Proven role is NOT THE SAME as proven alignment

Kmd4390 · Post Post #0 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:22 am

Why the fuck doesn't anyone on this site realize that

[/drunkpost]
[/notongoing (this came from a game that Spy and I almost won as scum but didn't cuz of a town I'm about to nom for best protown team performance or whatever the scummy for that is)]

Seraphim · Post Post #1 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:30 am

Two words: site meta.

Elmo · Post Post #2 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:46 am

1. People are idiots
2. Nonetheless I would approve if every newbie had this thread stapled to their forehead

Glork · Post Post #3 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:49 am

I don't understand how "Proof of abilty is not proof of alignment" is so often overlooked.

Meh.

PokerFace · Post Post #4 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:52 am

i have found countless ways to prove my roles and or claims on irc and main reason i succeed is people forget said role can also be scum. Just because i admitted to getting a govenor invention from somebody during the night doesn't mean i am town. Even scum can tell the truth and just cause their role is true doesn't make their alignment true

ElectricBadger · Post Post #5 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 11:45 am

Kmd4390 wrote:Why the fuck doesn't anyone on this site realize that

[/drunkpost]
[/notongoing (this came from a game that Spy and I almost won as scum but didn't cuz of a town I'm about to nom for best protown team performance or whatever the scummy for that is)]

You're so right. No one here, at all, does. Thanks for pointing that out in a non-dramatic way. Our lives are richer now, with you and poetry.

Glork · Post Post #6 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:05 pm

ElectricBadger wrote:You're so right. No one here, at all, does. Thanks for pointing that out in a non-dramatic way. Our lives are richer now, with you and poetry.

0/5 on hilarity
1/5 on proving a point

Furry · Post Post #7 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:09 pm

This happens because too many mods refuse to put common pro-town roles that are proveable in scum hands. One of these days someone needs to run a game with scum Inventor, Govenor and Neighborizer

UncertainKitten · Post Post #8 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:13 pm

[REDACTED, remind me to repost after the game is over.]

StrangerCoug · Post Post #9 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:28 pm

Furry wrote:This happens because too many mods refuse to put common pro-town roles that are proveable in scum hands. One of these days someone needs to run a game with scum Inventor, Govenor and Neighborizer

SWN II: The Curse of the Nekomata had something close to the first one (an arsonist jack of all trades), and if I understand the governor role correctly, it isn't all that pro-town since its ability denies the town information gathered from a lynch when it is used. A scum neighborizer would be interesting to see, though.

Seraphim · Post Post #10 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:31 pm

Tar has run a game with a Mafia Inventor, I know that for sure.

Yosarian2 · Post Post #11 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:36 pm

You do realize that the reasons I thought SpyreX were town had nothing at all to do with his role-claim, right? I don't think anyone just assumed he was town because of his claim.

Mr. Flay · Post Post #12 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:43 pm

People need to play more Single-Role Theme Games, that'll burn this tendency right out of them.

Vi · Post Post #13 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:09 pm

Furry wrote:This happens because too many mods refuse to put common pro-town roles that are proveable in scum hands. One of these days someone needs to run a game with scum Inventor, Govenor and Neighborizer

Mafia Inventor - Mind Screw Mafia III (note: really overpowered)
Mafia Inventor - Border of Touhou and Mafia (three of them! also underpowered in retrospect)
Mafia Governor - US Election 08 Mafia (note: never used)
Mafia Governor - Pick Your Power II (note: never used)
Mafia Neighborizer - Mafia Reverberation (note: never used)
Mafia Neighborizer - [ONGOING GAME] (note: never used)
Mafia Doublevoter - Mafia Reverberation (note: one-shot)
Mafia Doublevoter - Murder in Zachtown

Also, Neighborizer almost always dies before D2. I've always wanted to see one used in action (or BE one); it's frustrating.

Anyway, I love this trope to death and back. Almost all of my setups have played with this.

Glork · Post Post #14 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:38 pm

What exactly is a "Neighborizer" and since when is it considered a "common" role?

I wouldn't consider Inventors or Governors common protown roles either....

StrangerCoug · Post Post #15 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:47 pm

Glork wrote:What exactly is a "Neighborizer" and since when is it considered a "common" role?

My understanding of a neighborizer is that the mod can PM a player and those two people become neighbors. Is that correct, those of you more familiar with this than I am?

Glork wrote:I wouldn't consider Inventors or Governors common protown roles either....

Are you implying that inventors are not common or not protown?

Vi · Post Post #16 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:48 pm

Glork wrote:What exactly is a "Neighborizer" and since when is it considered a "common" role?

I wouldn't consider Inventors or Governors common protown roles either....

Mason Recruiter. Except without Masons. And infinitely better than a "Pro-Town Cult Recruiter".
Basically it allows you to choose someone else and start talking to them at Night. I love it; it's a weak power role on paper and its use is roughly equal to the skill of the person who has the role.

@Coug: Most likely not common. Inventors and Governors are usually pro-Town.

Glork · Post Post #17 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:51 pm

They are not common. I think out of the hundred or so games I've played in, there have been maybe 2-3 each of Inventors and Governors. And obvious I've never heard of a "Neighborizer" as such.

camn · Post Post #18 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 3:09 pm

Yosarian2 wrote:You do realize that the reasons I thought SpyreX were town had nothing at all to do with his role-claim, right? I don't think anyone just assumed he was town because of his claim.

It did destroy his wagon and carried him to endgame.
He was almost lynched all game before that.

Just sayin.

Furry · Post Post #19 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 3:24 pm

Vi wrote:Anyway, I love this trope to death and back. Almost all of my setups have played with this.

Cant agree more. Too many people accept some roles as "obviously town" and they get written off just because its against the site meta to make them scum roles. Im glad to see that there are starting to be quite a few mafia track/watch roles, doctors, but thats really about it for creativity with those role nowadays.

At the same time people cant comprehend things like "Town Roleblocker". I have seen a game where a RB claim actually caused a player who was unbelieveably town (still bitter) to be lynched.

Yeah ive seen neighborizer be "make X and Y neighbors" and "become neighbors with X". Again thats an underused roles. I know they are "uncommon" but that normally doesnt mean bad, just that most mods have no clue how to balance them, or know that they exist (same goes for the other roles ive talked about).

Yosarian2 · Post Post #20 (ISO) » Mon Apr 05, 2010 3:44 pm

camn wrote:
Yosarian2 wrote:You do realize that the reasons I thought SpyreX were town had nothing at all to do with his role-claim, right? I don't think anyone just assumed he was town because of his claim.
It did destroy his wagon and carried him to endgame.
He was almost lynched all game before that.

Just sayin.

Well, yeah. You don't generally lynch a claimed information role right away, especially one with proven information. That's not the same as assuming he's town, though.

The Fonz · Post Post #21 (ISO) » Tue Apr 06, 2010 3:33 am

Furry wrote:This happens because too many mods refuse to put common pro-town roles that are proveable in scum hands. One of these days someone needs to run a game with scum Inventor

I've seen a scum inventor before. It's a role that's very interesting in scum hands.

shaft.ed · Post Post #22 (ISO) » Tue Apr 06, 2010 5:56 am

Glork wrote:They are not common. I think out of the hundred or so games I've played in, there have been maybe 2-3 each of Inventors and Governors. And obvious I've never heard of a "Neighborizer" as such.

used to be a recruiting mason

Vi · Post Post #23 (ISO) » Tue Apr 06, 2010 6:21 am

my avatar has flashy colors; why are people ignoring my posts

Mr. Flay · Post Post #24 (ISO) » Tue Apr 06, 2010 6:40 am

Glork wrote:They are not common. I think out of the hundred or so games I've played in, there have been maybe 2-3 each of Inventors and Governors. And obvious I've never heard of a "Neighborizer" as such.

Agreed (and it's a wretchedly terrible name, to boot).

We used to get a few games that had Finding Masons, but they were searching for a specific person that they then gained the ability to talk to/confirmed town.