Mini 543 - Election Day - Game Over!

[Rishi]

Elias_the_thief has requested replacement. I'm working on finding one.

[Rishi]

The Fonz replaces Elias_the_thief, effective immediately. Will update the first post when less busy at work or at home.

[The Fonz]

Re-read coming.

[The Fonz]

OK, for starters, why aren't we pseudovoting?

Players post

Pseudovote: Name

and we do the votecounts ourselves.

Once we have a lynch majority, all town players commit to voting for the vote leader.

This would allow us to play, effectively, normally, and analyse players' play.

Immunity: MGM

Also, I do feel farside said some rather scummy things in the dialogue with my predecessor (who, fortunately, seems to have played a fairly good pro-town game). However, my current top suspect would be Qman. No real effort ever to push the game in a given direction, just pops up occasionally with his list of all the players (which I maintain is a scummy device) to make it look like he's contributing.

[farside22]

OK, for starters, why aren't we pseudovoting?

Players post

Pseudovote: Name

and we do the votecounts ourselves.

Once we have a lynch majority, all town players commit to voting for the vote leader.

This would allow us to play, effectively, normally, and analyse players' play.

Immunity: MGM

Also, I do feel farside said some rather scummy things in the dialogue with my predecessor (who, fortunately, seems to have played a fairly good pro-town game). However, my current top suspect would be Qman. No real effort ever to push the game in a given direction, just pops up occasionally with his list of all the players (which I maintain is a scummy device) to make it look like he's contributing.

I felt Elias and I were just arguing based on hascow. I liked Elias after everything was said and done. I admittedly made a case against Opie and unfortunetly it turned out against me. I really thought I had something on him.
As for votes we did that and then people started flaking off. Can I ask a question because it really doesn't make sense to me and I want someone elses imput on the subject. Does Qman's comments about voting against those to find out alignment make sense? I mean to me it sounded like he didn't think Elias or I was scum one day and now has us as #2 and #3 as possible suspects. Saying one alignment would say what others may be. Sounds like he is posting an order on who to vote out, but doesn't say anything about the non posters?
Plus second question is what are your thoughts on Gorgon and Shanba who have been less then ideal in scum hunting?

I second the immunity

Immunity: MGM

[Holy]

OK, for starters, why aren't we pseudovoting?

Players post

Pseudovote: Name

and we do the votecounts ourselves.

Once we have a lynch majority, all town players commit to voting for the vote leader.

If I'm the minority which not agree with the vote leader result, why should I follow it? :p

I mean to me it sounded like he didn't think Elias or I was scum one day and now has us as #2 and #3 as possible suspects.

Hey, I was "Slightly Pro-Town" for him, and today I'm his "Possible Scum", top suspect! Hm, I'm still neutral about Qman, I don't think he's scum though, I still need to observe him more, he's a unique case

[Qman]

Easter weekend over, pretty much just got home, catching up now.

[Qman]

As for my list, I assume you aren't asking why Holy or MGM are where they are so lets look at what I have.

Farside - Informational reasons as stated.
Elias - A close run between Elias and Gorgon for "middle of the middle" This also relates to you, as elias was hammering at you and knowing your alignment would affect my thoughts on him.
Gorgon - See above, really no major difference between the two, some small things but... *shrug*
Shanba - Of these four I'm pretty sure Shanba is town, he's seriously got a pro town feel to him both from past days and from his posts today on the vote stealing topic, and is unlikely to earn my vote today.

I'm sorry but yesterday you felt this way.

You, Elias, and Gorgon are this little pack of people with slight differences overall that I could go either way on. Of the three I think lynching you would give the most information to the town. I could see myself changing one off the other two to my top spot, but at the rate Holy is staying on my scum-o-dar, I'm not all to worried about a second suspect right now.

Okay since the second part of the above was the second part of the post that the first part came from, i assume that's a formatting error. If not, let me know.

Qman, Akonas ... what gives you the impression that Elias and farside both appear town?

I've said from early day 1 almost that farside has seemed town, her post just have that feel to me. Elias on the other hand is really hammering after someone and trying to scumhunt. Even though I think his target is town I view his hunt for scum as a pro town act. In the end they are both gut calls, but I'm about as sure as I can be that farside is town, and I like how elias is scumhunting, regardless of the target, he's putting effort into it. That said even thier interactions against each other haven't tripped any real scum warnings for me, normally in a discussion of the type they had, someone trips up. I didn't see anything that indicated scum to me.

Now what you seem to be saying my alignment leads you to believe Elias is scum for attacking me. Does those who are not scum hunting are trying to find scum look scummie at all. I find it odd that you have them at the bottom of the list of people of potentional scum.[/quote]


This post was before you got the Opie mislynch rolling, and Akonas turning up cop made me reassess alot of the game, remember how I voted Day 2 for the now cop confimred townie? hmmm? If you ask me having your vote on a cop confirmed townie requires a reassessment after the fact.

Look --- Holy is at the top of my list for her start to today, then there is the 3 pack of you gorgon and elias, MGM is confirmed town, and I storngly suspect Shanba is town as well. Your orchestraing a mislynch out of the blue at the end of day 2 really doesn't sit well with me and now you aren't pure and clean anymore. You have pretty much pushed both lynches, (At least I remember you as the driving force in the H-cow lynch, if anyone else doesn't correct me) and I never really like one person being able to do that, the day 1 lynch could have been an opportune bus of a partner with no clear suspects that day. I know I'd learn alot from your alignment, I suspect others would as well.

[Qman]

Finally I got a chance to read.
Many weird grammar on my posts :p

@Qman: so, what is this 'more than a slight' difference you found that you cannot agree on me?

The way you opened day 3 really bothers me, you clearly didn't look to see if the cop breadcrumbed anyone and made what you must have known would be a futile move to push an MGM lynch, a confirmed townie. I'm not sure I understand why you did that and for now, you are at the top mainly for that.

[Qman]

ALso on Holy, her posts #511, and 525 are so riddled with wrong.


Holy using to much WIFOM does two major things A.) Makes what you say look uncredibile and B.) Is generally seen as a scummy thing when overused.

All townies will have small elements of WIFOM in thier arguements, yes. The keyword there is SMALL. Yours have huge amounts, and townies using to much WIFOM generally ends up with the townie swinging from a noose.

[Qman]

OK, for starters, why aren't we pseudovoting?

Players post

Pseudovote: Name

and we do the votecounts ourselves.

Once we have a lynch majority, all town players commit to voting for the vote leader.

This would allow us to play, effectively, normally, and analyse players' play.

Immunity: MGM

Also, I do feel farside said some rather scummy things in the dialogue with my predecessor (who, fortunately, seems to have played a fairly good pro-town game). However, my current top suspect would be Qman. No real effort ever to push the game in a given direction, just pops up occasionally with his list of all the players (which I maintain is a scummy device) to make it look like he's contributing.

We have been psudovoting, pretty much. At least we were Day 1 and most of Day 2.... today... not so much. Agreed it would be a good idea.

On your immunity vote... why MGM? I know this might seem like a stupid question but I think MGM is the last person we should immunity.

Anyone voting for MGM at deadline is either an idiot or scum, and since the game isn't over the scum can't mislynch him alone. Giving him immunity seems a tad redundant at this point. Plus, from Akonas' death we already know that immunity doesn't carry over into the night like a doc protection, because Akonas just ended up dying night 2.

That said Immunity: Shanba.

At at your suspicion of me... okay, fine by me. It's bullshit to say I've only popped up with lists and you know it, but everyone needs a top suspect.

[Qman]

OK, for starters, why aren't we pseudovoting?

Players post

Pseudovote: Name

and we do the votecounts ourselves.

Once we have a lynch majority, all town players commit to voting for the vote leader.

This would allow us to play, effectively, normally, and analyse players' play.

Immunity: MGM

Also, I do feel farside said some rather scummy things in the dialogue with my predecessor (who, fortunately, seems to have played a fairly good pro-town game). However, my current top suspect would be Qman. No real effort ever to push the game in a given direction, just pops up occasionally with his list of all the players (which I maintain is a scummy device) to make it look like he's contributing.

I felt Elias and I were just arguing based on hascow. I liked Elias after everything was said and done. I admittedly made a case against Opie and unfortunetly it turned out against me. I really thought I had something on him.
As for votes we did that and then people started flaking off. Can I ask a question because it really doesn't make sense to me and I want someone elses imput on the subject. Does Qman's comments about voting against those to find out alignment make sense? I mean to me it sounded like he didn't think Elias or I was scum one day and now has us as #2 and #3 as possible suspects. Saying one alignment would say what others may be. Sounds like he is posting an order on who to vote out, but doesn't say anything about the non posters?
Plus second question is what are your thoughts on Gorgon and Shanba who have been less then ideal in scum hunting?

I second the immunity

Immunity: MGM

If it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside I can change the catagory you are in to a randomized list of neutrals, but worth watching.

Informational lynches can be very helpful in some situations. Not in all, but some.

The two people I won't vote for today are Shanba and MGM. Accept it. Be one with it. I have me reasons and I'm sticking to them. Everyone else in on the table.

[Qman]

Damnitall

Immunity Shanba

[Qman]

OK, for starters, why aren't we pseudovoting?

Players post

Pseudovote: Name

and we do the votecounts ourselves.

Once we have a lynch majority, all town players commit to voting for the vote leader.

As holy noted (+1 alignment) this idea stinks. I'm not going to go with a majority bandwagon if I don't agree with it. Playing normally also means voting for whom you want to vote for and seeing where peoples votes land at the end of the day matters quite a bit to me, even if it isn't on the lynchee. I'd rather not force peope to pull thier votes in the manner you seem to be suggesting.

[Qman]

@Fonz to clarify, how are 4 lists out of 36ish posts before today a lot of lists? that's 1 in 9 posts having then and the only one that could be called a pure list post was the first one, which was a catchup post since I'd neglected the game.

Before you get nit pickky I'm not counting the posts when I re-list a list because someone asked me about it, counting those as list lurking is retarded.

[farside22]

I'm voting for Immunity for MGM because right now I just don't trust anyone in this game. I don't think it is dumb to vote this way if I don't really trust anyone else to give immunity to.

[Qman]

I'm voting for Immunity for MGM because right now I just don't trust anyone in this game. I don't think it is dumb to vote this way if I don't really trust anyone else to give immunity to.

I find that to be a prefectly reasonable argument.

I do think MGM is safe from a lynch today, so I don't see the value in making him ... safer? from it unless I find no one else I consider town.

[Gorgon]

Shanba's argument about the politician looks convincing - I am no longer so sure it's a scum role. One's immediate reaction is that it's antitown to manipulate votes in this way, but, again, Shanba's counterarguments make quite a lot of sense.

Gorgon - He said his vote for opie was mainly a lurker vote, he didn't particularly like opie's reaction, thus he end up voted him with that reason. It's quite contradictory with his belief about lurkers, which he said before. Before day 2 ended, farside building a case on opie, did you do your search about it? What's the difference between opie and Mgm, if your vote yesterday was really because of his lurks btw?

What's my belief about lurkers that you're talking about? Looking over my posts in this game, I don't see me mentioning lurkers up until I voted opie.

The difference between opie and Mgm? At the time I felt it was not overly great - but you have to vote for someone. Also, just before I 'voted' (Page 18), Mgm came through with a pretty hefty (for him) and interesting post on links between players, which made me think better of him.

[Shanba]

Plus second question is what are your thoughts on Gorgon and Shanba who have been less then ideal in scum hunting?

Do you mean in efforts or results?

[Gorgon]

Mod, please replace me. I no longer enjoy mafia, and I am leaving the site. So long, and thanks for all the fish.

[Mgm]

The way you opened day 3 really bothers me, you clearly didn't look to see if the cop breadcrumbed anyone and made what you must have known would be a futile move to push an

MGM lynch, a confirmed townie

. I'm not sure I understand why you did that and for now, you are at the top mainly for that.

Things are looking up. It's quite likely Akonas investigated me, but let's not call me confirmed just yet.

[Rishi]

Mod, please replace me. I no longer enjoy mafia, and I am leaving the site. So long, and thanks for all the fish.

Seeking replacement. <sigh>

[Qman]

The way you opened day 3 really bothers me, you clearly didn't look to see if the cop breadcrumbed anyone and made what you must have known would be a futile move to push an

MGM lynch, a confirmed townie

. I'm not sure I understand why you did that and for now, you are at the top mainly for that.

Things are looking up. It's quite likely Akonas investigated me, but let's not call me confirmed just yet.

Well that's true, you could be a godfather/role thats guilty but investigates innocent, nor can we catagorically prove Akonas investigated you ...but I'm not willing to go after your neck today.

[farside22]

Alright I'm going to say my top two are Holy and Gorgon at this point. I asked question of Gorgon and unfortunetly he didn't answer them before he called it quits. Holy well you answered the questions I gave you and don't feel as strongly as I did about your as scum, but all I have is my gut on this one.
Pseudovote: Gorgon

[The Fonz]

OK, for starters, why aren't we pseudovoting?

Players post

Pseudovote: Name

and we do the votecounts ourselves.

Once we have a lynch majority, all town players commit to voting for the vote leader.

If I'm the minority which not agree with the vote leader result, why should I follow it? :p

The idea is to try to make the game as 'normal' as possible. The election day mechanic allows for lynches by plurality rather than majority, which is scum-favouring, and is open to manipulation by the politician, ditto, and we also have the issue of when the best time to claim is. Should a pro-town power role risk being lynched to keep his/her role a secret? If we garner a majority, give a day or two for claim, then all vote to open polls, that issue is eliminated.

If we try to work out what will happen in election day beforehand, demand that everyone votes the way the town has agreed, and lynch anyone who diverges, then the process is far less open to manipulation- the game becomes, in effect, a normal game of mafia.

At at your suspicion of me... okay, fine by me. It's bullshit to say I've only popped up with lists and you know it, but everyone needs a top suspect.

Well, obviously not every post you've made has been a list. But I've very much gotten the impression you're trying to blend into the background here and not draw too much attention to yourself. Who's got reason to do that? Hmmm.