Mini 568 - Nubigena (Game over!)

[Sammich]

Blah blah blah, if everyone thought that JDodge would be spamming goatse.

[quote=Mafiaplayer]Okay, I roleclaim vanilla townie.[/quote]

I guess I can vouch for him because I just got called a townie in my role pm.

It's been a while since I had a night start, I'm having fun.

[XReyoX]

I guess I can vouch for him because I just got called a townie in my role pm.

?? what do you mean?

[Imat]

...Is this whole game going mad? Is every Townie going to claim right here and now and the Scum will have perfect cover? I can't believe the turn this game has taken. Why, Sammich, did you also play the stupid card and give a potential Scum an easy out? Can we just restart this whole game, theres very little chance of Town coming back from this...

[Imat]

Sorry, forgot this: This now applies to Sammich as well: What is the EXACT NAME of your role?

[Mafiaplayer]

Just plain townsperson. Townies don't have names apparently.

[Incognito]

I don't see the point in asking players for the exact name of their role. The mod has listed the townsperson role pm in one of the opening posts. It does however make me wonder why Sammich has chosen to vouch for Mafiaplayer.

[Imat]

The problem comes in the name of the role when Mafia claim Townie. Sure, its been posted what the exact name is, but if they missed that they could get it wrong in their claim. The only problem with this reasoning comes when Power Roles are asked to claim, and for whatever reason they had claimed Townie and get the exact name wrong. However, if they are pressured, they could come out with their real role, and if nobody counters, we should have a Pro-Town role there. However, if they can't do any of those things, they are Scum who can no longer hide behind anything. It may be a stretch to assume the process is perfect, but it has its place when people claim Townie right off the bat.

[jerubbaal]

I don't see the point in asking players for the exact name of their role. The mod has listed the townsperson role pm in one of the opening posts. It does however make me wonder why Sammich has chosen to vouch for Mafiaplayer.

This was the point, but I was pretty willing to bet mafiaplayer was not aware of this. I was hoping he would try to claim something close, but not quite. I'm actually moderately inclined to believe him, because he did phrase it correctly before anyone actually pointed out that it was in the initial post. Sammich is probably fine too, I'm reading the claim as townie. Both get "stoopid townie" points, but I think they're both townie.

Anyhow, absolutely no more claiming. Hemhorraging information into the thread this early really only benefits scum and gains the town very little. Having two confirmed-ish vanillas doesn't really help the town very much at all, other than to avoid lynching stupids day 1. We've dealt the best we can with these claims, and I think we can move on to other issues. Harm done, but hopefully not much.


Imat is fearmongering like hell (I really hate using that as a tell, but this actually seems like one of the few legitimate uses of it) with his whole "Woe be to the town" post. And then he calms down pretty much immediately and goes all analytical, not seemingly worried anymore about the irreparable harm done to the town. I think we have a winner.

Unvote, Vote:Imat

[destructor]

Y replaces Fat_Tony.

[jerubbaal]

Eh, Sammich's is a little more suspect, now that I read it again, because he said that his role PM just called him a townie, but I'm still reading it as a pretty town response. He wants to justify the other townie who has claimed without a specific rolename. If he was scum, I doubt he'd want to vouch for mafiaplayer.

[Lowell]

I dont' think claiming townie on D1 really matters. Let's all just chill out.

[Incognito]

Meh, I won't go as far as to consider both Sammich

and

Mafiaplayer as confirmed townies. I'll be treating both "claims" as null-tells and continue reading both of them as neutrals until they prove or rather

suggest

otherwise. Mafiaplayer's claim strikes me as more genuine though.

Unvote; Vote: Near

I dislike the whole "Hi, my name is Near, and I'm picking up my prod while agreeing with one person and not commenting on anything else in the thread" post.

P.S. Welcome aboard, Y.

[Y]

Thanks.

I made a quick reading already, and I believe some bad actions were made by more than one player.
Now that I have a role, I'll make a deeper re-read and point exactly what are the things I don't like.

In the meantime,

FoS almost all players

(That's a joke, although it isn't far from the truth.

[Y]

So these are my thought after the second, deeper, reading:
While reading the whole game, I noticed two players who did various weird things each.
I'll start with the most obvious - Mafiaplayer.
1. Claiming in your first post? The first one in the game? WTF?!
2. To which end did he do so? T get

everybody

to claim. That's stupid. But there's more! He did it so we can kill all power roles... WTF?!
3. Once you do some stupid moved, you get questioned. Ignoring the questions is the worst thing. Do you have any problem answering them? Is there any info you don't want to share with us?

Have you not learned from last game? I act stupid, I wind up getting lynched, townies lose game. Can't you folks learn?

"I'm always a bad player, but if you lynch me, you lose".
Defending yourself with a meta-game excuse, using emotion instead of logic, playing in a way you know will get you lynched, and then you have the nerves to tell us we're the ones that lose the game for the town. Are you kidding me?

The second player is Sammich.
1. He used a dice for the random vote (Which has its flaws), but he did it outside the game. And he wound up voting himself. WTF?
2. Mafiaplayer claimed on P1 (Post 5). After four posts, he vouches for him in his fifth (Post 54). What took you so long? Why did you do it in the first place? Assuming you're town (Which is just to prove a point. I'm not saying you're town), what makes you, as vanilla, able to vouch for a player?
3. In the same post, your words were: "I guess I can vouch for him because I just got called a townie in my role pm". Here's a quote from the first post, the one on which the mod posted the Townie's role PM:

As a

Townsperson

you have no special abilities besides your wits and your vote. Use them well.

If the PM says Townsperson, why did you get one saying you're a townie?

I want the questions answered. Ignoring them won't help you.

[Imat]

I got angry jerubaal, stupid plays like Townie claims serve to point out the Power Roles that much faster. I didn't like where it was heading, I wanted to put a stop to it. I didn't actually mean we should restart the game, I wanted people to realize how bad claiming Townie is in this situation. Hopefully, and it looks to be true, I discouraged others from claiming. Nobody else would have, I can only hope, but on the off chance that somebody else felt inspired to ruin the game I tried to put an end to it. The "irreparable harm" isn't nearly as bad as it could've been, should we have continued and exposed a Power Role. So I settled down and back off of them, trying also to get them to perhaps explain why they claimed at all. You may disagree with my reasoning, but it makes sense when you think about it.

[Y]

Mafiaplayer told us why (A stupid reason, but he did).

I want to know why Sammich did so too.

[Mafiaplayer]

unvote, Vote:Y

It would appear that, quickly after replacing in, Y is ignoring some posts and focusing on others. For instance, Y ignored the post where I realized the question and got the name right.

[Sammich]

The second player is Sammich.
1. He used a dice for the random vote (Which has its flaws), but he did it outside the game. And he wound up voting himself. WTF?
2. Mafiaplayer claimed on P1 (Post 5). After four posts, he vouches for him in his fifth (Post 54). What took you so long? Why did you do it in the first place? Assuming you're town (Which is just to prove a point. I'm not saying you're town), what makes you, as vanilla, able to vouch for a player?
3. In the same post, your words were: "I guess I can vouch for him because I just got called a townie in my role pm". Here's a quote from the first post, the one on which the mod posted the Townie's role PM:

As a

Townsperson

you have no special abilities besides your wits and your vote. Use them well.

If the PM says Townsperson, why did you get one saying you're a townie?

I want the questions answered. Ignoring them won't help you.

The first question isn't really a question, you can blame that on faulty HTML code.
The second, jeruubbal's post about Mafiaplayer's rolename was on the 3rd, mine was 2 days afterwards, I wasn't on the fourth, why are you indicating a day's lack of reply is so long?
Third, I don't know, I shortened it, use that as a tell as you want, I deleted my PMs 3 days ago.

[Imat]

unvote, Vote:Y

It would appear that, quickly after replacing in, Y is ignoring some posts and focusing on others. For instance, Y ignored the post where I realized the question and got the name right.

You completely misunderstood Y's post. He said he read your explanation and that you answered the question (Posed 4 or 5 times...), but now Sammich has no real excuse for claiming. He ain't questioning you, hes questioning Sammich. He did, however, call your move stupid, which I agree with completely.

[Near]

Blah blah blah, if everyone thought that JDodge would be spamming goatse.

Okay, I roleclaim vanilla townie.

I guess I can vouch for him because I just got called a townie in my role pm.

It's been a while since I had a night start, I'm having fun.

Why did you decide to vouch for him? Did you not realize what jerubbaal was trying to accomplish by questioning Mafiaplayer?

Unvote

Vote Sammich

[Y]

The first question isn't really a question, you can blame that on faulty HTML code.

Dice voting isn't good. Doesn't matter how you do it. The fact that once it didn't work on the forum, you did it in real life is weird. Actually getting yourself voted, is even weirder.
You could've used BBCode for the dice, by the way (Or turn on HTML).

The second, jeruubbal's post about Mafiaplayer's rolename was on the 3rd, mine was 2 days afterwards, I wasn't on the fourth, why are you indicating a day's lack of reply is so long?

jerubbaal asked his question in post 25. You posted #31 and #43 before claiming in post #54. I don't care if it took you an hour or a month, I want to know why you ignored it once, ignored it twice, and then, on the third post, you decided to do it without any one asking you to do so. A townie knows no one. How can you vouch for some one you don't know? Can I claim vanilla and you'll vouch for me?
And if you want to know how anti-town you were:

What's your rolename again? Be specific. (and nobody feed him answers)

That includes you.

Third, I don't know, I shortened it, use that as a tell as you want, I deleted my PMs 3 days ago.

The whole reason jerubbaal asked for the name was to make sure he was telling the truth, by making sure he's not making it up. You fell to the trap.
Erasing your PM isn't an excuse. There's a copy of the vanilla role PM in the mod's post.

@ Mafiaplayer: I don't ignore things. "Why did you vote an NPC?" and "Why should we LAP?" were never answered. Besides that, "Why did you answer the question about your role name?" would be a stupid question. I try not to ask stupid questions.
I don't know about you, but my experience tells me that helping other players defend themselves helps scum, while attacking players helps town. I believe most of us will agree that I'm a better player, so I'll stick my own methods for now.
You need a reinforcement? You did good with the claim. Good Boy. Happy?

@ Near: We're all happy you're here, but could you add some of your own thoughts? It's your second post, and the second time you just vote some one due to some other player's reasons.

[Y]

Can we have a vote count?

[destructor]

.::] Vote Count [::.

Mafiaplayer (3)

- XReyoX, Y, the_cat_herder

Sammich (2)

- Imat, Near

Imat (1)

- jerubaal

thephantom (1)

- Lowell

Near (1)

- Incognito

Y (1)

- Mafiaplayer

Not Voting (2) - thephantom, Sammich

Six

votes makes a lynch.

[Y]

I didn't vote Mafiaplayer. Is it because the one I replaced did?

Anyway, I have no one I'd like to vote yet (Or I would have done so myself), so

Unvote

.

[XReyoX]

I agree with most of Y's #74.
Mafiaplayer ignoring my questions numerous times is getting really irritating. I don't like my Qs unanswered (which includes the stuffs about LAP, mafia roleclaiming, why he would think everyone would massclaim at the very beginning of the game, and etc…). Accusing people for not adapting to this play style is a very bad excuse for making scummy posts. Him saying Y is ignoring other people is calling the kettle black. Trying to vote for a corpse, sammich, me, and then Y looks hoppy to me.

Sammich’s dicevoting is not much of a scumtell IMO. Tho I’m a bit suspicious of him saying he rolled a dice in real life which told him to vote for himself. However, whether he was lying or not, I think it was an attempt to spring some discussion, not really a scumtell. Rolclaiming townie at this point is not at all necessary and I didn’t expect an experienced player like sammich to claim in this situation, understanding that roleclaiming townie only provides more information for the scum to work on whilst providing almost no benefit to the town at all. The excuse for not getting the answer right is poor. (Deleted your pm? Why didn’t you say so why you claim?)

The first impression on Jerubbaal was that he was rolefishing when he asked for people’s rolename, but then realised it was an attempt to see if MP is really a townie.

The bit voting and unvoting between Lowell, Jerubbaal, Near and Phantom, and thing about metagaming is confusing me. Can’t read anything from it atm.