.

and then voting Wetfox in his next post?

[Vi]

What do you think is Llamarble's reasoning for voting Deas?

(or if you so prefer)


I'm not against pointing out the weird noncommitality of post 146 but that came long after Llamarble's vote in 113.

[Vi]

I mean, I commented on it as well, and I still think it's one of the weirdest things from him:

@Llamarble--why did you completely drop your previous lines of reasoning to vote Deas without commenting on posts made by your "previous" scum suspects?

His reasoning was "not enough time for etc.", which is etc. of itself. But but--seriously, look at N. u._.u *whimper*

Please?

N is fluffier than me. Such a thing cannot stand.

---

Mind you, I'm not talking about the quirky "emulating Glrok" type of anti-town; I'm talking "let's just push

this mislynch

hard".

Do you have something to tell the class, CES?

[Vi]

Give the context behind calling Llamarble a mislynch, then.

[Vi]

Tierce, Shadoweh, T/S

[Vi]

<.<

There's a certain threshold where I go from cryptic to incomprehensible.

Tierce: What is your alignment read on Shadoweh?

[Vi]

Tierce: How strongly do you feel about N?

[Vi]

Okay then.

Unvote: Llamarble
Vote: N

(L-7)

[Vi]

Tierce I am extremely disapoint right now. Someone not commenting on the general town read on you isn't noteworthy. Vi should not need to explain your own vote to you. You should seriously stop blowing off reading Vi, even if you can't pick up sekrit scum tells, you can still find the town ones right? I'm not even going to comment on the other thing you did because I think you said it just to annoy me. I have no intestinal disagreements to your N case though and will consider following.

You're leaning pretty hard on Tierce right here. I hope you're not suggesting Tierce is scum deliberately not reading me. You're only making vague passes at me being scum here; if you thought I was Town you wouldn't be making these statements to start with and if you thought I was someone you could comfortably manage a wagon on you would have listed me among your suspects. And this is coming from someone who made a big deal of saying that I'm

so

easy to read.

[Vi]

You're leaning pretty hard on Tierce right here. I hope you're not suggesting Tierce is scum deliberately not reading me. You're only making vague passes at me being scum here; if you thought I was Town you wouldn't be making these statements to start with and if you thought I was someone you could comfortably manage a wagon on you would have listed me among your suspects. And this is coming from someone who made a big deal of saying that I'm

so

easy to read.

I have said you are town at least three times so what are you talking about?

You what.

I will politely ignore discussion of ə's urges.

Tierce, were you being serious when you said she was scum?

[Vi]

Oh, I'm going to go over Shadoweh's meta too since I remember she's a lot more snarky/abrasive as town.

Spoiler: All of her recent games are as Town or as one of two scumteams/SK, in which she was at least moderately more abrasive in all of them than here. This game's snarkometer reading (before seeing the chance to push on some Vi who got brought into this invitational) matches two more distant games I remember in which she was playing with me and Tierce. She was scum in both of them and justifiably scared.

Conclusion: etc.

[Vi]

This game's snarkometer reading (before seeing the chance to push on some Vi who got brought into this invitational)

^^^This is allegedly not true, but the person saying so is also saying that they've been calling me Town more times than they can count.

[Vi]

I know it's pointless because D1 Vi lynches don't happen.

They try though.

Gah. I need an hydra buddy or something. I feel like so much of this game is going WOOOOOSH over my head and that I don't know how to play alone anymore. I want to gripe about situations and get someone who reads the parts I skim and the possibility of bouncing ideas back and forth and I just

can't

.

I'm too scatterbrained for this right now, but eventually I'll probably appropriate the thread to act out a decent hydra discussion with Empire and/or Vi. It feels really damned awkward not being able to talk with either of them about the game as it is ongoing and I keep looking at AIM and pining for brainstorms we cannot have. Even when I currently have no idea what I

would

discuss, I feel like I need it.

Firebird feels very lonely and needs someone to hold her hand/wing/talon/whatever.

/)
(caveat the first: totes done this as scum before, with VP Baltar as victim)
(caveat the second: you've read more of the game for comprehension than I have)

Glowing optimism sets in after the realization that CES may actually be right about the scumteam (#447).

You're still new at this. You grow out of it eventually.

--

Vi, Tammy, T/S

You've seen a lot more Tammy-scum than I have, and from what I've heard I'm not going to be good at reading her.

With that said, T.

--

I've noticed in quite a few of my games I've alienated people and gotten myself mislynched, so I'm trying a new thing. I'm not sure what you're exactly expecting from me (have you gotten my meta mixed up with someone else's?), but I can go through the whole thread and make snarky comments if you'd like?

...how is this different? Aside from the greater prevalence of useless posts. On that note,

I don't think I am

[fluffy]

. Am I?

Yes. And I am

very

fluffy.

--

Is there a reason people are ignoring Wickedestjr?

Especially with those glasses.

[Vi]

Actually, what is your take on pengualien, N?

[Vi]

Actually, what is your take on pengualien, N?

Hey, you, with the N. ^^^

[Vi]

I think she and Knowoa are likely the same alignment.

Well that answer was meaningless.

Won't be able to post until tomorrow night, most likely. In the meantime, here's what I'm at with my reads. Remind me of this post later so I can go into my reasoning.

TOWN (S->W):

Tierce, Benmage, DV, Tammy, [gap], Shadoweh, Konowa, Llamarble, [gap], Johhog, CES

Scum in {CTD, N, Nacho, penguin, Vi, Wickedestjr}

If it gives you that overwhelming optimism again, this isn't a bad list. Except for the Vi-part, but etc.

but I've got a date with a swimming pool in the morning

Ew. Strongly chlorinated kisses.

---

penguin_alien (3) - Deasvail, Konowa, Shadoweh
Johhog (1) -

Tammy

N (5) - Tierce, Vi, CrashTextDummie, Empire, penguin_alien
Vi (2) -

Benmage, Cogito Ergo Sum

CrashTextDummie (4) - WickedestJr, N, Nachomamma8, Llamarble
Cogito Ergo Sum (1) -

Johhog

If all the people bolded could do something productive with their lives it would be most appreciated.
The Day is stagnant and we have four and a half days left until deadline.

[Vi]

Hey Benvolio, what's your take on pengualien?

[Vi]

Actually I'm amused by how well the Scum According To Empire corresponds to the activity overview. N might actually be Town, and then we'd be left with the four top lurkers as the four scum.

...it would be funny, anyway. (>")>

[Vi]

You're really going to pretend there are 4 scum, Vi?

...


Sure!

Hey Benvolio, what's your take on pengualien?

Town.

Why.

The list you said was good. Minus yourself, why are you solely lurker hunting?

I'm a geocacher; I hunt lurking things all the time with various degrees of success.

[Vi]

Vi is not being fluffy enough. Benvolio is a terrible pick for Benmage. Plus, that means he survives, and

yuck

.

Well I've had Banmage on my mind for a while now, but that more describes me, so I had to find a backup.

[Vi]

Vi is not being fluffy enough. Benvolio is a terrible pick for Benmage. Plus, that means he survives, and

yuck

.

Well I've had Banmage on my mind for a while now, but that more describes me, so I had to find a backup.

Also Shakespeare connection given Battle Mafia. Credit please?

[Vi]

PEdit: Benedick would have been more appropriate. I am still disappointed in you.

I am overwhelmingly impressed with your ability to out:whimsy: me with this four-layer reference.

With that said, you counterfail.

Credit please?

The correct response is "Child, please".

[Vi]

(Yes, that actually is how the vast majority of our hydra conversations go.)

Well there is the overjustification and the fact that I've probably posted more content myself over the course of the thread, but he's picking some awfully strange targets to antagonize. (CES, Empire - both with no wagons at the time)

I'm amused that that first sentence in the second quote came from the same person who said this, Tierce.

Uh, your problem? That is my personal policy. I play this game for fun. And lurking being rewarding detracts a lot of the fun. I think you should be rewarded for playing.

Given that Johhog's activity and interest looks different from that other game, etc.

[Vi]

There is also something else glaringly missing from Johhog's posts. A French pastry to anyone who can spot it (or lack thereof).

I actually expect a pastry. /)

Does it involve pressing scum reads?

[Vi]

Oh yeah,

Vi

, what do you think about the votes on you and the people voting you? (I would normally ask how you feel about them, but I don't think acute/obtuse/right angles feel...they seem more like thinkers to me, so.)

Both Benmage and CES are people who I think would willingly jump at the opportunity to vote me for the sheer intrinsic pleasure thereof, and not people I could convince to do much of anything; so much like 90% of the thread, I'm apathetic. Benmage's vote on me is at least surprisingly consistent with his previous stance. The fact that CES is doing more than trolling per 583 comes as a legitimate surprise to me.

I appear to be the only person who saw something in Llamarble giving a pass to one person and not another for the same reason. Whichever. See petsPick for a game where I had a similar amount of joy being in the same thread as Ll.

I feel vaguely insulted by CES's description of my scum meta, and only vaguely so because it seems that a whole

bunch

of people think that I'm so incompetent as scum that I would poke
1) CES
2) who had no movement against him at all
3) with a terribly weak throw-away

"Pretending that we have 4 scum" is a terribly weak throw-away. It's not very likely that an SK exists in the setup given that it's an invitational and 4/16 is pretty much standard; that aside, yes, I remembered seeing someone bring it up (I thought it was CES) and went with it while I was out going :whimsy: on a different thought.

smiley tell

You're really going to pretend there are 4 scum, Vi?

Random thought: Closed White Flag.

(original translation: "oic")
Because random thoughts like this are not leading and just inane babble from someone who famously doesn't say much. If you know something I don't, more's the better.

[Vi]

Also, unprompted thoughts because I feel like showering things with generosity.

I've been teetering on moving off N for a few days now just for the sheer moxie/"too scummy to be scum" of it. Then I actually read whatever N's latest post was at the time and completely lost my motivation to justify it to myself.

Empire's list o' reads is, again, quite agreeable and at my current level of interest I would be fine with lynching any person in the scum list save myself. I can be convinced to Johhog per the previous conversation and while Wickedestjr's posts feel like scum I don't have the time right now to find out what it is everyone else is seeing in him; as it stands if someone wants to switch them, whichever.

A quick look with site search suggests that this is the best move right now.

Unvote: N
Vote: penguin_alien

(L-4)

[Vi]

What's the likelihood of Vi getting lynched today?

Not as good as CES may expect.

Also Castle Zar (the 12:3 game I can think of offhand) was hardly an average-power game (2xVig and Gunsmith vs. Goons) so etc.

[Vi]

Both Benmage and CES are people who I think would willingly jump at the opportunity to vote me

for the sheer intrinsic pleasure thereof,

and not people I could convince to do much of anything; so much like 90% of the thread, I'm apathetic.

Take this for example. This subtly dismisses both mine and CES' votes as nothing more then shock-n-awe.

Very crafty and clever is the scum Vi. You'll be enlightened.

It's not very subtle. I think you're both more likely Town - yes I know that's dangerous to say around CES - and that by this time there's not a whole lot I alone can do about your votes.

Yeah, I know, I helped design the set-up. It was a cool set-up with a slight mountainous feel. Is that not what you're expecting here?

Ferrariday did say he was considering running Black Flag, so it's not out of the question. I do expect invitational games to be toned down to something reasonably basic, but not necessarily that far.

Disclaimer: My personal invitational experience involves wackadoo Team Mafia games.

Do you not like playing with me? I thought I played OK in Animal Rescue, or at least my reads list wasn't bad. I guess I did get run up D1 or D2 for getting off to a slow start or something.

petsPick was frustrating, though from what I remember you turned out Town (and did well) in the end.
Further pointless explanatory words go here, etc., bottom line is that I apologize for being semi-arbitrarily bitter - especially in this game.

---

Anytime someone wants to get the show on the road would be fine.
Deadline's getting closer and Faraday's job is getting boring, though that's partly because he's not posting more awful #hashtags.

[Vi]

Flambérd, would you mind validating the pengualien wagon?

[Vi]

Day 1, Votecount 25

penguin_alien (5) - Deasvail, Konowa, Shadoweh, Llamarble, Vi

Johhog (1) -Tammy
N (4) - Tierce, CrashTextDummie, Empire, penguin_alien
Vi (2) - Benmage, Cogito Ergo Sum
CrashTextDummie (4) - WickedestJr, N, Nachomamma8, Johhog

Not voting (0) :

NO ONE

• With 16 alive it takes 9 to lynch.
  
• Deadline is on 5th of March at 00:38am GMT
  
• Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2013-03-04 20:30:28)
  
• Tierce is V/la

Hey

Hey everyone

scum (half a lynching wagon) - Some people

scum (other half of a lynching wagon) - Some other people

Johhog and Vi (3) - some wishful thinkers
A whole line of people on the scumlist who probably have a vested interest in not moving (4)

is it can be desizhun time nao plz?

[Vi]

*tiem

[Vi]

VOTE: n

Unvote: penguin_alien
Vote: N

(L-3)

Hmm, I don't know if I really have a townread on him anymore, but I'm liking my penguin scumread a bit better.

Stop being etc. and change your vote.

Oh and for my fellow tinfoil theorists out there

I prefer alumi--oh, you said "theorists", not "enthusiasts".

[Vi]

There are

two

things on this page that are fluffier than me. This is getting upsetting.

[Vi]

Also, reading N as town, could be persuaded to vote penguin_alien at deadline or something, if it's needed.

^^^trying to force No Lynch

[Vi]

Oh hey

less than a day left

and rapidly approaching a point where claims are too little too late.

[Vi]

I hope Vi's "Trying to force No Lynch" thing against Johhog is trolling. I'm suspicious of Johhog and didn't think he remotely meant that.

Not trolling, and in retrospect what I meant probably wasn't correct, but I am kind of frustrated about how no one is actually threatening an imminent lynch. By 679 you don't say

out with that claim

, you say

out with that windpipe

.

The main reason I question if what I said was correct was because I kind of predict N will flip Town now. :/

Unvote: N
Vote: penguin_alien

(L-2)

This post felt like the first non-fluff post of the game, and it's mostly defense, a little posturing for a CES attack. Why bother, given your current level of interest in the game?

I question your definition of fluff.
I thought I needed to flip the Looks Town switch.

[Vi]

I thought I needed to flip the Looks Town switch.

I could gather this much, but why?

The point of :moveslikedutchie: is to be invisible; by that point I saw that I wasn't.

I also give up on things too easily, probably. :/

[Vi]

Now I know I'm trying to cut back on my bitterness output in this game, but where were the last two pages three days ago?

I feel like I should do something, but I don't know what and won't get more time for another few hours.

[Vi]

Penguin-alien's analysis post, while not as awesome-town as Nacho's, was at least 10 times more pro-town than anything N has done over the entire day combined. I see his entire conduct over the last couple of pages, including his refusal to claim, as entirely bereft of any pro town motivation or thinking. He's riding the "too scummy to be scum" angle to the finish line and for some incomprehensible reason, enough people are buying it that penguin-alien looks like today's lynch. Feh.

After having some time to think it over... yes. I was wondering if unvoting and hoping for No Lynch at deadline was a good idea, but if we had to lynch someone, it wouldn't be p_a just for the sake of best-worst-case-scenario. I was probably going to feel like I made the wrong move no matter what, but I think I actually did.

[Vi]

#BUKKIT

VOTE: OhGodMyLife

No. The correct move is--

Johhog -

Town Tracker

was killed Night 1.

...um... hold a moment.

While I think about what just happened, how is N's replacement not Very Town?

[Vi]

While I think about what just happened, how is N's replacement not Very Town?

How is it Very Town?

Either we're going to need to establish that N is a horrible person who is willing to flame you and then hatequit on a game, or etc.

[Vi]

CTD as Mafia Traitor means almost definitely four scum.
I'm really not thinking there's an SK and a Traitor in an invitational game, so I want to say Johhog was vigged and CTD was NKd... although that goes into whether Traitors can be recruited and etc.; more importantly I'm just not seeing scum kill Johhog. Which means that CTD looked Town somehow? and more importantly, our Town mascots Tierce and Empire are most likely completely off the mark.

Why is Konowa Town again?

[Vi]

P-Edit: Pretty sure I had CTD in my PoE pool.

That's one.

[Vi]

Why is Konowa Town again?

Does anyone actually know the answer to this?

I see Vi's suspicion of Johhog didn't actually extend to reading his posts.

This sounds like the sort of incoherent mostly-snark thing I would say. I would just

hate

it if my brand of uncool rubbed off on you.

Ideally more when I have time.

[Vi]

Vi, CES, T/S

Short answer: S

I said D1 that I thought CES was Town; his means of coming around to suspecting me seemed logical and supported by a surprising amount of thought (specifically "any that he chose to share"). At this point it seems evident to me that CES is tunneling me as an end to itself; if you understand what he's said about me Today, please tell me. Something similar happened with {Vi, N, penguin_alien}; notice that not only did CES coax both of the two wagons, but he deliberately didn't choose until his vote would hold the least accountability ("just put one down for the sake of avoiding No Lynch"). Now look at this exhaustive list of people CES has pushed over the course of the game:

Vi

Llamarble (when he had the big wagon)

N

penguin_alien

CES may move in mysterious ways, much like God and that guy handing out free candy on the corner, but put in that context I don't think it's completely inscrutable.

Vote: Cogito Ergo Sum

(L-3)

[Vi]

My point was simply being suspicious of someone and not picking up on a fairly explicit softclaim is not all that likely to be the result of diligent scumhunting.

Oh, so you killed Johhog.

[Vi]

Or anyone else who takes the time to read Tammy's walls.

That definitely implicates you more than me.

Actually there's something else implicating you more than me too.

[Vi]

Vi, CES, T/S

Short answer: S

I said D1 that I thought CES was Town; his means of coming around to suspecting me seemed logical and supported by a surprising amount of thought (specifically "any that he chose to share"). At this point it seems evident to me that CES is tunneling me as an end to itself; if you understand what he's said about me Today, please tell me. Something similar happened with {Vi, N, penguin_alien}; notice that not only did CES coax both of the two wagons,

but he deliberately didn't choose until his vote would hold the least accountability

("just put one down for the sake of avoiding No Lynch"). Now look at this exhaustive list of people CES has pushed over the course of the game:

This doesn't seem like a very valid point. I've only seen CES!scum a few times, but none of those time did he deliberately try to avoid choosing a vote so that his vote didn't have much accountability. He might still be scum here, but this is a weak.

Luckily, I said a fair amount more than you bolded.

Or anyone else who takes the time to read Tammy's walls.

That definitely implicates you more than me.

Sympathy for the reader.

unvote
vote: Vi

We're talking about CES; it's more like this.

If it makes you feel better, I've not read several peoples' walls. (If that doesn't make you feel better, etc.)

[Vi]

Here's the thing. I picked up on Johhog's softclaim and I think I'm usually pretty clueless about these things, so I think it's pretty likely that Vi would have especially if he was actually interested in reading Johhog as CES said (I actually don't remember this so I'm just trusting CES for now).

Not sure what you're saying in the parentheses.

With regard to what Johhog said that's being taken as a softclaim - on the one hand, I can kind of understand it

now

. On the other hand, N was doing the same thing, I'm doing the same thing, and the take-home message I got from Johhog's comment was more akin to this. But more importantly, you're missing the same thing CES is.

[Vi]

N gave explicit motivation for his change and you're in your own special category regardless. "Does me playing differently necessarily mean that I'm scum?" seems fairly explicit regardless.

If you say so.

I'm flattered I'm in my own special category, given how recent a development

that

seems to be.

[Vi]

I don't really see why Vi is being singled out here

The alternative is CES finding another Townie to mislynch. Also, I'm the one with a wagon.

[Vi]

Vi, can you sum up your vote in a way that doesn't sound like Oh My God CES You Suck?

Well if you want to get down to brass tacks I wouldn't say CES sucks because that would imply that he's Town giving a good-faith effort. In the medium term what he's doing is working out well from a scum POV.

CES has spent the entire game thus far tunneling on four people, all of whom are actually pretty likely to be Town and all of whom just happen to have been the major wagons going on without his input. Three of them were targets of opportunity (Llamarble, N, penguin_alien) and I was just an easy pick along the way to lynching N and penguin_alien.

Now consider that Johhog softclaiming his power role sounds a

whole lot

like why he was killed (feel free to come up with an alternative explanation; I'll wait). Now you get to choose whether you believe I'm spinning webs of elaborate fake confusion about why he was killed, or if I was actually left out of the loop entirely AKA not scum. I'm legitimately surprised that people who have read a whole lot more of this game than I have (well, the Townies, anyway) have not picked up on this yet.

[Vi]

Vote: Cogito Ergo Sum

(L-3)

Though to be fair to all parties this was a bad vote.

Vote: Cogito Ergo Sum

(L-3)
#YOLO

Much better.

[Vi]

Vi, Tammy, T/S

You've seen a lot more Tammy-scum than I have, and from what I've heard I'm not going to be good at reading her.

With that said, T.

But why though? At this point even empire, who should be good at reading me, didn't feel really comfortable calling me town. Why did you, even with the caveat?

Because I had no reason not to except what I said.

So you're just arguing mild suckitude, is what you're saying? Mafia is a long-term game

And Tomorrow if there's no obvious safe push you just go with whoever winds up with the wagon. It's not that difficult when on a meta level there's no expectation for you to positively contribute.

Calling yourself a pre-existing major wagon is inaccurate and suspicious (also the only way of making what you said make a lick of sense).

News flash: Sometimes I don't make sense and sometimes that's actually not intentional.

You have lost all credibility by tacking "and suspicious" on. You wasted words on

that

feeble attempt to drive home your irrelevant point?

Did I really need to spell out that faking ignorance is a perfectly legitimate play?

Given how much :effort: I've put into this game I think it's an unlikely one.

I gots ta say, though, you're really stroking my ego about my scum game. It's a lot better than what I remember people (and Tammy) saying.

[Vi]

You have a weird definition of useful.

[Vi]

I may have conflated Tierce and you a bit in hindsight. My point was simply being suspicious of someone and not picking up on a fairly explicit softclaim is not all that likely to be the result of diligent scumhunting.

I don't see how anything you mentioned is supposed to be plausible anyway. Accountability, really?

Who is your current scumteam pick?
Vi, same thing to you.

This question seems pointless

CES, Konowa, DV, side order of Shadoweh maybe.

I agree that one player getting singled out for something like that is stupid. Vi saying that he didn't notice it and trying to flip it around with "I think that implicates you more than it implicated me!" is a bit unexpected and I don't really like it.

If people can't recognize Town tells when they see them I don't see a problem with pointing them out.

[Vi]

This question seems pointless

More pointless for you than CES, probably. But Shadoweh being the maybe maybe scumread for both of you is interesting.

...I'm glad I already think you're Town, because otherwise I would call this insincere.

But the question is: would you fake a town tell to sound like town?

The better question is whether I would do it so well.

Also, I'm not getting some of your points about CES. It's kinda hard to tunnel four people, having four suspects pretty much indicates not tunneling. Llamarble was a natural push and actually seemed odd to me that he wasn't tunneling Llamarble at the start of the game.

What part of "people who were already under suspicion" is not making sense to you? And how many people other than myself have you seen CES talk about to any significant degree today?

Why do you suspect Shadoweh and not OGML? Especially considering OGML has done next to nothing since replacing in except call for a wagon on benmage? (Actually, I'd like CES to fill me in on the Shadoweh suspicion too. I'm putting this here to see if you actually read my walls.

Shadoweh is leftovers from D1.
OGML replaced N, next question please. My starbuck$ are on seeing someone else in that slot by the end of D3.

[Vi]

Vi- Actually finding someone scummy overrules town ~feelings~! Saying I'm scum is weird too

(...)

If you want reasoning for a read, then feel free to ask, but some of them are probably not very good.

I'm pretty sure I can tell it's not very good without asking. The look I just gave my monitor, etc.

[Vi]

#SCREAMINGINFANTS

You packed the duct tape in the checked luggage, I see. :/

[Vi]

- On the other hand, Vi pushing the whole "he hasn't really looked at anyone else angle" in #847 is pretty awful if you know anything about the way CES plays. Dude's pretty much one of the tunnel-iest people I've played with so him focusing almost exclusively on Vi is really CES just being CES, nothing alignment indicative -- Vi's played with him even more than I have so I just find that argument really weak. I don't know much about CES's scum meta (every time I've tried to metagame him it just ends horribly) but the idea that CES was trying to absolve himself of responsibility seems kind of ridiculous. CES can get away with a lot of things regardless of his alignment so I don't think he'd try a cop out kind of play like that as scum. My read on Vi is still very much TBD and I want to go through his meta one more time when I'm feeling better.

Don't you think I kind of get this?

Like, CES is obnoxious and tunnels as Town, but

not to this extent

. You played in Tierce's game too, etc.

As for "absolving himself" - would it sound better if I said it was one of the least meaningful votes on the wagon?

I didn't really "push" anything. It's a fairly minor scum tell and it seemed like a nice thing to have accompanying my vote. I didn't even care enough to check if my memory of events was correct.

"I push crappy arguments just in case it helps people vote Vi"

When you're actually pushing the "smiley tell" it might be time to wonder if you're digging your nails a little too deep into the bottom of the barrel while you scrape for things to pick out.

[Vi]

Stop being bitter, Sixkuya.

I'll be sour instead. (>")>

[Vi]

and I dislike CES's push that the scum team was most likely three and that Vi was trying to sow confusion about the size of the scum team.

That's really not the accusation. I don't think Vi was trying to do anything anti-town, she just made the safe/standard play of going with what had already been said.

As opposed to the WiLd and WaCkY play of saying there were five! #YOLO

Like, I want to type some snarky response here about disclaimers on every post, but I can't bring myself to do it because of how abjectly stupid this point is. I partly blame my mystification that people are actually assuming CES is arguing in good faith here.

[Vi]

Vi: In ADwD I thought my team's traitor was town right up to when he was lynched (and originally thought he flipped traitor for the other team). I guess I can't prove that I missed Johhog breadcrumbing a PR here, but my ability to read subtle hints is provably awful. Besides, if he did wouldn't you be able to find it too now?

The second sentence looked like something I should glance over sometime but the other two sentences made no sense to me, and CES said you meant him, so etc.

I'm overdue for taking a serious look at this game, which ideally will happen by or before tomorrow night. You in particular can help me along by elaborating on this--

If I were to get involved in this 1 vs 1 that people seem happy to watch I'd be in favor of lynching Vi,

but I really dislike how one-dimensional this is.

--

You already admitted previously that you were basing it on what had been said in thread, so don't talk to me about disclaimers. Do you deny that you'd make that play as scum?

I deny I would make that post at all as scum, but the weight of that point assumes that people have any direction at all on how to read me so etc.

*snide remark about how incredibly stupid your point is and how people don't see that because I don't even know why goes here* <- smiley

[Vi]

Right.

Benmage is tunneling on someone with extra ridiculous piled on, which on some level seems like :benmage:. I don't know if he would be so terribly blatant about it as scum; I know he's willing to do the outrageous as scum but he tends toward bussing so being ludicrously wrong makes him seem less bad. With that said,

In contrast, reading through his play in Heroes of Comedy, he's a lot more aggressive (like, A LOT more, the difference is really significant), and he seemed to spend most of the time he was alive deliberately antagonizing MoI and not really giving a shit about his motivations but trying to discredit him as much as possible.

Please double-check now that you have another data point in re: me, please.

CES is still scum until Empire shows me that not only does CES push one person exclusively as Town, but he also does so with transparently bad reasoning. I'd actually like to ask Tierce about Ponies 2 here, since I certainly didn't keep a copy of that game.

Reading CTD shows me that Llamarble, Empire, N, and maybe Nacho are more likely Town, which is a bit unhelpful. I notice that CTD spent a lot of time arguing with Shadoweh without ever voting her.

The wetfox has been doing bothersome things that have had me waffling about his alignment all game. The whole exchange with and about CTD and massclaims early on looks Town-motivated given the way it happened, but then posts like this happen.

Ooo wait. I actually think the whole thing about 1407 and wanting to post an Empire case might be pretty town. Is there a way of quickly getting Penguin run up?

(...)

but yeah, I'm a bit unsure with the lack of time and everything, but I may actually want to push harder against a N lynch. I don't know what to say though. I think N is less likely scum than I thought before so we should lynch Penguin maybe?

This looks to me like we're dealing with an invertebrate who is putting on a show. I'm not sure if he'd waffle on me so publicly as scum though. I don't know, if I had to put my chips down on green or red I'd call Wetfox Town, but with reservations.

The most striking thing about Empire is his general unwillingness to follow up on his promised wallposts when he's here and what appear to be rolling back-to-back-to-back-to-back V/LAs. On the other hand he's displaying some of the same kind of eagerness Tierce is. This post looks completely out of character for him; the last part of this post looks Town. I really don't feel like assuming someone is Town having a bad day because it seems like a bunch of people fall into that category, but given the last link, there it is. Plus it would be a bad thing if he's scum because I've been shamelessly using his meta and reads as a baseline in lieu of actual effort and attention.

Faraday means wagon analysis. The most interesting wagon of the game is this one right here.

Llamarble (8) - Benmage, Empire, Deasvail, CrashTextDummie, Vi, penguin_alien, Tierce, Cogito Ergo Sum

This is the first L-1 wagon in a large game, four scum expected, maybe three on the wagon. Where are they?

Llamarble (8) - Benmage, Empire, Deasvail,

CrashTextDummie,

Vi, penguin_alien,

Tierce, Cogito Ergo Sum

I will eat Triple D's hat (actually I may just nibble on it) (he won't actually let me do it, mind) (but he'll fully believe I'll try) (and he should!) if there isn't at least one more scum SOMEWHERE in this quote. The obvious choice is CES, but then, "obvious" isn't really getting through to this crowd.

Konowa's first two pages and interactions with Tierce (e.g. 319) look real. Whole time, I was expecting something worse. The one-liner posting doesn't speak well to his credibility, though, and I really dislike this post. I would care more about promised effortposts that never actually come if there weren't like five people doing the same thing to be honest.

I know Llamarble is decent as scum but at this juncture I just don't feel the :effort: required to try to envision his posts coming from scum. The wobbly logic/vote progression he has Today doesn't seem very scumsensical, plus his reads have in hindsight not been bad and also a bit against the grain (see: 579).

N was replaced by OGML. I've said all I'm interested in saying about this slot.

Nacho's posting style in general screams scum because the quote stripes don't actually look like they're going anywhere. Yet I continue to be impressed by how Nacho

didn't

take the low-hanging fruit in 703. I wasn't actually intending to discredit Empire with my reference to the Activity Overview - quite the opposite; I was agreeing with him - but etc. Nacho's interactions with me and CES+Vi (in particular 841) look uniformly bad and leave me somewhat confused as to what to think here.

Shadoweh's opening posts, as mentioned before, look fabricated. Post 50 in particular looks like a failed attempt to contribute reads that are supposed to look legitimate. 462 looks pretty nice in hindsight. Shadoweh's willingness to call CES+Vi Town vs. Town looks interesting but so does the throw-out that she'd lynch me even with a trailing note that I'd like elaboration on.

I honestly don't know how to read Tammy; not before looking through her posts, not after.

Tierce is plying generic Tierce Town Tells, but the rest of her play is weak. I would have much more of an issue with this kind of play when and if she actually decides to start putting forth the :effort: to fake what she knows fully well are her Town tells, which I'm pretty sure is not this game.

After looking at Wickedestjr I found the whole thing completely boring. :/

----

tl;dr

CES is scum; after that, one vote for lease to someone who looks like they know what they're doing and have a lot more capacity for paying attention to this game than I do. I'll trade my initial zombie shambling behind Empire for doing the same with Llamarble. I'm most interested in the Llamarble wagon because that doesn't involve extensive reading, seems very likely to have multiple scum on it, and has a fair number of people who are quite likely to be Town on it for some nice PoE action.

Konowa, humor a self-centered meido. Why have you avoided comment on CES vs. me?

Tammy, since your vote isn't really showing it, who do you want lynched right now?

[Vi]

Speaking partly as a math major, that's actually an

impressively

bad attack on Llamarble. Got anything else on him?

[Vi]

I'm overdue for taking a serious look at this game, which ideally will happen by or before tomorrow night. You in particular can help me along by elaborating on this--

If I were to get involved in this 1 vs 1 that people seem happy to watch I'd be in favor of lynching Vi,

but I really dislike how one-dimensional this is.

I dislike how one-dimensional this -DAY- is. I'm noting my choice out of the two leading wagons that have polarized this day like they were running for President. I heard there aren't third-party candidates in Americalands. This is what I mean, and the fact that both you and CES are going balls to the walls at each other is contributing to it. I'm confused because I believe you're both town, yet the way you're both acting makes me think it's unlikely that two townies decided to get brain damage and ply these on the surface unreasonable cases.

It's also in my opinion unlikely that the day would be centered around this debate if you were both town, surely the scum would be shopping around for less high-profile and talkative targets to be blamed for lynching.

tl;dr I think you both sound town but logically one of you is scum and I can't tell the difference so I feel like a slack-jawed yokel.

I'm not sure how the bolded makes sense. If there are two Townies polarizing the Day and both are (as you think) giving unreasonable cases on each other, why would the scum

not

push one or the other except for the sake of vociferously objecting and landing on a token third not-gonna-be-lynched party?

In possibly-related news, I'm not joining you on Wickedestjr.

(Also, weren't you saying I was easy to read D1?)

P.S. the scum in that quote is you, Vi. That was a pretty substanceless wagon analysis. Do you even believe in wagon analysis as a general principle?

Um, yes? I've definitely tried to replicate the Scumputer in my own notes on a few occasions (albeit without success). I'm not really sure where to go with substanceless since you drew your own conclusion from it, snide or otherwise.

---

I'll take Tierce, N, and Llamarble as free Town reads. Actually reading Empire 709 he's in the No Doubt list.
Empire vouches for Tammy and DeasVail (862). I'm politely ignoring Empire on Benmage and Nacho, the former more than the latter.

Benmage
Cogito Ergo Sum

DeasVail
Empire

Konowa

Llamarble
OhGodMyLife

Nachomamma8
Shadoweh

Tammy
Tierce
Vi

Wickedestjr

As smug and satisfied as I would feel if Benmage and CES were both scum, I can't help but have reservations. As it is, looking at the game this way I don't think that this game is necessarily as difficult as our power Towners are making it out to be as long as these Town reads hold. Three scum out of six non-strong Town reads (and myself, I suppose, but I've been kind of obvious Town in patches here and there all Day) is actually pretty reasonable.

But wait, there's more! :smug: :notyetsatisfied:

Llamarble (7)

- Benmage,

Empire,

Deasvail,

CrashTextDummie,

Vi,

penguin_alien,

Tierce,

Cogito Ergo Sum

Filling in strong Town reads and flips only. Again, highly unlikely that all the groupscum were off the wagon (with no counter) since it's a major D1 L-1 wagon on a somewhat easy target. Exclude DeasVail if preferred because see above etc.. DO HO HO

And that's why we should be lynching CES Today.

[Vi]

Empire vouches for Tammy (709) and DeasVail (862).

Editing, clarity, etc.

[Vi]

Because scum are subconsciously aware that they are pushing two townies and are unable to keep a straight posting face about it.

Y... You mean to tell me...

scum don't push mislynches?

Who

do

you want lynched?

Also: Can you do wagon analysis that includes more then one wagon I mean you're already using an unflipped person's wagon for proof so..

Are you saying you suspect Llamarble?

But sure, let's throw out more wagons and see what happens.

penguin_alien (5)

- Konowa, Wickedestjr, Cogito Ergo Sum,

Johhog,

Shadoweh

The initial pengualien wagon for I have no idea why. Given the (AFAICT) utter lack of reasoning behind it and how large it got it's unlikely to be all-Town. Put it down for 1 scum for now, start by lynching CES.

penguin_alien (9)

- Deasvail, Konowa, Shadoweh,

Llamarble,

Wickedestjr, Nachomamma8,

Vi,

Benmage,

Johhog

N (6)

-

Tierce,

CrashTextDummie,

Empire,

penguin_alien,

Tammy, Cogito Ergo Sum

D1's end wagons - N is not included because he was being stupid with his vote but I don't think he's scum anyway. Again, highly doubt that all of the groupscum were on pengualien given that N is probably not scum (though tbh it's not impossible).

Vi (3)

- Benmage, Cogito Ergo Sum, Tammy
Cogito Ergo Sum (4) -

Empire,

Vi,

OhGodMyLife, Tierce

WickedestJr (3) - Shadoweh, Nachomamma8, Konowa
Konowa or DeasVail (3) - Deasvail,

Llamarble,

Wickedestjr

Taken from one of the more recent vote counts Today. Can I get a Kool-Aid style OH YEAH (a Sweet-style OHHH YEAH! is also acceptable) for the all-probTown wagon on CES. Beyond that you can choose your own adventure as to where the scum are; any attempt at a division here would seem arbitrary IMO.

---
@CES: But it can't be that boring because you're responding to it! Clearly the best way for you to show that you really (don't) care about what I have to say is to shut up.

...actually don't do that. You're making yourself fun and personally gratifying to wagon. :justice:

[Vi]

On Llamarble: I don't not-suspect him enough to assume he's already flipped town and I still think its weird how he turned into a Bunny Ears Lawyer on day start. Weird isn't scummy though. I just wanted to point out you were using one early day moment instead of a fairly fruitful day wagonwise.

Day 1 was terrible wagonwise. Day 2 stands a good chance of being worse (it looks like we're going to be moving to

another

deadline scramble because no one cares about this game). So what did you learn from this bounty of wagons?

Yes scum push mislynches, but they tend to flinch and I find it unusual that so many people would JUST go for you/CES.

I think you're overstating things.

WickedestJr (3) - Shadoweh, Nachomamma8, Konowa
Konowa or DeasVail (3) - Deasvail, Llamarble, Wickedestjr

So you're saying scum is more likely in this group (read: not Benmage/CES/Tammy)?

---

If you want to talk about tunneling, Vi, have you seen OGML's posts Today?

Only accidentally. Reading them again, that's not tunneling.

[Vi]

While I think about what just happened, how is N's replacement not Very Town?

How is it Very Town?

Either we're going to need to establish that N is a horrible person who is willing to flame you and then hatequit on a game, or etc.

OGML replaced N, next question please. My starbuck$ are on seeing someone else in that slot by the end of D3.

[Vi]

I don't doubt that Vi can fake her town tone.

This is why we should lynch CES Today.

Also, Llamarble didn't even mention the part that makes me superTown.

[Vi]

Thought I posted tomorrow

We have got to re-break the board's timestamps so this post works.

[Vi]

So I might have just taken a twelve- or thirteen-hour nap.

Vi can you tell me what your supertowntell was?

Y'know, it kind of defeats the purpose of everything I was doing D1 if I just

told

you.

Latter half of 910.

---

I really don't get vi's near certainty that the N/OGML slot is town. I haven't seen anything that really looks townish, and I don't know anything about OGML but does he usually not really do anything in a game?

OGML hasn't done anything Townish. With that said, please see post 920.

(One reason I'm extremely skittish about reading you is because I'm told this kind of thought process does not work on you at all.)

I've seen him as scum tunnel on town and stay there even though they started dropping town tells that other people were noticing

Sekrit: This is what's going on right now; please see Llamarble's and Wetfox's posts for more etc.

I don't know what the smiley tell thing is though, that seems a bit silly? Unless its a personal vi thing.

The tell might not be entirely bad, but as applied there it's rubbish as it was obviously placed there deliberately. (That and I post smileys like a text-messaging hipster. #HASHTAG)

Me having posts where it looks like I'm paying attention to the game might come from me periodically trying to get into the game, albeit with limited success. I really don't know what to tell you if you think that I would willingly join a game like this and not try to care.

[Vi]

Pre-emptively, w.r.t. "omg ur still tunneling on CES" - If I had to switch votes to someone else it would be Konowa.

4.5 days left.

[Vi]

Because you're trying to undermine a Town read that I'm keeping for reasons that (to me at least) seem self-evident, and likely not doing so in good faith.

Given that other people are voicing similar concerns I'm not opposed to looking at him again later, but I'm not interested in voting him Today.

[Vi]

If you don't mind, I'd like to skip on the thought process questions.

I have to say I'm a bit intrigued that you aren't really trying to read me. That might not be the right word, but I just woke up and meh. And it's not because I'm totally self-centered but I've been getting antsy lately when I get town reads for almost no reasons, even though I'm always town, and even though this isn't exactly that, it's making me wonder. On the one hand, if you were scum, you could just call me town because you'd know that. But I'm not even sure what I'm trying to say here or what I really think about it.

Well I do appreciate being intriguing. Right now my reason for throwing you into the Town pile (not just a casual metaphor; it's very much the mental image of thoughtlessly pitching you into a pile) is because Empire emphatically said so and I don't have much of a reason to doubt him or disagree like with Benmage and Nacho.

YOLO! (unless you're reincarnated and then you might just come back as a troglodyte and wouldn't that be fun?)

See my first post for my alternative.

[Vi]

Oh and vi can you link me to a scum (or mafia) game that is not you as a hydra? And ideally not one in which you spammed the game in latin or in what I can only assume is Harry potter fan fiction? Oh and maybe something other than experimental mafia?

Otters vs. Tigers vs. Sharks, aka "what do you mean I can't bus my whole team" IIRC. Since a lot of that game died in the crash, that leaves DEFCON 3.0, which was one of many games I'd just as soon not see resurface due to the extreme badness therein. Please see wiki etc.

That is also evident in the wagon analysis.

I don't get the wagon analysis especially for non flipped people and is jut looks premature and like busy work.

So this is the part where you stop talking until you tell me that one of those blue reads is scum. Otherwise, despite however you may feel about this, what you're saying is unfounded.

With that said, quickly looking at Maf.Maiden you are correct - you were the first person to get six votes and they were all from Town. With that said
*this was an L-1 wagon
*there were no counterwagons and it was the closest this game ever got to passing for activity that wasn't 36 hours before deadline (which we're going toward again)

And he points out the llamarble thing (when he had the big wagon) but didn't note that he was one of the first to move off and say there was something there.

This is easy to do for Town points.

I still think that the exchange in Post 786 feels weird as I don't see suggesting he didn't notice the soft claim and is evidence of not diligence scumhunting and simultaneously claiming that he belongs to the same scum team that,killed him for his claim. Unless he's talking about the suspicion yesterday? My heads spinning. But I hate the "oh, so you killed johhog". It feels off to me for some reasons.

I'd like to explain but this first sentence isn't in a grammatical structure I can understand.

---

Honestly the thing that worries me most about this is the insistence that there

must

be one scum between me and CES. Regardless of how I feel about the Dutchie, being forced into a situation where it's possible that both of us are Town and the lynch is just kind of ~decided~ to be between one of us for vague reasons ("well they're the ones arguing, and it's taken up the whole day [because literally half the game isn't posting], and when two people go after each other all the time like this is must be TownVscum") is setting off giant red fireworks.

This plus the fact that it takes seven people to lynch and we have seven people posting

Benmage,

Cogito Ergo Sum, Deasvail,

Empire,

Konowa,

Llamarble,

OhGodMyLife,

Nachomamma8, Shadoweh, Tammy,

Tierce,

Vi,

Wickedestjr

is doing nothing for my confidence, not least because even if they were here I don't know if it would be more than "uh, game's hard, I'm just going to vote here". Swap Empire for Nacho depending on whose shift it is.

Also I'd like to bring this up again since I found it while looking for who I need to hate for the above--

It's also in my opinion unlikely that the day would be centered around this debate if you were both town, surely the scum would be shopping around for less high-profile and talkative targets to be blamed for lynching.

Because scum are subconsciously aware that they are pushing two townies and are unable to keep a straight posting face about it. That really doesn't seem to be happening here, there's a tenseness in the air. At least that's what I think. (I don't really want a Wicked wagon anyways and no one else is interested so okay.)

Yes scum push mislynches, but they tend to flinch and I find it unusual that so many people would JUST go for you/CES.

Vi (3)

- Benmage, Cogito Ergo Sum, Tammy
Cogito Ergo Sum (4) -

Empire,

Vi,

OhGodMyLife, Tierce

WickedestJr (3) -

Shadoweh,

Nachomamma8, Konowa
Konowa or DeasVail (3) - Deasvail,

Llamarble,

Wickedestjr

Okay, so if there are Definitely scum pushing one of the two major wagons here, which one is it?

Hmm let me think.

(Actually if you think me and OGML are scum, that kind of backfires, doesn't it.)

Orange name is there to prove a point - you're doing exactly what you're saying you think scum would do. Whether this is you admitting to being scum or you admitting your own philosophy is etc.

At this point I think I'm just being bitter in a vague general direction.

[Vi]

Nacho's interactions with me and CES+Vi (in particular 841) look uniformly bad and leave me somewhat confused as to what to think here.

I have no idea how to handle either of you, although you seem more approachable recently. How do you think I should approach you two?

How about "a way that isn't scummy as hell".

But Shadoweh being the maybe maybe scumread for both of you

[Vi and CES]

is interesting.

This is bullshit.

When that towntell is based on NK analysis, I tend to cringe a little bit.

This is denying the obvious under a buzzword.

Who is your current scumteam pick?
Vi, same thing to you.

This not only doesn't relate to the quote that it's under, but a

scumteam

pick is ludicrous, especially if you're going to follow up with "but how can they be on a team?".

Still feeling fine with a Wicked lynch, but I want to focus a lot more on CES-Vi today.

See comment in previous posts.

I don't doubt that Vi can fake her town tone. Just look at her points against me. There's not a hint of analysis to be found in them; it's closer to a rejection of thought.

I would imagine that it would be easier for Vi to fake her tone as opposed to fake analysis.

Tammy, I am going to look over your Vi walls tomorrow or later than tomorrow.

And this is you positioning yourself to be on your wagon. I'm tempted to tell you to vote me and get it over with since that's clearly where you're going with this.

[Vi]

Maybe CES and Vi should just both claim to give the rest of us more data.
Bedtime.

And you know what? On one hand this honestly came across as mildly offensive the first time I read it; on the other hand I think the chance of me making it to tomorrow unscathed is very low and after those last two posts I kind of want to screw over as many wrong and scummy people as I can.

I'm a 2-Shot Vanilla Cop. I was going to quote some Sherlock early on but then Tierce did it first and that was the first of many times that I lost interest in this game.

For information on who I investigated last Night and how it went see how I went from this--

Is there a reason people are ignoring Wickedestjr?

Especially with those glasses

.

and while Wickedestjr's posts feel like scum I don't have the time right now to find out what it is everyone else is seeing in him

--to this--

CES, Konowa, DV, side order of Shadoweh maybe.

After looking at Wickedestjr I found the whole thing completely boring. :/

Someone somewhere said that they agreed with me on Wickedestjr and I really have no idea how because I said literally nothing to justify my read - I didn't even bother to look at his posts in isolation to get a cover excuse.

It's not implausible for "Mafia Vanilla" to be a role in this game - I note with some amusement that I would investigate as "Vanilla", as the role returns whether someone has "Vanilla" in their role name - but I don't find that likely. If I'm wrong, it wouldn't be the first time I've gotten a pseudo-Miller role (and lynched for it, potentially), but I'm going to assume that Faraday didn't go to that level of "quirky role design" in this game in particular. (He totally would, just not in this game.)

So now that we've taken two wagons out of three off the table, this is the part where you start scrambling. Make my day.

[Vi]

Post 904 was not made by Wickedestjr, obviously.

[Vi]

Quintuple posting because :spite: .

[Vi]

No way of justifying it without the result. Plus I thought the third wagon was on Konowa and not W.jr until this morning, so I didn't think he was getting lynched anyway.

[Vi]

I'll take

Tierce,

N,

and

Llamarble

as free Town reads. Actually reading

Empire

709 he's in the No Doubt list.
Empire vouches for

Tammy

and

DeasVail

(862). I'm politely ignoring Empire on Benmage and Nacho, the former more than the latter.

Benmage
Cogito Ergo Sum

DeasVail

Empire

Konowa

Llamarble

OhGodMyLife

Nachomamma8
Shadoweh

Tammy

Tierce

Vi

Wickedestjr

[Vi]

...

I had already explained at length how Tierce, N, and Llamarble were Town. At that point I moved to agree with basically everyone else on Empire. Tammy was a read Empire stood behind very strongly, and you were one that Empire explained well enough plus the aforementioned strong standing-behind.

These are all Town reads that basically no one should have a problem with.

(Except N as it turns out, but I think we've covered that at length too.)

That is the bloody point of that post.

Wickedestjr does not fit in this model.

[Vi]

Ow, sorry, I'm about to go to work so I can't reply in bigness to Vi's hatred. (Why is it CES and you take turns between fighting to sucker punch me every time I post?)

Just to see if you're paying attention!

I think I go out of my way not to point out the scummy things I'm doing as scum, but I haven't scoured myself to check it. Good to know where you want the scrambling directed to though. Not that I'm bitter.

Well you're one of a few people I'd rather see the scramble go toward (see rainbow post), but if you want to volunteer~

I just have one question, are you -sure- that you're a Vanilla cop that looks for the word Vanilla and not a Vanilla Cop that looks to see if someone has a role or not, ie a Mafia Goon would trigger a positive from your role as well?

I'm -sure-. Otherwise I prrrrrobably wouldn't be nearly this confident on investigating a scum read.

--

So your role is a slightly stronger (but 2-shot) version of the one in Zach's game, Vi?

Before checking my wiki, my response was: Which Zach game?
After checking my wiki, my response is: Which Zach game?

How much, if any, reading did you do overnight?

None at all!
Any other attempts to discredit me in mind? I've got all day.*

*all day = 73 hours

[Vi]

This is bullshit.

Double ISO yourself and CES, control+F "Shadoweh", and call it bullshit again. You both interact with Shadoweh a little and attack her early game, then go into ignoring her for a little while, then she ends up being "D1 leftovers" for both of you. It's interesting, yeah.

How so?

^^^That's not a rhetorical question. How is it interesting?

And this is you positioning yourself to be on your wagon. I'm tempted to tell you to vote me and get it over with since that's clearly where you're going with this.

It surprises me that you say this because I have been waffling hard as shit recently.

Still feeling fine with a Wicked lynch, but I want to focus a lot more on CES-Vi today.

...which you have. Maybe if you're waffling about which of CES or Vi to vote, I suppose. See also the end of 982.

I didn't mean to be offensive

I'm kind of offendable right now. :/

I had a lot of stuff to say about Vi that's basically been voided by his claim (which I think is real).

"You're welcome" or "Sorry", depending on which is more appropriate.

Sorry for the triple post but I just checked out NY 146 to get the full details on the Vanilla Cop role and Vi, you reviewed this game.

...a year and a half ago. Your choice as to whether you buy that I picked this role up out of one of dozens I've reviewed (this one in particular being from two Octobers ago) and then tried to cover my tracks by elaborately saying I'd never heard of the game before since it wasn't on my wiki.

Vi being a reviewer of 146 is interesting.

I find this interesting too! Do continue.

[Vi]

Her DV vote is what I

would have done

as Town, so as reaction I wanted to see how she responded to me calling her Town early and then brushing off the "wtfcritwallz".

Ah. You were referring to this instead of "would do", right? ( [x] language )

(Well excuse me for being asleep.)

But vi why did you choose wicked to investigate?

A personal scum read who everyone thought was Town who would be a nightmare to go through and would probably coast all the way down.

That, and at the time of that post, I was reading

TOWN (S->W):

Tierce, Benmage, DV, Tammy, [gap], Shadoweh, Konowa, Llamarble, [gap], Johhog, CES

Scum in {

CTD,

N, Nacho, penguin, Vi,

Wickedestjr}

See also

and more importantly, our Town mascots Tierce and Empire are most likely completely off the mark.

P-Edit: Pretty sure I had CTD in my PoE pool.

That's one.

Vi, my main question regarding your claim is: why didn't you read Johhog last Night?

Why would I?

Two and a half days to deadline. I'll decide who to vote when I get back in.

---

#stillnotcontent: Vi, your rainbow pattern is broken. Though I do appreciate the red pick.

Mauve IS a color of the rainbow! *huff*

[Vi]

Oh and vi can you link me to a scum (or mafia) game that is not you as a hydra? And ideally not one in which you spammed the game in latin or in what I can only assume is Harry potter fan fiction? Oh and maybe something other than experimental mafia?

Otters vs. Tigers vs. Sharks, aka "what do you mean I can't bus my whole team" IIRC. Since a lot of that game died in the crash, that leaves DEFCON 3.0, which was one of many games I'd just as soon not see resurface due to the extreme badness therein. Please see wiki etc.

Thank you. Couldnt you have claimed before I read through that though?

You needed to see PookyTheMagicalBearxInternet Stranger.

Honestly the thing that worries me most about this is the insistence that there

must

be one scum between me and CES. Regardless of how I feel about the Dutchie, being forced into a situation where it's possible that both of us are Town and the lynch is just kind of ~decided~ to be between one of us for vague reasons ("well they're the ones arguing, and it's taken up the whole day [because literally half the game isn't posting], and when two people go after each other all the time like this is must be TownVscum") is setting off giant red fireworks.

If this is in reference to me it pretty much highlights one of the things that has bugged me about you not giving a read on me because you're skittish. It's not like I'm a lurker who doesn't post things and is therefore hard to read. I've posted quite a bit of content, so the "I'm relying on empire here" makes it convenient for you to change at your whim and you don't have to worry about looking unnatural shifting a town read if necessary. Saying that it doesn't feel like townvtown and that I'd be super surprised if both of you were town doesn't even come close to insisting that there must so strong must is italicized be that way.

And if you're not sure one of the two of you is scum, why has all of your arguments and evidence been pointing to the obvious argument that ces is scum

The latter part is more interesting than the former.
You must think me unnaturally dense to not keep an eye on what's going on around me whilst I pursue someone I think is scum. News flash: I'm not so single-minded and convinced that I'm right that I don't watch what other people are doing. That would require me to be a patsy for scum. I kind of hate it when that happens.

Oh and you asked in Post 1007 why you would read johhog? Didn't he fit a similar criteria? Scum red of yours a lot of people thought was town?

...not really.
Also, you're ignoring that I was using my investigation to

avoid

reading someone. (>")>

So, since you're whinging about reading through an old bad scum game before I claimed, and also trying to find reasons to call me scum, would you like to pick the kind of obvious correct side now?

---

YOUR BUS DOES NOT IMPRESS ME

I always do feel bad when people replace into scum slots at times like this.

---

Not actually going anywhere with this post because I don't actually want to think right this second. <("<)

[Vi]

as the great artist Juvenile once said, back that thang up

although he was talking about butts, not reads.

but really how disimilar are the two

sheep me, Tammy, I'm a PRETTY COOL GUY who KNOWS WHAT HE'S DOING

lynch all liars
you decide which part is the lie

---

That last one was a left over complaint, and I don't typically try to find reasons to call someone scum. However, sometimes they do jump in my lap and go "woof".

It's not

my

fault you smell like presunto.

UT hasn't posted enough to get a good read on him, though his posts that he'll be the shepherd and won't lead me astray feel like town on a gut level

But it must not be actual presunto because you appear to have indigestion (potentially research-paper induced). How are you taking it as anything other than bluster?

---

Also for Tierce - if you were referring to the order of the colors with the "wrong rainbow" comment, there's an obvious reason for why everyone is each color. Except Empire, but we have too much orange in this game. Even if that really IS an awesome avvy someone should be properly thanked for.

---

Vote: Shadoweh

(#yoLo-3)

[Vi]

Also I'm loving Vi's sideways attempts to discredit me without actually calling me scum. It's cute, really.

You're scum.

Revel in this unusual clarity of speech from me.

[Vi]

If you subscribe to the "Benmage scum usually looks at least a little pro-town when scum" bit, then why did you care about his contribution petering off? Shouldn't that reassure you a little bit?

Did you really just post this?

One day left to deadline; nothing to be gained from a No Lynch, pick a wagon and move it move it.

Cut: *snerk*

[Vi]

If you subscribe to the "Benmage scum usually looks at least a little pro-town when scum" bit, then why did you care about his contribution petering off? Shouldn't that reassure you a little bit?

Did you really just post this?

One day left to deadline; nothing to be gained from a No Lynch, pick a wagon and move it move it.

Cut: *snerk*

are you kidding me

"You said Benmage looks a little pro-Town as scum and Benmage is doing something scummy here so that means he's Town right?"

Please justify this logic. Please. I don't have popcorn but I have hot chocolate and that's close enough to party food for me.

---

Your reaction to your wagon isn't actually awful, though in your position if I didn't want a CES lynch I would make another one happen.

Benmage sure is the guy everybody wants to lynch but nobody is voting.

Benmage (1) - Shadoweh

[Vi]

Hey Nacho. Wanna vote Benmage?

[Vi]

Hey Tierce. Wanna vote Benmage?

[Vi]

Perhaps. What's your take on the CESta wagon?

[Vi]

Well, I meant joining the CES wagon. Y/N

[Vi]

Yes, that's what you were saying D1.

Then, that leaves us with the maybe-chance on Shadoweh or a better chance on Benmage, thinkest thou not?

[Vi]

Vi, whats your meta on Ben town v Ben scum?

I don't have one. I also don't care.

CES' wagon is funky enough right now that I wouldn't be surprised if it contained one of his scumbuddies. UT + CES would make sense to me.
I would love to see a few guesses at buddy-pairings.

No and stop saying scummy things. You're ruining my everything.

I'm going to be honest, everyone who wasn't in gray in that one post is fair game and it's OPEN SEASON with 24 hours left to go. Pick someone and go with it, dragging your friends along. This is not the time to stay put.

[Vi]

Unvote, Vote: Benmage

The wagon I always wanted and it's finally here! Oh happy day.

Goes back to playing Pathfinder...

...

[Vi]

At this point I would like to be a total prick and say that one of the

wonderful

things about playing Mafia with greater-than-72-hour deadlines is that we could be lynching UT right now if we had more than half a day (as opposed to Faraday) right now.

[Vi]

Day 2, Votecount 15

Untrod Tripod (2) - Deasvail, Tammy
Shadoweh (3) - Tierce, Cogito Ergo Sum, Vi

Benmage (4) - Nachomamma8, OhGodMyLife, Shadoweh, Llamarble

OhGodMyLife (1) - Benmage
Cogito Ergo Sum (2) - Untrod Tripod, Zachrulez

Not voting (1) :

Empire

• With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.
  
• Deadline is on 22nd of March at 11:59pm GMT
  
• Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2013-03-22 19:59:59)
  
• No One V/la

For people on the go (e.g. me).

@Zach: I aim to please! or insult, but in this case please.

@UT: Out of interest, what reference were you making with that image?

The CES wagon is officially bad. Zach, please move off. UT and Benmage are both great alternatives.

[Vi]

My main thoughts on a UT wagon at this exact second is it's kind of close to what happened to myself, someone who was considered a side target all day getting wagoned last minute.

Weren't you just saying that the Day was focused around me and CES? Just saying, etc.

I'd also like to agree with Tierce, except for the part about wanting to move off of UT.

Unvote: Shadoweh
Vote: Untrod Tripod

(L-2)

[Vi]

And pointless.

[Vi]

Vi - Why did you go from thinking CES was obvious scum to thinking his wagon was a terrible wagon?

When it vanished entirely and got replaced by UT on his own.

I don't buy this claim due to basically all of Tammy 1202. Hammah please.