Open 81 - The New C9 - Game Over
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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um, wow, no random voting stage? To be fair, I honestly feel likevoting roflcopterhere because quite honestly, armix's post doesn't look like rolefishing, it looks like an honest defense to what looks like a ridiculous crusade on your part that takes up half of page 1."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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I think it's pretty clear who I think is the scummiest right now. I admit I misread the post, but I still say while armix's question could be rolefishing, I honestly would probably ask that myself. It seemed to be a relatively random clearing."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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I know that was at iamausername, but I'd like to put in that if I said why, I wouldn't JUST be thinking of town roles. I'd probably be asking to find out if you had some sort of meta read that made you sure, or to call a bluff on an unsubstantiated claim. There are other possibilities than the one you are looking at, and the fact you are trying to FORCE it into that one possibility leads me to believe I might be on the right track voting you.roflcopter wrote: @iamausername, you may think its a stupid trap, but it worked. when someone says "player x is obvtown" at the start of day one, and someone else says "why?" the only answer they're looking for or thinking is "because i'm a town power role duh."-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Ugh. Fine,unvote roflcopter. Back to square one I guess. I guess I'll see what happens now :S. I still don't see armix's actions as a rolefish. Lowell's actions WERE a blatant rolefish, but I find myself agreeing with his logic."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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FoS STrangerCoug. I rather dislike how reluctant you were to get off the mason claimants, and then still trying to make it look like they could be scum. It's been beaten to death, but let's reiterate again. D1 mason claims would be pretty stupid for scum to do. I'm not ready to vote you yet, but should a wagon appear on you, I will sure as hell join it."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Well, in case you all DO want to kill me shortly, I might as well point out I'm a vanilla townie. No claim here, continue voting at will. I'm actually quite astounded that that one statement got a wagon on me. To be honest, I was justifying intuition. I don't feel that StrangerCoug is town, but I'm maddeningly incapable of backing that up with much more, hence why I only FoS'd. I didn't want to start the bandwagon because I didn't have any "real" evidence. If a wagon started, my intuition would be more justified, and I also might actually find the reason that I'm suspicious of him, other than what I said. I also think at this point there is probably at least one scum on my wagon (since they should pretty clearly know I'm not scum). Given that, I willvote Vamparificsince from what I can tell, he just waltzed in and jumped on the running wagon. Pretty easy way to hide as everyone was accusing me of attempting to do. I also am supsicious of StrangerCoug, but since that's not likely to go anywhere, let's hit the other one who looks mildly scummy here.
Also, I have 5 votes on my wagon. Thanks ."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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THANK you. Someone understands my logic here, even if you didn't quote it. Also, I only see two claims...am I missing something? I claimed to be a regular townie...I don't think that really counts as claiming, lol. As for my wagon, I still think that was way too quick and a bit weak. I said one thing that could be taken badly, and then explained my reasoning for it in a later post after I suddenly end up with 5 votes on me. I'm surprised no one has addressed that at all. Please, tell me what your new thoughts are given my explanation. Will you keep your vote on me, take it off, spontaneously combust? (scum, please choose the third option). I think it'd be rather helpful to know.
I'll say that this post by Vamp looks enough like opportunistic scum behaviour to warrant Unvote, Vote: Vamparific. Forbidden's post Was scummy so I have no problem with her wagon. Just think Vamp is better."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Because EVERYONE would claim to be a regular townie, even scum. I mean, generally, the assumption is everyone is a townie until they seem otherwise, whether by admitting they have an aux role or because their posts reek of mafianess."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Um...that's...pretty ridiculous. The scum know who they aren't. They already know I'm a townie, no matter what I said. And plus, I could be lying about being a townie, and could have a role I'd rather keep hidden. I don't, but it's a possibility. There's also the fact that since it looks like we had a rather fast wagon on me that possibly could have gone to completion, claiming regular townie at least reassures people they aren't killing an aux. Really, I don't see stating "I am a vanilla townie" as a tell either way."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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I cede your points. I forgot the SK was considered scum. And the fact that it could be considered anti-town if I'm shrinking the pool of potential power roles. Sorry."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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You weren't even at half the votes needed for a lynch. It would take some really dumb play from a lot of people for you to go from 4 votes to 9 without a chance to post in between, so your claim came far too early.
Just to fix this. I had 5 votes, not four votes. Coug miscounted. I'm at 4 with Strife's vote change. So, I was definitely at over half of the votes needed for a lynch. Just bugged me slightly."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Vamparific has more against him than you realize. You don't just throw a vote on a bandwagon with "I agree with what everyone else has said". Especially when you get into higher vote counts. It was the 4th vote, so not really bad, but it's still very fishy to walk in, vote with such a flimsy reason, and walk out. Then he comes back with his only defense being "I always screw myself over"? Yeah, that's not scummy at ALL. The "very little" you speak of is ridiculous. I had intuition on you for my FoS. I can't vote on intuition. Well, I CAN, but it's not good play. I do however feel if a wagon did form on you, someone would point out what my intuition was going off on, so I'd feel better about voting you;. Vamparific however, was just a straight reading the evidence. It's scummy, no two ways about it. So, I really think that you aren't examining the situation well, StrangerCoug."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Precisely my question, but you beat me to it, username. The unvote isn't going to get my vote off you. It actually makes me feel better about it. It's SCUMMY to vote and unvote without reasons."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Lowell, you've been mentioning pro town vibes a lot. If you don't mind me asking, who AREN'T you getting pro town vibes from, or possibly even scum vibes?"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Mostly what I already brought up. And fix your quotes in another post, PLEASE. You seem to think my reasons for voting you and vamp are the same. They aren't, and I have much more substantiation with Vamp (which still isn't much, but it's D1). Your case is mostly intuition, meaning I'd basically rather wait, as you say, to see what others thing to see what my intuition is going off on, since I can't seem to find much else than what I actually put down for my reasons for FoSing you. I think that covers it."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Meh, I don't know if I CAN make a case. I know what you say about intuition, but mine is rather frustrating as it's something I usually can't consciously pick out quickly. I'll relook it over (I did it once), but I don't think I'll get anywhere with that case. The case on Vamp, however, is not looking good in my eyes. He hasn't even TRIED to defend himself."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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I've relooked, and I think I know what happened. I got Coug's stance slightly confused and thought I saw a contradiction. I still FoS based on the idea that he was REALLY reluctant to get off pseudo confirmed townie roflcopter, buuut, I don't think I'd vote him, especially with vamp popping in and out with one sentence posts."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Arguable. Cougar was holding his vote pending a claimWhy did you claim at -4?? Claiming should NOT be done until you're at about -2. And just out the blue with no-one asking for a claim? What's that about?
Argument about whether the scum know who's town or not. I was under the impression the SK didn't count as scum so much as being in it for his own sake. I kinda screwed up my thinking here. It happens.Sorry, but where did the SK come into this topic?
In most of the games I have played on other forums, claiming townie is kinda just something implied. I forget about the SK and mafia being two seperate scum factions. I personally didn't see it as claiming because when I think claim, I think claiming a power role. So sue me, it's getting used to how things are done around here. I doubt I'm gonna be an NK target for it with so much suspicion surrounding me, and there was suspicion surrounding me even if I hadn't claimed vanilla townie.forbiddenlight, I'm utterly confused as to how claiming Vanilla Townie isn't really claiming, have you gotten Vanilla Townie and being generally protown mixed up?
Just figured I'd address those points."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Um, wow, ok. Geez...I want to stick on vamp, but I want to vote Korts too...that is blatant rolefishing...but...I feel better about vamp. No reasoning at all. However,HoS:Korts. Even if it's not rolefishing it's pointing something out that can only help the scum. Even if you think it's obvious, you don't come out and say it, because there is always a chance of stupid scum. In fact, isn't this the main argument against me? Revealing I'm a townie lowers the pool of power roles...but saying "Well, you've made it clear you aren't the vig"...doesn't? I think that's nigh hypocritical."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Ok, one thing, did you see it before you posted or after, Korts? Doing something because you "can't help yourself" isn't good play. (yeah, I know, I'm one to talk, but it's still true)."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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I did. I misphrased that. What I meant was did you see it hurt the town before or after you posted that?Korts wrote:
Did I see what before I posted?forbiddanlight wrote:Ok, one thing, did you see it before you posted or after, Korts? Doing something because you "can't help yourself" isn't good play. (yeah, I know, I'm one to talk, but it's still true).-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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lol, sarnath'ed. Ok, well, in that case...I'll drop to anFoS KortS. I can't let that go, but it's not quite as bad as it initially seemed."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Then play, or be lynched. Give REASONS for your votes, don't pop in and out with random voting and unvoting. The time for that has passed!"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Let me say I don't support the KortS lynch. I feel he made an honest mistake, that was worth an FoS, but he doesn't need to die for it. I don't feel good about that wagon. I prefer a Vamp lynch, since it is obvious we aren't going to get any insightful play from him, as well as the fact he's been playing scummy. I don't see KortS as the play. This can change, but I don't see it yet."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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But, it's not JUST a policy lynch. Can you say with full honestly Vamp hasn't been scummy? The policy is a factor, but to be honest his play has just been really scummy. That's the main reason I support it."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Because the comment is still questionable. Even as an honest mistake one must be open to the idea of slips. I still stand by vamp being scummy, but I will do a reread to see who I favor in the KortS/armix debate here, if either. I'm also going out, so I probably won't post my conclusions from the reread til I get back.iamausername wrote:
If you think it was an honest mistake, why is it worth a FoS?forbiddanlight wrote:Let me say I don't support the KortS lynch. I feel he made an honest mistake, that was worth an FoS, but he doesn't need to die for it.
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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I apologize for being out longer than I thought I would last night, and thusly unable to do my reread with thoughts. I would do it today but I'm also going to be out til later tonight. However, I do know when I'll be back and it'll leave time for a good look at things. I'm sorry if it sounds like I'm trying to delay or something, but this weekend hasn't been very free due to real life (understandable, I assume, for people who live in America, given the 4th of July thing). So, tonight for certain I'll return with a good post about my thoughts after a reread. I apologize for the absences ."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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This post brought to you by the power of caffiene and techno:
Iron Man: Mason. I'm not even sure if his posts need analyzing. If people really want I'll EBWOP one in, but for now, seems like wasted effort.
roflcopter: See above.
Ok, now that we have the roles out of the way:
armix: Starts by approving N0 vig. Further discussion of the vig kill, but names it irrelevant. Then accuses Iron Man of vig fishing. Dismisses the vig/kneecap comment as not understanding N0 vig logic. Questions roflcopter's assertion that Iron Man is town. States in response to roflcopter's accusation that armix is scummy that there are 3 scenarios, stupid cop claim, scum protection of scum buddy or preparing an I told you so, or townie who looks like scum doing the previous. Explains N0 vig logic, votes roflcopter, defending himself against that rolefishing claim because no cop would be stupid enough to out himself post 2, so it had to be a meta read or total bullshit, which it is evidently the latter. Says rofl's question was almost protown, but off enough to be bad, and that iron man's self fufilling prophecy point had credence. Points out username hasn't been pushing strife's lynch, just answered rofl's question saying strife is scummer. Outright refusal to Lowell's stance that the masons should out themselves. Elaborates, stating with no doc, the masons outing themselves is suicidal with an SK and mafia, and the fact that it helps them by narrowing the pool of power roles, or gives them confirmeds to kill. Says assuming there is no doc is the best play. Unvotes, telling rofl there was no need to out iron man. Answers rofl's claim that he rolefished Iron's mason claim out by stating that there was a lot of town pushing the wagon and that rofl left a breadcrumb to it on his own. Fake mason claim is a crackpot theory. Responds to SC with the fact that rofl claimed mason. FoS' vamp for the armix is scummy post/vote. Asks Vamp why rofl's side is relevant. Opposes Lowell's view on the mason reveal, saying it does hurt town because if gives scum info. Armix agrees with korts about forbiddan's post, and votes her. Asks why rofl is less inclined to lynch SC for my post, due to bussing logic. Says rofl is OMGUSing him from that earlier question. States no one believes rofl's rolefishing claim. States no one has commented on armix "poisoning the well", stating that he has a valid point about how forbiddanlight being scum doesn't clear SC, whereas rofl doesn't think armix made a valid point. In response to korts, states that rofl was dumb for listening to lowell then. Argues that while it invalidates the wagon to claim point, it doesn't invalidate rofl's rolefishing claim being bogus. States forbiddan's claim doesn't count. Counters Greasy saying rofl should have waited til he was closer to lynch and should not have revealed his partner for true town benefit. Intuition isn't valid reasoning, and advises no claims til L-2. Explains what using intuition is. States that it doesn't matter whether you have half or more votes in a claim, you should only claim when you reach a certain number of votes as dictated by some equation. Further clarifies the math. FoS' Greasy and Sun Tzu, Greasy for dodging questions and Sun Tzu agreeing with Korts' last post. Tells Lowell the mason outing only works in mini games with few town power roles and one mafia group, not a large game with 2 killing groups. States that username was right in voting greasy, because not answering was scummy, but he should have done it when he reiterated the question, not waited til later. Takes issue with the question lacking a neither option, would be on greasy's side if he hadn't stalled in answering. Claims that not offering a neither option creates bias, states vibes aren't logic, and will tell Lowell to show his work if he does any more unexplained alignment calls. Puts a stop to the vig discussion. "but for now no one should bring up the subject any more as it will give away who can't be the vig if people agree/disagree. " Votes Korts for rolefishing, agreeing with username, thinks forbiddan is just newbie wagon bait in general. Feels a connection between SC and Korts, could vote for SC given the shameless bandwagonning. SC defending Korts for the connection. States the he doesn't feel forbiddanlight is scum, which is why that connection means less. States vamp should be vigged, not lynched. Polarizing lynches have more info. Says the quote about being against the mason claim is relevant to Lowell's towniness later on. Then states that reading it it looked like rofl claimed early in response to the wagon on him, albeit early, and states Korts case is nothing but OMGUS and what Korts himself sees as minor scumminess. Reiterates that a vamp vig is good, says he responded to every point on the case, and then states he knew about Lowell's call to claim, but didn't assume this was why rofl claimed, because of the growing wagon and it was one of the dumbest ideas ever. States he already addressed the connection point because he feels forbiddan is town, and plus, why should a connection matter if Korts is town? Asks why he would attack someone he thinks is town based on one point, whereas SC has been on every bandwagon so far...except Korts. Questions where it says armix says only SC defends Korts? Then says Korts is misrepresenting him, quoting Korts where he says "Since your point was only that SC believed me ". Leans Korts because he's not sure if SC always plays like this. Says from what he's seen it is not Korts normal.
strife220: Puts the second vote on Iron Man as a D1 wagon and also because of the comment on the vig with the doctor and kneecapping. Also states kill discussion is irrelevant. Sarcastic comment about roflcopter's case and deciding lynches page 1. States that rofl's trap was terrible, unvotes (presumably due to mason claim). States scum fake claim is too risky on the grounds that the real masons would come out and we'd have two scum lynched off the bat. States he's 2/3 done with an essay on dcorbe. Explains he posted that in the wrong game. Wants rofl to elaborate on why forbiddan's post makes him less inclined to lynch SC. Asks for further elaboration. Votes forbiddan for her "scummy post", asking rofl why he wouldn't outright vote her. Asks Lowell about a meta on the mason outing, thinks that forbiddan's wagon is fine, but Vamp is scummier and thusly votes him. Thinks GS might have been lashing out as scum, or maybe just has a bad attitude, sees the whole GS/username debate as irrelevant. Wonders where Lowell gets pro town vibes from forbiddan from, being his number 2 suspect at the time. States that forbiddan is right there are too many town vibes, says scum have more motivation to say whose town, and this is the opposite of scum hunting. Corrects armix stating that forbiddan's wagon doesn't exist anymore, it's on vamp now. Wants Korts to back up his statement, says it doesn't feel natural. Wants to see the case on armix if Korts is confident in his vote. Wants to see Vamp vigged, unvotes, decides to closer read on Korts.
Vamparific: Finds armix scummier in answer to roflcopter's question, votes armix for "trying to take control of the game". Doesn't want to be on rofl's side, unvotes. Votes forbiddan with an "I agree" post. "Lol I keep screwing myself over". Unvotes. Says he doesn't want to be replaced...and nothing else. "Oh, I got lotsa votes, lol"
Korts: Opens by voting roflcopter for trying to force tunnel vision. Also salutes the killer of Killa Seven. Then states in response to roflcopter that he's "always right EVENTUALLY", and that tunnel vision is bad for the town. Claims the harm of rofl's forcing the armix/strife debate on us is that if someone finds someone else scummier the debate still ends up running along those lines and the case might be ignored. Refuses to answer rofl's question. Says forbiddanlight isn't reading before she writes, roflcopter's assertation that armix is rolefishing was related to the "why" on page one, not his defense. Sees possible reason in rofl's point, but thinks he's blowing it way out of proportion. Encourages both Greasy and forbiddan not to answer rofl's question if they don't think either is scummy. Says he's basically trying to balance rofl's push to answer the question by pushing against it so the people's voices are untarnished. Rather strongly rebukes rofl for misrepresenting him in the question debate, and states that there is a remote chance that this is a scum gambit, even if rofl is untouchable today. Explains why he objects to the false dichotomy of rofl's question. SC's post voting rofl looks scummy to him, states rofl was more accusing armix than defending himself. unvotes rofl, stating he was reckless though. Is inclined to vote for SC also, but doesn't. Votes Forbiddan for preemptively justifying wagon opportunism. "Just die". Argues armix's assertion that rofl was wagoned to claim. Hopes roflcopter points are edible. (apparently 3 will lead to a cookie). Doesn't want to count forbiddan votes. States that the fact that rofl responded to lowell nullifies armix's wagon to claim point which was to defend his supposed rolefishing. answers SC with the connection between rofl's claim and rofl being wrong (about rolefishing, I think). Asks vamp to answer username's question, but realizes he got the wrong person. Buys Sun Tzu's vote explanation, dislikes forbiddan's explanation for her FoS, saying she could have researched SC to see what triggered her intuition and didn't. Votes forbiddanlight, chastises lowell for lack of reasoning. Buys the last part of forbiddan's post concerning vamp, votes vamp, complains about his own vote hopping. Korts misinterprets armix's post and says that he revealed that he wasn't the vig. Denies rolefishing, saying he didn't ask anyone to claim, nor did he ask armix to confirm this, nor was any of this implied. Calls BS on the wagon forming on him. Realizes his post could hurt the town, said that he couldn't help but point out that armix was unhelpful. He reread and realizes armix never denied being the vig. He reiterates this, also saying he never assumes stupid scum. Responds to forbiddan's question saying that he thought he was helping the town at first, but realized it was anti town later. Says armix is setting up multiple lynches in advance, tells BlakAdder to paraphrase, says policy lynches are bad concerning forbiddan's stance on vamp. Says that armix didn't see that connection between forbiddan and himself, votes armix, saying he should have done it awhile ago. Agrees with armix's stance on vigging vamp, then presents armix case, of changing history in the wagon to claim debate, then the againstness on the mason claim D1, wagon hopping to forbiddan, changing history again calling rofl's vote on armix OMGUS, and finally the ignoring possible forbiddan korts connection because she's not scum, even though to him SC and forbiddan have reacted the same way. States armix ignored the actual case, just answering a few supporting points. Says vig directing is scummy, but rofl is for the most part confirmed, and also doesn't disagree rofl is right eventually, but would scum hunt him if he weren't untouchable for that. Counters username saying that he's using the same case as armix. States that no connection should be ignored unless one is 100% sure someone is town...and that can only happen if you are in an informed minority. States armix might have just come up with the bandwagon thing with SC in desperation, since the original point was SC defended him, as forbiddan did. Counters, saying that forbiddan wasn't even mentioned in passing for the same action, and armix is misrepresenting him. Calls a word twist showing that the that between only indications that the connection was armix's only point. States some points of his armix case are weak, but the pushing of an SC connection and ignoring a forbiddanlight one is a big point. Calls blatant misrepresentation in post 283, and then asks why armix is sure this is Korts' normal play. Claims that he refuted the connection claim, then says he actually discredited, and phrased wrong. He also starts to say that there is an armix/username connection from the way they are pushing the SC/Korts connection, but then notices Jordan's claim.
iamausername: Starts with a random vote on tinvision, answers rofl's question saying strife looks scummier. Declares roflcopter's "trap" to be terrible. Questions Korts urgings for forbiddan and greasy not to answer the question, saying that they can tell us themselves if they find someone else scummier. Asks Korts why rofl's question tarnishes the people's voice. Can kinda see where rofl is coming from, but still states that pro town is just as qualified to ask that question. Votes Korts for being opposed to the line of questioning so strongly. Asks why Greasy says there is no case on strife, if it's because he's done nothing scummy or no ones pointed it out. Asks Greasy if he thinks there IS a case against armix (Greasy never said this, but he also never said armix doesn't look scummy). Outing masons is a bad idea. Tells people to stop claiming, readdresses his "So, do you find armix scummy" question to Greasy Spot. SImple no to BlakAdder's intuition comment. Asks why a townie claim wouldn't count. States claiming townie is NOT what everyone does, just claims to be protown. It's anti town to reduce the pool of possible power roles. Points out the two scum factions, and the fact that scum doesn't know if I have a power role or not. Counters the power role comment saying this claim would shed too much doubt on it if I claimed power later. States the claim was too early anyway, I wasn't even close to lynch. More or less agrees that my claim was a null tell. Votes Greasy Spot for not answering. Exhorts people to make a case, votes Sun Tzu for his unreasoned vote. Claims authority as a scumhunter to Greasy's challenge. Takes the Korts/Greasy case on armix comment to be his answer, so asks why Greasy protested rofl's question when he already had decided who was scummier. Asks vamp why he unvoted without saying anything else. Says that voting didn't come into it (given GS's phrasing was neither was scummy enough to vote), the question only asked who was scummier, and then asks why other scumhunting going on would make a difference. Also counters armix asking if armix thinks his delay in voting was scummy, and asks what he has to gain as scum doing that. Asks who said the question lacked a neither option, and also asks which stall armix was referring to. Asks Greasy what happened between post 17 and 31 to make him ask "You ask us which we think is scummiest yet there is no case against Strife so how could I possibly decide right now?", then rephrases to say post 42. Says he's not the one changed his answer after 25 posts. Asks him why he said that he couldn't decide between armix and strife when he apparently thought armix was scummier. If he really couldn't decide, why did he specifically say no case against strife? Treasures the OMGUS always. Gets in the vig discussion. Joking comment about how scum totally wants to NK claimed townies. Votes Korts for rolefishing with the vig comment. Asks Korts what possible benefit the vig comment could have. Believes that Korts may have misinterpretted armix, but he still rolefished. And that rolefishing is more innocuous comments to find roles rather than a direct asking like Lowell did, and he doesn't see Lowell as scummy for thinking a D1 mason claim is good for the town, even if he disagrees. Questions why forbiddan sees an honest mistake worth an FoS. Korts and SC have outed themself as scumbuddies obviously, according to him, BlakAdder case good too. Says rofl is wrong about armix, even if he has been persuing him since page 1. Feels that Korts pushing the forbiddanlight connection is a freak out between SC and Korts for getting caught so soon, and that setting up D2 lynches make sense when you have obvious connections like this.
Greasy Spot: Asks armix about N0 vig logic. Refuses to answer question til he wants to, states there is no case against strife, says he can't decide now. Asks rofl what response IS appropriate to someone starting the day with a claim someone is town. Answers username saying strife hasn't done anything scummy he's seen, and rofl is pushing his lynch without cause. Proposes a theory that rofl, Iron, armix and lowell are all scum. Questions Enlighted about why he looks odd, says armix is using craplogic, whereas Greasy was proposing a theory. Argues that the masons are nothing but glorified townies and being out helps the town by lowering the pool of people that can be scum. Gets defiant with username, asking what authority he has to ask that question. Also claiming he and Korts have cases against armix. States he was going to answer usernames question the second time he asked, but decided not to when he was voted because he felt that username was forcing his question on him, and he dislikes that. Counters username saying at the time he said that, neither of them was as scummy as the people pushing their lynch, and that a lot has changed since then. Responds that at post 17 neither was very scummy, to show how ridiculous username's claim that the scumhunting that happened since then didn't matter. Counter questions with username's: "Why would the fact that other scumhunting is going on make any difference to its relevance?" Says that username is an idiot for not allowing people to change their minds, and votes him "for being too stupid to be a townie."
forbiddanlight: Wonders whatever happened to random voting, and votes roflcopter for his attack on armix who she thinks appeared to be asking an honest question, not rolefishing. States she already voted for who she thinks is scummiest, and that while armix's actions COULD be construed as rolefishing, she'd honestly probably ask that herself if she saw it initially, because it was seemingly random clearing. Answers the question directed at username, stating there are other possibilities than fishing for roles. Unvotes rofl rather reluctantly, states she doesn't think armix was rolefishing, that lowell was, but she agrees with his logic. FoS' SC, states that she doesn't want to VOTE him, but she'll jump on his wagon. Claims regular townie, says that she didn't want to vote on pure intuition, thus the wagon comment, feels wagon would justify her intuition, votes vamp under the impression there is scum on her wagon, and that vamp has waltzed in to jump on wagons all game, and that while she still suspects SC, she's letting it go since no one follows. Just wanted to claim so they knew they weren't lynching a cop or something. Doesn't see townie as a real claim, is grateful someone sees the Vamp logic, and encourages discussion on the new developments. Retorts claiming townie is what everyone is assumed to be til they claim aux or their posts reek of scumminess. Claims username's view is ridiculous because the scum already know who's townie or not, and that she could have a power role she's keeping hidden for now, though she says she doesn't, just that it's possible. Doesn't see "I am a vanilla townie" as a tell either way. Cedes username's points, forgetting SK is scum and that she understands the claim could be anti town, apologizes. Fixes username's vote count. States why she thinks Vamp is scum (4th on a bandwagon with no reasoning, "always screw myself over comment", waltzing in and out of the thread.) While SC was intuition, Vamp is evidence. Was going to ask the same question, but username beat her to it. Still reiterates question. States it was scummy to unvote without reasons. Questions Lowell's pro town vibes, asks who he ISN'T getting town vibes, or even scum vibes from. States she already brought up the faulty examination, explains intuition was why she FoS'd. States she did look over, and couldn't find what triggered her intution, but usually has this frustration in mafia. She also sees the vamp case as solid. Relooks again, sees what happened, and it was a misunderstanding with SC, but she keeps her FoS on him because of the roflcopter claim issue, claims she's not likely to vote SC given Vamp's in and out one liners. Counters Jordan saying Cougar was semi asking for a claim, pointing out where the SK came into the discussion, re explains her stance on claiming townie, or what it used to be. HoS' Korts, claims she feels better about her vote on Vamp because of his no reasoning. Also mentions how this is blatant rolefishing, and questions how saying armix is not vig is any better than her claiming townie. After all, there can be stupid scum. Then asks if Korts saw it before or after he posted. (it being if it was anti town, as clarified later). Drops to FoS on Korts, stating she can see what might have happened, but doesn't want to let this go. "Then play or be lynched" to Vamp's comment. Doesn't see Korts as the play, thinks Vamp is for not playing insightfully. Says that while Korts made an honest mistake, it deserves an FoS. Reserves right to change her mind. States she's not policy lynching, Vamp has honestly been scummy, it's just that the policy does have a minor factor into it. Answers username saying that even as an honest mistake it could have been a slip, worthy of an FoS. Then rereads to figure out who is right in the armix/Korts debate. Comes back stating she finally has a chance to reread...then...posts...this!
StrangerCoug: Votes roflcopter, stating that such certainty can only be scum or cop, the latter being idiotic, and that he shot off the question of why he thought so by saying it was scummy and later rolefishing. Doesn't buy rofl's defense saying armix was rolefishing. Accuses rofl of moronicness for claiming mason and outing Iron Man. Refuses to unvote rofl because he made a serious blunder, town or not. Stonewalls on unvoting rofl, states he should take pride in being an informational power role. Specifically stating he does not have a good reason to unvote rofl. Relents, unvotes rofl, FoS' him. Votes Lowell for rolefishing. Doesn't believe armix was rolefishing. Says that he was looking at page one when he first posted, then responded to the quote on page 2 (defending against Korts). Then says he let the mason thing go by unvoting rofl, but kept and FoS on him for the scummy behavior exhibited before. Also states it's pretty clear we do have an SK, and asks if Lowell has anything else to say for the OMGUS vote on him. Questions why Lowell feels good about his SC vote. HoS' forbiddan, counters the reiteration point and says forbiddan is letting scum lead with the wagon comment. Also questions Korts inclination to vote him. Asks aboutt how many votes are on forbiddan. Doesn't want to kill forbiddan before she can claim, thus not voting her yet. Counts four votes on forbiddan (there were five). Asks about the connection that Korts refuted. States 3 people unneccessarily claimed, asks how other people voting him justifies forbiddan's intution, states that forbiddan FoS'd him based on little, but votes Vamp based on very little, votes forbiddan. Buys the Vamp/SC explanation (for why forbiddan voted the way she did), says she was going to play the waiting game for what to think of SC, questions what forbiddan meant when she said SC wasn't examining the whole situation. Stays on forbiddan, claims he never wanted a claim from me, just wanted to give me a chance to defend myself, will look at Vamp's case and reread mine. Comes back and unvotes me, votes Vamp, stating that Vamp comes in, posts one liners, and pops out, posting too close together to really be considered lurking. Too little info analysis to be considered town. Corrects Jordan in saying Vamp is male. States he buys Korts' defense, even if it resulted in a rolefish, but it was minor compared to Lowell's. Agrees with rofl's case on BlakAdder, though questions a couple points, tries to draw similarities to forbiddan's case, unvotes vamp, telling him to post more, and votes BlakAdder. Enourages Vamp to actually defend, says armix contradicted himself with the mason claim thing, and then votes armix. States Lowell is still scummy. Wants to see Jordan's thoughts on a forbiddan Korts connection.
BlakAdder: One liners about how rofl is scum. No, literallly, "Everything rofl has said so far points to him being scum"...seriously. One liner about how there could be another doc. Retracts saying he might have been being reckless. Found rofl's behavior to be suspicious, saying assumptions are a part of mafia. Unvotes. Doesn't feel the need to justify his intuition, figures that people make assumptions because if we waited til we were SURE someone was scum deadline would roll around. Cedes intuition point, says he's used to trusting his gut. FoS' vamp, to give him a defense chance. Claims when he got back to the thread everyone said what he found suspicious, and that's just how he plays.
Lowell: Walks in, votes sun tzu, and then asks the masons to out themselves. Responds to iron man saying he doesn't know there are masons, so what's the harm in asking them to out themselves if they don't exist. Also admits it's a rolefish. Explains mason outing logic. Gives kudos to rofl for claiming, votes SC for "shedding crocodile tears". States that having the masons claim is ALWAYS good, ESPECIALLY with an SK since the scum factions can't coordinate. Retorts saying he feels good about his vote on SC. Claims a game where he and his mason buddy claimed D1 that town won, would have outed himself this game had he been a mason, and gets "town vibes" from forbiddan and korts. More pro town vibes, GS and username. States he only has pro town vibes from who he mentioned, and once he gets a few more he'll have the scum team picked out. Explains that because forbiddan has bent over backwards to defend herself she seems pro town, also counters Jordan's point about scum fakeclaiming masons. Doesn't see Jordan as pro town. Sees username as pro town again after agreeing with his post on rolefishing.
Sun Tzu: States rofl has played badly, but mason claim D1 is suicidal for scum. Isn't sure how he feels about early mason outing in multiple NK games, though they are good in 1 NK games. Dislikes rofl's question. Votes Vamp, says the forbiddanlight case looks good too. No reasoning. Answers the allegations for his non reasoning saying he thought it was obvious, and "I'm always screwing myself over" seemed like a confession to him. Discusses the value of vigging. Dislikes the case on armix, saying he saw Korts as protown initially but this case is bad.
-TinVision-: States that anyone wanting rofl's death after his claim should be hit in the head with a baseball bat. Questions BlakAdder's bandwagoning. Asks BA to elaborate on the making assumptions comment. Clarifies the math armix provided. Is satisfied with BlakAdder's answers, feels armix is pro town, wants a closer look at korts, ignores the vamp wagon.
Enlight_Bystand: Shows up page 5, dislikes rofl's question, states the rofl probably didn't do anything brilliant for us, but him and Iron man are probably safe for now. States Lowell has 4 posts mostly defending his call for the mason reveal. States armix has been active, got on Iron for seemingly pushing for a vig reveal, but has been working to get votes off the masons. armix also opposed the idea of a fake mason plan, questions vamp for following rofl's plan and going after activity. Enlight states that he will look at SC, Korts, and Greasy after he eats. Analyzes SC, Greasy Spot, Korts, and forbiddan. States Greasy and forbiddan look odd, Lowell looks scummy in the background of the thread, but no one stands out. Sees the vamp wagon as having moved fast, but there is a decent amount of evidence against him. Forbiddan appears to be addressing points against her, wants to know why rofl sees BlakAdder as scum, and thinks the GS/username thing was benign, but will be something to look back at later. Points out Vamp is at L-3, and doesn't want to put him at L-2.
silence: Finally posts page 7! figures neither armix or strife was scummy with rofl's question, Mason claims were ok, but they should think before asking. Asks about HoS and FoS.
JordanA24: Finally shows up page 9 with an analysis post. Finds SC, forbiddanlight, and vamparific his top suspects. SC for hiding in shadows, a quick wagon disintegration, and the general bending to others wills to look townie, forbiddan for following bandwagons, claiming needlessly and confusing posts. Vamp for being most obviously scummy with the one liners and "I keep screwing myself over". Probably would vote SC if he voted then, Vamp is tempting, possibly forbiddan. FoS' BlakAdder's bandwagoning. States he meant that the claimed mason would be dead before the other scum claimed mason. Feels Vamp wagon is scum driven, as well as forbiddan's, feels Cougar is more scummy than Korts, so the connection should be tested there. Does not see armix as scummy. Sees BlakAdder as a decent wagon, REALLY sees tin vision as scummy and would vote him if it weren't for SC.
Feelings on this to follow shortly."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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armix. Well...to be quite honest, I'm not buying Korts' claims relating to armix. He has been very protown throughout the game from what I can see, especially given his comments relating to the vig which started this whole problem. Heavy lean town.
strife: seems kinda non committal, but towards the later part of the day seems to get in gear. I will look forward to the results on your reread. I lean kinda town here.
Vamparific: Uh yeah...I think it's pretty clear I heavily lean scum here. One liners and "I'm always screwing myself over" does not a defense make. Lowell has a point about how scum defends. The only reason I'm going tounvote Vamp; FoS Vampis because I agree a vig is best to gather information.
Korts: Ah, yes, the other man of the hour. Well, to me, it seems you started off pro town, but you are panicking. I agree with armix that there is a connection between you two, especially given the fact Coug has done the bandwagon thing except on you. I also think it's funny you are trying to push a connection between you and me. The way I see it, when you flip scum, that will be WIFOM'd and possibly confuse the issue enough to save Coug. I would vote you, but I agree also with Jordan that SC has acted scummier. Your early game is your saving grace right now.
username: I don't like how he questions. He seems to set up questions so that no matter what you say is wrong and it will lead to you being scummy. However, I also can't disagree with results, and personally I'd be interested in seeing how Greasy Spot turns up eventually. He did something odd mentioning strife early game but not armix in which was scummier. I don't feel strongly that he's scum cause of that though...either way, this is about username. To be fair, Korts is right you keep reiterating armix's case, but to be fair, others have either. Given your overall play, and how you are actively scum hunting, I lean town.
Greasy Spot: I don't like your early game at all. Username was right in questioning you. But, the way you reacted seems more like a child who didn't get his way than scum. Having a bad attitude and all that as mentioned before. I don't lean much either way with you though, but that vote for username being "too stupid to be townie" raises eyebrows, and you haven't said anything since. Slight scum.
Forbiddanlight: That's for YOU guys to have feelings on. I read my role PM ya know .
SC: What a mess. Blatant bandwagoning throughout, was VERY reluctant to get off roflcopter, even AFTER the claim. But then...avoids the Kortswagon. I realize this is mostly what armix said already, but you can't ignore something like this. I really hope he doesn't play normally like this, because it feels panicked, and some of his later posts feel like they are following Korts' lead.Vote:StrangerCoug
BlakAdder: Whereas Tin Vision has cleared him, I don't . I won't say he's scum yet, but one liners as I said are a bad game. I want to see improvement in the future. Just because you trust your intuition doesn't mean you don't have to justify it. Seriously, I have this problem all the time, which is why I try not to push cases on intuition (even when it's right). Otherwise, a lot of your postings are weak, and the defense half hearted. I lean scum, but not heavily since he seemed to make an effort when Tin called him out.FoS BlakAdder
Lowell: Aww, that's nice, you see me as pro town. Guess what? I don't quite agree with how you handle these things. You are hunting for scum, not townies, as others have said. But, you did explain your pro town vibes on a couple people. Can you tell us why you feel pro town on the other 3? (username, GS, and Korts...especially Korts given the latest drama) Slight scum, could change with his explanations for the others.
Tin Vision: Note, I forgot the part where he votes silence for Lurking. BAD. The mod sorts out lurkers. I want to see your closer look on Korts soon, I also want to see why you found BlakAdder's explanations satisfactory. Also, explain why armix is pro town. Otherwise, I see you as slightly scum.
Enlight Bystand: Better late than never, I say. Seems slightly hesitant to outright say anyone is scum, but his observations seem rather well thought out and good. Be a little stronger with your stances, I think, and it might lead somewhere good. Leaning town.
silence: I haven't seen enough of you to make a judgement. Get back here or ask for a replacement.
Jordan: Well, he's not afraid to speak his mind, even when he shows up that late. I like that, and it's also drawing attention to him which is what scum don't want. I like that kind of start. I like a lot of his analysis as well, and definitely seems to be working for the town. I'd like to see more small posts that relate to the current things, rather than mega analysis posts, (because you are more likely to give yourself away as scum in small posts you don't put as much work into), but otherwise, I lean town.
Alright, that took me way too long, but it's done. What does everyone think?"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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It reminds me of a cop friend of mine. He used to say he could make you agree to anything. Now, I'm not sure if this is username's intent, because I think he relented before dealing the killing blow in each line of questioning, but it puts me uneasy when you can force answers like that. It leads to bad cases.roflcopter wrote:
this is an interesting point. please elucidate further.forb wrote:username: I don't like how he questions. He seems to set up questions so that no matter what you say is wrong and it will lead to you being scummy.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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I think he's protown too. That was a personal comment on his questioning style. I don't like it but it does seem to get results because he uses it responsibly. But, since you want examples.Given your overall play, and how you are actively scum hunting, I lean town.
Innocent start, very understandable, given what Greasy said.So do you think there is a case against armlx?
Slight leading because he assumes that's what Greasy meant. To be honest, this is still within the realm of reason given what Greasy posted.
when you obviously had decided who you thought was scummier?
This gets iffy. I see Greasy's point here, not username's, and it's a clear leading question that kinda forces Greasy to respond (if he answered the question) in a way that implicated him slightly. I'm probably reading into this point too much though.Why would the fact that other scumhunting is going on make any difference to its relevance?
Rhetorical question for armix when he didn't even say that. I think that's kinda a strawman? I dunno my fallacies well.Are you suggesting that my delay in voting is scummy? What do you think I stood to gain, as scum, by doing so?
Kinda the same strain as the armix question. You begin to see how he's leading Greasy on? (however, because Greasy goes with it rather than protesting and explaining what I think his stance was (I could be wrong), he comes out scummier, which is why while I don't like username's methods, the results are valid)
So what happened between post 17 and post 31 to change your answer to "You ask us which we think is scummiest yet there is no case against Strife so how could I possibly decide right now?"?
This is the big shot. Its forces the assumption the change was in that post frame whereas no one said that (but Greasy confirmed this view by not refuting it, which adds a lot of validity to username). It's presenting Greasy with a view he never directly said he had, but worked himself into with username's help. It's forcing a view not explicitly stated, and barely implied. And the way Greasy responded made Greasy look scummy, but it might have been like that no matter how he answered. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, but I hope I've illustrated my point there now.
OK, so let's get back to the original point; why say you can't decide between armlx and strife when you did, in fact, think armlx was scummier?
Alternatively, if you didn't think either was scummier than the other, why specifically say that there was no case against strife?"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Hmm...I think I was trying to paint that in the light that if he flips scum that there would be a lot of WIFOM given how he seems to be trying to force a connection to me, and said when in the sense that when that happens that will follow. However, I admit that was very odd phrasing, and I actually can't adequetely defend it. I did, of course, however mean if. Whether anyone wants to make a case from that phrasing is up to them.Emphasis by me. Why would you say "when" instead of "if" FL?
Think typing that post was fun? No, but I felt it had to be done so I myself could get a better read on the situation and also see what others saw, if they disagreed with my summary.Reading through this game feels like homework of late.
This isn't good. If you think someone is scum, vote them, and back it up. If there is no case, then why do you think they are scum? The unvote isn't helping you Korts.So the case pretty much consists of a single debatable point, at the moment. I think I'll have to do this, even though I think armlx is scum.
Hmm...this kinda seems a little bit like redirecting, buuut, I see his point pretty well, added to the "scumhunting is a lot easier" thing about my post. It better not be too much easier, because that means you are just accepting my logic because I made a big post. You aren't critically analyzing it to see if my points have any credence, such as what strife pointed out (which, by the way, gives strife a little bit more townie points there). But, I've already FoS'd BlakAdder. Let's just say that that feeling hasn't been alleviated.Good job further implicating the connection between you and TinVision, which Jordan already noted had some things implicating. Protip: if you're scum, don't answer questions/points intended for your buddy.
Vote: BlakAdder"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Just so you know, you already did vote him. And while I said it made you look scummy the way you responded, I'm attributing part of that to the way the questions were asked. For now, you are a bit lower on my scum list than several others that have been mentioned, FoS'd, and voted by me. However, I do appreciate the elucidation on why you handled it that way."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Meh, well, you could always try to push it with conviction or something, ala ABR. But, fine, so it's only a gut feel now? Alright, well, being an intuitive player myself I can't fault that, but hasn't intuition or gut already been explained by armix earlier in thread? A reread should give you what you are looking for unless there's something you don't want us to know.Korts wrote: Who said I want the unvote to help me? I unvoted because firstly, I'm not achieving anything with my vote on armlx, and secondly because I realized how little material is left in my case on him. I still think he's scum, call it a gut feel, if you want.
Not what I said. By all means address suspicions while under fire...it was mostly the way you phrased it and the fact you don't seem to be as worried about any accusations brought against you that got me looking at that. It's a weak point though, so I won't really press it, since I do agree BlakAdder looks kinda scummy too.Korts wrote: Redirecting? Alright, so you don't want me pointing out scumtells as long as I'm under fire? Got it.
I knew this, it's just I usually get lazy with quoting. But thanks for the advice though.Tip as one player to another, forbiddanlight, use your quote tags like this: when you start quoting, you initially have only this:[ quote ] (without spaces, of course) but to make it clear who you're quoting, do it like this: [ quote="My Awesome Self" ] (again, without spaces). It makes everyone's job a lot easier. In action:"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Roflcopter, can you explain your case on armix more than obvscum, or point to a page where you have done so?"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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This is completely unrelated to the actual game, but I think that Greasy Spot needs to make "vote: iamausername" his signature. Just a suggestion"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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FoS silence. That post reeks of such horrid non committalness I don't even know WHAT to say. Are you even reading the thread? There is scumminess all over the place! I mean, you have no opinion about the current Korts/armix debate? Or maybe the Greasy Spot/username thing? Or basically ANY of the discussion going on thus far? I wasn't leaning anyway on you before since you barely posted. In one post though, I lean scum on you."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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I already did. It's on Stranger Coug. I like that one better because he's shown himself to be relatively scummy too. That could change quickly if silence keeps that act up."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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I don't. We've been jumping in and out of vig discussions all game. It doesn't need to be discussed. He was nice before. Maybe people will respond to the ruder admonishment."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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FL 303-304: And I also hate posts like this. TL;DR. Blinding us with text, a la vollkan. FL, we don't need a summation of everything everyone's done in the game. Give us your top couple of suspects, and why. Also, if necessary, point out a popular wagon you disagree with and why.
You should know how much a summary opens people's eyes. It's as much for me as it is for everyone. The fact that I SEPARATE my thoughts from the summary, meaning all you really have to read is the thoughts section if you want a tl;dr version, and also my list of suspects, should show that I genuinely consider that a good move to get my thoughts together and also tell my opinions of everyone with evidential backup. But, whatever, some people don't like megaposts, and I can see where they'd be scummy. I just still felt the need to do it to get my thoughts together."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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That's an opinion, Coug. It doesn't affect his alignment either way. And in the end, discuss it after game. Seriously, you seem to be panicking, throwing accusations around for such little things. If I weren't already voting you I'd vote you now. and an "I've got my eye on you" still indicates suspicion. If it's not scummy, why are you looking at him?"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Good idea Sun Tzu. Why DON'T you talk about who you think is scummy and why. Why is Korts scummy? Why would you rather lynch SC? (I think you already addressed vamp.) IF you already addressed these, sorry. But I'd like to see answers.I don't see a good reason to lynch armlx or iamausername. Korts seems somewhat scummy, but I'd rather lynch SC or vamparific.
Roflcopter, we don't decide who the vig kills. The vig does. Just talk about who you think is scummy and why.
Again, why? Please answer these questions.I'm ok with BlakAdder too I guess, but I think StrangerCoug is the best choice."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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What about me? Oh...wait. And you are misinterpreting. The only "forbidden" discussion is about the meta argument of N0 vig kills and general discussion OF the vig kill since it could out the vig in a way, as armix pointed out earlier. What we should discuss is the flow of the game, votes, reactions to votes, reactions to posts, and everything you'd NORMALLY discuss in mafia to find scum. I really don't like how you are trying to make it look narrower than that. The vig discussion really should be taken to MD because of the fact that not only does it put the vig role in danger (because the more it's discussed, the more likely an accidental breadcrumb is dropped), but it's also tiresome and filled with opinions that aren't precisely relevant to the game.
If discussion about how this game should be played and has so far been played is forbidden, what IS ok to be posted? Claims, votes, that's it?"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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First, I apologize for my profanity earlier. It's rather annoying to see your scummiest suspect end up being the vig. But, stuff happens. Moving along, I feel a lot better about the TinVision thing, with a possible link to BlakAdder (IIRC, Tinvision "cleared" BlakAdder for being cooperative with his questioning whereas there were loose ends.) I'm on the fence with Korts. I don't know why, but I'm beginning to feel he might not be the play. Just emotion. I'm sure if I did another analysis of what happened between page 13 and now I'd find this, but I'd rather avoid another tl;dr thing. I may do a feelings post soon though without the block of summary text."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Why is Korts better than Tin Vision or Blak Adder? Wasn't the majority of your case on Korts a percieved link between him and SC? Well, SC is the vig, so far without counterclaim. So, that's gone basically. The rest of the case isn't as solid, though it's there. So, tell me why Tin Vision or Blak Adder aren't good lynches? Or someone else of your choosing?"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Why? You probably stated the case earlier, but this seems rather OMGUSy. I want answers from both of you, please.Actually, if some people would be willing to vote armlx, that'd be all kinds of great."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Um...I think you need to vig Vamp, assuming his replacement doesn't fix the massively bad play. But, otherwise, it is of course up to you. I just heavily favor vamp vig."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Sorry, here is why: Korts has been all over the place vote wise, and kept digging at the vig issue.
That was your case on Korts then? So why is that better than the other options? Not just the ones I mentioned (though they were scummy), but is there anyone else you are looking at? I will say that given what you say there, Korts does look bad."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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I admit I phrased it badly. It ended up being a somewhat leading question. REally, what I meant to see was what the case on Korts actually was. It's been answered. However, I did press the question about why the case was better than any others, and you are right, the burden of proof should be on me. I suspect that there is potentially a Tin Vision Blak Adder pair given the fact that Tin Vision was trying to clear BlakAdder after asking him a few questions that Blak answered unsatisfactorily to everyone except Tin himself. Blak has been scummy in his own right with the way he's been playing with mostly one liners and no real analysis. I think bandwagoning is in there somewhere as well. I think the Tin/Blak case is superior to the Korts case because of all that.This looks like a logical fallacy but I have no clue what the name is. Not quite a strawman - it's just an impossible to answer question. He said Korts was a good lynch, and you want him to essentially 'prove' that he's a better lynch than Tin and Blak Adder? If you think Tin or Blak Adder is a better lynch, it's your job to provide a superior case.
Also, don't like Meurrto for the reasons stated. Even if the claimed masons are somewhat useless in helping town (and I'm still out on roflcopter. He's arrogant, but from what I hear, he's always right eventually), there is no need to kill off townies with the town NK when the scum will eventually take care of it given their win condition (i.e, SK)"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Ugh...I don't like this Korts. Not at all. It's all well and good to vote your gut, but to expect others to vote with you because of it? Not gonna work. Case or die. I'm fine with my vote on Tin, but BlakAdder and Korts seem to be good plays as well. Also Muerto, but not as much."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Actually, adding Korts was new. And also, I provided an explanation in the last post of why I think you and Tin are scummy.@FL: We get it. You're voting Tin, but you think Korts and I are scummy. You can quit including that in every post you make now.
Fallacy. I shouldn't have said case or die I guess, though that may be your case if you only have your gut for cases. And I'm saying you should ask them two...AFTER you've figured out why your gut dislikes armix. A gut feeling isn't a case. Pointing to what might have gotten you uneasy is. Even if it's a meta argument, it's better than "I'm voting my gut". You should know that."Case or die", forbiddan? This is BS. You say it's okay to vote based on gut feeling, yet you declare that I shouldn't ask anyone else to vote armlx based on my gut feeling? What point would there be in voting at all if I would be content to be the only one voting armlx?
Not at all. I think it's a healthy attitude so that we don't get complacent.
Don't you think this is a bit harsh?"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Well, since it appears more people are interested in a BlakAdder lynch than a Tin Vision lynch, I willunvote, vote BlakAdder. Really, both of them are fine lynches by my sights."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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Vote Count 8
Korts - (3) {iamusername, armix, strife220}
silence - (2) {Sun Tzu, -TinVision-}
iamusername - (1) {Greasy Spot}
StrangerCoug - (1) {JordanA24}
armix - (1) {roflcopter}
-TinVision- - (1) {forbiddanlight}
Lowell - (1) {StrangerCoug}
Not Voting: {BlakAdder, silence, Vamparific, Iron Man, The Fonz, Korts, Lowell}.
With 17 left alive it will take 9 to lynch.
To prevent this game from dragging I am setting a deadline. The deadline will be Tuesday 29th July at 2:00 am GMT.
The deadline lynch rules are that the player with the most votes will be lynched. In the case of a tie the player who had the most votes for the longest amount of time. In the unlikely circumstance of no one voting the game will go to night without a lynch.
The player who would be lynched based on the current vote count will have their name bolded.
Prods have been sent to JordanA24, Greasy Spot and -TinVision-.
_________________
Yeah there is. Here."Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug
TTGL Mafia is over. Going to mod [b]Umineko No [color=red]Na[/color]ku Koro Ni[/b] Mafia. Pre-/ins, as always, are accepted.-
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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forbiddanlight Blowfish
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