Micro 680: Matrix6 No Reveal (Game Over!?)

[shannon]

Dammit I wanted to be first.

[shannon]

VOTE: Echo Vision one of the few names on the list that I don't recognise

[shannon]

It would seem so. I'm about to have a Big Snooze (it's almost bed time), I'll see you all in the AM.

[shannon]

Yes it's the second time I've run in to that today, It's half ten in the evening here on #westside Straya

[shannon]

Well, that was an exciting read!

[shannon]

alisae why aren't you spamming posts i thought that's what you normally do? or is that just in larges

THIS MAN HAD LIKE 300 POSTS IN DAY 1 OF OUR ONE GAME

This is my experience of Alisae too.

[shannon]

I know this is random voting stage but if I had to pick scum right now it would be Shannon. I think she is trying too hard to act casual and talk about things that don't have anything to do with this game. Contrast that to Transcend, who asks about pineapple pizza (delicious!) but in a jokey kind of way that doesn't look like he is trying to convince us that he is harmless.

I think Echo is rude and shouldn't have said that to Alisae. Hopefully they are friends and this is kind-hearted banter.

VOTE: Shannon

*she*

You sure do read a lot in to two or three posts

[shannon]

alisae why aren't you spamming posts i thought that's what you normally do? or is that just in larges

THIS MAN HAD LIKE 300 POSTS IN DAY 1 OF OUR ONE GAME

This is my experience of Alisae too.

OMGAWD THAT'S MY EXPERIENCE PLAYING WITH MYSELF AS WELL!

We don't need to hear about your special alone time

[shannon]

Ok Alisae is caughtscum

Can you believe it?

I caught scum 3 pages into the game!

Too bad we won't see his red role PM until post game.

I'm not so sure - I think *at this point* Ali seems authentic, if a little muddled. I also think maybe, just maybe, Occam's Razor applies and the reason my wagon fell apart is because it was pretty much an RVS wagon.

Aris is town yay

This one I agree with. I also TR you, FWIW.

[shannon]

@Hamster This little comment is all I felt I needed to say, because I don't generally see RVS wagons as particularly worth commenting on. But to expand: I think you were being very reachy in your interpretation of my game start. When we have played together more you will get to know my 'quirks', social awkwardness being one of them. I don't know what else you want me to say? Tunnel away, my friend.

I know this is random voting stage but if I had to pick scum right now it would be Shannon. I think she is trying too hard to act casual and talk about things that don't have anything to do with this game. Contrast that to Transcend, who asks about pineapple pizza (delicious!) but in a jokey kind of way that doesn't look like he is trying to convince us that he is harmless.

I think Echo is rude and shouldn't have said that to Alisae. Hopefully they are friends and this is kind-hearted banter.

VOTE: Shannon

*she*

You sure do read a lot in to two or three posts

[shannon]

Also another thing that concerns me is that Echo was more worried about PP and not Dont_Vote_me

that was just cause he hasn't confirmed yet so Im assuming he didn't even know the game started. penguin however confirmed with his role so he knew the game was starting soon.

IMHO it's worse for someone to confirm and then lurk than it is for them to not confirm.

Sorry to be brief this morning, busy elsewhere, will post properly this evening.

[shannon]

UNVOTE:

Actually nvm

21 looks a bit like over analyzation

VOTE: the hamster

retweet

VOTE: The Hamster Guy With a Cute Ass Picture

Transcend it looks to me like you left my wagon as some kind of reaction test. You don't strike me as the sort of person to say 'never mind' after L-1ing someone on a page 1 wagon. So, did you get what you were after? What did you learn from the way that people joined/didn't join my wagon?

I don't see what's wrong with the overanalyzation.
I think they just want to leave RVS as early as possible so they're town for that to me.

Their join date:
Joined: January 25, 2017

I checked this out, and it's right - Hammy joined on Jan 25 and this is his first game on site. The thing is, I don't think he's new altogether.

Alisae, you say you think he wanted to leave RVS ASAP. This is not how newbie town thinks, IMHO. In all my newbie games (and I mean, with actual newbies to mafia, not people with off site experience), people have been unsure 1) about what RVS even is, and 2) how on earth you actually get from RVS to getting reads on people and voting. It's also weird that Hammy would pick a non-newbie game to start on site, unless he has experience.

I think you are trying to get us to view Hammy in a way that assumes he doesn't know what he's doing. I think he knows what he's doing. I think I know what *you're* doing, too, and you're not being very subtle about it.

Their join date:
Joined: January 25, 2017

So what

The post was bad

Why are you defending this slot

They want to start analyzing things to get us out of RVS.
I don't see how getting us out of RVS is a bad thing.
Plus I figured it was the kind of post that would get scum to jump onto them like dogs to a bone.

Alisae how was Hammy's post designed to get scum to jump on him?

And, why would scum jump on Hammy's post? To try to derail my lynch (not happening, I'm town so why would they?) or to try to lynch Hammy for it (why would they, when I'm at L-1?).

Give the hamster a chance to defend themselves.

No I'm just looking at it from a newb!scum perspective.
If hamster was newb!scum he would make more time into deciding if he wanted to put shannon at L-2.
I feel they would be more careful about it.

How would I know that it's an alt? And even if I did guess correctly on it being an alt, how would I know who the alt belonged to?

At this point I rescind my previous statement that Alisae is genuine. 'Give the hamster a chance to defend themselves' from like one or two votes, vs. happily having me at L-1 when I've announced that I've gone to bed and you know I'm in a totally different time zone. Weren't so keen to give me a chance, were you?

How do you know what newb!scum will do? Shouldn't newb town also think really hard before L-2ing someone? How could NewbieTownHamster be so prescient as to try to move us out of RVS, yet so thoughtless as to L-2 a townie?

Also, it was you who originally put me at L-2. It went Karnos (11), Transcend (12), Alisae (14), then Transcend changed (18), Hamster (21), Transcend (22). Why would Hammy be afraid of of following your lead to L-2 me again?

[shannon]

I just don't think this is alisae's town game...

VOTE: Alisae

I think you're right.

VOTE: Alisae

[shannon]

I think I'm at L-1.
Claiming VT

That's a nice safe claim for scum, good job.

[shannon]

I think I'm at L-1.
Claiming VT

That's a nice safe claim for scum, good job.

It's better then not claiming.

Uh

Why not deny being scum here

Why deny the other part to what shannon said?

Ding ding ding we have a winner!

All aboard Alisae please. ASAP.

[shannon]

^^What I think is that Alisae is making excuses for your play (and sorry for calling you he, Hammy) by saying 'OMG Hamster is new, nothing to see here!'. When in fact you are not new. You know when you are saying scummy things, and so does Alisae. At the moment I have you pegged as a team.

[shannon]

But - if I am wrong about your teamdom, it's Alisae who is scum.

[shannon]

Alisae is caught scum

Just hammer

^^What I think is that Alisae is making excuses for your play (and sorry for calling you he, Hammy) by saying 'OMG Hamster is new, nothing to see here!'. When in fact you are not new. You know when you are saying scummy things, and so does Alisae. At the moment I have you pegged as a team.

Also your scumread on me is based on this association which is dumb, because you're looking for associations and/or distancing before a flip, AND flips aren't revealed this game. It's silly!
How are you supposed to look for association when FLIPS DON'T EXIST.

[shannon]

Somehow I posted that without typing anything.

@Transcend Alisae is L-2

@Alisae what strategy would you recommend, then?

[shannon]

Just hunting scum.
I can't associate myself with anyone or distance myself with anyone because I'm town.

1) I am hunting scum, I happen to think I've caught one in you. Hammy looking bad is just a bonus
2) Town can totally associate themselves with others. That's what happens when you form a town block. Or when you investigate someone and get a clear on them.

Penguin is PowerTown

[shannon]

Just came to say i've gotta do a wedding set up, attend it, then pack it down over the next couple of days so I won't be here much. I don't think I need to VLA but who knows how this shit goes.
Happy with where my vote is, let's lynch Alisae.

[shannon]

You have been at L-1 for awhile now. No scummy quick-hammer. Maybe you are scum. Maybe scum is playing the long con. Maybe both scum are already on your wagon.

This post sucks

Merry Christmas, Alisae.

VOTE: karnos

Maybe scum is avoiding voting because they don't want to bus their buddy who is already at L-1 or L-2, so early in the game... I can see that.

VOTE: Karnos

[shannon]

Back! I've only read just the last two pages, I'll go back further later on.

Such Mafiascum
Much dayvig
Very scum

Wow

Karnos come on buddy

Happy birthday Transcend

Nah, you are missing the point. I know my role. But it's not reveal on flip, so what shred of difference does it make to claim? I claim, scum calls my claim a lie and lynches me, no flip. Eventually the game ends and my alignment is revealed but scum already won.

Claiming isn't a useful play in this setup.

Agree, for now. I think at some point though, claiming is going to be necessary if this is going to be anything more than a crapshoot. (Not to underestimate the ability of others to get reads, but I tend to rely a bit on VCA as well). Also, should we be considering no lynching as part of the strategy? Scum gets such an advantage from this setup, there's got to be some strategy open to us that's not just 'lynch and wait until the mod declares it over'.

[shannon]

Reviewing the vote counts these past couple of days.

I think Echo is town based on the fake hammer of Alisae in 258. I've never seen that kind of reaction test done by scum, and I don't have any other good reason to scum read him.

I also want to point everyone's attention to these vote counts. Clearly there is something going on when two wagons in a row consist of {Echo, me, Transcend, Penguin} and our current wagon is on one of these and features none of these.

I'd tell you my thoughts about this but I don't want to lead people in to a certain response. So please, everyone, what do you see here, if anything?


VOTE COUNT 1.6
Alisae (4):

EchoVision, shannon, Transcend, PenguinPower

: L1
Echo Vision (2): Aristophanes, Alisae
shannon (1): Prof Hamm T Smiggles III

Not Voting (2): BTD6_Maker, karnos

VOTE COUNT 1.8
Karnos (4):

Transcend, PenguinPower, shannon, EchoVision

: L1
Echo Vision (2): Aristophanes, Alisae
shannon (1): Prof Hamm T Smiggles III

Not Voting (2): BTD6_Maker, karnos


Compare with the current vote count

VOTE COUNT 1.10

Echo Vision

(4): Aristophanes, Alisae, karnos, Prof Hamm T Smiggles III : L1
Karnos (1):

shannon

Alisae (1):

Transcend

Not Voting (3): BTD6_Maker,

PenguinPower, EchoVision

[shannon]

Also:

I think Echo is town based on the fake hammer of Alisae in 258

with no unvote. YaY!

what do you mean with no unvote? Shannon's not voting me??

Penguin

oh nice I'm getting lynched isn't that fun

well I'm a 1shot BP so if anyone claims cop doc or tracker lynch the fuck out of them later k thnx <3

Glad you claimed, now we have a starting point to work from.

All this stuff you post below is spot on. Spoilers because it ends up being so much.

Spoiler:

Karnos should claim now or explicitly state that he will not be claiming. I also intend to hammer, so if Alisae backs off we still should get a claim and some more discussion before we go to night.

Here you say it's fine for him to state that he's not claiming

VOTE: Karnos

L-1

Karnos should claim if someone intends to hammer. I understand that this setup makes it impossible to verify until the end of the game, but forcing claims could give town PRs a more solid read on the person who is forced to claim, based on whether or not such a claim is possible given what the PRs know is possible with the set-up. I'm not saying for example that if Karnos fake-claims cop and there is a real town cop in this game that they should counter-claim, but at least the cop in that situation would know 100% that Karnos is scum.

but HERE you say that he should claim and dont give him the option to not claim anymore?

VOTE: Hammy

[shannon]

I garentee you they are going to say that their name starts with an A and ends with lisae

the issue is I don't think that you two are scum together...

For the sake of a new perspective, let's say they're not a team.

Hammy looks worse to me than Ali does, hence my vote there. All that spoilered stuff above adds up to a pretty good case. And I really don't think she's new, at all, and I think she's been playing on that in a way that is dishonest, if not a scum tell exactly.

Alisae if it's not you, where should I be looking for scum? (Don't say at myself, or we're just going to go around in circles). And what do you think of Hammy?

[shannon]

Penguin, Aristo, neither of you are voting. What's the go as far as you see it?

FWIW Alisae I can't really see what's scummy about Penguin. If you've connected some dots though I'd love to see it.

Transcend is a bit of a mystery to me, by which I mean I don't really know how to read him in any game ever. Current strategy is to treat him as though he's town unless he remains suspiciously alive later on.

[shannon]

Transcend wagon is good, this resistance implies we hit the scum jackpot.

Or it just shows that people think he's town? Can you explain why you think resistance = scum jackpot?

[shannon]

^^Hammy you've made me go back and check out what happened there.

@Penguin if you started to town read Karnos like you said, why did you justify your unvote by saying you wanted to hammer him? More to the point, why *didn't* you hammer him once Hammy put him back at L-1?

@Transcend why the unvote? If Karnos is scum, who cares whether or not Hammy is bussing?



(All the relevant quotes in spoilers because wall)

Spoiler:

Vote Count 1.9

Karnos (3): PenguinPower, shannon, EchoVision
Echo Vision (2): Aristophanes, Alisae
shannon (1): Prof Hamm T Smiggles III

Not Voting (3): BTD6_Maker, karnos, Transcend

With 9 players alive it takes 5 votes to lynch.

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2017-02-12 09:24:49)

karnos might actually be town. He usually uses bad logic to get out of lynches as scum...not seeing that now.

UNVOTE:
Nah. I wanna hammer it.

UNVOTE:

you think town are on your wagon? who's scum that's off of it?

Echois probably scum. Maybe Prof Hamm T Smiggles III or BTD as a lurking scum partner.

I was thinking penguin might be scum, but I don't think scum penguin would 362

VOTE: karnos

you ith'd Alisae yet you gave these 3 bullshit scumreads lol

L-1

pedit

L-2

I will hammer one of Alisae, Echo, or karnos. No one else.

I also want to hammer, so I don't wanna vote right now.

VOTE: EchoVision

VOTE: Karnos

L-1

Karnos should claim if someone intends to hammer. I understand that this setup makes it impossible to verify until the end of the game, but forcing claims could give town PRs a more solid read on the person who is forced to claim, based on whether or not such a claim is possible given what the PRs know is possible with the set-up. I'm not saying for example that if Karnos fake-claims cop and there is a real town cop in this game that they should counter-claim, but at least the cop in that situation would know 100% that Karnos is scum.

I think you hammered

Be more careful next time

Nvm pp unvoted I'm dumb and stupid

UNVOTE:

Hamm do you even fos karnos

[shannon]

Five days left. Can we start to consolidate, at least on the 'no' list?

Today I'm not voting:

Echo (claimed 1 shot BP, not voting a claimed PR D1)
Transcend (because I can't get a read there D1, and I think it's worth the risk/reward having him around until it starts to look suss)
Aristo (because I haven't seen anything at all worth voting)

The three above I won't hammer if they get put at L-1 today.

I would strongly prefer to lynch Hammy at this point.

I am up in the air about these others:

Ali (reconsidering my strong scum read, someone made a good point that they're unlikely to be the team with Hammy and I am feeling really strongly about Hammy)
Penguin (reconsidering my strong town read, his early D1 unvote doesn't make sense in context)
Karnos (mixed feelings, lean scum)
BTD (can't get a read - you confirmed your replacement in on post 209, but it took you til 482 to post again. What gives?)

[shannon]

Can someone explain to me what's scummy about saying I won't vote someone who I have no reason to scum read?

[shannon]

Take the context of my whole post. Aristo is on a list of people I am not voting today. He is on that list because I haven't seen him do anything that's worth a vote. I could have added that I town read him but I thought that was implied.

[shannon]

Can I remind you of this, Ali and Aristo? Perhaps you should read my phrasing as charitably as you did Alis's?

He wants to help me bus.
Cool.

Did you actually just claim scum here!?

I don't think you've been bad by play, but geez! What am I supposed to think here.

Ari I was trying to convey that PP was bussing but when I posted it phrasing was bad.

Acceptable actually, I totally misphrase things all the time!

Alisae, I really don't think you're scum. Who do you think has the worst (by that I mean scummiest) push against you and why? I could totally see scum capitalizing on this wagon.

[shannon]

Aristo (because I haven't seen anything at all worth voting)

You're scum for this one read.
This read is legitmately saying "I haven't found an excuse to jump on them yet."
You're not looking for scum, you're looking for people to jump on.

I think Shannon might be scum but I'm not sold that this is a scumtell. But I also think there could be a hint of "being caught for the wrong reason" in Shannon's follow-up. More damning is her lack of pressure on me, who she is voting, and lack of follow-up on 413 and 516.

I want Karnos and BTD to give reads on Shannon.

OK then, why do *you* think I'm scum? Let's get it all out of the way now so then we can move on.

[shannon]

Aristo (because I haven't seen anything at all worth voting)

You're scum for this one read.
This read is legitmately saying "I haven't found an excuse to jump on them yet."
You're not looking for scum, you're looking for people to jump on.

I think Shannon might be scum but I'm not sold that this is a scumtell. But I also think there could be a hint of "being caught for the wrong reason" in Shannon's follow-up. More damning is her lack of pressure on me, who she is voting, and lack of follow-up on 413 and 516.

I want Karnos and BTD to give reads on Shannon.

Regarding the follow up: I'm still mulling over the stuff I mentioned in 413, believe me. I am watching to see how my wagon develops now as I think it's going to hold some answers.

As for 413, thank you for reminding me that Transcend hasn't replied yet. I got distracted by the impending end of day and also by this rubbish wagon that is appearing on me. Interesting that you peg me for not following up, and not Transcend for not answering the question, though.

[shannon]

UNVOTE:

I am not sure about transcend. He still may be scum, but I don't like BTD on the wagon and I don't see any advantage to pushing a wagon that is going nowhere, apparently nobody else even wants to consider voting him so it's not going to happen.

I am also unsure about Transcend. I consistently struggle to read him, especially D1. He has a reputation for being an excellent scum hunter, and also for being the sort of person whose scumminess becomes evident in later days only. That's why I'm not interested in wagoning him today. If we lose him, we lose big; if he's scum then it should become obvious later.

[shannon]

I'm the jail-keeper.

Now let's lynch VOTE: Karnos

I don't believe you.

[shannon]

lynch someone jk me tonight thnx

This only works if you believe Hammy's claim. I don't believe his claim.

[shannon]

Do you really want me to say it?

[shannon]

I always make a mess of this. I'm either too obvious, too quick to claim, or generally cock it up like I have now. I should have just not said anything and come back with a result tomorrow, but what are the chances scum would send Hammy to do the kill?

Hammy is faking JK. I am the tracker. I hope Echo was faking BP earlier because that means there's a doc and I still have a chance to give a result.
For the love of god if you're the doctor don't claim, just protect me and we will lynch Hammy or Echo tomorrow.

Sorry I screwed this up

[shannon]

I've never been in this position before and I wasn't quite sure what to do! For future reference should I have shut up and pretended to believe Hammy or ???

PEdit: I can't see how I'm going to be alive tomorrow. Maybe if scum decide to play Super Wifom I suppose but I probably shouldn't comment on that. If I am here tomorrow, I don't know what I can even say to prove that my claim is real. So scum get me either way, via NK tonight or lynch tomorrow Sorry

[shannon]

If I can say something good I am actually quite pleased that I've finally managed to peg a scum on D1!!! Yeah!! (Assuming someone actually hammers Hammy)

Transcend town for what shoudl now be obvious reasons

Karnos probably town for hamster's attempt to push a wagon on him late today, could have been a risky attempt at distancing by bussing but that's an outside chance at the moment.

Echo town for his claim which is consistent with mine, and also it makes no sense for scum to both fake claim. If he's town and fake claimed, that's perfect because it outed scum to fake claim an impossible role. (Really really outside chance that this was super wifom scum plan or that Hammy went rogue by fake claiming after echo did)

Scum within Aristo, Penguin, BTD, Alisae. Probably BTD based on lurking.

Sorry for typos not sure when hammer will come and wanted to get that out before night.

[shannon]

Sorry to cut and run I have to close the shop for EOD. Back in an hour hopefully, traffic being OK.

[shannon]

OK back, sorry for delay, power outages here with stupid rain

[shannon]

I don't know, it's dinner time here is it late where everyone else is?

[shannon]

With no flips, scum knows that if they lynch me today, they can take a shot at Echo tonight. Day 2 everyone is wifom'd (

did Echo get hit as BP or did Shannon make a save?

). Mislynch day 2. Night 2 they shoot and kill Echo. Day 3 is 2 scum V. 4 town and Shannon is just now being suspected of lying about being doc but probably doesn't get lynched until day 4.

Yeah I still wouldn't have CC'd as scum here in Shannon's shoes.

Shannon claimed tracker, not doc, so that first paragraph doesn't make sense. So the tracker fake-claim is perfect for scum right now as they have no more town PRs or any flips that will counterclaim them, and they can give fake results on their way to an easy win.

Town really should lynch outside me and Shannon today and sort between the two of us by who is alive day 4.

The bold part reads as though you forgot what I claimed and tried to fake a narrative around me being a doc. And then you tried to retcon that by saying 'that first paragraph doesn't make any sense'. Also, if I *was* a doc, there's a third option for a no-kill, which is a mafia roleblocker. But that's academic, I'm the tracker and you're caught.

Also, why the hell would town wait until D4 to get rid of you? How does it make any sense to 'sort between us' by seeing who is alive then? Surely you can see how that's a shit strategy; either of us could just *leave the other alive* and have this strategy be null? More to the point, if anyone agrees with this strategy you will just kill me tonight (but go wifom and blame someone else of course) and I can't give any results.

So the tracker fake-claim is perfect for scum right now as they have no more town PRs or any flips that will counterclaim them, and they can give fake results on their way to an easy win.

Town really should lynch outside me and Shannon today and sort between the two of us by who is alive day 4.

If we lynch outside me/Shannon, scum cannot shoot the jailkeeper tonight without losing Shannon tomorrow. Yes they can roleblocked me. The alternative if you lynch me is you can never know for certain if Shannon is fake-claiming tracker.

There. is. no. jailkeeper. You know that - that's why you're saying 'cannot shoot the jailkeeper' instead of 'cannot shoot me'. Not to mention, there is no roleblocker. There can't be one, given my role. You're trying to play on people's emotions. Just give in to the lynch. Even if you do miraculously swing this lynch off of you, there's no way in hell you're getting away with it D2 - Transcend and hopefully Echo will make sure of it and you can't night kill all three of us.

yeah but there's literally no reason for shannon to claim pr here.

literally none.

just self hammer imo, you're not escaping a lynch.

+1

You are caught. Just accept it and move on. It was clever of you to fake claim in order to draw out a CC, I will give you that.

[shannon]

Aristo, Penguin, BTD, can any of you end this day *please*?

[shannon]

In the unlikely event that I live tonight, should I tell you in advance who I am going to track? Or is that not a thing?

[shannon]

OK cool. No more posts from me until someone else does something.

[shannon]

Hey sorry I thought I would be dead.

I tracked Penguin, he went nowhere x

[shannon]

He didn't vote at the end of day, was what got it over the line. Was either going to be you, Aristo, dead guy or penguin. No point checking Transcend I don't think.

[shannon]

I don't have any reason to think Echo is faking, his role is consistent with mine and I don't see both scum fake claiming roles on D1. And if I checked him and he was scum wouldn't that be a bit unbelievable anyway, given that I claimed a PR and am alive? Better that town sort him out I think.

PEdit: Penguin wasn't voting anyone before he hammered. Thought it might have been scum trying for town cred or trying to prevent certain questions being asked.

[shannon]

VOTE: Shannon
Bullshit.
If you tracked Echo and found out he was fakeclaiming we would have won the game by now.
Town isn't concerned with being believable. Scum is.

Let's imagine that I had tracked Echo and said he fake claimed. Would you have believed it?

What if I tracked Echo and said he was conf town. Would that be believable?

What if I'd tracked you and cleared you?

I get that you don't trust me based on how yesterday went down and how I CCed Hammy. That's fine. I don't expect you to, I didn't even expect to live to claim a result.

You can either accept me and Penguin as town, and Echo as un CCed town, and proceed from there, or you can make up whatever story you think fits the narrative. Make scum NK me, don't do the work for them. Especially not when it would render any VCA of today pretty much useless.

[shannon]

But fine, if you so wish I'll save you for tomorrow on the condition that you lynch Trans with me.

Not happening.

Based on what I saw yesterday and what I found out, Echo + Trans + Penguin are all town. Including myself, that's four of seven players. If we lynch inside the three remaining *and only inside those three* we should end up with a town win. We are in a really good spot here, I'm not letting you stuff it up.

All we need to do to win is lynch the scummiest of the remaining three players, and do that every day until we win in 3P.

Killing any of us during the day ruins the system

. So I am going to insist that we lynch within {Ali, BTD, Aristo} until I get firm info to the contrary.

Cuz saying "Make scum NK me" sounds like "I am trying to avoid my lynch for as long as possible."

Of course I am trying to avoid being lynched, everyone tries to avoid being lynched, it's how the game is played.

Shannon, that pp check is basically a scum claim for me

Sigh

Why so? I asked whether I should say who I was going to check and you said not to.

But Ari! They're so fucking in sync. Like the dots are so fucking there.
Just because it's obvious doesn't mean it's ruled out.

Alisae ask yourself whether all these things make sense together:

I am scum under no pressure but decide to counter claim Hammy and draw attention to myself. Despite knowing that I will either be lynched D1 for fake claiming, lynched subsequent days for not being NKed.
Transcend is scum my buddy and backs my claim, drawing attention to himself. He does this knowing that I will be alive D2 and still thinks it's a good idea.

Your answer should be no, these things do not make sense together.

I know it's possible for Transcend to be scum with Hammy, but in that instance I don't see why he'd bus Hammy so hard. Why not just call BS on my claim instead, and direct his power lynching skills to me?

[shannon]

^^This is just how Alisae is.

[shannon]

@Trans I meant the general overexcited attitude, not the conf bias.

@Ali you are going to have to get with the program here or get lynched. Yes, I am being pushy but that is because you are being stubborn. Aristo, this goes for you too, stop following Ali's rubbish.

I am the tracker. That is why I CCed the fake JK claim. The JK claim was probably designed to draw out a CC, so it might have been silly of me to do it. Nonetheless, it's done now, and while I'm alive I intend to make the best of it. That involves not allowing you to lynch Echo, who is un-CCed, Penguin, who I saw go nowhere, or Transcend, who helped me to lynch Hammy. It definitely involves not allowing you to lynch me, since I am the only one at this point who can potentially clear or catch people.

If Transcend is scum it will become obvious later on when he is suspiciously alive. Same with me. I don't know how I can state this more clearly than what Transcend has already said.

If you lynch me today you are doing scum's work for them. Make them use a night kill on me. Make them choose between lynches in the scum pool today so that we can compare with D1 and D3. Don't make it easy for them by lynching the only person who can catch them out. Make them off my town team, one by one, until it's only two townies and one other person left. If they try to wiggle out of it with a no lynch or a no nightkill, so much the better for catching them.

To get this far I've had to CC and I've somehow survived a night. I'm not giving up on myself or on town just because my existence makes you feel uncomfortable. Scum have made it this way deliberately. Yes that is ATE, but you are clearly not listening to reason so I am going with feelings instead. I don't know what else I can say. But I am 100% not giving up just because you want me to.

[shannon]

I'm not voting anyone until I get some more input from the folks who are aren't saying much today.

I would also like to hear Penguin's take on things since he is Capital T Town.

[shannon]

If Trans and Echo want BTD, I'm fine with that. My town reads on those two are pretty much locked and it's just a numbers game for me.

Intent to hammer BTD

[shannon]

TL;DR Penguin, you're conf town, I've got a merry band of townies, we're working our way through the scum pool until I die. Then when I'm dead, the rest of you continue working through the scum pool, and town revels in the glory of victory.

[shannon]

if btd6 isn't scum and neither is Shannon then that rules out Trans and PP is conf Town..

that means tomorrow if Shannon dies tonight then we lynch aris imo.

Ari or Ali, makes no difference just make sure you stick to lynching within the scum pool. You are town, Trans is town, Penguin is Super Town. Eventually they are going to run short of people to kill and we are going to win. Just follow the plan.

He's doing the BTD things.
You know.
The things where he lurks.
Like, a lot.

I was really surprised to see BTD in this game because he was lurking so hard in the game I was in (it's now over) it wasn't funny. Anyway, good to know it's not just my experience. I'm happy to hammer him if no one else is. We can't take a non-player to LYLO, he's ripe for coming in and voting the wrong way.

I am willing to give Shannon the benefit of the doubt for today. If it really comes down to a choice between Alisae, Transcend and myself, I am willing to push Transcend. Transcend's ongoing push on me seems a lot like scum opportunism, pushing me because he knows I am an "easy mislynch" (even claiming I lurked in Open 660, when I had next to no Internet access). Alisae, meanwhile, is a Townread of mine. I am not willing to lynch here.

Transcend has given next to no reason for pushing me today apart from simply "we need to lynch someone other than Shannon".

VOTE: Transcend

This is the wagon I will push.

Dude really? Did you not read what happened above? We're not lynching Transcend, he is town as hell for D1. What possible case can you make on Transcend? And for what reason should I not just hammer you now?

[shannon]

I tracked you, you went nowhere. To me, you're as town as it gets.

If you choose not to trust me, that's your prerogative and a feature of the setup, but it's nonetheless true.

There's no way scum fake claims D1, so Hammy is as good as caught to me. If he wasn't, why wouldn't he just come out and say yeah I claimed for shits and giggles, don't take it seriously?

[shannon]

Hammer BTD. Or I will in the morning, whatever.

Onward to glorious victory!

[shannon]

It's no longer a hammer, he's at L-2 after Transcend voted.

[shannon]

VOTE: BTD

L-1

[shannon]

OK so it's nice that we're playing games and everything, but can we actually play *this* game? All this other shiz is distracting.

[shannon]

Why am I giving this guy a chance

This is my scum play to actually give someone a chance lol

Do not start with the WIFOM, please.

[shannon]

I know not funny

[shannon]

I'm sorry, I was wrong, it's gotta be Transcend. There's no other way I live until today, except he's cruising by on my town read of him and hoping that I get lynched today and then he can win in LYLO.

We are 4:1 today, if Transcend is lynched today and is scum, we win. If he is town, we are 2:1 tomorrow (assuming a kill goes through - I guess if they target Echo we could be 3:1). If we mislynch me today we are still 2:1 (or 3:1 if Echo is targeted) tomorrow. My main concern is what happens with Transcend there. If I get killed D3 and he lives through N3, he's just got to be the last scum, no doubts about it.

I feel like I shouldn't really say too much because I know that I can't be trusted based on the mechanics of the game at this point. I don't want what I say to be taken as trying to twist things against town or trying to play WIFOM or whatever. So yeah, questions if you have them (I'll be up in 8 hours, it's past bed time here) otherwise I'll just be around to look in in the morning.

Also FWIW I checked Echo, he went nowhere, totally totally confirmed town do not ever lynch him

Good luck town xo

[shannon]

VOTE: Transcend

[shannon]

Transcend why are you being so uptight here? If you're town, town still has tomorrow if we lynch you.

[shannon]

UNVOTE:

[shannon]

Sorry to scare you I didn't realise you were all here *right now* and Ali might hammer.

[shannon]

I don't know if i'd say 'time to hammer', I can see four posts within the same minute

[shannon]

Wasn't 864 directed at you?

[shannon]

Alisae if you don't blitz me I'm confirming you as town

Pedit great!

When you confirm someone as town who is already town because you're the last scum #justtranscendthings

[shannon]

Alright I have to go to work so let's do this. I'm so confident in Transcend Scum that I am going to vote him and hope like hell one of you hammers.

If I am wrong, we are in 3P tomorrow (or MYLO I guess but then 3P after that if no one votes). Obviously if i'm alive in that, vote me. But I won't be, there's no way I *can* be, because me + echo + third person who is scum makes it way too obvious. IF YOU LYNCH ME TODAY AND TRANSCEND SURVIVES TO TOMORROW, VOTE HIM 100%.

Otherwise, here's what I've got -

Echo: Conf town for the un:cced bulletproof claim. No one has come out and claimed Doc, so they're either keeping that really quiet or it's not in the game. Obviously don't lynch him.
Aristo: He seems to have scum read me from the start but mostly is looking at who my partner could be. That makes a little bit of sense from a town perspective, because he's not assuming that my claim was genuine.
Alisae: Also seems to have scum read me from the start, and keeps connecting me with Transcend. I thought she was scummy for doing that; in retrospect I see Transcend is scum so she was on the money. Seems to have flipped back and forth a bit today, voting Transcend then unvoting him on AtE.

I really can't see scum between the last three, it's got to be Transcend.

VOTE: Transcend

[shannon]

Yep, I feel confident in saying that Shannon and Ari are the scumteam.

Oh no!

you seem too pissed off that you had 2 votes on you. trying to be obvious town but I don't see it...

VOTE: Trans

Oh yes!!!!!

Couldn't you tell that by how Shannon A. Held her vote then B. Tried to blitz Trans?
LIKE REALLY ECHO?
REALLY?

Uh yeah Echo Ali makes a good point.

Shannon was obvscum and never got lynched.
Just wow.

I never get lynched, I've been lynched like twice, ever. Funnily enough, one of those was in 3P lylo in a newbie game, where the newb townie voted me within 24hrs of the day starting.

THE HAMSTER DIDN'T DIE FOR THIS SHIT

Hamster died for somebody's sins, but not mine

Echo, thanks for hammering this "not trolling" scum!

Tomorrow we lynch Shannon for the win!

Ari you were awesome, I never thought we'd get this far off a fake claim, and then when I stuffed it up today (I actually didn't see the unvote, whoops) I thought we were toast.
Really, Echo's not seeing my vote just realigned the universe.

Echo is trying to learn from me and copy from me
that's already a red flag.

damn it

im sorry hamster lol

Sorry not sorry x

[shannon]

Why so?

[shannon]

Town could totally have won it if they'd listened to their gut and not gone with the WIFOM option all the time.

It should have been incredibly suspicious that I counter claimed the person who just happened to have scum read me right from my first post. I figured that if my CC didn't work I was going to be lynched anyway, so why not try to take him with me.

Regardless of Hammy's alignment, the thing to do was lynch me D2.