Thespival Mafia (Denouement)


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Post Post #1550 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:04 am

Post by petroleumjelly »

I HATE THIS GAME AND I HATE HOW STUPID THE PLAYERS ARE.

1.)
Beep! Beep!, I have been even
more
vocal today because I have been particularly
pissed
at how terribly the town has been doing, and additionally, how bad the logic has been for what the town has done. The fact that you "called me out" has nothing to do with anything.

2.)
hasdgfas being "open" to double-kills is
only natural if he is scum
. He will need to have
some
back-up when the town discovers that Farside22 was actually a Doctor. Regardless of his "openness", the Farside22 lynch was pretty much going to happen no matter what after hasdgfas claimed to have vigged Sarcastro.

3.)
Putting "effort" into making scores for voting patterns is not effort towards finding scum, I do not believe. I keep a voting pattern list in
every game I play in
. That is not the same as scum-hunting. Putting scores to them is also not the same as scum-hunting; it is busy-work that allows you to claim suspicions, and then fall back on "Oh well, it was just a voting pattern; guess we had weird voting this game". You are not staking a personal opinion by whipping out scum scores, and that's what makes it a lack of effort.

I could spend all of my time in this game making posts such as "1, 4, 7, 10, 13, 16" ad infinitum just adding +3 to prior numbers; that would certainly take "effort". But it is not effort I am putting into finding scum.

4.)
I completely agree that the weakest portion of CKD's claim is his timing, and the fact that he has claimed to have targeted dead people. The point of
my
post was to attack what I considered to be
bad
reasoning: namely, that his method of crumbing was "weak", something I very much disagree with.

5.)
hasdgfas is in "no such danger"
precisely because he claimed before anybody could put him under pressure
. He has essentially preempted the scenario where people express substantive suspicion of him prior to claiming; by claiming right off the bat, that cannot possibly happen.
"Logic? I call that flapdoodle."
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Post Post #1551 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:49 am

Post by hasdgfas »

mafia RB?
jdodge1019: hasjghsalghsakljghs is from vermont
jdodge1019: vermont is made of liberal freaks and cows
jdodge1019: he's not a liberal
jdodge1019: thus he is a cow
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Post Post #1552 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 9:30 am

Post by Beep! Beep! »

PJ wrote:1.)I have been even more vocal today because I have been particularly pissed at how terribly the town has been doing
Maybe. But the coincidence casts doubt on your affirmation.
PJ wrote:2.) hasdgfas being "open" to double-kills is only natural if he is scum.
Unless I don't understand what you are saying, you appear to be incorrect. hasdagas said he had a one-shot vig. I see no contradiction.
PJ wrote:3.) Putting "effort" into making scores for voting patterns is not effort towards finding scum
It is very labor-intensive, and it IS effort in finding scum. I don't think you'll recruit many players to your opinion.
PJ wrote:4.) I completely agree that the weakest portion of CKD's claim is his timing, and the fact that he has claimed to have targeted dead people. The point of my post was to attack what I considered to be bad reasoning: namely, that his method of crumbing was "weak", something I very much disagree with.
You choose to attack BM's crap argument, which is that the breadcrumb itself might have been faked. It's preposterous, and I ignored it for the red herring that it is. The core of the argument, and that's the only part you should discuss instead of BM's non-issue, is that he claimed to have breadcrumbed on Day 3, having roleblocked dead, non-scummy players.
PJ wrote:5.) hasdgfas is in "no such danger" precisely because he claimed before anybody could put him under pressure.
That is patently absurd.
Beep! Beep!
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Post Post #1553 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 9:36 am

Post by petroleumjelly »

I don't even think it is necessary to even respond to Beep! Beep! any longer. All of my responses should be quite obvious. If anybody has a problem with this, feel free to say as much.
"Logic? I call that flapdoodle."
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Post Post #1554 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 10:31 am

Post by Battle Mage »

hasdgfas wrote:mafia RB?
I doubt it. Notice how all his claimed targets are dead, so we have no way to confirm him? -.-

This is too easy.

BM
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Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
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Post Post #1555 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 11:04 am

Post by hasdgfas »

excellent point
jdodge1019: hasjghsalghsakljghs is from vermont
jdodge1019: vermont is made of liberal freaks and cows
jdodge1019: he's not a liberal
jdodge1019: thus he is a cow
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Post Post #1556 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 11:05 am

Post by Battle Mage »

Amen brother! :p
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Nightkilled - 10
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Post Post #1557 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 2:41 pm

Post by Iammars »

Another quick post. It looks my long post is going to have to come on spring break unless my teachers continue to pile work on me.

BM was being stupid about breadcrumbs. The only thing that ckd has going against him is the lateness of it. But I am inclined to believe it based on the page number.
"Rolefishing is fishing for someones role. It's called fishing because it requires subtlety. When you grab a shotgun and start firing into the water, thats not fishing." - IH
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Post Post #1558 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 4:10 pm

Post by curiouskarmadog »

will comment tomorrow, need sleep
NO YOU'RE OVER DEFENSIVE
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Post Post #1559 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:36 pm

Post by petroleumjelly »

Been thinking a bit.

First, though: Iammars, please clarify your statement. You are "inclined to believe CKD's claim", or inclined to believe something else?

~~~~~

Given that I have correctly metagamed Thesp at least once in this game so far (by guessing the Quack Doctor before it was even claimed), I do want to remind everybody that:

Ability =/= Alignment

I seem to recall in Sanity Mafia, Thesp included a Mafia Tracker. Even if hasdgfas turns out to be right about CKD, at least for me, it will
not
confirm him as protown in my eyes. I have been thinking that it may be the case that he is a SK who could not kill on Night One due to his breaking his restriction. This would be another method to account for the nightkills, despite the fact that SK is clearly not one of the win conditions on the front post.

Actually, not sure why I haven't asked this question before:

Mod
, is it possible for there to be win conditions other than those presented in the first few posts?
"Logic? I call that flapdoodle."
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Post Post #1560 (ISO) » Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:43 pm

Post by petroleumjelly »

CKD, please link me to past games where you have breadcrumbed your role, as well as any games where you falsely breadcrumbed as scum. I would like to compare them to this game.
"Logic? I call that flapdoodle."
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Post Post #1561 (ISO) » Tue Mar 11, 2008 1:27 am

Post by curiouskarmadog »

I actually hardly ever breadcrumb(because apparently I suck at it)...I dont have a game that I breadcrumbed as scum, check out my wiki site, I have all the games there that I have been scum check for yourself.

The only completed game I could find (but I think there is another). is mini 486.
viewtopic.php?t=5886&postdays=0&postord ... &start=901

in the post ABR(mod) makes fun of it (because is was so obvious) yet again, no one saw it.
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Post Post #1562 (ISO) » Tue Mar 11, 2008 1:27 am

Post by curiouskarmadog »

will answer all other question when I get time later
NO YOU'RE OVER DEFENSIVE
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Post Post #1563 (ISO) » Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:41 am

Post by mathcam »

Iammars: Yeah, that last line made no sense. If you're talking about CKD, why would the page number convince you he's telling the truth? I put forward an argument that the page number is actually evidence
against
the possibility he's telling the truth.
petroleumjelly wrote:I seem to recall in Sanity Mafia, Thesp included a Mafia Tracker. Even if hasdgfas turns out to be right about CKD, at least for me, it will
not
confirm him as protown in my eyes. I have been thinking that it may be the case that he is a SK who could not kill on Night One due to his breaking his restriction. This would be another method to account for the nightkills, despite the fact that SK is clearly not one of the win conditions on the front post.p
I don't think it would confirm has for me either, but it would be pretty sadistic to make an SK earn his kill each night by sastisfying a posting restriction. I also doubt an SK would make this move in his situation -- he wasn't in significant danger of being lynched when he came out with his info, and has brought a lot of attention on himself by doing so. It's not like SK's can sacrifice a player for gain like the mafia can. A mafia tracker, on the other hand, is certainly plausible.

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Post Post #1564 (ISO) » Tue Mar 11, 2008 11:58 am

Post by curiouskarmadog »

jesus, have a week of being screwed by fakeclaims..ok, will focus on this game in the next 48 hours.
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Post Post #1565 (ISO) » Tue Mar 11, 2008 11:58 am

Post by curiouskarmadog »

having a week
NO YOU'RE OVER DEFENSIVE
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Post Post #1566 (ISO) » Wed Mar 12, 2008 2:11 pm

Post by Iammars »

mathcam wrote:Iammars: Yeah, that last line made no sense. If you're talking about CKD, why would the page number convince you he's telling the truth? I put forward an argument that the page number is actually evidence
against
the possibility he's telling the truth.
It's page 42. Don't tell me you don't know what that means.
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Post Post #1567 (ISO) » Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:46 pm

Post by mathcam »

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh. Never mind then.

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Post Post #1568 (ISO) » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:10 pm

Post by Mr_Gnome_It_All »

Iammars wrote:It's page 42. Don't tell me you don't know what that means.
It means your pages are longer than mine. I'm on page 63.
Who the hell is "General Failure", and why is he reading my hard drive?
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Post Post #1569 (ISO) » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:21 pm

Post by Iammars »

Mr_Gnome_It_All wrote:
Iammars wrote:It's page 42. Don't tell me you don't know what that means.
It means your pages are longer than mine. I'm on page 63.
We're talking about ckd's breadcrumb, not about the current page length.
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Post Post #1570 (ISO) » Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:28 pm

Post by Mastermind of Sin »

I need to get caught up on this game. Sorry I haven't posted yet today. I have a tournament this weekend and a test on Friday, so it'll probably be next week.
Permanent V/LA.
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Post Post #1571 (ISO) » Wed Mar 12, 2008 8:27 pm

Post by Battle Mage »

Iammars wrote:
mathcam wrote:Iammars: Yeah, that last line made no sense. If you're talking about CKD, why would the page number convince you he's telling the truth? I put forward an argument that the page number is actually evidence
against
the possibility he's telling the truth.
It's page 42. Don't tell me you don't know what that means.
Please tell me it doesnt have anything to do with the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy. -.-
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Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
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Post Post #1572 (ISO) » Wed Mar 12, 2008 9:58 pm

Post by petroleumjelly »

I will be away from March 13 - 17. By the time I return (March 18), I fully expect everybody to have finished the assignments I have given; any and all players are more than free to analyze me (something I hardly ever ask for in the first place, since I tend to get analyzed in the process of assigning people things anyways). Claiming that it "might help scum who to nightkill" is 100% bullshit; yes, of course it might do that, but more importantly it lets townspeople get reads on other townspeople as well as scum. Every single opinion helps
both
the town and the scum make 'more informed decisions'; live with it. The difference is scum don't need to have information to kill somebody who is not in their group, whereas the town
does
.

This is not a veiled jab at mathcam; in fact, it is very unveiled jab. His 'justification' for refusing to do my assignment is nothing more than skirting the issue with a bad reason provided. I will give a preemptory
FoS: mathcam
should he even attempt to wriggle out of doing my assignment again.

If you would like confirmation that I have a precedent of doing this, look no further than my newbie games (and probably others, but I'm not going to scan all my old games for examples). I will 100% agree that I have also done this as scum (Kingmaker II being an example that comes to mind), but right now I'm tired and I honestly could not care less about that.

Talking = helps the town. Let's get to it.
"Logic? I call that flapdoodle."
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Post Post #1573 (ISO) » Thu Mar 13, 2008 1:01 am

Post by Beep! Beep! »

petroleumjelly wrote:I will be away from March 13 - 17. By the time I return (March 18), I fully expect everybody to have finished the assignments I have given.
I agree that people should give their opinion and that discussion is desirable.

However, we have caught CKD scum.

And your list of assignments is quite simply ridiculous.

(1) You have omitted yourself from the list of persons to analyze.
(2) Amelia gets special treatment and needs to be analyzed by two different players.
(3) Holy and Battle Mage have no assignment.
(4) My opinion is expressly not sollicited, and you know that I think you are scum.
(5) Your distribution of task is uneven, biased and has no rhyme or reason.
(6) If people follow this list of assignments, it is my belief that they are playing in the hands of PJ-scum.
(7) mathcam is completely justified in refusing to participate.
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Post Post #1574 (ISO) » Thu Mar 13, 2008 4:28 am

Post by Thesp »

Official D4 Vote Count

Note:
Cult of the Couch Members:
1 (Mr_Gnome_It_All)


curiouskarmadog - 4
(hasdgfas, Beep! Beep!, Mathcam, Battle Mage)
hasdgfas - 1
(curiouskarmadog)

Not Voting - 6
(AmeliaSlay, Holy, Iammars, Mastermind of Sin, Mr_Gnome_It_All, petroleumjelly)


With 11 alive, it's 6 to lynch.

Prodding all players who haven't posted in the last 72 hours, replacing non-responders.
Last edited by Thesp on Thu Apr 03, 2008 6:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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