In post 12335, Reasonably Rational wrote:HERE'S THE THING:
There doesn't need to BE any blame because we've freaking handed the game a 100% win probability plan
So why the fuck are you so opposed to being lynched, when by the 100% win plan, you being lynched still results in a town win?
That's my issue.
But aside from that.
Fuck my reads.
Throw them out. I mean, I have a scumread on you anyway. But you can ignore my reads.
It doesn't matter if my read on you is right or wrong.
Lynching you is a simple precaution.
Almost50 has made it as clear as day that he, if he is scum (and that's an IF), cannot win this game with us enacting the plan. This means he, if he is scum, has no countermeasure to it. Meaning he can be safely bubbled. We can do this, 100% safely and reliably.
You have made every effort to resist being lynched. This implies you have some reason to not be lynched, which runs contrary to your stated "we have this guaranteed win".
This is made worse by the fact that, by your own words, you as scum would not propose a scenario in which you as scum could not possibly win. So that means that if you are scum, with Shiro and grapes out of the game and Almost50 lynched, you have a method of winning the game, because if you didn't, you wouldn't be okay with this plan.
You might not be scum, sure. But while YOU know this. randomidget and I both do not. So lynching you first is a precaution. It costs the town nothing; we still fucking win. It deals with a potential problem before it exists. And yet, vice-versa, there's the risk. We have to assume you are town, because if you are scum then letting you live results in a scum win.
The thing is you keep saying I'm the one being irrational here.
Yet you're the one who continues to not address this simple plan. This simple truth: if we lynch you, we should still win.
So why the fuck is lynching you some sort of taboo?
Why the fuck are you doing the one thing which you would do as scum? (Avoid getting lynched.)
Actually sit down and put your skill to work.
Yeah.
I have been.
You know how many fucking hours I've poured into this?
Do you know how many times I crunched the numbers?
How many angles I've pursued?
How many times I've assessed the play here?
And yet, how many times I keep consistently seeing you pulling a scummy-as-fuck stance of "WE MUST LIVE", running contrary to what I know from you? You're asking me to do something I've done.
Not once.
Not twice.
Not even half a dozen times.
Ten. Twenty. Maybe more times, I've done this exercise. At the computer explicitly. Away from it entirely. I've poured it over, and the game not only makes more sense with you as scum, not only do you not make sense playing this way as town, but also everyone else has more reason to be town than you do.
Yet again, all of this is irrelevant.
I asked you a question.
Would you, as scum, propose a plan which you know would lead to your loss?
You know the answer.
So given this.
If our situations were reversed, if this player who you knew wouldn't propose a plan leading to their loss proposed a foolproof plan, would you just blindly accept them as town?
You can't say yes. Because fuck no. You'd test them. You'd put their claims to the test. If their plan was truly foolproof,
they would be willing to die as part of it
.
So you would ask them to die.
And that's what I've done.
Again, fuck the scumread. The scumread's not as invalid as you paint it to be, but it's not even relevant to the issue.
I want you lynched because it's safer.
If you're so prideful that you think your plan is foolproof: prove it by letting yourself be the lynch.
And at that point, it's impossible to fuck up.
You say you're worried that we have some special ability to avoid being bubbled or some crap like that. The thing is, Titus made us claim everything about our role explicitly, and then STOLE it as a way to check us, and our honesty was a big part of why she trusted us.
True enough.
What's to stop you from having a scum event, though?
Almost50, with his freakout, if he is scum, has made it clear enough that HE does not have one.
You might not have your role anymore thanks to Titus, but what about FACTIONAL abilities? Can you say that there's no possibility you have an event like, oh, saaaaaaaaaaay...the one we just fucking had today? One which could do something like, just to give one potential possibility, prevent gems from actioning? (I know that's probably not a scum ability, but I'm talking about things along those lines.)
There's literally dozens of ways which could force randomidget's bubble to fail. All it takes is one of them for a scum-you to win. And your posts ooze this confidence that you can win, so IF you are scum, then yes you fucking have that ability to foil the bubbling.
Basically, there's a cognitive dissonance of sorts.
Almost50 is freaking out--if he is scum, this is because he can't win. So we can let him live.
You are confident in victory--if you are scum, this is because you have a way to win. If you are town, you should be proud enough to let yourself be lynched. Yet because you're refusing to be lynched when we have an autowin, it gives the impression you're in the former (scum with path to victory) rather than the latter.
Also yes I was frantic and the PM I sent to Varsoon will show that postgame but I'm a little bit better now.