Mini #1007 (Game Over)

[AlmasterGM]

Go ahead and try, but I'll bet you a large sum of money that if you try and catch him doing anything, he either 1) bury it in a giant text wall with some sort of vague question or fluff-response as a rebuttal or 2) tell you that it's part of his playstyle.

Case in point - everybody agrees that his ENTIRE PLAYSTYLE is anti-town and predicated on BAD LOGIC, yet he ignores us all and keeps feeding off lines about how he HAS to be Good and Honest.

[Kid Know Nothing]

Redtail, would you vote Zach or Kid Know Nothing? Your vote is being wasted on ConfidAnon. Gonanno is also wasting his vote at the moment. Put it on Zach or Kid Know Nothing please.

KKN: it isn't too late to get

some

town points for bussing Zach.

Did you really just say that? If I'm going to vote, I'll vote for my own reasons. Please don't tell me who to vote.

Hoopla, from what I understand. I'm scummy to you by numbers. Can I please have a case against me? Either today or tomorrow?


This is also another instance of you trying to direct votes. I'll go back and count them all later.

Shotty; I did ask you questions. Please look again.

"Shotty, suspects and why. I want you to read the thread over again, find things you think are suspect and suspicious. In your own words, please."

"Why [did you protect Hoopla last night]?"

That tells me you aren't even reading the thread, Shotty.


Zack;

Being that his vote is still on Good and Honest despite his assertion that my play apparently makes me very likely scum, I'm getting the feeling that he seems to be rather interested in his vote being off wagon when I'm lynched, and that's something that's bothering me right now.

Oh BS. Are you telling me I can't find someone suspicious and keep my vote somewhere else?

I'm not going to respond to anything that accuses me of fluff or one-liners because it completely ignores my approach to the game in general.

Because posts where you say nearly nothing and come close to clocking in at actively lurking is your approach to the game?

So you're making it a prerequisite that whenever someone votes, they need to come up with their own reasoning to do so? I'm not sure how I'm supposed to do that short of making stuff up. Points were raised on Almaster, and they were legitimate ones. I agreed they were scummy and voted accordingly.

A prerequisite to say something other than "I agree with this wagon" over and over again. I've yet to see you come onto a wagon with any real analysis posted on that person.

Mislynches are great when you're not on them and can look for an easy target to blame for them aren't they? Have some scumpoints.

So your defense to my point, that you voted Elleran without commenting on her once, is that my commentary is scummy because I wasn't on the wagon? Noted.

It seems you have a habit of voting without listing reasoning. You can say that it's your approach to the game, but you should understand why I think that's scummy. Jumping onto a wagon to make it L-1 without even saying something like "Elleran isn't paying attention to the game, I think this is scummy" would have been a lot better than simply saying you didn't want to see a no lynch.

Plus nothing she says is going to actually amount to a vote... so... she's posting to what end exactly? Contributing to what end? Making points that others might agree with and vote on? How is that content? How is that contribution? It's like the opposite of contribution. It's sitting back and hiding. It's ridiculous. I could care less how much she "contributes" at this point, cause she's NOT contributing anything. I'm more interested in the anti-town behaviors and the potential scum motivations behind them, and I see clear scum motivation behind her refusal to claim. (Refusing to claim because she would have to lie.)

It might amount to the vote of someone else. G&H has posted a lot more quality information than you. While you might not agree, I think you should read through the thread again. G&H asks questions constantly, points out odd actions that she sees, and so on. You've done pretty much the exact opposite, offering little to no explanation to your vote.

Zack, if you were to play a role that had a restriction on voting, would you not be able to contribute to the game if you couldn't vote?

[AlmasterGM]

If this game no lynches I will serious explode.

[ConfidAnon]

If this game no lynches I will serious explode.

FFR, pics or it didn't happen.

[Espeonage]

Vote Count

4 -

Zachrulez

- Hoopla, ConfidAnon, drmyshottyizsik, AlmasterGM (L-2)
2 -

Good and Honest

- Zachrulez, Kid Know Nothing (L-4)
1 -

Vel-Rahn Koon

- gonnana (L-5)

Not Voting: Good and Honest, Vel-Rahn Koon, redtail896

Countdown Timer:
http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/cus ... c=0&p0=240

Approximately 31hours for no clicky linkers.

[gonnano]

A couple of people have said that they would be willing to lynch Zach, and he's my second choice behind VRK, so here we go...

Unvote
Vote Zach

That should put him at L-1. Time for a claim, then most likely a hammer.

[redtail896]

I'm here all day, and I am willing to hammer. Zach, please claim.

[Hoopla]

I'm holding you to that, redtail.

[AlmasterGM]

If this game no lynches I will serious explode.

[Good and Honest]

Zachrulez did mention taking a trip last Friday... But it's a pity this has happened at a time when people here are really expecting to hear from Zachrulez.

gonnano, I gave you explanations why I "didn't feel like" answering those questions. If you honestly "don't feel like" answering my questions, please give me an explanation why. It's unfortunate that the questions you've asked me are not "right" in my opinion. The questions you have asked ConfidAnon are for me examples of "right questions" - they ask about particular things happening in this game. Why haven't you asked me such questions?

By the way, I'm confused by your question to ConfidAnon: "Are you still not sure why Hoopla thought Almaster was probably town?". What made you think ConfidAnon wasn't sure about that?

Thank you for answering one of my questions. I'd like to know how the fact that Elleran has turned out not to be a mafioso has changed your perceptions about that situation with the votes for Elleran.

redtail896, I have been sharing my thoughts and observations. I find your first three questions somewhat strange - as I have said, I think everyone should always consider the possibility that each other player might be a mafioso.

Do I consider the possibility that you are a mafioso? Yes. But, as you surely have noticed, so far I haven't found something that noteworthy about you.

Do I consider the possibility that Hoopla is a mafioso? Yes. And I have mentioned numerous times things that could point out to such a solution. Now there is one I'd like to add:

I have seen in various games on this site that when deadline comes near, some players change their vote to the person with most votes just so they can have someone lynched. So when Hoopla asks people to vote Zachrulez, I'm not that surprised. But there is another player Hoopla asks others to vote for - Kid Know Nothing. Not someone who has already received votes (me, Vel-Rahn Koon, ConfidAnon) but a player who no one has voted for! So this reason - to avoid having no one lynched - seems illogical to me in Kid Know Nothing's case.

By the way, redtail896, it would be interesting for me to know what you think about Hoopla stating the game is "stalling" and at the same time neglecting my questions and comments...

Do I consider the possibility that ConfidAnon is a mafioso? Yes. I think I have commented quite a lot on ConfidAnon's behaviour. However, it has to be said that, whenever I have interrogated/commented on ConfidAnon, ConfidAnon has responded to me, which is a good thing. There has been one exception - when at the end of Day 1 I asked ConfidAnon "What are your observations on Zachrulez so far?", ConfidAnon didn't answer but instead attacked Zachrulez immediately on Day 2.

Regarding the part of my previous post where I talked about ConfidAnon - you say that what's most important is what I think about ConfidAnon's actions. I disagree. I have already expressed my point of view when I shared my thoughts on Vel-Rahn Koon's post (whose point Vel-Rahn Koon said I had ignored) - I think the observations I make are more important that what I think about them. In this particular situation my observation might have been about something relatively obvious but that won't always be the case - I'm sure sometimes I'll notice things others haven't noticed. The funny thing is, in this particular situation I did give my opinion: "It looks almost as if ConfidAnon's plan is to make only one or two prominent things per Day..." I feel we don't interpret the word "opinion" in quite the same way. I guess you want to know whether I think that this supposed plan of ConfidAnon's could point to ConfidAnon's being a mafioso. Yes. But that's not a certainty - as I told Vel-Rahn Koon, there could be numerous explanations for everything.

About your blaming the town's potential loss entirely on me - let's imagine the hypothetical situation that I'm a "Doctor" or something similar and drmyshottyizsik isn't (by the way, I'll state once again that I don't think that drmyshottyizsik lying about something automatically proves drmyshottyizsik is a mafioso). In that case, if one of us dies, that will be revealed to all other players. And if we both reach the last stage of the game, I suppose that will be one of those special situations where I'll reveal my role. So I don't think you should worry about that too much (not to mention that it's just a hypothetical situation).

Now we get to something curious, redtail896. When you say that gonnano was "referring specifically to keeping an open mind about Hoopla's roleclaim", I think you're basing this on gonnano's post #96. However, I'm interpreting that post as having a much more general meaning. And then there is gonnano's post #193 which, in my opinion, completely proves my interpretation.

The soccer analogy - I'm informing the other players of my playstyle shortly after the whistle is blown so there is plenty of time to adapt. Not to mention that I do believe in a game of Mafia my playstyle is actually detrimental to the mafia (so the mafia in fact have more right to be angry)... By the way, I didn't understand this sentence - "In addition, I'm not sure that I like that subtle dig at the end there".

Finally, you say: "I think G&H's logic has a bunch of holes (some of which I was trying to point out above)" - did you have your post #483 in mind? Because I must admit I didn't feel like you were pointing out holes in my logic there. In any case, I'll be glad if you talk more about such holes in logic of mine.

AlmasterGM, when I discussed my playstyle with Hoopla, I did say: "Hoopla, yes, I realize that if everyone had the same playstyle as me, nothing would happen as no one would ever be lynched. However, I think that not a lot of people have a similar playstyle as me - at least I haven't seen such people on this forum. I think that having a single player with a playstyle like mine in a game of Mafia wouldn't be such a problem". So, if we imagine a situation like the one in our current game - where only one player refuses to vote - it's absolutely true that this makes it more difficult for the mafia to lynch innocent townspeople.

You continue presenting my playstyle as detrimental to the town. So I'll ask again: how come then that in my second game on this site the mafiosi killed me on Night 1 and in the post-game comments they said they had considered me a threat to them?

I'm happy that you're answering my questions now. So I hope this time you'll explain what the real reasons for your vote for Elleran on Day 1 were.

Zachrulez might have "evaporated" - but people have noted that. Any discussion we're having in the meantime might prove to be useful in the future.

I have to say that telling me you'd never talk with me hurts. Imagine meeting someone in real life and finding that there are quite a lot of things you enjoy discussing with them... and then it turns out that I'm that person! So you'll stop talking with me just because you disagree with my playstyle in a game?!

Kid Know Nothing, I asked you a couple of questions which I hope you'll answer: "you say that from Hoopla's perspective (regarding the votes on Day 1) at least one of you, ConfidAnon and Zachrulez is a mafioso. What is your perspective?

The other question - you mention that there didn't seem to be many reasons for your vote for AlmasterGM. Is that how you think the other players perceived your vote or did you yourself think at the time your reasons for the vote weren't strong?"

[gonnano]

Zach said something about a week-long trip. He probably won't be back before deadline, so we need to decide whether to lynch him or not. If we decide not to because we can't get a claim from him today, we need to move to another bandwagon ASAP. Personally, I'm not sure if another lynch would be feasible at this point.

If you honestly "don't feel like" answering my questions, please give me an explanation why.

I don't like answering your questions because that makes it seem like I am fine with you ignoring my questions, which I am not. I completely understand why you can't tell us whether you are town or not, and why you can't tell us who you think is scum. I have absolutely no clue why you refuse to answer the massclaim, and the only explanation I have seen for that is that you don't want to.

The "right questions" that I asked ConfidAnon were some crap that I came up with off the top of my head, and I was more interested in the way that he answered them than the actual answers. I was also hoping that they would be enough to get him started posting some real content.

By the way, I'm confused by your question to ConfidAnon: "Are you still not sure why Hoopla thought Almaster was probably town?". What made you think ConfidAnon wasn't sure about that?

I've already answered one of your questions, so I'll wait for an answer to one of mine before I answer any more from you. As a courtesy, though, I will tell you that the answer to this one is already out there if you want to find it yourself.

[gonnano]

12 hours to deadline... we aren't getting a claim, so redtail needs to hammer if he's still around.

[Zachrulez]

Sigh... I'm a survivor.

[redtail896]

I'm here. Given this claim, any objections to hammering?

[redtail896]

EBWOP: I have none

[gonnano]

none here, it's an easy claim to make as scum.

[Kid Know Nothing]

I have none.

G&H, I made a post answering your questions on my phone but apparently it didn't go through. I'll answer them tomorrow.

[redtail896]

Alrighty then.

VOTE: Zachrulez

[drmyshottyizsik]

*sigh*
redtail I hate that you had to hammer before a claim, but I think you had to. Zach was just going to try to active lurk his ws to a no lynch.
Guys if(and I don't think he will) he flips town, please don't attack redtail for the hammer.

[AlmasterGM]

lol shotty you don't have to be so obv about not reading the thread.

[drmyshottyizsik]

lol shotty you don't have to be so obv about not reading the thread.

and what do you mean be this?

[AlmasterGM]

Zach did claim.

[Kid Know Nothing]

It was obvious he wasn't reading the thread since day one. Honestly.

[drmyshottyizsik]

oh survivor was his claim, I thought he meant he thought he would live. Sorry I just got back to Texas like 15 minutes ago a bit tired, but I wanted to check this because of how close deadline was, anyway still if he flips town don't give redtail shit just for that. anyone would have hammered there.

And yes KKN I have only been scimming this because I have been working in Tennessee and only had limited access, but now that I'm back I have full access and can be all caught up, except for tomorow cause I will be at Gandalf's house

[Hoopla]

I'll be pretty pissed off if there is a survivor in a mini normal game - that was a seriously unusual claim.