Mini 773- Welcome to Lynchville! Perfection! (Over)

[ppp973]

add: toward Alexhans

[alexhans]

Unvote, vote to lynch A mafiaso

Shessh I was kiddding, someone kept doing that one this sites I was playing at so I did it here

You said that you were scared, only mafia are scared to be lynched when the lynched targeted.

Unvote, Vote Alexhans

for now.

err... ok... any reason? Joke reason?

[Light-kun]

<3 Red Coyote for having my back on Cool Spot.

While I find it silly to vote for ppp based on his joke to vote for "the mafia", I'd like it a lot more if he'd at least try to contribute. While random votes on people doesn't provide much useful information, it's still

something

.

@ Kublai: PieisPopcorn has a point. I get the feeling you were trying to push that bandwagon without being on it. It's pretty minor as far as scumtells go, but combined with how snappy and defensive you're acting towards Pie in response, I think it's worth a vote switch.

unvote: alexhans

vote: KublaiKhan

And I find this opportunistic, vote stays. I am also giving a meaningless FoS to Pie for taking a joke (Clearly a joke. You underestimate town if you really thought people would vote PPP over that post) for more than it is, but you may have just been joking in return. I do not see this intent with the 7-Up guy.

[afatchic]

And your second votecount looks something like this:

ppp973-(2)- Archaist, alexhans,

ChiefSkye4-(2)-PieIsPopcorn, LesterGroans
BrianMcQueso-(1)-Light-kun
Light-kun-(1)- RedCoyote
Kublai Khan-(1)-BrianMcQueso
alexhans-(1)-ppp973

Not voting-(4)-cater action, Cream147, Kublai Khan, ChiefSkye4

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

And by the way, I edit the votecount in post one every time someone votes/unvotes so thats always gonna be an accurate votecount. It may be a good idea to have the thing on so you always have the first post up.

[RedCoyote]

Vote ppp973

for trying to vote early to confuse things and then not voting anyone.

Going to chalk this up to a language barrier, but I thought it was weird how alex said ppp was suspicious for "voting early".

Additionally, I'm not going to touch the ppp thing. I have no problem with his vote, I actually thought it was kind of clever (although I'm sure it's been done countless times).

---

Since PieIsPopcorn is starting the questioning in the opening 2 pages where people are still going to pop in with their random vote, all he accomplishes is sewing confusion and chaos into the opening procedures.

Better to let everyone show up, say their hellos, make their jokes, etc.., and then leap in with pointed questions. I just don't see the benefit in breaking with convention.

I don't care for this post. You'll usually get the player who will say, "Ok RVS is over" or something like that, but there's no, like, set amount of posts or pages that stuff is supposed to go on for.

I can't even give you credit for the confusion idea. PiP isn't stopping anyone from "saying their hellos" or "making their jokes", he saw something that he thought might be discussion worthy, and he brought it up. If someone is confused about a post and or what the author means, they should just ask.

Not sure the motivation here, maybe, as Brian suggested, to subtly pile on the PiP attacks?

Well, it gives me a reason to

unvote

and now

vote: Kublai Khan

.

---

And I find this opportunistic, vote stays.

Could you explain this a little more?

[PieIsPopcorn]

I'll have a detailed post on the criticisms against me tomorrow after school, however I would like to say that I support the Kublai wagon. Also,

unvote ChiefSkye4

. Again, as I'll explain tomorrow, I found her reaction to my vote to be one I'd expect from a pro-town player.

[Cream147]

I put no stock into the "X on the wagon is scumz" flack, but, aside from that, my explanation is above. IGMEOY means "I've got my eyes on you" right? Haha sorry.

Normally I don't put anything in the "X on the wagon is scumz" thing either, but when the votes go on in consecutive posts, it generally is more significant, because then it would make sense as an opportunistic vote, and hey, even better, it's the random vote stage so you can get away with it! However, having read your response, and also the fact that you really can't take anything too serious from the random vote stage (it's quite random unfortunately), I don't think it was opportunistic in your case. Still, as I say, IGMEOY!

IGMEOY means I've got my eye on you yes lol. So you'd better watch out!

[ppp973]

Unvote, vote to lynch A mafiaso

Shessh I was kiddding, someone kept doing that one this sites I was playing at so I did it here

You said that you were scared, only mafia are scared to be lynched when the lynched targeted.

Unvote, Vote Alexhans

for now.

err... ok... any reason? Joke reason?

read my post instead of tl;dr.

[Kublai Khan]

@ Kublai: PieisPopcorn has a point. I get the feeling you were trying to push that bandwagon without being on it. It's pretty minor as far as scumtells go, but combined with how snappy and defensive you're acting towards Pie in response, I think it's worth a vote switch.

Snappy? Defensive? Holy leaping to conclusions, Batman! Don't you have to know me first before making that call? All I said was that I disagreed with PieIsPopcorn's early game tactics.

And as far as "pushing a (ppp973) wagon without being on it" goes. Did you notice I put a smiley? It was a rib at ppp973, and I think he got it. (Or he may not of, I don't know, I still can't read him very well).

This is what "pushing a wagon without being on it" looks like:

I'll have a detailed post on the criticisms against me tomorrow after school, however I would like to say that I support the Kublai wagon.

Hell, he even unvoted within the post without voting for me.

[alexhans]

Vote ppp973

for trying to vote early to confuse things and then not voting anyone.

Going to chalk this up to a language barrier, but I thought it was weird how alex said ppp was suspicious for "voting early".

Nope. Never said he was suspicious. But I find it more interesting if I give my vote a content other than: "vote Mr.Doe because he smells like my socks :p"

Unvote, vote to lynch A mafiaso

Shessh I was kiddding, someone kept doing that one this sites I was playing at so I did it here

You said that you were scared, only mafia are scared to be lynched when the lynched targeted.

Unvote, Vote Alexhans

for now.

err... ok... any reason? Joke reason?

read my post instead of tl;dr.

Oh! wow. now I understand... you think that because your vote annoys me then I'm mafia and scared by your -I want to say stupid but i'll say meaningless- vote? and also you OMGUS me? This is really an OH MY GOD YOU SUCK!!!! with all the letters.

This game has gotten aggressive pretty soon... Let's all remember we are practically in RVS with not much content. Let's soften the accusations a little because town players wouldn't know for certain that someone is scum for 1 post. Investigate, but be smart. Don't get emotional so soon.

[Archaist]

You said that you were scared, only mafia are scared to be lynched when the lynched targeted.

What makes you think that only mafia should be afraid to be lynched? If anything townies should be more nervous about a lynch, as they don't know if the person will turn up mafia or town.

[BrianMcQueso]

Snappy? Defensive? Holy leaping to conclusions, Batman! Don't you have to know me first before making that call? All I said was that I disagreed with PieIsPopcorn's early game tactics.

How am I supposed to get to know you without pushing your buttons? Besides, I still see you as being on the defensive if you hastily call my actions "jumping to conclusions". It seems like everyone who's made even the slightest claim against you has gotten a huge post reaction. That's the read I've got on you so far, and it's worth a single vote from me to bring attention to it. You act like I'm already stringing up the rope!

This is what "pushing a wagon without being on it" looks like:

I'll have a detailed post on the criticisms against me tomorrow after school, however I would like to say that I support the Kublai wagon.

I totally agree with you on this one, though. A post from Pie addressing criticisms against himself is all well and good, but the Kublai thing seems tacked on randomly.

[Light-kun]

And I find this opportunistic, vote stays.

Could you explain this a little more?

Looks like opportunistic wagoning for a weak reason, like a tack on bill. Reads scummy. See post I quote from Kublai.

I also think Pie is possible scum, but this is not contrary to Kublai's scumminess. Nothing more to say really...

Brian has a low percentage.

[PieIsPopcorn]

Let me make a confession- I dislike the RVS. Sometimes it's fun, sometimes it's neccesary, but as a whole I fail to see the benefit for the town. Any content that is provided through the RVS is clouded through the simple jokey nature of the phase. There can be information brought by the RVS, but you have a sift through a variety of jokes, and seemingly scummy comments to reach it's true significance, and really comprehend the content that can be obtained through the RVS. As a result,

I decided to make an attempt to side-step this stage entirely by putting pressure on the first semi-suspicious thing I saw. It wouldn't neccesarily be the issue itself, but the reactions there in, that would be interesting to behold. I believe that I got a good chunk of information from the reactions there-in.

I have experience playing with ppp973. Voting for him is the best Day 1 action for town.

Looking at ppp's past game, I see your point. However, if you're for an early ppp bandwagon, why aren't you voting him?

Because I'm not really sold on the utility of policy lynches. Plus I'm sure he's bound to dig himself into a hole sooner than later.

As far as I'm aware, one more vote would have not lynched him, or even put him at L-1, or L-2. 4 votes would have put him at L-3, not a huge threat as far as a policy lynch is concerned. And if he is "bound to dig himself into a hole", I fail to see the negatives of putting pressure on him early. That way, we could have examined how that reaction potentially compares to his meta.

BTW - What's with the over-aggressive questioning during the random vote phase?

Perhaps you and I just have a different definition of "over-aggresive"? I just am questioning details that I'm finding interesting. As far as I'm aware, that's how one scumhunts. Exactly what is wrong with aggressiveness during the early stage of the game?

Third vote is opportunistic? Really? That's a stretch.

I agree... I'm thinking that it fishes for reactions more than starts a bandwaggon... Who is gonna call him off for that...

How exactly does a third vote on a wagon fish for reactions? It was a very minor issue, that was relatively clearly a vote with light-hearted connotations, however it was the third on the votewagon. all of which were based on the same thing- ppp's post. Finding this interesting, I decided that some pressure through a vote was warranted, to find out the origin of the vote, and if any thought process was present. In addition, I was able to pick up an early reaction, which will potentially help the town later in alignment reveals.

Also, why are you responding before ChiefSkye? You couldn't know her alignment, so why would you respond to criticism before she did? If it was reaction testing, she would make that clear, and even give a read on my reaction. If it wasn't, then you would be able to react based on that information. You almost seem to be feeding her an answer, and tainting the analysis.

These two votes are based on legitimately "scumtells", and at the very least seem to be an attempt to draw information from the player, and seem to be non-random votes.

Wrong. My vote wasn't based on a scumtell. It's a random vote but I always give it a reason so we can maybe get a response.

I would like to apologize for this then. I'm used to random votes being clearly jokes. I did not mean to mischaracterize your post the way that I did, and it was an invalid assumption that I made. I shouldn't have done so without clarification.

Also, it's PAGE 2. Don't expect airtight cases.

That's what I meant.

... I'm not sure what you mean here. Do you mean that you did have a reason for your vote, it just wasn't particularly solid?

No, not at this point ... I probably wouldn't have chose Chief if I knew that he had a vote on him(same post time), but I'm fine with it where it is for now. Pressure on a couple of players gives us more information.

You wouldn't vote for someone who already has a vote? why? you think it can lead to a bandwaggon to fast or what

Now, I'm aware that arguments are not going to be solid, but there is a different between arguments not based on airtight premises and craplogic, and this is the latter. If Lester honestly believed what you claim he did, he would have quickly unvoted, and voted somebody else. He did explain his vote too, eager to hear your response.

@ Kublai: PieisPopcorn has a point. I get the feeling you were trying to push that bandwagon without being on it. It's pretty minor as far as scumtells go, but combined with how snappy and defensive you're acting towards Pie in response, I think it's worth a vote switch.

unvote: alexhans

vote: KublaiKhan

I like this post. This was my point completely, and I find it interesting that Kublai didn't really had defensive and snappish connotations the moment I put pressure on him. There were slight hints with that "over-aggression" piece, but it wasn't particularly clear.

BTW - What's with the over-aggressive questioning during the random vote phase?

I don't think there's a problem with it, it's really the only way we're going to get out of random stage.

Yeah, but random stage is going to happen. Mind as well let people get it out of their system. Since PieIsPopcorn is starting the questioning in the opening 2 pages where people are still going to pop in with their random vote, all he accomplishes is sewing confusion and chaos into the opening procedures.

Better to let everyone show up, say their hellos, make their jokes, etc.., and then leap in with pointed questions. I just don't see the benefit in breaking with convention.

It was after Lester asked an (IMO) pretty innocous question that suddenly Kublai gets defensive and starts attacking my method of ending the RVS. It feels like if it were genuine, it would have been more immediate.

Yeah, but random stage is going to happen. Mind as well let people get it out of their system. Since PieIsPopcorn is starting the questioning in the opening 2 pages where people are still going to pop in with their random vote, all he accomplishes is sewing confusion and chaos into the opening procedures.

Better to let everyone show up, say their hellos, make their jokes, etc.., and then leap in with pointed questions. I just don't see the benefit in breaking with convention.

I don't really see how this game has been a break in convention. Aggressive questioning during the random stage is generally how I've found games go from being random to serious. And that needs to happen at some point, doesn't it.

Agree with this entirely.

I find Chiefskye's action questionable, third vote on a bandwagon is always dodgy, third vote on a bandwagon in the random stage where the last two posts have also been votes on the same person, that's worse. However, in the random stage, I don't think anything too serious can be drawn from it...but IGMEOY Chiefskye.

Don't like this as much. This is exactly what I'm hoping to avoid by ending the RVS as quickly as possible. "Well, this behavior was scummy, but it's not a big deal because it's still the RVS WHEE." The RVS can be an outright barrier to scumhunting if you make it one, and that is what happens with most players. I don't want a stage that provides little to no useful infommation for the town.

Vote ppp973

You know your vote doesn't count right?

ppp already had two votes for his behavior. Why did you feel the need to add a third on, for the exact same reasoning? Reeks of opportunism.

Vote: ChiefSkye4

To be completely honest, I was scanning the page, and I only saw 1 vote on him :/ Sounds like a convenient excuse, but it's true. Since it was the RVS, I didn't thoroughly read :/ ppp's vote stood out because it was longer than the others', and I saw it, and in going to reply, I spotted only one other vote, Archaist's.

I find Chiefskye's action questionable, third vote on a bandwagon is always dodgy, third vote on a bandwagon in the random stage where the last two posts have also been votes on the same person, that's worse. However, in the random stage, I don't think anything too serious can be drawn from it...but IGMEOY Chiefskye.

I put no stock into the "X on the wagon is scumz" flack, but, aside from that, my explanation is above. IGMEOY means "I've got my eyes on you" right? Haha sorry.

While the first two votes were relatively serious and were to draw pressure and information, this vote is just... there. It doesn't particularly seem to be placed for any particular reason. (Yes, I know, RVS, but it's placed on a player that had already recieved pressure for his actions.) Thusly, in my opinion, it warranted some pressure via my vote.

Again, explanation in the first paragraph, but wanted to add: I may be missing some things, but I do have a sense of humor. I understood that ppp's vote was a joke, and I returned with a joke. It was RVS, so I thought I could be lighthearted, but little did I know, I was 3rd to vote him, thinking I was only second.

Unvote

seeing as RVS is over, or nearly there, rather.

This is a pro-town reaction for a couple reasons. I find the fact that she outright depricated her own explanation ("Sounds like a convenient excuse"), and the general tone and demeanor give me extremely good vibes.

Unvote, vote to lynch A mafiaso

Shessh I was kiddding, someone kept doing that one this sites I was playing at so I did it here

You said that you were scared, only mafia are scared to be lynched when the lynched targeted.

Unvote, Vote Alexhans

for now.

Not neccesarily. Many players don't like being lynched on town, and a lynch on a townie is a lynch that isn't on scum, and with the Mafia night kill, the town is, in most cases, down two players. Also, when did Alexhans state that he was scared to be lynched?

<3 Red Coyote for having my back on Cool Spot.

While I find it silly to vote for ppp based on his joke to vote for "the mafia", I'd like it a lot more if he'd at least try to contribute. While random votes on people doesn't provide much useful information, it's still

something

.

@ Kublai: PieisPopcorn has a point. I get the feeling you were trying to push that bandwagon without being on it. It's pretty minor as far as scumtells go, but combined with how snappy and defensive you're acting towards Pie in response, I think it's worth a vote switch.

unvote: alexhans

vote: KublaiKhan

And I find this opportunistic, vote stays.

Exactly why is Brian's vote opportunistic?

I am also giving a meaningless FoS to Pie for taking a joke (Clearly a joke. You underestimate town if you really thought people would vote PPP over that post)

I disagree with you in this regard. I feel that town should jump on anything that they find strange or scummy seriously, especially early on, when the Mafia are not expecting pressure or speculations. It can lead to more authentic reactions.

@ Kublai: PieisPopcorn has a point. I get the feeling you were trying to push that bandwagon without being on it. It's pretty minor as far as scumtells go, but combined with how snappy and defensive you're acting towards Pie in response, I think it's worth a vote switch.

Snappy? Defensive? Holy leaping to conclusions, Batman! Don't you have to know me first before making that call?

Yeah, you see this, this is both snappy and defensive.

All I said was that I disagreed with PieIsPopcorn's early game tactics.

And you've never really explain why coherently. You state that my vote is over-aggessive, but you don't explain why this is anti-town. You state that suspecting players too early will simply lead to confusion and chaos, yet you don't explain why this is so. This pointing fingers

And as far as "pushing a (ppp973) wagon without being on it" goes. Did you notice I put a smiley? It was a rib at ppp973, and I think he got it. (Or he may not of, I don't know, I still can't read him very well).

At this point, the action itself isn't as important to me as how you reacted to being called on it. Instead of just waving it off, as you do here, you come up with wanting to avoid a "policy lynch", and qickly attack me for my methods of trying to inject some method into the RVS. If this was your genuine thought when stating such, why wasn't this your initial reaction?

This is what "pushing a wagon without being on it" looks like:

I'll have a detailed post on the criticisms against me tomorrow after school, however I would like to say that I support the Kublai wagon.

Hell, he even unvoted within the post without voting for me.

You are correct that I should have voted you, but I dislike voting for players until I have established why I find them scummy. I didn't have any time, and I wanted to explain both my suspicions, and that I had a new post coming. I could have done it in a much clearer way, and I apologize.

Vote: Kublai Khan

Preview Response-

Looks like opportunistic wagoning for a weak reason, like a tack on bill. Reads scummy. See post I quote from Kublai.

How can it be wagoning when nobody else had voted Kublai at that point? Also, early in the game, as mentioned, nobody should discount issues just because they appear "weak". Pressure is the best way to get early information out of players.

I also think Pie is possible scum, but this is not contrary to Kublai's scumminess. Nothing more to say really...

Why are I and Kublai scummy? You keep throwing suspicion onto players without directing explaining why without some pressure. It feels like you're just mud-slinging to see what sticks.

FOS: Light-kun

[PieIsPopcorn]

BTW - What's with the over-aggressive questioning during the random vote phase?

I don't think there's a problem with it, it's really the only way we're going to get out of random stage.

Yeah, but random stage is going to happen. Mind as well let people get it out of their system. Since PieIsPopcorn is starting the questioning in the opening 2 pages where people are still going to pop in with their random vote, all he accomplishes is sewing confusion and chaos into the opening procedures.

I'm not prohibiting people for having their random vote. If people want to have random votes, go ahead. But if there is something about that random vote that I find curious, or even scummy, I am going to press and see their reaction. I fail to see how this is going to "sew confusion and chaos". Once everybody gets here and situated, they will be able to comment on the content already provided. In addition, the mafia are used to having the RVS as a "free pass" if you will, so much of the RVS is spent joking around that the Mafia can easily slip actual connections under the guise of jokes. The earlier content is provided for the town to analyze, the better.

Better to let everyone show up, say their hellos, make their jokes, etc.., and then leap in with pointed questions. I just don't see the benefit in breaking with convention.

I don't see how the convention is pro-town, and if it is, how the loss, of the slim potential information garnered by the RVS, and the stall sometimes caused simply because everybody's actions can be attributed to random voting, is worse than the gain of content by an attempt to bypass the RVS entirely.

I missed this part of the post when I was compiling my responses. I apologize for the double-post.

[BrianMcQueso]

After reading that

phone book

post by PieIsPopcorn, I would withdraw my comment about his support of a Kublai wagon being "random".

Brian has a low percentage.

Precentage of...?

[ChiefSkye4]

I put no stock into the "X on the wagon is scumz" flack, but, aside from that, my explanation is above. IGMEOY means "I've got my eyes on you" right? Haha sorry.

Normally I don't put anything in the "X on the wagon is scumz" thing either, but when the votes go on in consecutive posts, it generally is more significant, because then it would make sense as an opportunistic vote, and hey, even better, it's the random vote stage so you can get away with it! However, having read your response, and also the fact that you really can't take anything too serious from the random vote stage (it's quite random unfortunately), I don't think it was opportunistic in your case. Still, as I say, IGMEOY!

IGMEOY means I've got my eye on you yes lol. So you'd better watch out!

Fair enough. And, thanks for the IGEMOY explanation lol.

[RedCoyote]

I agree. Confirm vote: Kublai Kahn. XD

Just kidding, just kidding. I do agree with a lot of what PiP has to say, especially with his jab at Light-kun...

Looks like opportunistic wagoning for a weak reason, like a tack on bill. Reads scummy. See post I quote from Kublai.

But, if you mean Brian, how is he wagoning? As PiP noted, he was the first person to vote KK. What did Brian do wrong in his post? If you find KK scummy,

I also think Pie is possible scum, but this is not contrary to Kublai's scumminess.

then why is Brian scum for "wagoning" him on weak reasoning? If Brian's reasoning is weak, what is your reasoning for calling KK scummy? Or PiP?

[ppp973]

My vote targeted only the mafia's so I doesn't make sense for a townie to have a problem with that

[ppp973]

addon- I agree with all of your comments, but yes I know it's meaningless but it only targeted mafia.

[Light-kun]

After Pie's #63, his scumminess is contrary to Kublai's. Low percent.

After reading that

phone book

post by PieIsPopcorn, I would withdraw my comment about his support of a Kublai wagon being "random".

Brian has a low percentage.

Precentage of...?

0%=confirmed town
100%=confirmed scum.

[cateraction]

After Pie's #63, his scumminess is contrary to Kublai's. Low percent.

After reading that

phone book

post by PieIsPopcorn, I would withdraw my comment about his support of a Kublai wagon being "random".

Brian has a low percentage.

Precentage of...?

0%=confirmed town
100%=confirmed scum.

Would you mind telling us what you think is so townish about Brian?

PPP: Do you have anything else to add? It seems to me that there have been several interesting points brought forth and a good deal of pressure applied, any comment?

[alexhans]

Also, it's PAGE 2. Don't expect airtight cases.

That's what I meant.

... I'm not sure what you mean here. Do you mean that you did have a reason for your vote, it just wasn't particularly solid?

No... I meant that this was RVS and there won't be solid cases but reaction fishing...

No, not at this point ... I probably wouldn't have chose Chief if I knew that he had a vote on him(same post time), but I'm fine with it where it is for now. Pressure on a couple of players gives us more information.

You wouldn't vote for someone who already has a vote? why? you think it can lead to a bandwaggon to fast or what

Now, I'm aware that arguments are not going to be solid, but there is a different between arguments not based on airtight premises and craplogic, and this is the latter. If Lester honestly believed what you claim he did, he would have quickly unvoted, and voted somebody else. He did explain his vote too, eager to hear your response.

Well.. As I become more experienced by playing more games I'm starting to discover that some things I initially scummy are not necessarily like that. And that there are different playstyles and strategies that one may use. I don't think it was crap logic. Right now I felt that the quick waggon might have been an intelligent move to see who would accuse him and in what terms... But ultimately this may be all some kind of WIFOM. I'll think about it.

Not neccesarily. Many players don't like being lynched on town

I don't want to get lynched. Ever. I can't imagine a situation where lynching a town player would be helpful.

Also... I don't like very much that people start cataloging others as town or townie because that doesn't help at all(IMHO) and is usually a trick by scum to befriend players or remove suspicion from them in a eventual death situation. And can make other people take that towniness for granted too.

Let's focus on finding scum, shall we?

[BrianMcQueso]

Also... I don't like very much that people start cataloging others as town or townie because that doesn't help at all(IMHO) and is usually a trick by scum to befriend players or remove suspicion from them in a eventual death situation. And can make other people take that towniness for granted too.

Let's focus on finding scum, shall we?

I disagree completely. Making public your belief that "I think player A is town" or "I believe player B might be scum" is the very basic foundation of useful information to hunt scum. If we don't say who we suspect and who we don't suspect, how else are we to find the scum?

@ Light-kun: I don't quite get you. From what I understand, you read my first "real" vote as opportunistic, and you voted me because of that. I get that, that's fine. But then you say that PieIsPopcorn and Kublai Khan are both scummy, I'm "low percentage" (meaning less likely to be scum), and from what I read from your post 70, you find Pie's argument against Kublai to be a convincing one.

Is all the above accurate? I'm just trying to get a hold on what you've been posting, but you've been doing it in a confusing manner (IMO, maybe it's just me).

[PieIsPopcorn]

addon- I agree with all of your comments, but yes I know it's meaningless but it only targeted mafia.

What do you have any opinions regarding the game thus far aside from your read on alexhans?

PPP: Do you have anything else to add? It seems to me that there have been several interesting points brought forth and a good deal of pressure applied, any comment?

I feel like I commented on most of the game in #63-64. Is there anything in particular you want me to talk about?

Also, it's PAGE 2. Don't expect airtight cases.

That's what I meant.

... I'm not sure what you mean here. Do you mean that you did have a reason for your vote, it just wasn't particularly solid?

No... I meant that this was RVS and there won't be solid cases but reaction fishing...

Fair enough.

No, not at this point ... I probably wouldn't have chose Chief if I knew that he had a vote on him(same post time), but I'm fine with it where it is for now. Pressure on a couple of players gives us more information.

You wouldn't vote for someone who already has a vote? why? you think it can lead to a bandwaggon to fast or what

Now, I'm aware that arguments are not going to be solid, but there is a different between arguments not based on airtight premises and craplogic, and this is the latter. If Lester honestly believed what you claim he did, he would have quickly unvoted, and voted somebody else. He did explain his vote too, eager to hear your response.

Well.. As I become more experienced by playing more games I'm starting to discover that some things I initially scummy are not necessarily like that. And that there are different playstyles and strategies that one may use. I don't think it was crap logic. Right now I felt that the quick waggon might have been an intelligent move to see who would accuse him and in what terms... But ultimately this may be all some kind of WIFOM. I'll think about it.

Ah, my apologies, I thought that your comment was an accusation in regards to Lester due to your word usage. I seem to be having some difficulty fully comprehending your posts.

Not neccesarily. Many players don't like being lynched on town

I don't want to get lynched. Ever. I can't imagine a situation where lynching a town player would be helpful.

I disagree with you, in that lynching town may be helpful in the case of scum fakeclaiming cop or tracker, or if by lynching that townie, you now are aware of the scum through process of elimination. Overall though, being afraid of being lynched is not something unusual for pro-town players.

Also... I don't like very much that people start cataloging others as town or townie because that doesn't help at all(IMHO) and is usually a trick by scum to befriend players or remove suspicion from them in a eventual death situation. And can make other people take that towniness for granted too

Although "I think that ______ is town" can be used by scum to buddy up to other players, if it is backed up by reasoning, it can be quite useful in helping to derail wagons against those players who you think are town, and also helps share your opinion with the other players, which is always good. If scum start clearing people that we don't want to be cleared, then when that player flips scum we can analyze that connection, and see if we find it to be buddying-up, or scummy in nature.

After Pie's #63, his scumminess is contrary to Kublai's. Low percent.

Why aren't you responding to Red and I's questions?