Mini Normal 1857 (Game Over - Mafia Wins!)

ssbm_Kyouko · Post Post #2975 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:22 pm

Strongman makes sense with the Gerry flip in Co text of the morning of D2. It also makes sense in a setup that has a doctor and a 1-shot jk and 1-shot BP on the JOAT combined with a full doctor.

What doesn't make sense is if there's a strongman to bypass so much of towns power, why would there also be an ascetic to bypass our limited investigative power (2-shot follower, 1-shot GS)

JaeReed · Post Post #2976 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:30 pm

VC 4.03

Titus (3)

: ssbm_Kyouko, Sesq, Drone

-- L-1!

shadonra (1)

: Titus

NOT VOTING (3)

: shannon, Raskolnikov, shadonra

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Deadline is in (expired on 2017-01-19 16:10:00)

shannon · Post Post #2977 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:53 pm

Yeah I think it's fair to say at this point that the 'no result' came from Titus being blocked and not from an ascetic.

Titus · Post Post #2978 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:56 pm

In post 2972, Sesq wrote:
In post 2950, Titus wrote:
In post 2948, Sesq wrote:
In post 2892, Drone wrote:Alright.
Confirmed what I wanted.

Sesq.
What gunsmith thing are you talking about?
Do you know Titus' claim at all?
I'm sure I heard gunsmith somewhere. Might be part of something greater.
Hey Sesc, you might want to not recreate the past while you do not even have a clue what is going on.
At least I'm open recieving new ideas.

Shit, you're dragging me down into your pettysphere.

Shannon, I'm VT.

I am. You need to provide new facts.

Instead, you ran off and lynched my lock town read.

Titus · Post Post #2979 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:58 pm

Ok, is anyone townreafing Impoetic/Shad?

Scum clearly do not want him discussed. No one townreads him. He couldn't get lynched.

Sesq · Post Post #2980 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:05 pm

In post 2979, Titus wrote:Ok, is anyone townreafing Impoetic/Shad?

Scum clearly do not want him discussed. No one townreads him. He couldn't get lynched.

He's the nulliest of null for me. I would perhaps compromise lynch him.

When I say you're not being open-minded, it's because you're taking your scumREADS and townREADS and labeling them as scum and town indefinitely. This has been a recent trend in your posts (or perhaps I didn't notice before).

Titus · Post Post #2981 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:09 pm

In post 2980, Sesq wrote:
In post 2979, Titus wrote:Ok, is anyone townreafing Impoetic/Shad?

Scum clearly do not want him discussed. No one townreads him. He couldn't get lynched.
He's the nulliest of null for me. I would perhaps compromise lynch him.

When I say you're not being open-minded, it's because you're taking your scumREADS and townREADS and labeling them as scum and town indefinitely. This has been a recent trend in your posts (or perhaps I didn't notice before).

Yes. That's a me trait.

I get information. I solve the game. I push the solution.

Sesq · Post Post #2982 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:34 pm

In post 2981, Titus wrote:
In post 2980, Sesq wrote:
In post 2979, Titus wrote:Ok, is anyone townreafing Impoetic/Shad?

Scum clearly do not want him discussed. No one townreads him. He couldn't get lynched.
He's the nulliest of null for me. I would perhaps compromise lynch him.

When I say you're not being open-minded, it's because you're taking your scumREADS and townREADS and labeling them as scum and town indefinitely. This has been a recent trend in your posts (or perhaps I didn't notice before).
Yes. That's a me trait.

I get information. I solve the game. I push the solution.

But what happens is you label them as scum and town, and then use these unconfirmed reads as evidence against people.

Titus · Post Post #2983 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:40 pm

In post 2982, Sesq wrote:
In post 2981, Titus wrote:
In post 2980, Sesq wrote:
In post 2979, Titus wrote:Ok, is anyone townreafing Impoetic/Shad?

Scum clearly do not want him discussed. No one townreads him. He couldn't get lynched.
He's the nulliest of null for me. I would perhaps compromise lynch him.

When I say you're not being open-minded, it's because you're taking your scumREADS and townREADS and labeling them as scum and town indefinitely. This has been a recent trend in your posts (or perhaps I didn't notice before).
Yes. That's a me trait.

I get information. I solve the game. I push the solution.
But what happens is you label them as scum and town, and then use these unconfirmed reads as evidence against people.

Great, you want to argue Impoetic is town then? Go ahead.

If not, my analysis is sound.

Sesq · Post Post #2984 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:49 pm

In post 2983, Titus wrote:
In post 2982, Sesq wrote:
In post 2981, Titus wrote:
In post 2980, Sesq wrote:
In post 2979, Titus wrote:Ok, is anyone townreafing Impoetic/Shad?

Scum clearly do not want him discussed. No one townreads him. He couldn't get lynched.
He's the nulliest of null for me. I would perhaps compromise lynch him.

When I say you're not being open-minded, it's because you're taking your scumREADS and townREADS and labeling them as scum and town indefinitely. This has been a recent trend in your posts (or perhaps I didn't notice before).
Yes. That's a me trait.

I get information. I solve the game. I push the solution.
But what happens is you label them as scum and town, and then use these unconfirmed reads as evidence against people.
Great, you want to argue Impoetic is town then? Go ahead.

If not, my analysis is sound.

Can you read? I just said I would compromise lynch Shad.

Titus · Post Post #2985 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:18 pm

You seem to want me to go elsewhere or believe he is town. If you want me to do that, ok. You will need to say why.

I need to know why I cannot get a basic conversation on him. Waiting for a compromise just wound up with you ignoring my compromise pool and lynching obvious town.

shannon · Post Post #2986 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:26 pm

In post 2978, Titus wrote:
In post 2972, Sesq wrote:
In post 2950, Titus wrote:
In post 2948, Sesq wrote:
In post 2892, Drone wrote:Alright.
Confirmed what I wanted.

Sesq.
What gunsmith thing are you talking about?
Do you know Titus' claim at all?
I'm sure I heard gunsmith somewhere. Might be part of something greater.
Hey Sesc, you might want to not recreate the past while you do not even have a clue what is going on.
At least I'm open recieving new ideas.

Shit, you're dragging me down into your pettysphere.

Shannon, I'm VT.
I am. You need to provide new facts.

Instead, you ran off and lynched my lock town read.

I'm the first to admit I stuffed up D3.

Your town read on Gerry and refusal to lynch there, when you probably spotted the clues to his PR status that only became evident to me afterward, is really what's stopping me lynching you today. That, and that I've had vibes about SSBM on-and-off all game

shannon · Post Post #2987 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:28 pm

In post 2985, Titus wrote:You seem to want me to go elsewhere or believe he is town. If you want me to do that, ok. You will need to say why.

I need to know why I cannot get a basic conversation on him. Waiting for a compromise just wound up with you ignoring my compromise pool and lynching obvious town.

The problem I have with lynching Shad is that you tried to tie him to me because I got frustrated and impatient with you for not revealing who you targeted.

Sesq · Post Post #2988 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:56 pm

In post 2985, Titus wrote:You seem to want me to go elsewhere or believe he is town. If you want me to do that, ok. You will need to say why.

I need to know why I cannot get a basic conversation on him. Waiting for a compromise just wound up with you ignoring my compromise pool and lynching obvious town.

I don't see why you think I'm talking about shad primarily here. It's a pattern within your posts in general.

Also, I think we should start looking at other players a bit. If scum is outside of Titus and shad (and it's unlikely both are scum), they're currently getting no attention.

ssbm_Kyouko · Post Post #2989 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:20 pm

Only way shad and Titus are town is if drone and Rask are the team

Painbringer · Post Post #2990 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:37 pm

In post 2989, ssbm_Kyouko wrote:Only way shad and Titus are town is if drone and Rask are the team

Why?

Why couldn't I get a Shad wagon through if that is the team? It would make much more sense that they're protecting a partner.

Titus · Post Post #2991 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:38 pm

In post 2990, Painbringer wrote:
In post 2989, ssbm_Kyouko wrote:Only way shad and Titus are town is if drone and Rask are the team
Why?

Why couldn't I get a Shad wagon through if that is the team? It would make much more sense that they're protecting a partner.

Titus · Post Post #2992 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:39 pm

In post 2987, shannon wrote:
In post 2985, Titus wrote:You seem to want me to go elsewhere or believe he is town. If you want me to do that, ok. You will need to say why.

I need to know why I cannot get a basic conversation on him. Waiting for a compromise just wound up with you ignoring my compromise pool and lynching obvious town.
The problem I have with lynching Shad is that you tried to tie him to me because I got frustrated and impatient with you for not revealing who you targeted.

You made a dumb play and I temporarily scumread you for it. I apologize for that. Sometimes I do mistake dumb for scum.

ssbm_Kyouko · Post Post #2993 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:47 pm

What I mean is, if you're town Titus, shad could easily be scum. But I don't think he really has partners as far as I've seen

shannon · Post Post #2994 (ISO) » Thu Jan 05, 2017 11:14 pm

In post 2992, Titus wrote:
In post 2987, shannon wrote:
In post 2985, Titus wrote:You seem to want me to go elsewhere or believe he is town. If you want me to do that, ok. You will need to say why.

I need to know why I cannot get a basic conversation on him. Waiting for a compromise just wound up with you ignoring my compromise pool and lynching obvious town.
The problem I have with lynching Shad is that you tried to tie him to me because I got frustrated and impatient with you for not revealing who you targeted.
You made a dumb play and I temporarily scumread you for it. I apologize for that. Sometimes I do mistake dumb for scum.

That is the worst apology I've ever read. I hope you're not like that IRL!

Titus · Post Post #2995 (ISO) » Fri Jan 06, 2017 5:26 am

In post 2991, Titus wrote:
In post 2990, Painbringer wrote:
In post 2989, ssbm_Kyouko wrote:Only way shad and Titus are town is if drone and Rask are the team
Why?

Why couldn't I get a Shad wagon through if that is the team? It would make much more sense that they're protecting a partner.

SSM, I want an explanation for this, not an offhand comment about how Shad has no partners.

Titus · Post Post #2996 (ISO) » Fri Jan 06, 2017 5:27 am

In post 2994, shannon wrote:
In post 2992, Titus wrote:
In post 2987, shannon wrote:
In post 2985, Titus wrote:You seem to want me to go elsewhere or believe he is town. If you want me to do that, ok. You will need to say why.

I need to know why I cannot get a basic conversation on him. Waiting for a compromise just wound up with you ignoring my compromise pool and lynching obvious town.
The problem I have with lynching Shad is that you tried to tie him to me because I got frustrated and impatient with you for not revealing who you targeted.
You made a dumb play and I temporarily scumread you for it. I apologize for that. Sometimes I do mistake dumb for scum.
That is the worst apology I've ever read. I hope you're not like that IRL!

It's very me in Mafia. It's not me IRL. Well 99.9% of the time. The times where I argue my client is wrong scum well :-p

Raskolnikov · Post Post #2997 (ISO) » Fri Jan 06, 2017 9:40 am

1850 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=69080 (reviewed by Cephrir, Untrod Tripod, Cogito, http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=68509)
Cop, Vigilante, Doctor -VS- Mafia Roleblocker, Encryptor, Goon

1848 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=68980 (review info missing, postgame suggested it was scum-sided despite the town win)
Jailkeeper, Odd-night cop, 1s Vigilante -VS- Mafia Neapolitan, 1s Strongman, Goon (no daytalk)

1847 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=68970 (review info missing)
Rolecop, Vigilante, Doctor -VS- Mafia Jailkeeper, Goon, Goon (no daytalk)

1844 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=68870 (reviewed by Antihero, callforjudgement, Radja, review thread missing. WTF @ how this even passed review, everyone agreed it was super townsided)
Tracker, 1s Gunsmith, Neighborizer/DeNeighborizer, Odd-night weak doctor, ?Universal backup -VS- Mafia Rolecop, Backup Rolecop, Goon (daytalk)

1843 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=68822 - anomaly, just 3 mason setup, universally agreed as scum sided (you can't just run an open as a closed mhsmith)

1841 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=68714 (reviewed by mastin2, TTH and Cogito, thread missing)
Watcher, Jailkeeper, Neighbouriser, 1sBP -VS- Mafia 1s Tracker, 1s Ninja, Goon (no daytalk)

1839 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=68685 (reviewed by mastin2, callforjudgement, mykonian, thread missing)
Tracker, Innocent Child, Neighbouriser, Bodyguard, Backup Protective -VS- Mafia Odd-night roleblocker, Encryptor, Goon

1838 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=68600 (reviewed by Antihero, fferyllt, Cephrir, http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=68002) [weird pure wifom setup]
Cop, Jailkeeper, Backup Cop, Ascetic, Ascetic -VS- Mafia Neapolitan, Goon, Goon (daytalk)

1836 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=68519 (reviewed by Antihero, fferyllt, Nexus, thread not public, weird OP "archaeologist" role dominates the setup) [not very relevant]
1-shot BP Archaeologist, Tracker, 2s Vigilante, Weak Roleblocker, Bodyguard -VS- Mafia Jailkeeper, Goon, Goon (daytalk)

1833 http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=68482 (review info missing)
Watcher, Mason, Mason, Hated Townie -VS- Encryptor, Goon, Goon

Raskolnikov · Post Post #2998 (ISO) » Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:05 am

This is presumably

A [Titus is town but roleblocked]
JOAT(1s BP, 1s Gunsmith, 1s Jailkeep), 2s follower, Doctor, Universal Backup -VS- Strongman, Roleblocker, Goon -OR- Mafia JOAT with goons

B [Titus fakeclaimed UB]
JOAT(1s BP, 1s Gunsmith, 1s Jailkeep), 2s follower, Doctor -VS- Strongman (full or x-shot), Goon, Goon [if Titus is scum there probably isn't both RB+strongman]

C [What titus is saying is the case]
JOAT(1s BP, 1s Gunsmith, 1s Jailkeep), 2s follower, Doctor, Universal Backup -VS- Strongman, Ascetic, Goon

and that's not even considering the neighbour thing which complicates it all that more assuming existence. I'd guess the "power" of a neighborhood depends on composition, i.e. a 2 town hood probably helps town whereas mixed maybe not. At least I don't think there's any precedent for ultra mod WIFOM scum-scum neighbourhoods so that's ruled out for sure, so a scum neighbour flip would clear the other player here.
Ordinarily something as bold as entirely faking a neighbourhood with a partner would straight up be too crazy for consideration but Titus of all people is the type of person you can't rule it out from. Except I think that would fail hardcore when you lynch one of them and don't see neighbour in the PM? Wouldn't both be caught then? But even then that could be an oversight, I've lost games before from expecting scum to have made optimal moves and being wrong...

Raskolnikov · Post Post #2999 (ISO) » Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:20 am

I'm not sure guessing the right amount of town power is even possible without knowing scum power. We only know for sure that 1 strongman action kill was done onto transcend, and 1 goon flip.
Haven't played with jaereed in a very long time, but I know mhsmith0 likes scum-sided and hates cop or confirmed guilties (he doesn't like lack of counterplay),
mastin2 I know has a reputation for her scumplay which might make her learn there but could go either way, Nexus idk anything about.
As a trend I see daytalk completely ignored in balance calculations even though you'd assume it's scum power.
Finally every once in a while a very badly balanced setup inexplicably passes review so nothing's even for sure... might've just wasted a few hours tbh.