Mini 536: Heroes Smalltown. Game Over!

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

WHy on earth would you want to lynch someone for which your scumdar doesn't work when you must lynch correctly? This makes no sense.

Firstly, if you can't think of a reason, then you're not thinking hard enough. My scumdar doesn't work on DGb, but I wouldn't exclude lynching here today either.

Secondly, you're pretty much strawmanning here. She merely said she'd rather take a DGb lynch over a no lynch. She certainly hasn't been fighting to get DGb lynched.

I'm actually fairly sure Adele is town at this point.

[curiouskarmadog]

I'm actually fairly sure Adele is town at this point.

based on what?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Intuition.

Her stance on DGb resonates rather strongly with me, in particular. Her latest posts show a distinctly pro-town mindset as far as I'm concerned.

[curiouskarmadog]

well, they are someone else's "stances"..she has just agreed with them out of no where, but you feel that she is town for that...so your thoughts on the original person who thought DGB might be scum (yvonne)..what about cicero? If you like Adele's "stances" you must like thier stances as well, yes?

do you feel DGB is scummy? or just slightly less scummy than myself?

other than saying you dont like DGB/jdodge, but they werent giving you any solid tells, have you demostrated that you felt DGB is scummy any where? Seems to me that I can find a post or two where you agreed with DGB.

can you please provide me some posts that Adele has posted that you think are town tells that had contributed to your "intuition". Also, does it bother you that Adele has not displayed any suspicion of DGB before coming out and saying she would support a DGB lynch?

At least when Cicero walked out on the ledge to support Yvonne as being town he displayed some sort of "case" for it...you..just intuition.

[DrippingGoofball]

Let me get this straight, CKD. Adele and CES would vote for be because I'm "unreadable???"

What I am missing here?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

well, they are someone else's "stances"..she has just agreed with them out of no where, but you feel that she is town for that...so your thoughts on the original person who thought DGB might be scum (yvonne)..what about cicero? If you like Adele's "stances" you must like thier stances as well, yes?

The only thing in common between these stances is that they are not favourable to DGb. Liking one such stance, doesn't in any way imply I must like all such stances.

do you feel DGB is scummy? or just slightly less scummy than myself?

You are my top suspect. DGb is my number two currently by a more than significant margin.

other than saying you dont like DGB/jdodge, but they werent giving you any solid tells, have you demostrated that you felt DGB is scummy any where? Seems to me that I can find a post or two where you agreed with DGB.

I am perfectly capable of agreeing with someone without me thinking they're town. I have nothing concrete on DGb, so I haven't had much reason to express my suspicion. At the same time, she hasn't given me any reason to trust her, whereas most have. Mostly, it's not that I suspect her more now than just after reading the thread, it's that I suspect nearly everyone less now.

can you please provide me some posts that Adele has posted that you think are town tells that had contributed to your "intuition".

I "can". 1155(the second paragraph), 1267, 1272, 1274(her latest posts)

Also, does it bother you that Adele has not displayed any suspicion of DGB before coming out and saying she would support a DGB lynch?

Neither have I. I have no problem understanding it. The very thing that mystifies you strikes a chord with me.

At least when Cicero walked out on the ledge to support Yvonne as being town he displayed some sort of "case" for it...you..just intuition.

I have a pretty good gut though.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Let me get this straight, CKD. Adele and CES would vote for be because I'm "unreadable???"

What I am missing here?

Reading comprehension.

[curiouskarmadog]

Let me get this straight, CKD. Adele and CES would vote for be because I'm "unreadable???"

What I am missing here?

where did I say I would vote you?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

That's a period, ckd. Not a comma.

[curiouskarmadog]

That's a period, ckd. Not a comma.

why are you asking me DGB?

CES I have a reply coming later....

[shaft.ed]

WHy on earth would you want to lynch someone for which your scumdar doesn't work when you must lynch correctly? This makes no sense.

Firstly, if you can't think of a reason, then you're not thinking hard enough. My scumdar doesn't work on DGb, but I wouldn't exclude lynching here today either.

Secondly, you're pretty much strawmanning here. She merely said she'd rather take a DGb lynch over a no lynch. She certainly hasn't been fighting to get DGb lynched.

I'm actually fairly sure Adele is town at this point.

I'm not strawmanning anything here.

Adele rather flippantly adds DGB to a list of people she is comfortable lynching today. She has not once expressed any concerns on DGB, yet all of the sudden she is suspicious, and this coincides with a point where DGB happens to have a couple votes on her.

And I didn't make my case clearly. My point wasn't that one shouldn't lycnh someone because they cannot read them. My point was that this was the ONLY reason that Adele provided though stating she could provide reasons if needed. This is really a weird statement to me.

[DrippingGoofball]

Let me get this straight, CKD. Adele and CES would vote for be because I'm "unreadable???"

What I am missing here?

where did I say I would vote you?

You didn't say you would vote me. But is it my imagination? What other reasons have Adele and CES brought forward, beyond un-readability? Interesting.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I'm not strawmanning anything here.

LIES! Seriously though, you are, to an extent. I mean, it's generally a bad idea to advocate lynching someone in LyLo if you don't have a good read on them, as per your "This makes no sense." comment. But she isn't advocating that lynch. She merely stated she would prefer it over no lynch. That's worlds apart.

And I didn't make my case clearly. My point wasn't that one shouldn't lycnh someone because they cannot read them. My point was that this was the ONLY reason that Adele provided though stating she could provide reasons if needed. This is really a weird statement to me.

Now this I have no problem with. Even though I wouldn't call it weird. It's just a matter of comparison.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Neither of us has given unreadability as a reason, DGb.

[curiouskarmadog]

what would the reason be?

CES, could you please tell me what Adele's "stance" is on DGB and why, as you see it. I just want to understand why you agree with her stance, when I am not sure I understand the why.

[DrippingGoofball]

Maybe it was this sentence:

My scumdar doesn't work on DGb, but I wouldn't exclude lynching here today either.

Is there more to it that I missed?

[Adele]

Wow, I'm controverisal today . I'm about to see a movie, but I'll post when I get out, and try to explain what I mean more clearly. However, I'd like it noted that I

have

been finding DGB hella scummy; I've been suppressing my response to her as much as possible, but if we're in a dilemma and we need to make a pick, then one thing that I would do is to suppress it

less

.

And, right now I don't think she's the

ideal

lynch - but she's

better than a no-lynch

.

[Adele]

OK. "Unreadability" has, if anything, given DGB a

free pass

from me so far, which I am stating a willingness to revoke.

DGB, I'm sure you agree you shouldn't have a free pass just because you're a bad player, right?
So if I reread your posts now and find them unutterably scummy, you'll have no objection to me preferring your lynch to a no-lynch?
Great, thanks

[shaft.ed]

Adele. I read back over your original post a couple times and I do think I was interpretating in a more scummy way than it was written. I do still have a bad leaning for you but I would like to get back to my line of thought before this came up.

unvote

OK so before I postulated that last nights killer had to be one of CES, DGB, or The Fonz. Would the three of you be kind enough to comment on the other two players on this list?

[DrippingGoofball]

DGB, I'm sure you agree you shouldn't have a free pass just because you're a bad player, right?

Plain old, transparent, Goofball bait.

I'm not biting.

shafted: if your calculations are correct, from my perspective, I'd say CES and the Fonz have a 50-50 chance! TSQ's behaviour early in the game was pretty distracting, and the Fonz has remained rational and calm, but I'm not liking his vote on CKD.

[YvonneSeer]

hasty= impatient; impetuous; thoughtless; injudicious; unduly quick; precipitate; rash

Cicero impies that you could be townish by not wanting to jump on the Gorgon wagon so quickly, if you want to use that defense, please explain the hasty Oman vote.

I still don't get it. My vote on Oman was a random vote that eventually evolved into a lynch vote at the end of the day. I was not impatient to vote him, it was there the whole time.

[curiouskarmadog]

obviously there is a break down of communication here...Cicero was implying that you are townish because you were hesitant to vote Gorgon....I am asking if that is true..why werent you hesitant to vote Oman? Still waiting for him to address this too.

[YvonneSeer]

Okay, now I think I understand.

They were under two different circumstances. From what I gathered, Gorgon was a D2 lynch candidate after having 2 townies dead and he was going to be lynched mainly because of the 50/50 chance of him being the SK. As you already know, I didn't agree with this reason and therefore I didn't want to lynch Gorgon and instead preferred a safer way to find out aka "directing you to jail him" because if Gorgon was a townie, we would have been in serious trouble after lynching him.

On the other hand, Oman was a D1 lynch candidate. We had nothing to go on and we definitely needed a lynch to gain information. At that point, Oman was the closest thing to being scum since I found nobody else sticking out with their scumminess.

So, yes, there will be a difference depending on the situation.

[cicero]

obviously there is a break down of communication here...Cicero was implying that you are townish because you were hesitant to vote Gorgon....I am asking if that is true..why werent you hesitant to vote Oman? Still waiting for him to address this too.

The breakdown to me appears to be you:

a) not listening, because she just answered you. You have yet to demonstrate that her vote was "hasty" or even undeserved on 'poor Oman'. It appears that it was a random vote that she chose to never move. Can you demonstrate why such a vote could be described as "hasty"? Is it just because it was first, because she JUST explained that.

I mean, if she's scum CKD she knew that Oman and Gorgon weren't scum. So what's her motivation for treating them differently in the first place as scum?

I'm just having trouble putting myself in the mocassins of scum-Yvonne and sorting out the theory that you and/or DGB seem to have. Can you explain it to me better?

It seems to me your language is obscuring the scumtell here because personally in isolation I just call such votes "sneaky". I find it highly suspicious when someone in the early game places a vote on someone and never moves it. +1 Scumminess to Yvonne for quiet wagon surfing. This is not the same as "hasty" since I dont even know how to characterise this accusation by CKD. (CKD - if you want an example of what I mean go back to Mafia 69 and look at Twomz's votes during the volatile and controversial Karen wagon. It wasnt a random vote. But look how he hops on the wagon and then just quietly rides it.

b) What I've said is that there was a possible townish motivation for wanting to have you jail Gorgon. It was because of the fear that we might be killing Sylar's target instead of Sylar. Given that Gorgon's phase power would be very useful to Sylar, this was a reasonable concern that all of us shared, and which even scum would have paid honest lip service to since they want to appear townie and we now know that Gorgon was not one of their team.

Please remember though: Articulating a townie motive doesnt make a person necessarily town, however. Scum try to do the townie thing as much as they can manage it.

[shaft.ed]

CKD you said you wanted to find the shooter. What do you think of my narrowing down to CES, DGB and Fonz?