Mafia MetaMafia ~ Game Over!

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

I'm not claiming yes or no until DDD tries to guess them.

I am saddened he thinks I fake-claimed his name just for teh lulz ;_;

I am curious as to who he thinks I crumbed earlier (why are you even looking for things like that?)

-Demon

1) If he is High Priest of DDD he doesn't have soloism as one of his domains; I'm pretty confident in that fact.

2) Yeah, you'd never do anything like that; you're a straight shooter with a conservative style to match.

3) Do you usually italicize half of a random word for funsies? I saw emphasis where I see no reason for emphasis and made the logical jump.

[Demonic Angel]

FOUND IT

I was holding off on reading the game, because my reads get a fuckton better the later I "replace" into a game, but if you clowns are "hurr durr Katsuki lynch GOOO" before i can get a word in Edgewise, I'll have to start reading now.

I'm glad someone noticed that, it was just a joke because Edge is the name of another of my hydras, and I'm in a hydra in this game.

LAWLZ.

No I'm not Priest of ReaperCharlie thank god and knowing Vi's utter hatred of him as well I doubt he's in this game.

You're right that soloism isn't one, but which ones ARE they?

2) You're damn right I am. I know you've had the misfortune of running into one of my... less than optimal gambits, but it still had a

purpose

to it. Fake name-claiming for shits and giggles isn't something I do.

-Demon

[MagnaofIllusion]

Add my ‘Yes’ to the VPB claim both Domains.

--

MoI: You mean I thought you were town when quadz had yet to flip and I thought he was town and felt you were seeing the same thing. And now that quadz has flipped scum I have a different opinion on the matter that makes me feel slightly suspicious of you.

Here’s why I’m finding this a suspect response Rayfrost.

1. Yesterday you were in the Quadz is not scum camp.
2. My read on Quadz was similar.
3. Quadz’s flip happens.
4. Suddenly you suspect me for not suspecting Quadz.

Step four is where you lose me. If you are of a Town mindset and didn’t suspect that Quadz was scum then it does not follow that after his flip you look at other players who didn’t suspect Quadz and are suspicious of that one element. I am not looking at Plum, DDD or whoever else didn’t vote Quadz and saying “You are likely scum for not voting him” because I didn’t vote him either. That was my Town perspective read. I can understand others of possibly having the same Town perspective read on Quadz also.

Had you been Town banging on Quadz wanting his head I could understand your position. But you weren't.

--

Not to ooba. To your choice of townread. It's not a plan you would execute now. It's a plan I'd expect you to have talked about D1 when ooba first mentioned Justice/Balance worships.

Well your expectations of what I would do are greatly different than reality. I looked at the Donate portion of my role-pm and said “Meh, maybe if I get a goldmine of Faith N1 I’ll use it that Night for a Town read”. Then 2 whopping additionally Faith over my N0 worship flowed in. I guess that’s what happens when you saddle a Solist type player with Elmo’s role …

I had a gut scumread on VPB since D1 as well. But my reads get modified by the evidence, not held in spite of it. Yeah, yeah, sucks when it's hasdgfas in ASoS. I will fall for that trick. Every time. But VPB-scum here makes no sense. VPB-SK makes potential sense, but there's no way VPB-SK is winning this game now.

What evidence am I not considering? That he claimed a Power in conflict N2 with the Cast I used? That his normal abililty screams “NOT TOWN” at the top of its lungs? His lack of tangible push on any of the flipped scum (Quadz, Singer, Hito) while trying to claim Town cred as the leader of the pack against them? His overreaction to being voted?

At this stage taking out SK VPB would be a boon for Town. With 3 scum down reducing the amount of NKs would greatly help Town’s long term chances.

[Vi]

Mini Vote Count:

MagnaofIllusion (L-1) ~ VP Baltar, Demonic Angel, Seraphim, AlmasterGM, Debonair Danny DiPietro, ooba, RayFrost
RayFrost (L-5) ~ Parama, Magua, Plum
Plum (L-6) ~ sottyrulez, Faraday
VP Baltar (L-7) ~

Plum,

MagnaofIllusion

Demonic Angel (L-8) ~

ooba

Minimum (L-8)

Not Voting:

AlmasterGM, Debonair Danny DiPietro,

Nobody Special,

RayFrost

-MagnaofIllusion is at L-1!

Battery power:

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(85%)

[ooba]

Unvote]/b]

[ooba]

...

Unvote

[Plum]

Plum’s attempt to paint VPB as a SK instead of town is hysterical to me though it did at least let me think about the ability from multiple perspectives. I guess there could be unnamed limitations to the ability but to give a SK the ability to basically cut the day down to nothing and at a minimum in half multiple times would just destroy the town in comical fashion. This game is going to be so much easier now that I actually feel comfortable riding VPB’s coattails.

VOTE: MagnaofIllusion

Look at it this way: An SK has to have options for Casts that kill Town. An SK has no scumteam to back him up with Worships, so he has to coordinate some on his own just to get a Cast through, which is difficult. Therefore mega-Vig abilities plus an ability to increase one's own Faith bypassing the normal have-to-accumulate-support-from-somewhere-in-order-to-get-much-of-anything-done are very much in line with a reasonable Vi-minded solution to putting an SK in a game where scum need to accumulate Faith. Furthermore he has

another

ability which artificially accumulated Worship support directly to himself:

3 Faith - Project Rampage - I can target up to five players and if they're not Good (whatever that means) and they choose to worship, they worship me. Now the thing that is weird about this is that it says they worship me, not one of my domains. I'm not sure how this affects me...perhaps it gives me a permanent faith boost or something. idk.

Lastly we

don't

know what his limitations are for the Battery-drain-accumulate-Faith thing. But I do think back to the Holy Orders games, where the scum could manipulate the Battery to get extra Faith. You also misread - he can decrease the Battery a

maximum

of %50 - and as Vi promotes quick Days as pro-Town it's not unreasonable for that to be a multi-use ability even for an SK.

Also VP is TOTALLY Tahlridaniur with his ABR fake-claim. Beautiful Vi, beautiful. Keep this in mind because AGMDERP and otehrs have said, I'm probably not going to make it till end game.

FOR THE FIRST TIME IN THIS GAME I CAN SAY HONESTLY HOW MUCH I LOVE YOU YOU BRILLIANT FOOL <3

Right. VPB's abilities lean SK over Town to me

Sure thing darlin'. I was scum for my QT knowledge, now I'm SK cause I just made you look pretty stupid for your weak wagon attempt on me. You scums have too much pride to go slinking away now. Get your buddy MoI over here to back you on this line of malarky. I'll just shoot you both in the face anyhow.

Uh, no. You're scum for your claim. Just plain Vig who shot Hito would've been normal and I'd believe it came from Town - but while you're almost certainly not TIGER scum and I was wrong, however good I felt my case was, it is unrelated entirely to my old case and your put-downs make no difference to me on that count. I don't think I did look stupid for my previous case and vote on you, I don't think it was weak, and I have no interest in voting anyone for making me look stupid because that's a part of this game. Your powers are SK powers completely. We don't have confirmation on the limits of your Battery-drain powers, your power-combinations make sense for an SK, and your argument that your powers are unbalanced for SK are completely without the hard data we'd need to say that. It's an assumption we'd have to make about the setup and about how much truth you've told about your powers. Variations of the powers you've claimed could be very reasonably balanced for an SK in this game. If you plan to shoot me it doesn't look likely that I'll be able to stop you. But no. I'm sure as hell not slinking away from someone I suspect of being the SK. Anyway. Why'd you Worship one of your own Domains N0?

VOTE: VP Baltar

If there's nothing to be done about the Magna lynch - I am very much disinclined to think Magna would attempt to fake that in this situation - I

insist

VPB answer this question before any hammers. I confirm Worshiping Justice/Balance tonight.

[ooba]

"Solism" as one of their domains?/b]
- Yes: VPB
- No: Magna,ooba, Demonic Angel, Magua
- Unclaimed: AlmasterGM, Debonair Danny DiPietro, Faraday, Nobody Special, Parama, Plum, RayFrost, Seraphim, sottyrulez

Plum? DDD?

[Plum]

Nope, no Soloism here.

[sottyrulez]

Plum's VP is SK vote is ridiculously scummy.

[Plum]

Why?

[sottyrulez]

Even if he is an SK, why is lynching an SK preferable to lynching scum in this situation?

[Plum]

Because I'm pretty damn sure he's the SK, he's confident, and people are interested in boosting him heavily tonight. I'm quite a bit less sure that RayFrost is scum than that VPB is SK. And hell, if it gets people to take notice of my analysis of his claim even after I'm dead so that you are less likely to go along with whatever plan he devises, it's worth focusing on him.

[VP Baltar]

This is why plum isn't town. When she's town, she makes sense.

[Magua]

Why?

Look.

VP-is-SK makes no sense with the abilities that VP has claimed.

You gain 5 Faith from draining the battery. 5 Faith gives you, with the claimed abilities, one kill. That's one kill every two Days. Assuming you can get two worship from other places, that's two kills which is one kill every Day.

Do you think that VPB killed N1?

Do you think that VPB killed N1 *and* was able to influence the battery? If so, why not do the battery thing again today?

VPB could be SK due to his behavior, but not due to the abilities he posted. You can postulate that draining the battery does something completely different than giving him faith, which is very temporary and makes no sense for an SK. You could argue that he's scum, except that doesn't fit in with the observed behavior.

But that's all it is, postulating. And given the high chance that VPB will simply be dead tomorrow, arguing about it now is highly pointless.

[VP Baltar]

@Seraphim - can you make sure your PGO ability would be active on me the same night you grant it. Want to make sure.

[ooba]

VP-is-SK makes no sense with the abilities that VP has claimed.

You gain 5 Faith from draining the battery. 5 Faith gives you, with the claimed abilities, one kill. That's one kill every two Days. Assuming you can get two worship from other places, that's two kills which is one kill every Day.

Do you think that VPB killed N1?

Do you think that VPB killed N1 *and* was able to influence the battery? If so, why not do the battery thing again today?

Disagree on this.

One Factional kill for SK + one extra action (battery drain or cast for kill) makes sense.
N1: Kill + Use Battery for faith
N2: Kill + Use accumulated faith to cast a kill
Tell me why this does not make sense.

[sottyrulez]

Why'd you Worship one of your own Domains N0?

We worshiped our own domains on N0 and N1. We didn't even realize until recent discussions that it was even possible to worship outside of your own domain. (Which is something we are now willing to do now that it's being proposed... I guess.)

Solism isn't one of our domains for the record.

Also, we have been debating disclosing this, and we're going to do it now because it makes me uneasy about worshiping Justice, and without disclosing this it's hard to explain why.

Singer worshiped Justice the night she was killed, which leads us to believe that worshiping Justice as we're planning to may net scum some kind of benefit.

[ooba]

Singer worshiped Justice the night she was killed, which leads us to believe that worshiping Justice as we're planning to may net scum some kind of benefit.

I'll also claim that N2 faith for Balance+Justice was 5. I worshiped Balance the night before. Would prefer if people boosting me stuck to Balance.

"Solism" as one of their domains?

- Yes: VPB
- No: Magna,ooba, Demonic Angel, Magua, sottyrulez
- Unclaimed: AlmasterGM, Debonair Danny DiPietro, Faraday, Nobody Special, Parama, Plum, RayFrost, Seraphim

[Plum]

VPB: Yeah. And when I think I've found scum, and when I'm ticked, I vote.

But please, answer my question. Humor the girl you're probably planning on shooting tonight.

Magua: He has another ability which nets him Faith which he claimed. The wording suggests this might be a

permanent

Faith-boost; even if it's not, it's up to an extra five Faith the next Night. The Battery thing might be limited by various factors; it might be usable only a limited number of times or for a limited total Battery drain/Faith gain, with up to %50 maximum at a time. He may have a factional kill and get extra kills when he gets enough power.

But if you're to believe the basics of what he claims he has: That he can drain the Battery to get Faith for himself, that he can convert Worship power onto himself from where it was directed, that he has can make himself untargetable for a Night with a Cast, that he has Casts which give him kills aside from any possible factional kills - it's

exactly

what an SK needs in this game and completely in line with what Vi would do to power up an SK in this game. VPB is unlikely to be dead tomorrow if scum are afraid he's been made into a PGO. So yeah.

We worshiped our own domains on N0 and N1. We didn't even realize until recent discussions that it was even possible to worship outside of your own domain. (Which is something we are now willing to do now that it's being proposed... I guess.)

I wasn't asking you. I was asking Baltar and I still am.

[ooba]

@Seraphim - can you make sure your PGO ability would be active on me the same night you grant it. Want to make sure.

VP sets up a reason for his being alive tomorrow.

Magna is a tiger, VP is SK.

[ooba]

Oh and Plum is town.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Question for the Town

–

Do either Furcolow or Yosarian seem like players with likely Hider / Weak Doctor roles to you? I’ve been mulling over the jump from 3 kills to 4 last Night and that’s the one element I can come up with to answer the swing.

If it’s Furcolow then not much can be pulled from it given that Dramonic never posted in thread to give reads. Gamma’s scum reads are more accessible. Unfortunately Gamma seems a much more logical NK target for scum than Dramonic.

--

Even if he is an SK, why is lynching an SK preferable to lynching scum in this situation?

With 3 scum dead taking out a SK reduces the number of non-Town Nightkills (which are more than likely going after ‘confirmed Town’ after last Night) by 1. That extends the amount of time Town has to lynch the remaining Mafia.

Also, we have been debating disclosing this, and we're going to do it now because it makes me uneasy about worshiping Justice, and without disclosing this it's hard to explain why.

Singer worshiped Justice the night she was killed, which leads us to believe that worshiping Justice as we're planning to may net scum some kind of benefit.

Yes, that’s definitely information that needs to be out for public comsumption.

--

I'll also claim that N2 faith for Balance+Justice was 5. I worshiped Balance the night before. Would prefer if people boosting me stuck to Balance.

So Balance plus Justice = 5.

And Balance plus Austerity = 2.

And both ooba and myself have claimed N1 worships of Balance.

Thus Justice equals 3 N1 worships.

Magna is a tiger, VP is SK.

Well, you are at least half wrong on that. And I don't think the VPB is SK half is incorrect.

[Magua]

One Factional kill for SK + one extra action (battery drain or cast for kill) makes sense.
N1: Kill + Use Battery for faith
N2: Kill + Use accumulated faith to cast a kill
Tell me why this does not make sense.

Tell me the gameplan for VPB claiming as SK. Tell me how this gets to him winning.

What we need to be worried about is scum getting juiced. Scum can get juiced, do some megacast badness that fucks us over, get lynched, and *still win*. SK cannot. This makes scum the priority. This is why VPB-as-SK does not concern me at this point. If I thought VPB-as-scum was plausible, that would concern me.

[VP Baltar]

@Seraphim - can you make sure your PGO ability would be active on me the same night you grant it. Want to make sure.

VP sets up a reason for his being alive tomorrow.

Magna is a tiger, VP is SK.

Ah no, the point is for me to live so I can shoot the following night. AFter that I don't give a shit if I die. It's critical I live through tonight though.

Unvote, Vote: Plum

More confident that she's scum than MoI now.