Otherkin

[Annadog40]

I've read some discussion about otherkin lately on the forum and been wanting to create this topic for a while and I want to hear what your thoughts on otherkin are.

[Ythan]

3go.

[Porochaz]

Hmm. It might be where my headspace is at right now, but this actually angers me a bit. There are people in the world who have genuine issues with gender and sexual identity and this detracts from it. For every single human in the world, their mother was a human, their father was a human. Guess what? You're a fucking human. There is no debate, you weren't born out of 2 animals falling in love and your spirit transferred into the womb of a woman. Even if you believe in reincarnation, and you once were a hippopotamus, you aren't that now.

[Psyche]

i cannot parse the metaphysics in a way that makes the idea sensical. it's a lot easier to do that wrt trans people since it just requires distinguishing between gender and sex. sexual orientation is even easier. but what is the sense in which otherkin identities map to reality? if we can get the idea down to a network of propositions maybe we can figure out the most respectable form of the idea and then work from there

[arachnidsGrip]

Hmm. It might be where my headspace is at right now, but this actually angers me a bit. There are people in the world who have genuine issues with gender and sexual identity and this detracts from it. For every single human in the world, their mother was a human, their father was a human. Guess what? You're a fucking human. There is no debate, you weren't born out of 2 animals falling in love and your spirit transferred into the womb of a woman. Even if you believe in reincarnation, and you once were a hippopotamus, you aren't that now.

My god no, no this is not how this works. Why do people act as if like there is some supreme fucking limelight that must 8e focused upon specific types of people's plights, one after another, until we've all made it down to the least oppressed. This is the most inane, denegr8ing, and stupid position anyone could have on this. My identity doesn't fucking w8 for other "normal" trans people to get their time to 8e accepted. It's not wrong for me to want to 8e accepted, I am having GENUINE issues too, asshole, and you are one of them.

Not to mention, you are actively invald8ing people who have genuine identities just out of hand, with this you just automatically placing people like me outside of the realm of consider8tion ar8itrarily.

This post is riddled with a general misunderstanding a8out expression and identity as well. You are attri8uting some form of 8iological essentialism to it when you can't even prove that. It's just what you want to think.

[Ythan]

So is it all b's, a's when pronounced like the eigh in eight, and anything that sounds like eight itself?

[Psyche]

so do you have a dysphoria that goes beyond gender or some profound affinity or

[arachnidsGrip]

i cannot parse the metaphysics in a way that makes the idea sensical. it's a lot easier to do that wrt trans people since it just requires distinguishing between gender and sex. sexual orientation is even easier. but what is the sense in which otherkin identities map to reality? if we can get the idea down to a network of propositions maybe we can figure out the most respectable form of the idea and then work from there

As the one 8eing scrutinized, I h8 this. First off, I think you are just asking the wrong questions, I can't engage with what you just said. Second off, I really don't need you to formul8 "the most respecta8le form of the idea" what does that even mean?

[arachnidsGrip]

so do you have a dysphoria that goes beyond gender or some profound affinity or

Yes, I do, 8oth in gender, and more profoundly, in my identity as Vriska. Profound affinity, spiritual inha8it8tion, you can call it whatever you want. I still dislike this format I do have to say.

[Psyche]

if you don't wanna talk this that's ok i will do my own research and imagine others have also at least looked into the phenomenon

[arachnidsGrip]

So is it all b's, a's when pronounced like the eigh in eight, and anything that sounds like eight itself?

Yes, exactly so.

[Isis]

by format do you mean you don't like the way people are approaching you with questions or that it's a topic that you prefer to address in phone calls or in person

[arachnidsGrip]

if you don't wanna talk this that's ok i will do my own research and imagine others have also at least looked into the phenomenon

Do you have discord? Most of your "research" isn't going to pertain to me.

[arachnidsGrip]

by format do you mean you don't like the way people are approaching you with questions or that it's a topic that you prefer to address in phone calls or in person

Expressing this deep seeded shit makes me feel vulnera8le and insecure. I'd prefer some privacy.

[Ythan]

You obviously don't have to post itt if you don't want to of course but I guess that goes without saying.

[arachnidsGrip]

8luh, I think I might 8e a8le to clarify here I guess, I even talked to one of you on discord a8out it in a 8ig post. Go ahead and ask more questions, I welcome it. Though I do want to sleep soon.

[chamber]

At the heart of the question for me isn't whether someone identifies some way or not, it's whether that is a healthy thing to do. It seems easy for me to think of possible identities in the scope of all identities where the answer to that is very obviously yes or very obviously no. Although less obvious than more extreme examples, a webcomic character still seems like it's pretty obviously on the unhealthy side of the line.

The follow up question to the whether its unhealthy side of things, is whether it can be changed, for something as constructed as a webcomic character, that seems like it should be changeable. There is nothing intrinsic to a fictional character.

All of those thoughts sound a lot like criticisms of other identities I consider valid though(not that my consideration is worth anything). Hard line to walk.

[arachnidsGrip]

At the heart of the question for me isn't whether someone identifies some way or not, it's whether that is a healthy thing to do. It seems easy for me to think of possible identities in the scope of all identities where the answer to that is very obviously yes or very obviously no. Although less obvious than more extreme examples, a webcomic character still seems like it's pretty obviously on the unhealthy side of the line.

The follow up question to the whether its unhealthy side of things, is whether it can be changed, for something as constructed as a webcomic character, that seems like it should be changeable. There is nothing intrinsic to a fictional character.

All of those thoughts sound a lot like criticisms of other identities I consider valid though(not that my consideration is worth anything). Hard line to walk.

I will get 8ack to this in a moment, lots to say, just doing something with a few friends

[Donempire]

I've read some discussion about otherkin lately on the forum and been wanting to create this topic for a while and I want to hear what your thoughts on otherkin are.

Roleplaying is fun. As long as you're in realization that you're roleplaying. If you're a trans person you're a trans person. If you have a dog persona you're still human. Thats end of discussion. If you're bullying someone because they are larping a character you're an asshole. If you think you are an unreal character then you're deranged. This is quite the non issue that i dont think its deserving of a thread, but sure.

[arachnidsGrip]

I've read some discussion about otherkin lately on the forum and been wanting to create this topic for a while and I want to hear what your thoughts on otherkin are.

Roleplaying is fun. As long as you're in realization that you're roleplaying. If you're a trans person you're a trans person. If you have a dog persona you're still human. Thats end of discussion. If you're bullying someone because they are larping a character you're an asshole. If you think you are an unreal character then you're deranged. This is quite the non issue that i dont think its deserving of a thread, but sure.

I am deranged, and pretty comforta8le with it. This isn't a real argument though. This just reinforcing 8ullshit pretenses of normalcy. The dismissive attitude at the end is really telling. You are not ready to have this discussion and pro8a8ly should leave.

[arachnidsGrip]

At the heart of the question for me isn't whether someone identifies some way or not, it's whether that is a healthy thing to do. It seems easy for me to think of possible identities in the scope of all identities where the answer to that is very obviously yes or very obviously no. Although less obvious than more extreme examples, a webcomic character still seems like it's pretty obviously on the unhealthy side of the line.

The follow up question to the whether its unhealthy side of things, is whether it can be changed, for something as constructed as a webcomic character, that seems like it should be changeable. There is nothing intrinsic to a fictional character.

All of those thoughts sound a lot like criticisms of other identities I consider valid though(not that my consideration is worth anything). Hard line to walk.

Why? You are making pretty ar8itrary lines in the sand. My identity as Vriska has 8een empowering, and increadi8ly helpful for my self realiz8tion, I get genuine euphoria from it. Even 8esides that, I don't think an identity lived genuinely could 8e unhealthy, and 8y what metric? Therapy is a farce and spits ND people out even more fucked up than when they went in most of the time in my experience. Also it's vile to even think a8out what you mean in the last st8ment, that if I could 8e changed, what if? I am very happy with myself right now, and no you are wrong, this identity has 8een intrinsic to my expression since I discovered it 5 years ago.

[arachnidsGrip]

I am going to go to 8ed, I'll pick up where I left off tomorrow. Psyche, I kind of want to talk to you a8out this, even though I am afraid of how you will take it.

[Untrod Tripod]

the thing I'm curious about is how you identifying as Vriska relates to the existence of Vriska as a character? are you and the character Vriska the same or are you two discrete entities?

[Donempire]

I've read some discussion about otherkin lately on the forum and been wanting to create this topic for a while and I want to hear what your thoughts on otherkin are.

Roleplaying is fun. As long as you're in realization that you're roleplaying. If you're a trans person you're a trans person. If you have a dog persona you're still human. Thats end of discussion. If you're bullying someone because they are larping a character you're an asshole. If you think you are an unreal character then you're deranged. This is quite the non issue that i dont think its deserving of a thread, but sure.

I am deranged, and pretty comforta8le with it. This isn't a real argument though. This just reinforcing 8ullshit pretenses of normalcy. The dismissive attitude at the end is really telling. You are not ready to have this discussion and pro8a8ly should leave.

Normalcy has pretty clearly defined lines. If you can comprehend that and still go on as normal, good for you. If you cant comprehend that you're simply dumb and going forward you'll only harm yourself. I assume you're young when i say these, if you're old and still have this attitude you're fucked to begin with. But dont take the tolerant attitude of this site for granted - it has very accepting people. Not everyone is like that, and if you dont realize this and expect the world to react logically to you then you're in for a surprise.
I'm saying all this for your sake. Keep demonizing me if you want however. All im asking is for you to think about your actions and how people interpret it.

[Vi]

Let me try.

Honestly I'm not bothered by this posting style. The message is still precisely legible, the character replacements are not that obtrusive on a skim, and the color is nice on the dark theme. There are much more disruptive posting affects that are much more common; such as constant third-person roleplaying, incomprehensible BRoken ENGLISH!!, and the stereotypical experience of being 13 on the Internet. If I

were

bothered by it, this forum is large enough that I can go someplace else in the same vicinity. While I understand that there are plenty of people who will take poorly to this method of expression, I don't feel a need to be offended or concerned on their behalf.

I don't think chamber is coming from a bad place or had an unreasonable train of thought, but it's kind of useless outside three cases:
1) You plan on "curing" this person. You're not and you won't... unless you're planning to bully them until they change, in which case you may as well be overt about it.
2) You believe this person is a threat to themselves, or otherwise unhealthy. As chamber mentioned, the interplay between one's self-concept and how they present is important because a mismatch will cause a faulty understanding of how other people behave, or a lack of satisfaction with how other people behave. That doesn't seem to be applicable here; in fact, aG has been direct in saying they're aware of the consequences of their expression.
3) You believe this person is a threat to others. An example would be the US President, who is most likely very comfortable with what's most likely malignant narcissism even as he victimizes literally everyone in the world directly or indirectly. For a smaller-scale example, consider Yami-Chan/BabyBlue, ye olde drama magnets with a flair for suicide threats and making everything about them. And then you have the people who get into the sexual interpretations of "otherkin". This ain't that.
...so if what aG is doing isn't healthy in some context, that doesn't really concern me as a bystander.