You don't think it's odd that all townies are in green and that the two scum that died are listed in different colors?Skruffs wrote:Vote : Rishi
That kind of 'in game' knowledge is usually a scum tell, I think!
One question, skruffs:skruffs wrote: Vote : Rishi
That kind of 'in game' knowledge is usually a scum tell, I think!
What was he going to do, out his own scum buddies and become a pariah here?xyzzy wrote:Fos: the people who decided that it was better to just kill the scum quickly befor we could get any info out of them.
I assume we don't have much scum left. How do ya'll suppose we're going to find them since we killed the one person who knew for sure before they could tell us anything useful? That was quite scummy.
I completely agree that the two colors mean different scum groups, or, perhaps, a death miller. However, I am wondering why you , as soon as day started, went to the first page to compare the two mafia deaths and then 'announce your findings'. You made it explicitly clear in your post that you 'found' them, I think, in an attempt to make it look 'accidental'. However, with no out of the ordinary changes in the game, no odd roles, etc, why did you go look at it in the first place?Rishi wrote: You don't think it's odd that all townies are in green and that the two scum that died are listed in different colors?
Do you think a townie or a mafia would be more eager to posit that there are in fact two seperate scum groups? I am of the mindset that scum is scum. A mafia of one group seeing another mafia die would of course be inherently curious to go see if the colors were different, if there was a differentiation in the first post, which explains (more likely) why Rishi discovered this. I have no problem 'killing the messenger', in this regard.vollkan wrote: One question, skruffs:
Is it unlikely, to the point of meriting a vote, that a townie would actually notice the colour difference and suggest that it may be indicative of two scum groups?
I must answer my question firmly in the negative. Colours are often used to differentiate alignments, so it is a perfectly ordinary suggestion that it might suggest different scum groups.
OhGodMyLife wrote:I had the same thought about the two different colored mafia, so I don't find that to be a legitimate basis for an attack. I did find it odd, however, that the evidence that really seemed to make egruntz break down was a supposed link with xyl, which may not actually exist if they were in different scum groups.
I don't know about anyone else, but I frequently look at the first post. I'm in a lot of games right now (probably more than I can handle) and I needed to remind myself which game this was and what had happened. If you guys can remember who was killed, their roles, and the current game situation off the tops of your heads, good for you - but I can't do it, especially in a game this large.Skruffs wrote: I completely agree that the two colors mean different scum groups, or, perhaps, a death miller. However, I am wondering why you , as soon as day started, went to the first page to compare the two mafia deaths and then 'announce your findings'. You made it explicitly clear in your post that you 'found' them, I think, in an attempt to make it look 'accidental'. However, with no out of the ordinary changes in the game, no odd roles, etc, why did you go look at it in the first place?
Skruffs, go to page 1 and tell me whether or not you notice the colour difference when you look at the "dead players" list.Skruffs wrote: Do you think a townie or a mafia would be more eager to posit that there are in fact two seperate scum groups? I am of the mindset that scum is scum. A mafia of one group seeing another mafia die would of course be inherently curious to go see if the colors were different, if there was a differentiation in the first post, which explains (more likely) why Rishi discovered this. I have no problem 'killing the messenger', in this regard.
Well, you said to me that:Skruffs wrote: Vollkan - I'm not saying it's not noticeable. Did I say that it was too subtle to notice? I didn't. I said that Rishi's post seems to be very carefully formulated to be an 'oh by the way guys look at this'... I'm not saying he should be lynched for it, I'm expressing my suspicion of him.
That makes it pretty clear that you think it more likely that Rishi-scum would discover it than Rishi-town. You even use the exact words "explains (more likely) why Rishi discovered this." If your problem was only Rishi's reporting of his discovery, as you now claim, (and I will get to this in just one minute) then this doesn't fit.Skruffs wrote: Do you think a townie or a mafia would be more eager to posit that there are in fact two seperate scum groups? I am of the mindset that scum is scum. A mafia of one group seeing another mafia die would of course be inherently curious to go see if the colors were different, if there was a differentiation in the first post, which explains (more likely) why Rishi discovered this. I have no problem 'killing the messenger', in this regard.
He says he "noticed" it. He goes on to give the two best explanations, and gives evidence supporting that there are 2 scum groups.Rishi wrote:
So I noticed something. Xyl and egruntz were listed in different colors when dead. Now, Elias could have done this for no good reason, or Xyl and egruntz could have been on different scum teams.
With three deaths on the first night, it's likely there's more than one scum group. Only one death last night, but that doesn't mean anything... especially now that we know there's a doc in the setup.
You'll notice that I have argued that it is not, in fact, a scumtell. Thus, I consider any suspicion of Rishi stemming solely from his reporting of the colour difference to be unjustified. Just because you personally consider it to be a scumtell doesn't justify your belief.Skruffs wrote: I stand by my earlier stance. You'll notice that, however, that I'm not attacking people who disagree with me. It's a personal scum tell that I am going to stick by for the time being.
Stupid question, really.Skruffs wrote: I am guessing by your last paragraph that you are *not*, in fact, in the same situation as Rishi. However, isn't the situation, as you see it, that Rishi, as town, noticed something on the front page? What about your situation is different than his?
I guess you are referring to this:Skruffs wrote: Also, noticed you teasing the cop that claimed to have been roleblocked the previous night. FOS that's as much a scum tell as someone congratulating the doctor on a successful no-kill. Why would you expect him to have results today?
That isn't teasing. My intention in adding theSkruffs wrote: And, Antithesis, let's hear some results
was to express eagerness at the prospect of getting more information, particularly given that we hadn't received information on D2. If you bothered reading that, you would see my position stated very "I consider any suspicion of Rishi stemming solely from his reporting of the colour difference to be unjustified." In other words, I reject that it is a scumtell. Nowhere do I say he seems even slightly pro-town. All I am saying is that your arguments are bullshit.Voll wrote: You'll notice that I have argued that it is not, in fact, a scumtell. Thus, I consider any suspicion of Rishi stemming solely from his reporting of the colour difference to be unjustified. Just because you personally consider it to be a scumtell doesn't justify your belief.
Imagine this - Vollkan has just argued the earth is flat:
"I stand by my earlier stance. You'll notice that, however, that I'm not attacking people who disagree with me. It's a personal view that I am going to stick by for the time being."
As I said, "I don't much care whether or not it is a "personal scumtell", I'm going to attack it and consider it illegitimate unless you either objectively justify it, or relinquish it."Skruffs wrote: Why are personal scumtells unacceptable in games with you in them?
Again, you miss the point.Skruffs wrote: You reference involved something that is known not toue; the earth being flat; under the that it is their personal opinion and not something they expect others to believe. The two examples don't match up,though. I provided reasoning for why rishi scum would say what he said, you then called my hypothesis a flat earth theory. If the earth might in fact 'be flat', (or in this casse, rishi might be scum), why the unadulterated resistance agaiinst theoretical examinations of his motives??? One clue either leads to anotheer clue, or it leads to a dead end.
