Mafia 69: noXkill - Game over!

[Dead Rikimaru]

And that's all folks.
Thank you very much to everyone who played the game.
Feel free to comment, complain, suggest, question, whatever.

[Kison]

Just a few things...

DR, this game rocks as much as you do. I can't rememeber why I signed up, though I think the no crosskill thing had something to do with it, but it wound up being a lot of fun towards the end of my living days. Very similar concept to another game I played elsewhere. I have no complaints whatsoever. If you don't mind my asking, though, what does "lynch will be decided by duel" mean?

I had a feeling Twomz was the Mafia, but he wasn't near as obvious as Zoneace, who constantly pushed for me to be lynched with the worst logical backing I've ever seen, and later relentlessnessly went after Peers when over and over again I tried explaining how bad of an idea it was. I started thinking he was getting extremely frustrated that he was pushing to have his own partner lynched and was being berated for it, hence my later comment where I said I thought he was Mafia, not wolf.

Twomz made the better call of laying off those two routes, but he was one of the people I eyed for pushing to have Peers lynched. The problem was that there was little substance from the other two, so you couldn't be very certain of anything. His choice to kill Cicero on the last day as also the perfect move - on the off chance Cicero was lying, he would have entered the last day as the only player with a previous reputation while leaving no confirmed players alive. If Cicero was telling the truth, he entered the day with 2 other suspects. Good decision, in my opinion.

I never had a good read on the wolves. With them I basically just was looking at the unclaimed list.

Cicero rocked this game hardcore also. I remember coming back thinking, "Who the hell is this guy? He's the only one that makes sense." So he gets the Town Champion award.

I honestly can't believe Town pulled this one off. When I came back from my lurking spree and started trying to figure out what was going on, I thought there was next to no way we could win. We won because :

1) We selectively targeted the Wolves
2) Cicero claimed early enough that the Wolves didn't accidentally kill him(he was not beneficial for them to kill)
3) Peers helped us out
4) We're lucky as all hell

So good game everyone. 3 more ongoing games for me. Maybe I'll see some of you there.

[Cephrir]

All the people taking my side were scum

[cicero]

Ah, thanks KIson!!!

While I'm pretty happy with my play this game, as far as I'm concerned Town Champion was Curiouskarmadog. He was in it from the beginning and deserves some kind of MVP award. His case on Twomz is what convinced me at the end, for example. He's a very talented player.

Rikimaru - Great game! And for the record, I agree completely with your reasoning as to why a wrong kill woulda been a mafia win, not the everybody loses/tie that I figured it should be. Apologies for being pest-y about it. Your reasoning on the last page just makes sense.

[Tarhalindur]

Tar - if we kill a mafia today, then it allows the wolves to, i don't know, fulfill their win condition. or am i missing something?

Hmm. Perceptive.

Perhaps there is an acceptable compromise here for all sides.

Unvote, Vote: No Lynch

If everybody plays right, Happily Ever After is inevitable.

The funny thing was, I was telling the truth. Check the scum win conditions.

I knew that our group was toast when mafia outed DAS (CA would have been lynched at some point even without the out-of-game evidence). Oh well, better town wins than rival scum wins.

[curiouskarmadog]

great game guys...I followed it after my death...glad to see I was right on with the scum teams (minus my cephirr read, sorry), looking forward to reading the scum transcripts, this would have been a great game for me if I hadnt self voted. I was hoping someone would come out and claim, but in retrospect that might have back fired...

I didnt think the town could pull this one out...I think this game was one for the books.

Dead, going to nominate this game for flavor..thanks!!

[Twomz]

/sigh. If I have a repeat of this game... no pushing the claimed scum >.>

Really though, I thought it was the protown thing to do, that's why I followed it. I had no clue why everyone was so trusting of the claimed mafiaso.

I was also planning on bussing Zoneace from early on, but I was out of town or something when he was lynched .

Good playing town, especially Cicero ^5 for not bringing in meta reasons that he found in another thread :p (I rarely live to endgame as town unless I have some confirmable role that isn't cop or doc, but for some reason I usually live to endgame as scum).

Again, GG.

[Twomz]

Oh, and I nominate myself for living to the last day without getting replaced .

[TheHermit]

Good game. Could have done without the plugs, but to each his own.

I am royally pissed at Chocolate Attack. I don't think I have to explain why. Even without that blunder I didn't stand much of a chance. I don't fault cicero for using what he got (hey, you do what you gotta to win), but CA never should have given that information up.

At first glance it seems that town is woefully underpowered, but on closer examination the "noXkill" hurts the mafia a lot more than it helps them. After finding a member of the other scum team, one member has to claim in order to make his findings known. But on doing that, their days are numbered. Two scum dead. Advantage: town. The "equal number of scum at endgame = town victory" is especially mean; if both scumgroups play a perfect game, they lose. While I understand the presence of the rule is to give town a fighting chance, I still don't like the execution.

[cicero]

:Good playing town, especially Cicero ^5 for not bringing in meta reasons that he found in another thread :p (I rarely live to endgame as town unless I have some confirmable role that isn't cop or doc, but for some reason I usually live to endgame as scum).

In fairness, I don't deserve this particular compliment. As can be shown from my attack on ChocolateAttack and TheHermit, I will use meta information whenever it's useful, even if it seems a bit "elbows up". But I didnt need to use it on you, Twomz. The other two players were pretty much convinced. I just needed to convince myself. And when I did so, I really didnt give reasons. I just blamed it on "gut" even though it was much more than that. Things were going the way I wanted them to go and I didnt want to upset the apple cart.

It pained me to vote for your lynch though, Twomz. You have no idea how many times I kept reading to try to find another answer. :p But the evidence was overwhelming. There was CKD's case. There was Peers refusing to test you at night (might be in CKD's case), there was you attempting to capitalise on my lurker hate (cute but transparent), and your general sense of resignation when heading to the gallows.

Which isn't to say I didnt doubt the decision all the way through... but I knew I'd rather me AND ckd be wrong, then to push for a lynch in opposition to his great work and have him call me an idiot until doomsday.

[curiouskarmadog]

ok, nominated for best flavor...you put a ton of work in this game a deserve a nod.

[cicero]

I agree with CKD

[Hjallti]

I also rather had finished of Jenter than Twomz, and probably Jenter would have preferred me above you, just for playing like this.

I happened to be in both games that are already nominated for best flavor, and I wouldn't have wanted to miss one of them. Great Dead Rikimaru. I don't know why you PM'd me a second time to replace in, but I am very happy you did.

Sorry that I dragged the last day one week to long, but I seem to have been absent in the first four days after reopening the game.

GREAT GAME to CKD, Peers, Twomz and Cicero. I think I was just lucky to fall in the right team.

Twomz, I do think that going for the Peers lynch was a scumtell, there is a subtle difference between what town would do and what you think town would do, and this was an instance of it, I do believe. However when I am in the same situation I also don't see when the difference arises. Only when pondering over the possibilities you find that lynching Peers is not a good idea. Ideally we should have got TheHermit before ZoneAce rather than after. It did cost us a townie...

I am so happy my decision was the right one....

[WhoMe?]

gooooo town

Thanks Dead Rikimaru, good game. It moved along at a reasonable pace too.

[Hjallti]

Great win conditions! I somehow hit on some of the subtilities when I commented that we shouldn't go for nolynch in the end, but the fact that Peers claimed might have been partly due to that win condition.

[ZONEACE]

ok, nominated for best flavor...you put a ton of work in this game a deserve a nod.

yeah ive been waiting ot nominate this game for flavor for like 3 months

[ooba]

Whoo Go Town !! I kept reading this game after i was killed and it was nail bitting in the end ..

Great Game Dead !! The flavor was the reason i replaced in since it made 30 pages of actual game play look like a story.

And great game guys - I enjoyed playing it with all of you !!

PS:

Ok .. I would not like to see another townie lynched so I think i'm doing the right thing here (Since my role is not that powerful anyways) ..

Claim : Sorceror , and i can protect against werewolves every even night

Hence my assurance that CKD is town .. Now if we could please unvote and try to hunt scum?

Town took my advice to heart - we lynched scum correctly on all days after this

[Jenter Brolincani]

Wahey! We won!

...

and stuff.

Bye!

[cicero]

The "equal number of scum at endgame = town victory" is especially mean; if both scumgroups play a perfect game, they lose. While I understand the presence of the rule is to give town a fighting chance, I still don't like the execution.

Yes. This was the one problem I had with DR's mechanism as well. IMHO this would be better done by articulating that a town massacre was really an "everybody loses" scenario.

Not

a town victory. That's just wrong.

[curiouskarmadog]

did anyone else feel dirty reading the scums' thread? I feel like maybe I shouldnt have read that.

[cicero]

Do you mean because we get an insight into the player's thought process as scum?

[curiouskarmadog]

yeah...I feel like maybe I shouldnt have that read on them

[cicero]

I guess. I didnt feel I learned a ton, really(should I look harder?), and I think some other sites regularly make such info public post-game, though I could be wrong.

It leads to a problem I've noticed when playing as scum though. It's hard to get some players to nighttalk and I think it's because they are scared of giving away info for the next time they face their scumbuddies as town opponents. I don't worry about that as much. I just play to win the game I'm in and am my usual chit chatty self on the Quicktopic board.

[curiouskarmadog]

I just have never seen that before..so it was new to me...

[Peers]

That, was one hell of a game, and I'm glad I got a chance to play in it with everyone. Here's to seein' y'all again soon.