Open 666 - Pick Your Poison - Day 5

[Desperado]

Vote: ArcAngel9

Hi Arc!

[Desperado]

I'm not really sure where you're going with this Alisae. By definition the end of RVS doesn't come naturally; someone has to take it upon themselves to lay down a serious vote and defend it. Whether that comes in post 20 or 200 isn't very relevant and personally, ending RVS early leans town for me.

In what ways is he reacting poorly to your RQS and wagon hop?

[Desperado]

I didn't keep tally but I'd say >50% of the game still responded tho. Why aren't you doing anything with the information that you did get?

[Desperado]

I didn't keep tally but I'd say >50% of the game still responded tho. Why aren't you doing anything with the information that you did get?

Probably because the information he received won't help in regards to determining ones alignment.

Unvote
Vote: Lil Uzi Vert

[Desperado]

Yeah Zyf you're probably town.
Let's vote here instead.
VOTE: Superhans

What do you make of Lil answering the question I directed towards you for you?

[Desperado]

Without addressing what occurred between you and Zyf, no less.

[Desperado]

So we're on the same page w/r/t my vote on him then?

[Desperado]

How does it do that?

[Desperado]

That's not how I read it and I don't think that's the way you intended it either.

[Desperado]

VOTE: Lil Uzi Vert

[Desperado]

Apparently it's the difference between my vote being counted or not.

[Desperado]

... Gut town on Zyf.

If ur gonna gut read early anti-rvs pokes you should get on a relevant wagon

Btw desperado accusing someone of answering your question directed towards someone else isn't exactly a great tell. Also if uzi were wk-ing it's still totally a possibility for ali to be scum, and you'd have been making an actual wagon with me at that point if you had voted ali instead.
But w/e, hans is a more important flip right now

Uzi really stumbled in response to that as well so I'm standing by it.

[Desperado]

@ Superhans: I didn't like him ignoring the Zyf/Alisae encounter to answer a question that wasn't asked of him, and then I also didn't like him lying about his intentions when pressed on it.

It's good enough for now. You got a better idea?

[Desperado]

I didn't keep tally but I'd say >50% of the game still responded tho. Why aren't you doing anything with the information that you did get?

Probably because the information he received won't help in regards to determining ones alignment.

To be fair, I dunno why he would answer it for me. Comes off as trying to whiteknight or buddy me or some shit.

I'm not sure how you got that from my answer. If anything, it puts you in a bad light.

How does it do that?

It puts him a bad light because it implies he's just asking questions to look busy.

^Are you buying this?

[Desperado]

UNVOTE: Lil Uzi Vert
VOTE: Superhans

[Desperado]

Vote Count

Not Voting (1):

ArcAngel9

Zyf (1):

Gamma Emerald

D3f3nd3r (1):

A Simple Plan

desperado (1):

Lil Uzi Vert

Superhans (7):

Hawk, Alisae, Gendaberry, Desperado, rb, Zyf, Superhans

Gendaberry (2):

Dwlee99, D3f3nd3r

Superhans will be lynched.

Deadline in: (expired on 2017-01-14 00:00:00)

This wagon is town as fuck. I'll be lynching outside of it today.

[Desperado]

The thing with Super's wagon is, there's at the very least one person (Hawk) who is still on Super as an RVS vote. If Hawk isn't thinking that anymore, might be good for him to unvote.

Yeah, it was. But with my last post there's no reason to keep it as is.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Gendaberry

Would love to see some content out of him, there's next to nothing in any of the posts he's made so far.

This looks like a good place to start

VOTE: D3f3nd3r

[Desperado]

gamma and superhans explain please

It's less that i townread zyf than I wanna know why 2 RVS votes are parked on him

I like the cut of Zyf's jib and I dislike the cut of these RVS votes by Gamma/Superhans.

VOTE: Superhans

So...we can just lynch D3f3nd3r now yeah?

[Desperado]

If he was still paying attention to the game and was scum, why wouldn't he stop RVSing his teammate who is getting lynched?

[Desperado]

@ Uzi; do you often see scum bus in RVS? And do you think Super would have self voted if he had any buddies on his wagon he could have counted on to unvote?

And you're halfway there on that post. The vote and reasoning were absolutely terrible, yes, and the way he stayed away from the Super wagon by calling it RVS and then voting a lurker I'd exactly how I would expect scum to have treated the Super wagon.

[Desperado]

RB had a reason for voting Super; I already quoted his progression on him for you.

[Desperado]

@ Uzi; do you often see scum bus in RVS? And do you think Super would have self voted if he had any buddies on his wagon he could have counted on to unvote?

And you're halfway there on that post. The vote and reasoning were absolutely terrible, yes, and the way he stayed away from the Super wagon by calling it RVS and then voting a lurker I'd exactly how I would expect scum to have treated the Super wagon.

I wanna answer this question as well. Not for Uzi, but mostly because the questions are shit. It doesn't matter if it happens often or not, it's still possible. And I don't think it would have mattered if he had buddies on his wagon.

...........

[Desperado]

Do you think scum bussed yesterday? I don't care if it's possible. Do you think it's likely given what occurred?

And the last part...Are you serious??? Of course it matters if he had a teammate on the wagon. It was RVS. The only reason super self votes there is If he feels like there is already no escape; why would he feel that way if he had a buddy on the wagon that he could expect to unvote because the wagon was so early?

[Desperado]

It's not a misrepresentation at all. He did not need to self vote and it makes the most sense if he saw an all town L1 wagon and just didn't want to expose his teammates any more than necessary, or force them to make a decision on his wagon.

[Desperado]

....

Again, if Hawk is scum why would Superhans self vote when Hawk can easily unvote his buddy that he RVSed and is now L1? Literally no one would find that weird or suspicious.

[Desperado]

That's your opinion.

All I know is that the most simplest explanation here doesn't clear anyone.

So what is the simplest explanation then?

[Desperado]

Caught scum on page 9 with obvious RVS votes still on him?

Come on.

[Desperado]

And why was he flailing?

Because his wagon was all town and he couldn't couldn't on his teammates to save him without exposing themselves; kind of like how Super dismissed his wagon because it still had RVS votes on it and then voted a lurker.

[Desperado]

That should read "Kind of like how D3f3nd3r dismissed..."

[Desperado]

You're not townreading ANYONE?

[Desperado]

That's the beauty of being me: I get to look at that wagon knowing that I'm town! If you just do it to you will see what I see, I assure you.

[Desperado]

Pretty much, yeah

[Desperado]

RB slot is town

[Desperado]

So...we can just lynch D3f3nd3r now yeah?

He avoided a scum lynch, then casts shade on my slot at the beginning of the day, so... I'm good with this right now.

I don't see why town would think scum would be more likely to be on a Scum Lynch than off it.

Will most likely wind up voting here.

Yeah, just looks like scum keeping their options open. Uzi's a lot scummier than Alisae in regards to that tho; not having a single townread after that d1 is pretty outrageous.

[Desperado]

UNVOTE: d3f3nd3r

Not ending the day yet.

[Desperado]

How exactly is my logic "borderline awful?" Has the site meta changes so much that scum teams are bussing and self voting in page 9?

[Desperado]

Even if both scum bussed for maximum WIFOM, the best they can hope is that we lynch everyone off the wagon first, they don't kill any of the town that was in the wagon, and then they are looking at 5 way LYLO having pushed three mislynch off the wagon through.

Does that sound worth it to you?

[Desperado]

A) why am I assuming 3 scum in an Open setup? ........
B) yes, I'm saying hypothetical scum that bussed D1 and would be using the unlikeliness of bussing to lynch from off the wagon would still find themselves in a 5 way LYLO situation at absolute best
C) Zyf was obvtown.

[Desperado]

VOTE: Alisae

because there is no way a game with this many replacements has a winning wagon.

Reading now

Read the rules first then; 24 hour prods and then you have 12 hours to respond or you're force replaced. It's pretty extreme.

[Desperado]

Guys, if you're posting it has no effect on you so I really don't understand why everyone is just throwing up their hands and threatening to quit...

[Desperado]

I think so; we're still not ending the day.

[Desperado]

We need thoughts from Genda and Gamma and I'd like to hear a lot more from Transcend, Narna, and yourself before we move on.

[Desperado]

Vote Count

Not Voting (1):

Narna

Zyf (1):

Gamma Emerald

D3f3nd3r (1):

A Simple Plan

desperado (1):

Transcend

Superhans (7):

Hawk, Alisae, Gendaberry, Desperado, rb,

Zyf

,

Superhans

Gendaberry (2):

Falco XV, D3f3nd3r

Superhans will be lynched.

Deadline in: (expired on 2017-01-14 00:00:00)

Here's the D1 lynch with replacements inserted.

[Desperado]

Vote Count

Not Voting (1):

Narna

Zyf (1):

Gamma Emerald

D3f3nd3r (1):

A Simple Plan

desperado (1):

Transcend

Superhans (7):

Hawk, Alisae, Gendaberry, Desperado, -Grey-,

Zyf

,

Superhans

Gendaberry (2):

Falco XV, D3f3nd3r

Superhans will be lynched.

Deadline in: (expired on 2017-01-14 00:00:00)

Here's the D1 lynch with replacements inserted.

[Desperado]

I'm also a little bit worried about Alisae considering the scumkill ended up going Zyf's way. Zyf was fairly worried about Alis on Day 1 but nobody else really was. This makes the Zyf kill make some sense, but maybe I'm just reading into a bit too much as Zyf was giving a ton of content and really did spearhead the Super lynch.

I will lynch in:
Gamma
LUV
Defender

Explanation?

Simple Plan's posts have looked fairly good today. Even though Day 1 he was giving out very little, if anything, I would imagine that that was because of the New Year. Got a town read on him, but I feel like we'll need to see what happens with his reads before we can get a better idea of whether or not he's town.

I don't get the Uzi wagon, Gamma and Alis. Can you two give me an explanation of why he doesn't look great to you?

Zyf was obv town. Who did you expect to be killed if it wasn't him?

[Desperado]

Grey
Hawk
Alisae

Simple Plan
Genda
Gamma

------------------------------ <---Line of Lynchability

Transcend
Narna

Falco
Defender

[Desperado]

There has to be some town off the wagon too and if you were scum you could have done something (even bussed) in 182 but you didn't.

[Desperado]

>the replacements make this game too confusing
>let me make it even more confusing for someone who wasn't here for the entire game and replace out too!

[Desperado]

We did lynch scum d1 right? I didn't hallucinate that?

[Desperado]

Are Transcend, Narna, and Falco at the bottom there thanks to their predecessors being inactive of this there something more there.

All were off the Hans wagon d1

[Desperado]

You separated Falco from the other two so I'm assuming there's more to that.

Ya, dwlee was scummier than AA and Uzi and 375 looks kinda like a frustrated teammate.

[Desperado]

Let's pause for a second-

Hans self hammered. Do you think he's gonna self hammer with 6 town on his lynch?

I think it's possible, but he cut discussion really short so this leads me to think there was at least one busser and he self hammered quickly to give them town cred.

Yes, I do. Much more likely that he didn't see way out and he wanted to limit the damage to his teammates.

[Desperado]

>the replacements make this game too confusing
>let me make it even more confusing for someone who wasn't here for the entire game and replace out too!

Who do you think is more likely to be frustrated to the point of replacing out in this situation, town or scum?

NAI, they're just annoyed at the mod. TBH multiple players have been backseat modding all game and it's been kind of inappropriate.

[Desperado]

Fair point but he cut it really short.

The Hans wagon still had RVS votes on it. If scum was bussing...they didn't need to be. Not lynching a teammate d1 is worth a lot more than whatever towncred you get for the next couple of days. I've already explained how we could lynch and kill everyone off the wagon under the assumption that scum didn't buss and they'd still have to ML three times and survive a 5 way LYLO.

[Desperado]

That was incredibly rude.

Regardless of your opinion of the mod's abilities, he's trying to provide a fun experience for a dozen people. You could at least respect the effort.

And, I disagree with you. Scum loves disarray, town hates a jumbled mess to sift through.

What? I don't have any problem with James' modding...

[Desperado]

That looks pretty lazy lol.

Dodging lynches as scum is easy.

Which is why Hans self hammered when multiple players were still on their RVS vote?

[Desperado]

I mean we were having a conversation too...

[Desperado]

To respond to the points about the SH wagon by Transcend: I think he was scum frustrated by being voted by his buddies

So you think both scum bussed Hans? Who are they?

[Desperado]

Think I just need to hear a bit from TTTT and wait for an Alisae replacement and a defender lynch is a go

[Desperado]

@ Transcend: I "threw shade" and the same four people I've said I'd push all day?

I thought you said you'd read.

[Desperado]

Like, you said I was null until my most recent posts today but I've been beating the same drum all day phase.

[Desperado]

Good thing I haven't said that.

You're aware that I built the Defender wagon, right? Cause your shade comment also implied that I was just going with the flow on that lynch.

[Desperado]

I was pretty clear about why i unvoted. I've gotten input from everyone I needed today except TTTT and now Alisaes replacement and then I'm ready to lynch my biggest scumread.

[Desperado]

Your timeline is way off. I didn't unvote because he claimed VT, I unvoted because he was L-1 and we had three new replacements and two players who hadn't really commented on anything all game. That situation has now changed.

I've already sorted his slot; I think he's scum and he's not done anything to change that.

[Desperado]

And that "gem" is just a quick snapshot of my reads that anyone could have pieced together themselves by just reading my posts.

[Desperado]

The thing with Super's wagon is, there's at the very least one person (Hawk) who is still on Super as an RVS vote. If Hawk isn't thinking that anymore, might be good for him to unvote.

Yeah, it was. But with my last post there's no reason to keep it as is.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Gendaberry

Would love to see some content out of him, there's next to nothing in any of the posts he's made so far.

This looks like a good place to start

VOTE: D3f3nd3r

gamma and superhans explain please

It's less that i townread zyf than I wanna know why 2 RVS votes are parked on him

I like the cut of Zyf's jib and I dislike the cut of these RVS votes by Gamma/Superhans.

VOTE: Superhans

So...we can just lynch D3f3nd3r now yeah?

[Desperado]

In case you also missed it in your reread, defender started today pushing rb because he voted Hans without a reason or explanation.

[Desperado]

I don't think desperado/defender are ss. I want more interactions from them together, but they're not gonna cross each other after their other goon gets roped d1.

I don't tr defender but if desperado is scum which i believe he is then defender is a really bad vote.

The most you'll see 3 "3's" in my vote is if it's deadline for the time being.

am i talking to a wall

or what

[Desperado]

Vote: D3f3nd3r

Oh look, I crossed!

....again!

[Desperado]

Unvote

But I still want to hear from TTTT and get an Alisae replacement and hear from them before we go to night phase.

[Desperado]

Defender is literally voting me because my reads (lol...vote rankings) are "weird feeling."

[Desperado]

Grey
Hawk
Alisae

Simple Plan
Genda
Gamma

------------------------------ <---Line of Lynchability

Transcend
Narna

Falco
Defender

Grey
Transcend

------------------------------ <---Line of Lynchability
Hawk
Alisae

Simple Plan
Genda
Gamma

Desperado
Narna

Falco
Defender

Ftfy

Da reads:

Town: -Grey-, Gendaberry, ASP
Lean Town: Gamma, Alisae(?)
Null: TTTT, Falco
Null scum: Defender, Narna
Scum: Desperado

Is your mind blown?

I know mine is.

(Btw desperado was null until his most recent posts).

Transcend's reads are almost identical to mine, they're just presented in a different way. Does anyone really believe D3f3nder is being genuine right now?

[Desperado]

That's not the point. All you said was my "vote rankings" were awkward and weird feeling; it's a completely empty accusation and it feels more like you making up a reason to join Transcend than truly finding them scummy.

[Desperado]

And yet your reads after that are basically the same...

[Desperado]

Again, just illustrating the point that 421 and 441 are the same thing with different presentation and there's absolutely nothing awkward or weird about a full reads list.