Mini 368: Town Of Suspicion - Game over!

[al_kohaulec]

Also, wow at this going for 60 days and nearly 300 posts so far and still being day one. Talk about great D1 discussion.

[M4yhem]

Rosso- Can you explain using small words what metagame you are talking about?

Pooky- Let me summarise the Thok/Pj debate:
Thok says that Pj should have known LML was a townie, and pj should have avoided voting Relyte because of that.
Pj says nuh-uh- Relyte was acting so scummy that it cancelled out LML's 'breadcrumbing'.
I agree with Pj here. Sometimes it seems like Relyte is

trying

to be scummy.
Meh, then they have a disagreement about whether P-jelly is omgusy as town. Pj says yes, Thok says no surprisingly.

Now, as for your good self. I'm sorry you find the game depressing. Personally, I get happy when there's lots to read. But that's not something I can use to see how innocent you are.

I don't understand why you wouldn't share what you are thinking with the town. How can we catch scum if noone shares what they are thinking? Maybe someone else has noticed the same thing as you, and then we can get a wagon started.

I don't really care what you think of me. But what you think of other people is very important. For example, what was it about the Relyte wagon that you didn't like? Where do you stand on the Thok/Pjay debate?
Who should we be lynching, Pooky?

If you don't answer these questions, then for all I know you are just stalling, trying to avoid being pinned down so that you don't make any enemies.

WB, Al. It's been 60 days? Good lord, can we just lynch someone now, please?

[Relyte]

WB, Al. It's been 60 days? Good lord, can we just lynch someone now, please?

There was a deadline that would've taken place the day after the site went down. I guess it just never happened.

[Rosso Carne]

do we have a mod still?

[Rosso Carne]

m4y: yes i can. I'm not going to yet. but i can.

[mith]

Catch up time, PBPA style (where P = Player).

al_kohaulec: Having brought him up on the by-player filter, I now feel like he has said a lot less than I had thought. Most of his posts have been focused on defending attacks against him (attacks based on him being strangely defensive earlier in the game). No votes other than the early random one.

al, who do you consider the two most suspicious people right now, and why?

Ameliaslay: Didn't set off any alarm bells when she was playing, and has since asked for a replacement (she hasn't been replaced yet, has she?). Given that a month has passed since her last post, I don't have much to say here (though I'll make a mental note to re-read her posts when she's replaced and/or when we have some deaths to correlate things with).

Cogito Ergo Sum: Easily the most annoying player, and probably needs to be replaced. Little to point to as scummy beyond the non-participation though; he hasn't avoided giving his opinion on who the scum are.

CES, Post, if you're still playing. 59 words or more, please.

CrashTextDummie (replaced Tyfo): Tyfo posted once, and CTD has posted three times. Great. Seems somewhat defensive of Rosso (though I can't decide if it's scummy; I know I was on the other side of that particular argument, so I may be noticing it more due to disagreement). Need more data. CTD needs prodding, if not replacing.

CTD, Post, if you're still playing.

lordy: Clearly scum.

Mod, only joking. A vote count would be nice, as well as some prods.

M4yhem (replacing Seol): I'm back and forth on him. On one hand, since he took over, he has been one of the most consistently active players. He has not shied away from arguments, and most of his arguments have at least been coherent and rational, whether I agree with them or not. On the other hand, I still don't feel like he is actually trying to catch scum. This could just be his playstyle, but it's something to keep an eye on.

M4yhem, ignore for a moment the goal of getting people to talk and so on. If you had to pick one player and if they are scum you win instantly and if they are town you lose instantly, who would you pick?

Machiavellian-Mafia: Huh, skipped him initially because I thought he had already been replaced. I am still suspicious of him, though that has cooled somewhat due to the whole not-posting thing. Replace, please. [Insert last bit of Ameliaslay paragraph here.]

mith: Obviously the most innocent player in the game.

mith, do an awesome PBPA and catch us some scum.

petroleumjelly: Gah, what is this, Verbose Mafia 2.5? I am going to have to go through his posts in detail when I have a lot more time. I still find him most likely innocent for the most part, but the big blue question bothers me a bit. I do think the answers/reactions could be helpful, but I am always wary of comments like "when you learn that I am town". Scum seem to make them more often.

pj, 2.1 people will vote for Thok. (But if you want to know whether

I

will vote for him, that obviously depends on what happens between now and then.) You've said an awful lot, so I'm digging pretty deep for a question here: Do you really think that Relyte and M4yhem are... [good isn't quite the right word here, but something along those lines] enough players to pull off that type of argument if they are scum together?

PookyTheMagicalBear: Disappointing. I like playing with Pooky when he's on his game, and he's not here. This is

mostly

a null tell, since he's not the type of player to let his interest be dictated by his role, but I'd lean in the scummy direction because it does seem he's stalling. Depressed or not, he should have posted something content-wise by now.

Pooky, given that your little quiz was supposedly to give "us" a better idea regarding whether M4yhem is "flailing scum" or making newbie mistakes, I find your refusal to discuss what you think about the answers very odd. What are your reasons?

Relyte (replacing LoudmouthLee): Still the scummiest, IMO. His behavior regarding M4yhem was amazing, and he seems much more concerned with his own skin than catching scum.

Relyte, I would like you to give us your top two suspects, and three scummy things each has done (with quotes and reasoning following the quotes, please).

Rosso Carne: Not quite as frustrating as CES, but pretty close. When Rosso does make an argument, I have a lot of trouble making sense of it. Something doesn't feel right to me, but it's mostly hunch.

Rosso, what Day 1 topic of discussion have you found most interesting so far? Why?

Thok: Whew, nearly there. Playstyle-wise, Thok has been fairly consistent with what I've seen of him as protown... but there's not a lot of differences between that and his scum play. The breadcrumb thing... well, see below.

Thok, you seemed awfully concerned with what pj thought about my response. What did

you

think about it?

Right, that'll do for tonight. Probably back to daily concise posts Wednesday, rather than infrequent longish ones.

[Thok]

Thok, you seemed awfully concerned with what pj thought about my response. What did

you

think about it?

Right, that'll do for tonight. Probably back to daily concise posts Wednesday, rather than infrequent longish ones.

My reason for specifically asking PJ (as opposed to including others) about your response is that I was (and am) trying to gauge the possibility of a mith/pj scum pairing. Both of you have been making comments of the form "Talking a lot and appearing to be hunting scum is a protown sign" (and using that to suggest that you find each other protown), while it strikes me that you've been ignoring the fact that one should also judge the quality of said posts (how wellfounded the arguments are, for example).

As I've implied, I'm pretty sure that Relyte/LML is protown, and that a player who has seen LML's playstyle would come to a similar conclusion. So I find it suspicious that you chose to jump on Relyte as you did.

[Relyte]

Relyte, I would like you to give us your top two suspects, and three scummy things each has done (with quotes and reasoning following the quotes, please).

I can already tell you my top two suspects are PJ and Rosso, I'm a bit busy but when I find the time I will find quotes.

CES also leaves a bit of a scummy image in the back of my head.

[Rosso Carne]

mith: rel vs m4y

[MeMe]

Game note

:

lordy has yet to respond to either the email or PM I sent out on Friday and, actually, hasn't even logged in to pick up the PM. I plan to give him a full week (about 85 more hours) before assuming he's not coming back and pulling the plug on the game.

[M4yhem]

I really hope Lordy comes back.

m4y: yes i can. I'm not going to yet. but i can.

RARR, M4YHEM SMASH…er, I mean, sure, take your time; it’s not like we really need to lynch someone or anything.

Mith-
I would probably lynch Relyte. His behaviour still bothers me. It would be hard to justify going after anyone else. Or I might pick one of the quiet players, on the basis that it always seems to be the quiet ones. Probably CES.

Your analysis on Crash sends alarm bells ringing in my mind. He tends to lurk as scum, then pop up if someone accuses him. Of course, he could just be away, rendering this whole line of argument ridiculous.
Crash, are you scum? If so, can I like, lynch you? That would be awesome.

Not sure about Pooky still. Your weak defence of him is noted.

I disagree that scum use the ‘when I’m dead, do x’ more than town. I’ve used it as both types of role (NB, it never, ever worked.) Probably slightly more as town. I

am

somewhat surprised to see Pj resorting to it, but he was under a fair amount of pressure.

Al_Kohaulec plays very conservatively as town. I’m not sure how he plays as scum, but his behavior here is consistent with his townie behavior.

Thok-
Quality of arguments doesn’t mean that much. I’ve seen town make awful arguments, which make your eyes bleed, and scum can make a case which looks pretty good. To me, effort and the intention behind it is a better indicator of alignment.

I have seen LML’s playstyle. I did not come to the same conclusion as you. So you’re wrong. Tell me, how does LML play as scum?

Rosso- You forgot to say why.

unvote

[Rosso Carne]

mith: its the only revealing thing thats happened.

everything else is shitty townies diverting attention from scumhunting.

[Rosso Carne]

hi m4y

[petroleumjelly]

Thok, could you please address the five (A-E) things I brought up against you in the post where I voted you? 'twould be appreciated.

[Thok]

Thok, could you please address the five (A-E) things I brought up against you in the post where I voted you? 'twould be appreciated.

Long post coming. (I'm about half way done with it, but I need to review about four of your games, and all of your posts in this game.)

[Rosso Carne]

uh oh, thok metagaming coming.

better watch out or pj'll say you dont have a metagame on him either.

[al_kohaulec]

Game note

:

lordy has yet to respond to either the email or PM I sent out on Friday and, actually, hasn't even logged in to pick up the PM. I plan to give him a full week (about 85 more hours) before assuming he's not coming back and pulling the plug on the game.

I was planning to reread some of the thread today, if I do lordy better come back.

[Rosso Carne]

LOL id wait a few days if i were you.

[al_kohaulec]

ya, I will.

I'm getting tired right now anyways.

[M4yhem]

hi m4y

Hi Red. Fancy seeing you here.

Aah, apathy. I'm starting to think we'll never get anyone lynched. So who wants to play "guess the scumsters?". My official guess: Relyte, Pooky, CES. I can't wait to find out how horribly wrong I am. Also, if we have a SK, it's PJ.
What's your guess, slackers?

Anyway,

Vote: Relyte

because he bugs me.

[Relyte]

hi m4y

Hi Red. Fancy seeing you here.

Aah, apathy. I'm starting to think we'll never get anyone lynched. So who wants to play "guess the scumsters?". My official guess: Relyte, Pooky, CES. I can't wait to find out how horribly wrong I am. Also, if we have a SK, it's PJ.
What's your guess, slackers?

Anyway,

Vote: Relyte

because he bugs me.

Reasons?

(I am aware I have still not posted my quotes. Schoolwork is getting the better of me... and if the game does shut down, I'd rather not spend 30-60 minutes looking for quotes. I will post after the game is or is not abandoned.)

[Thok]

A.)

My refusal to unvote Thok during the random voting stage. There is absolutely no problem with this, and it is not scummy. Thok, however, kept pushing the issue, as if it were larger than it truly is.

B.)

Thok then claimed I was "avoiding his questions", here:

I will admit that I am trying to bait you a bit for reactions/clarification; but it bothers me that you took like three posts to actually get my point (which I thought was clear; maybe others will disagree).

When it should be pretty clear I was

trying

to answer his questions. This is not the first time I have been accused of "avoiding the question", and I sincerely urge you to read Gmk's posts against me in Most Mountainousest. Sometimes I address posts how I interpret them, and that can be different than what the author of the post intended.

I haven't had as much time as I'd like to address PJ's points, and the original message I had was lost when my Safari crashed. Since these two points are quicker to address I'll post about them now, and do the other ones later.

A.

I have never attacked you for refusing to unvote me in the early stage.

Again, I have never attacked you for refusing to unvote me in the early stage.

I have specifically said multiple times that I wasn't attacking you for refusing to unvote me in the early stage.

What I have done, and what you have repeatedly refuse to understand, is accuse you of attacking me as a justification for a vote that you knew was random. I have said that if you just said "Thok's not in danger, so I don't need to unvote", I wouldn't be bothered by you. I am specifically suspicious of the specific fact that you then went on to suggest that I am scum.

B.

I'm suspicious because

you

keep misinterpreting my comments, even though I have specifically tried to clarify them to explain why I found them suspicious.

Also, gmk was town in Most Mountainous. So this might be a pro-town tell, but it can't be a basis for an attack on me.

[Thok]

EBWODP

"So this might be a protown tell

for you

"

Also, just for reference my response to C/D/E should come up on Friday at the latest.

[M4yhem]

Reasons?

I'm sure you're smart enough to figure this one out for yourself, buddy. It has something to do with that long arguement we had earlier.

Part of me can't help but wonder if Mith is leading me around. Seems like we agree on everything currently.

Not that it matters really. Looks like this game will end prematurely, which is a shame since I was really enjoying it, now that activity has picked up. If it's not over, remind me to look at Mith in more detail next week.

[mith]

I'm still here, but given that:

a. I am happy with my vote.
and
b. No one has directed any questions my way.

I don't have a lot to say. Also, I am extremely busy, between work and nano and various other things, so I'll wait to see if the game is continuing before committing any more time here.