Mini 1875: Pine's Death Trap Post Game - Town win!

RadiantCowbells · Post Post #2175 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:26 pm

VOTE: Nancy

I believe this is the right lynch today.

Fro99er · Post Post #2176 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:27 pm

In post 2173, RadiantCowbells wrote:But scum could have a blocker

That's what a jailkeeper is

Grendel · Post Post #2177 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:27 pm

In post 2160, Fro99er wrote:
In post 2159, Fro99er wrote:
In post 2155, RadiantCowbells wrote:can we just lynch LUV or something
No.

Because when he flips town you'll just accuse me of being scum who knew he was town
I can't win either way.

Either I'm scum who knew he was town or I'm his scumbuddy if he flips scum.

Just lynch me

Like if Fro99er is scum he is doing a major disservice to his buddy with this suicidal behavior. I'd like to think a scum Frog wouldn't force himself to be lynched as scum when it'd force another scum to play the rest of the game solo.

Unless his partner is stationed to go deep or something?

RadiantCowbells wrote:BP is an unprovable usually scum claim. And unless it goes to someone dangerous it is usually not a huge deal for scum.

I figured it would be a -meh- role in a closed game.

Hmm

RadiantCowbells · Post Post #2178 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:29 pm

It's a very meh role in a closed game. Fro99er doesn't really understand what he's talking about. Some NRG reviewers would block it on policy because of the edge case where it goes to someone who lynches 3 scum in a row while eating 3 nightkills but it's overall not considered very powerful. In a jailkeeper set up I'd even say that it's meant to be negative utility; make it unclear whether the JK blocked anyone.

Grendel · Post Post #2179 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:30 pm

In post 2175, RadiantCowbells wrote:VOTE: Nancy

I believe this is the right lynch today.

I think you could be right

nancy · Post Post #2180 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:32 pm

You don't want me in LyLo RC? I'm hurt.

RadiantCowbells · Post Post #2181 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:32 pm

I don't want your slot in LyLo. JJD may have set it up but the way he was only pushing back against you makes me feel like you're his scumbuddy hard bussing him.

Fro99er · Post Post #2182 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:33 pm

This is dumb

Fro99er · Post Post #2183 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:33 pm

In post 2181, RadiantCowbells wrote:I don't want your slot in LyLo. JJD may have set it up but the way he was only pushing back against you makes me feel like you're his scumbuddy hard bussing him.

And then who is scum with Nancy?

RadiantCowbells · Post Post #2184 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:35 pm

Basically anyone could be.

nancy · Post Post #2185 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:36 pm

RC it's fine if you just want to mislynch me for PoE but really, you've suspected everyone except Akarin today, the paranoia is eating you alive.

nancy · Post Post #2186 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:41 pm

Anyway I don't have any site meta to back this up but I don't bus. I don't like bussing I think it's a shitty gimmick people use when they don't have the skill to play scum properly and the current bus-heavy meta is something I could really do without.

RadiantCowbells · Post Post #2187 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:42 pm

In post 2186, nancy wrote:Anyway I don't have any site meta to back this up but I don't bus. I don't like bussing I think it's a shitty gimmick people use when they don't have the skill to play scum properly and the current bus-heavy meta is something I could really do without.

I am offended at that suggestion.

nancy · Post Post #2188 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:49 pm

Well I'm sorry it's my opinion

Bussing is only required IMO if you don't have the ability to outmaneouvre and misdirect Town with pure skill play and coordination. You shouldn't ever need to kill your own teammate in order to win. Aiming for a perfect win in every single game is something that imo people don't do enough. They're content to ride it to LyLo and hopefully win there by PoE. This is why there are so many lurkers on MS. They're both related as I see it. But I'm a newbshit so I really don't have any idea what I'm talking about.

nancy · Post Post #2189 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:52 pm

You seriously need to resolve this paranoia otherwise you're going to be completely paralyzed when it comes to LyLo.

RadiantCowbells · Post Post #2190 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:53 pm

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=61784

Not skilled play / coordination? Bussing is hard to do well, y'know.

Grendel · Post Post #2191 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:56 pm

I've never bussed in any of my scum games either. It always seemed to work against what is supposed to be a team game. That's not to say that if I thought a bus could win me the game that I wouldn't take it though. But if everybody just "didn't bus", then town would mop up almost every game. Because a scum wagon would clear everybody on it.

Which wouldn't be fair, or fun

Fro99er · Post Post #2192 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:56 pm

In post 2184, RadiantCowbells wrote:Basically anyone could be.

VCA doesn't support this

nancy · Post Post #2193 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:03 pm

Fro99er how did you get a scumread on JJD so quickly after replacing in? Your first read is "JJD is probably scum" in your 3rd ISO post. 1433

Why did you choose to give a running commentary as you were doing your catchup read? 1431, 1432, 1434

Why did you claim in 1444 when there was no pressure on your slot?

Why did you focus so heavily on your read of LUV? You didn't really go into significant detail on other slots.

nancy · Post Post #2194 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:08 pm

In post 2190, RadiantCowbells wrote:http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=61784

Not skilled play / coordination? Bussing is hard to do well, y'know.

I take your point, but none of this would exist if bussing wasn't so prevalent. Turning bussing into coordinated team play is necessary adaptation to the meta, it's the meta I don't like.

In post 2191, Grendel wrote:I've never bussed in any of my scum games either. It always seemed to work against what is supposed to be a team game. That's not to say that if I thought a bus could win me the game that I wouldn't take it though. But if everybody just "didn't bus", then town would mop up almost every game. Because a scum wagon would clear everybody on it.

Which wouldn't be fair, or fun

If scum is getting run up then the scumteam has fucked up somewhere and that's what should be addressed. Bussing is just "welp, we played bad, guess we better kill each other to hide the fact". Obviously you have to mix up your meta every now and then to keep Town healthily paranoid but there's a bus in every single game I'm in it seems like and it's just ridiculous.

Fro99er · Post Post #2195 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:17 pm

In post 2193, nancy wrote:Fro99er how did you get a scumread on JJD so quickly after replacing in? Your first read is "JJD is probably scum" in your 3rd ISO post. 1433

How many times do i have to say this.

I've played with town Jar 3 times when i was town so i've had to figure out his town game.

This wasn't it. He doesn't give shallow reads like he did on RC.

Town Jar figures out if RC could have fake claimed D1 as town. Period.

Fro99er · Post Post #2196 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:21 pm

In post 2193, nancy wrote:Why did you choose to give a running commentary as you were doing your catchup read? 1431, 1432, 1434

Because I replaced in and was giving my thoughts as I read them

Fro99er · Post Post #2197 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:25 pm

In post 2193, nancy wrote:Why did you claim in 1444 when there was no pressure on your slot?

Because if I claim and it doesn't jive with my predecessors then that's not good. So I basciallybclaimed right away to show you all that that if my predecessor claimed that it jives with mine

And if they didn't then me claiming VT doesn't hurt town

Why did you claim VT so soon after replacing in?

Fro99er · Post Post #2198 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:26 pm

In post 2193, nancy wrote:Why did you focus so heavily on your read of LUV? You didn't really go into significant detail on other slots.

Because I developed a strong read there.

I've already said why

nancy · Post Post #2199 (ISO) » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:34 pm

I thought I was at L-1.

I'm sorry to go over this shit again I'm just trying to figure out if this just paranoia or if there's actual scum motivation to what I think I'm seeing. Work with me?

Claiming kinda does hurt Town because you're giving scumteam information for NKs.

Have you played without anyone else besides RC?