I love the 90's Cartoons - Game over all hail The Brain!

[sword_of_omens]

Poro please point out the points you want me to explain in one post.

[sword_of_omens]

ugh...new page...
See 3123

[sword_of_omens]

EBWOPX2:
3124...
ugh I hate my phone

[Porochaz]

Sword on the other hand has a lot less minor things, but the game has unravelled from beneath him. There is also 3 major points that I can't let slip by.

1. The PR thing.

Unneeded and if he is scum, he could have pretty much win the game right there. It didn't make much sense especially from a townie standpoint.

2. The L/S Pere vote.

If you are unhappy and have 3 days left then why choose one of the two? This wasn't a point I made, but its a good one that damns you.

3. The "I Can Prove Im Town" argument.

Was a load of bullshit wasn't it?

Then there is the fact that the majority of Jals big post remains unanswered. All the points I wanted you to counter, you didn't. Your case against her didn't really hold up.

[Porochaz]

I mean you have me doubting myself slightly so I commend you on that, but when it boils down to it, I personally think the whole OS thing was pretty clear cut and I dont know why you had to check it.

The only conclusion I can come up with is that you were frantically searching for an out. You should have never changed your vote once it was set.

The main thing I keep coming back to is point 3. I can prove Im town. I can't see how you are going to convince me otherwise. You stalled hugely, then when you finally "proved" it, it was a lot of conjecture and extrapolation of OS's posts without any proof.

If you want me to believe you are town you need to explain:
How O/S's post restriction would have helped you determine whether he was scum?
How it wasn't clear that MS was only given role names?
Why you stalled for so long on the proof of town?
How the extrapolation of O/S's posts provided conclusive proof you were town?

Im going to bed for what looks like 6 hours.

[Jal]

She continually tried to throw the idea of a third party out there to add confusion to the town, even after the Mod confirmed that the post she was referring to was in fact just a standard flavor lynch.

Jal on the other hand,
has kept trying to bring in 3rd parties when it was clear that there weren’t any.

Didn't think I mentioned third parties that much. Went back through ISO. I was wrong one one point - I didn't bring up third parties the day after RBT was killed. I mentioned it later during mass claims when no one had claimed having anything to do with the peculiarity of RBT's death flavor not being attributed to PM.

Most of my mentions to third party claims

were responses

to other people.

1.

Response to Oversoul bringing up the oddity of GNR's death in post 2448 (yeah, we were confused that this was purely flavor). Commented on that and how RBT's death doesn't make sense from a scum perspective. I shut down this line of conversation in post 2500 after finding no similar roles n the wiki.

2.

Response to Oversoul in post 2721. He asked the mod a question concerning what MSH could accomplish being the last scum alive. I asked what he thought Lastsurvior was then, and then commented that given the game size I think we're looking for at least two scum. There would still be one scum, even if he doesn't think Lastsurvivor was part of the scum team and was "something" else.

3.

Seanald brought it up. My response in post 2823 was saying how I've thought about it, but again, no roles match what had happened.

4.

Response to your posts post 2873 and
and post 2887

You kept leaving the number of scum team up in the realm of possibility, by considering there could be only 4 scum which is unlikely in a 24 man game. My response in post 2891 was shutting down that realm of possibility unless you believed in a third claim, which there was no indication of, so no, there were two more.

I didn't just keep "bringing up" a third party at random or whatever. I was either responding to other people, or I was making it clear how the scenarios concerning a third party either didn't make sense, or for their scenarios to be correct there had to be a third party

which I then mentioned how there's no indication of a third party

.

You are just wrong.

[sword_of_omens]

ok, got to s spot...addressing these:

If you want me to believe you are town you need to explain:
How O/S's post restriction would have helped you determine whether he was scum?
How it wasn't clear that MS was only given role names?
Why you stalled for so long on the proof of town?
How the extrapolation of O/S's posts provided conclusive proof you were town?
How O/S's post restriction would have helped you determine whether he was scum?

We had 4 Post restrictions this game..by all accounts, that does seem like a lot.
We had 1 flip as scum backup
We had 1 flip as VT with Restriction.
We had you with as town with backup (mechanics-wise, makes sense as town)
What were the odds of another VT with restriction?
Considering that scum already copped him and left him alive, it would seem weird for him to be a power role, especially with the NK targets. OS came in as a replacement. I didn’t know enough about his pred to know if he could have been faking a restriction as scum to “look town” , so OS would have been stuck trying to play it off if he had. Seeing as we were going to no lynch that day, OS did not need to have a vote. This way I can verify that yes, he had a restriction. To me, this would have lent a little more credibility to OS’s words, and it wouldn’t have hurt town at all. If he was lying then it would lean him more towards scum. Scum already knew he had a post restriction so it wouldn’t make sense for them to even try and show that he had one. MS said he checked 1851 and 1857 to verify that OS (as VE) had valid post restrictions. When MS flipped it mentions that he will get the name of the character and their role…not role “title” , so I assumed that it meant their ability name (like roleblocker,odd-night vig, etc). I honestly did not even think to check until Jal made mention that OS’s ability was unknown, when I was certain that that wasn’t the case. Mod proved me wrong.
I wasn’t “stalling for time”… when I was going through OS’s ISO to find crumbs, like I said I was going to do, I found that he asked me point blank if I was town. And I responded with “yes, I am town”. As a lie detector, you can’t get anything better than that. It’s your job to try and get someone to say that they are town, or that they are not scum, so you have a definitive sentence to check…my answer was 1 sentence..either I was town or I wasn’t. Why else would he ask me that, if he wasn’t planning on following up on it? The time frame allows for this ..like I said, Seanald was already a question mark after he evaded a lynch. He was a good candidate for pre-OS. Also, when I did try to prove his post restriction OS got upset..Jal had to explain that PR meant Post Restriction, not Power role…again, the only people who knew of his power role were him, and scum. As town VT one would only see PR as post restriction. That’s how I saw it, I’m pretty certain that’s how you saw it as well. Power role shouldn’t have been considered at all, period. But Jal thought I might have known about the Power role and that’s probably why she corrected me. Look at my response to her..like I said, it never even crossed my mind to think of Power role. If OS saw it as me knowlingly try to out is role. That should have made me scum in his eyes, but he didn’t call me out as scum. Why not? I think it was because of the lie detect. I wanted to wait until the next day to bring it forward where I thought it would benefit town the most. With Seanald confirmed by OS and you confirmed by mechanics I thought we had a sure thing. Although, I guess my delivery could have been better…

Jal says I keep saying town mentality and scum mentality..and the reason I say that is because I want you to know the difference. Town has to guess and deduce and try to understand all the shit that’s going on, whereas scum works with inside knowledge. I had no inside knowledge nor does it look like I do at any point. Jal looks like she does, as I’ve explained already, and she blew up when I called her out on it..and that’s not typical of her play this game at all…
I explained everything from start to finish..what I was thinking and my purpose for it..it hasn’t changed,
I did everything I could as town to try and help town...
Re-read my ISO and you’ll see that I’m not lying..

[sword_of_omens]

also keep in mind i was V/LA for the weekend during my "stall time" and you didn't realize that i was at the time...

[sword_of_omens]

also, if you have time,
I have history of playing a good game and then blowing it at lylo..
I tend to overthink things..
Read the ending pages of Final fantasy vi mafia...


Ok going back to my house, bed and meds now

[farside22]

vote count

sword_of_omen (1) Jal
Jal (1) sword_of omen

With 3 alive it will take 2 to lynch.

Deadline December 21, 8:30am EST

[Porochaz]

Im here, as far as I've worked out, I have 55 minutes.

[Porochaz]

Jal says I keep saying town mentality and scum mentality..and the reason I say that is because I want you to know the difference. Town has to guess and deduce and try to understand all the shit that’s going on, whereas scum works with inside knowledge. I had no inside knowledge nor does it look like I do at any point. Jal looks like she does, as I’ve explained already, and she blew up when I called her out on it..and that’s not typical of her play this game at all…

This was in my considerations.

The problem is and where you ultimately fail is that there is logic there but not enough to hide any shortcomings.

The way you see things going down are not the way I saw things. For instance, I couldnt care less what OS thought you meant, I cared about the intent behind it. I was also pretty confident MS didn't get anything more than role names.

Your first and last line of 3118 also strike me as off. Its a minor thing and might just be a language thing, but I hadn't voted yet. You act like all is lost. You don't ever say town in that post, you refer to the loss as your own (and at the end, mine as well)

[Porochaz]

I looked at FF, very different scenario to here.

Not convinced.

Oh god, I hope Im correct...

vote sword

[Porochaz]

LAST HAMMAH EVER!!!

[Porochaz]

Gah I need to know whether I've done awesomely in the last couple of days or just ended a shit game (for me) even more shitly...

[sword_of_omens]

Well, either you were scum trolling me and Jal,
Or you have chosen very poorly...

Sorry I failed you OS...


I tried......


Sigh...

[Porochaz]

If you are not scum trolling me then you should know that you should have never tried to prove you were town. It wasn't out there, from an outsiders perspective it didn't prove a thing it just served to condemn you.

[Porochaz]

From a critical point of view, I played badly in the last day in that I should have posted with more time to spare, unfortunately I was unable. That said, throughout the two larger conversations between sword and Jal, Jal came out with some strong points some of which didn't get answered, basically she came out all guns blazing and you responded to a couple of the points then proceeded to attack but with a lot of weaker points, which would have been fine if you had answered all the previous points.

As I said during the game, I also failed to add up a lot of your later day posts. What you were doing didn't make sense from a town perspective. I'd be interested to hear what other town members thought going into this day...

[PinkyandtheBrain]

In the immortal word of T.J Detwiller

TV Show: Recess
Character: Theodore Jasper Detweiller
Flavor: Everyone knows you as T.J. You are the ringleader in your band of best friend. You love planning pranks, your best quality is speaking in public.
Role: Townie
Ability: Your vote and nothing else.
Win Condition: You win when all evil forces are eliminated.

sword is lynched and he is town.

mafia wins

I will post more tomorrow. Sorry for the delay on this.
Never work two jobs and mod any game.

[Seanald]

Worst player ever wow......

[Kmd4390]

I thought Jal and Prere were pretty obv on the day Prere was lynched.

[Kmd4390]

Also sword looked very genuine in his "proving" he was town.

[sword_of_omens]

Worst player ever wow......

is this directed at me, Seanald?

[sword_of_omens]

also..btw , i hate you Jal!
you did a damn fine job...

[sword_of_omens]

OS, if you're not too pissed off at me, do you have the dead QT link?