Thespival Mafia (Denouement)

[QuickBen]

You know the really sad part is that we're spending an inordinate amount of time on the Jester when we really need to be looking for scum. Currently, GS and BM are my favorites for lynch today just from the distraction they've caused from our true purpose- finding and lynching scum.

[mith]

If they are your favorites for lynching, why are you not voting for either of them?

[curiouskarmadog]

You know the really sad part is that we're spending an inordinate amount of time on the Jester when we really need to be looking for scum. Currently, GS and BM are my favorites for lynch today just from the distraction they've caused from our true purpose- finding and lynching scum.

and how did they cause distraction?

and (maybe I have missed it) what are you doing to scum hunt? At least this has spawned conversation.

[Thesp]

Monkey

replaces

Dark Ermac

, effective immediately.

[QuickBen]

@Mith- because townies can be a distraction as much as scum and I try not to vote until I actually have or read a case that I believe in.

@CKD- they've been a distraction by dragging out the whole jester issue WAY longer than it needed to be. Why discuss why the jester should or shouldn't come out if you're not the jester?? What purpose does it serve? You're right, I haven't done much scum hunting myself as of yet. I didn't hold myself above anyone else in my post. TBH, yeah some of the names in here are a little intimidating. Under my former username, there was never a game in which MeMe didn't peg me for scum no matter what my alignment was, lol. Mith was the first host I ever played a game under. (I think I was actually Pooky's lover in that game and he turned out to be a werewolf.) But I've decided I need to shake off that kind of thinking and not sit back and let everyone else take the lead when I know we're being distracted.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

You were the best lover I've ever had in a Mafia game.

[Greasy Spot]

You know the really sad part is that we're spending an inordinate amount of time on the Jester when we really need to be looking for scum. Currently, GS and BM are my favorites for lynch today just from the distraction they've caused from our true purpose- finding and lynching scum.

I agree that too much time is being spent on the Jester and not scum hunting. If you look at the total amount posts in this game I don't have as many as most of the others here do, so I hardly think I am a distraction.

@ALL If you lynch me the Jester will win and the Town will be well on its way to losing.

[Dark Ermac]

I'M BACK.

The site wouldn't allow me access yesterday.

[Dark Ermac]

... damnit...

[Battle Mage]

Pooky made a case?

I'm surprised you've been around this long and you still don't know a case when you see one.

Im surprised you feel able to make such criticisms, when you have no experience yourself.

One of the main characteristics (good or bad) about me is that i tend to stick to my instincts even in the face of every other player saying im wrong.

And when your instincts are wrong? You can't play this game on instincts alone. You have to base your judgments and decisions on logic.

True, but thats generally the way i play. It means im not always right, but often that i pick up on things that the majority of people don't, which can be incredibly useful. I personally find players who give in to peer pressure in games such as this when the players disagreeing with them are unconfirmed, less than brilliant.

Actually I've decided that it's dumb to do back and forth with you because we're moving closer to the deadline and we need the Jester to understand that my case is ironclad.

The only way the Jester wins is by making the Town Lose in the endgame if he has been revealed.

Basically the Jester effectively moves the town one day closer to the endgame if he claims and survives till then.

However LYNCHING the jester does EXACTLY the same thing as not lynching him. By lynching him, we are ALSO moving the game one day closer to the endgame, which is the same thing we do if we leave him alive.

EXCEPT WHEN WE LEAVE HIM ALIVE, WE HAVE A CHANCE OF LYNCHING MAFIA, WHEREAS IF WE LYNCH HIM WE HAVE NO CHANCE OF LYNCHING MAFIA.

So yea, I'd guess keeping him alive is the town's best play.

In

bold

is the heart of the argument. We don't want to waste time lynching non-scum.

Anti town is anti town.

*dont ask me why im even bothering arguing this in defence of the Jester. I just HATE lies stated as fact.

I wonder how you play as scum, then. Do you go out announcing to everyone "Hey, guess what? I hate lies, so I'm scum"?

BM, why don't you just give us a clear, non-ambiguous reply to mith in #276? You're emitting a plethora of scum-confusion tactics from your miserable, obnoxious self. Do you like being unpopular? Does it make you feel better to have a bad reputation on MS as being one of the most unfun players to play with?

When you have completed your first newbie game on the site, i suggest you have a read of some of my games as scum then. Miserable and obnoxious? you old flatterer!
Im still not convinced by claims that you're the alt of an experienced player. But you clearly have some reason for disliking me, outside this game, seeing as i've actually been making an effort here. A bit of advice kid, if you ask someone a favour, being polite is a MUST. Dont expect anyone to take you seriously if all you do is make nonsenical comments and unwarranted insults.

Pooky's post #280 should leave

no doubt

for the jester to claim. At this point, an unclaimed jester is a

bad

jester.

If that is the case, the Jester will see your obvious logic and claim. Im not seeing it though. Sucking upto Pooky won't win you any favours with me either.

And to think, i was trying so hard to be polite, and avoid getting into a flame war.

Lies. I know what's going on in the minds of attention-seeking players like you. You act as a detriment to the town in every game you play, regardless of your role. It's a playstyle that's hard to read, but it's also a playstyle that isn't enjoyable to participate with. Do you like having fun at the expense of other people? If yes, what does that make you? Why bother pulling a Slayer's Gambit? It's not a good way of catching scum and it only serves to confuse the town even further.

Wow, do i know you? ROFL.
And

I'm

being attention seeking? Lol.
Anyways seeing as im trying to put extra effort into this game, down to the fact Thesp let me play in such a legend field, i'm not going to respond to your baiting. If you want to discuss any personal issues outside of the game, i'm a good listener, and hopefully i'll get you straightened out. If you have genuine concerns about my play, please do show me where i've acted as a detriment to the town here. Oh and btw, pointing out the failures in the reasoning of the majority doesnt count.

Conclusion: I know what the B in BM stands for. Bad play. Unless he's deliberately being anti-town, in which case we should lynch him as soon as possible.

Actually no. If you'd read my name, the B stands for Battle and the M is for Mage. Thats why some people call me Battle Mage.
And as a general rule, in acronyms, 1 letter tends not to represent 2 distinct words.
As far as your reasoning goes, i'm intrigued to hear why you would think being 'DELIBERATELY ANTI-TOWN' would be lynchworthy in a game where several people, yourself included, are paranoid about a Jester?

@the jester: if you're worried about getting lynched D1 after your claim, there's no chance of that happening. We're not horrible players who only seek to make one person lose. I'm sure the town would rather have a higher chance of finishing second place instead of a much lower chance of winning it outright.

I'm gonna call Appeal to Emotion here.

Here's how your not claiming hurts the town:

1. It gives scum the opportunity to claim jester, which is incredibly detrimental to us.

In case you hadnt realised, its probably wise to point out that this point is total bollocks. Scum can claim Jester at any time. Its not as if we are going to take the first Jester claim at face value. lol

3. A late jester claim, as elaborated on by Pooky and mith, can be devastating for the town in the end-game.

Actually, they also pointed out how a Jester claim full stop can be detrimental to the town.

If you just claim now, all those problems will go away, and we can turn our attention to catching scum instead of wasting our time on figuring out who the jester is.

Or we could just try and catch scum anyway. I think thats what most of us are currently trying to do, but this discussion is immensely distracting.
And a personal note here: If you are town, and want me to catch scum, intentionally setting out to f*** up my scumdar by making this into a personal issue, is extremely short-sighted, and yup, you guessed it- detrimental to the welfare of the town.

BM

*oh and for those who clearly havent been reading, ill say it a 3rd time. I'm not the Jester. 0.o

[Battle Mage]

You know the really sad part is that we're spending an inordinate amount of time on the Jester when we really need to be looking for scum. Currently, GS and BM are my favorites for lynch today just from the distraction they've caused from our true purpose- finding and lynching scum.

Inconsistency much?
You criticise GS and myself for distracting the town from hunting scum, when the point we've been making is that we should stop wasting time with the Jester, and GET ON WITH HUNTING SCUM.
Suspecting the two most controversial players seems like a very easy option.

Unvote, Vote: QuickBen

@GS- im not following post 306. How would lynching you allow the Jester to win?

CKD is making an astounding amount of sense... :O

BM

[Battle Mage]

EBWOP

@BM: Elaborate on #277. Explain to us how you think mith's and Pooky's views differ.

If you'd read Pooky's comments, you'd see that he explained how the Jester claiming helped the scum. Mith on the other hand, was keen to promote how the Jester claiming hurt them.

BM

[Greasy Spot]

@GS- im not following post 306. How would lynching you allow the Jester to win? BM

I simply meant if they lynched me on the 1st day, then the Jester would win.

[wolfcrier]

Have you read any posts GS and yes I know what hypocritical means why would I say it if I didn't know what it ment. Lets get this day over with.

[RossWilliam]

this little post stuck out to me, BM has already answered the question...why would it make him more scummy if he doesnt answer it again? Seems like you just wanted a reason to say something and look town here. please explain.

All right, I'll explain, even though it's not really too complex. You don't think it looks scummy to dance around a question evasively? Well, I do. is that enough explanation?

And I would think of something very clever to acronymize BM into, but a wise old guru once told me don't feed the trolls.

And thirdly, all this second-place or third place crap is ridiculous. I feel like we're a bunch of three year olds arguing over a four-square game. Come on people. And finally, can we lease get more detailed arguments than just "A" is "A" or "X" or "X". really, people, Bullcrap is Bullcrap. rant over.

[MeMe]

Dark Ermac's two posts are

extremely

questionable. He claims connection issues for yesterday -- but what about the other seven silent days? And the "damnit" following quickly -- as though he didn't know with his first post that he'd been replaced but figured it out just a minute later. Weirdness.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

I'm also getting curious about Fletcher since I'm almost positive I saw him reading the site yesterday afternoon and was fully expecting to see a resulting post. So...did my eyes deceive me, Fletch? If not, why no post?

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Because something can both hurt and help the mafia.

It hurts them in the sense that the town knows one person who is not mafia for sure.

It helps them in the sense that they know one person who they don't have to use a nightkill on.

Please read our sentences in context instead of taking them out of context and trying to make it look like they contradict each other. It's craplogic, it's stupid and it's definitely not protown.

[mith]

We also don't want to give too much away to the Mafia. They may not know the correct strategy for this type of game.

Overall, the Jester claiming now is a clear advantage for the Town and Jester, and a disadvantage for the Mafia even with perfect play from them - but if they don't know what they're doing, it's even worse.

I need to look through later at the responses, see who has been trying to mislead the Jester into staying hidden. And also see who the slackers are who haven't placed a non-random vote yet.

[Iammars]

I'm also getting curious about Fletcher since I'm almost positive I saw him reading the site yesterday afternoon and was fully expecting to see a resulting post. So...did my eyes deceive me, Fletch? If not, why no post?

This is one of the reasons that I'm glad that no one from my family is on this site.

[Fletcher]

GAH! Was going to post last night and got sidetracked and lost my post.

In summary:
I'm not the Jester, but I do agree with the Jester needing to come out as soon as possible.

Don't think Greasy Spot is very scummy, because, like Dani Banani, I thought the same things at Thespival.

I like the idea of the Cult of the Couch not using his power until later in the game when we can have a more strong idea as to what effects it will have.

I don't think Iammars slip was very scummy either.

I would agree but the 1 doubt that keeps coming into my mind is that if I say I'm going to recruit a scum, then the scum NK's me. Now you know who a scum wold be, but theres also huge WIFOM there......I'd like to hear more opinions

There is no avoiding this since everything is public anyways. Or am I missing the point?

@ALL If you lynch me the Jester will win and the Town will be well on its way to losing.

?

In response to Battle Mage's view of the jester situation: You state that you are playing in a legendary field of players, but you seem to have no respect for their experience or thoughts. This is shown through your blatant denial of the whole plan. This is doubly shocking when EVERYONE from Thespival playing in this game agrees with the plan. Do you think we are all idiots? Do you think we are all lying? Are we all mafia? I'm going to have to guess no. As I said before I understand the confusion on this topic, but to not back off after so much opposition is questionable at the very least.

Vote: Battle Mage

[Monkey]

Just caught up in my other games, I'm off to read and then post in this one .. 13 pages may take a while.

[Monkey]

I would like all townies to say "I understand that the Jester should come out, but I am not the Jester".

I understand that the Jester should come out, but I am not the Jester

I don't think the CotC should recruit unless consulted with the rest of the town first.

Not even worth an fos for Iammars at this point, it seems that the town concludes it as being a slip.

And I would think of something very clever to acronymize BM into, but a wise old guru once told me don't feed the trolls.

I'm a nurse in RL and there's only one thing that comes to mind for me when I see those initials .. Had to make that known btw.

I'd really love to post a pbp analysis of this game, but I just don't think it's really worth the time. It's been stated over and over why it'd be a good idea for the jester to reveal him/herself and honestly if that person hasn't done it by now, I'd be surprised if they did reveal at this point.

I can't say that I would support the greasy spot wagon for any reason other then he stated to get him out of this hell hole .. It's ok to disagree with the majority I think, add flavour to a game.

I think that more players would be active if the topic wasn't revolved around primarily one issue, that being the jester. I will state for the record though that I agree for the jester to come out, but it's not like we can make him/her.

I'm find laughter in a lot of Battle Mage's post personally and haven't seen anything "scummy" from them. He's stated that he wasn't the jester, which is enough for me.

It's hard for all the players in this game (especially with the amount of players in it) to all agree on the same point. I don't label anyone scum for being anti-outing of the jester, especiallly when the've replied that they are not the jester.

Oh and Mith, I'd love to place a vote being that it's almost the end of the 1st week here but I don't have enough reasoning for that just yet (being my first post and all). At this point the only vote I'd place would be on Greasy Spot, but only due to his request.

[Battle Mage]

GAH! Was going to post last night and got sidetracked and lost my post.

In summary:
I'm not the Jester, but I do agree with the Jester needing to come out as soon as possible.

Don't think Greasy Spot is very scummy, because, like Dani Banani, I thought the same things at Thespival.

I like the idea of the Cult of the Couch not using his power until later in the game when we can have a more strong idea as to what effects it will have.

I don't think Iammars slip was very scummy either.

I would agree but the 1 doubt that keeps coming into my mind is that if I say I'm going to recruit a scum, then the scum NK's me. Now you know who a scum wold be, but theres also huge WIFOM there......I'd like to hear more opinions

There is no avoiding this since everything is public anyways. Or am I missing the point?

@ALL If you lynch me the Jester will win and the Town will be well on its way to losing.

?

In response to Battle Mage's view of the jester situation: You state that you are playing in a legendary field of players, but you seem to have no respect for their experience or thoughts. This is shown through your blatant denial of the whole plan. This is doubly shocking when EVERYONE from Thespival playing in this game agrees with the plan. Do you think we are all idiots? Do you think we are all lying? Are we all mafia? I'm going to have to guess no. As I said before I understand the confusion on this topic, but to not back off after so much opposition is questionable at the very least.

Vote: Battle Mage

Try metagaming. Thats just how i play. Hell ive even said it twice in this game alone. I dont get pushed around by people. Furthermore, its not unlikely that this crew from Thespival actually has a motive for lying. But then, of course you probably havent considered the possibility that the whole thing is a setup designed to out and eliminate the Jester. Either way, apparently im not the only one who feels this way, as the Jester STILL HAS NOT CLAIMED, and Mith is still my prime suspect for that role.

Out of interest, why do you find GS's criticisms of the logic of those at Thespival to be reasonable, and mine to be inherently scummy, despite admitting that YOU also shared those views when you were at Thespival?

BM

[Battle Mage]

this little post stuck out to me, BM has already answered the question...why would it make him more scummy if he doesnt answer it again? Seems like you just wanted a reason to say something and look town here. please explain.

All right, I'll explain, even though it's not really too complex. You don't think it looks scummy to dance around a question evasively? Well, I do. is that enough explanation?

And I would think of something very clever to acronymize BM into, but a wise old guru once told me don't feed the trolls.

And thirdly, all this second-place or third place crap is ridiculous. I feel like we're a bunch of three year olds arguing over a four-square game. Come on people. And finally, can we lease get more detailed arguments than just "A" is "A" or "X" or "X". really, people, Bullcrap is Bullcrap. rant over.

Lol, i didnt realise the BM-haters society had formed and now had its own thread on MS.
Dont you kids have anything better to do? Play mafia maybe?

BM

[MeMe]

Furthermore, its not unlikely that this crew from Thespival actually has a motive for lying. But then, of course you probably havent considered the possibility that the whole thing is a setup designed to out and eliminate the Jester.

I'm part of the "crew from Thespival" -- and the only way we could all have a motive for lying would be if we were a 9+ person group tasked with lying in this game, and anyone who believes that is "not unlikely" is either paranoid or purposely spewing crap.

Same goes for your "setup" suggestion -- but, even if you truly believed it was designed by the majority of the players as a trap, why attempt to debunk it? Why not just allow it to play out and see if he/she falls for it? And, to be clear, I think it's correct jester play to come forward, but I don't get why anyone who might

truly

believe otherwise wouldn't also consider it anti-town to give the jester strategy tips.