Mini 518: Underground Mafia, The Nightmare is Over!

[Adel]

Mod: does this game have a fully open reveal?

If Korlash was a Mafia Roleblocker, would that have been posted?

Additionally, if Mexal or Miztef had a role, would that have been revealed with their death?

[NabakovNabakov]

Mod: does this game have a fully open reveal?

If Korlash was a Mafia Roleblocker, would that have been posted?

Additionally, if Mexal or Miztef had a role, would that have been revealed with their death?

My policy on revealing reveal policy is decidedly closed. Better luck next time.

[Oman]

Why don't you feel pressured?

I will put a pressure vote on him

Oman: you can stop this process right now by posting.

I think it was more that I just knew that I could post and it would go away (that is, it wasn't stated there was no reason other than lurking stated).

[Mr. Flay]

Thank you for the response. Vote stands, though, you continue to fit the profile of Active Lurker.

[NabakovNabakov]

All players without posts on this page have been prodded.

[Adel]

vote: Mr.Flay

It is time to end this day. I will not be making a case against him for his partner to hide behind, but I am sincere in this vote, and I

will not move it

for the rest of this day.

[jerubbaal]

Sorry for the lack of posting lately, I've been getting bogged down lately with other games and other things. I've said what I want to about Flay and I think he's a fine lynch for today. I'm not thrilled about the quality of Oman's post, but it's a post. I'm confused how that still meets the criteria of Active Lurker. Agree that this day needs to move towards a close, the only thing which broke up the paralysis holding up the day was the whole lurker thing with Oman, but now that he's at least proven that he's here, hopefully we can get something done. Caution is good, paralysis is not.

Vote: Flay

[curiouskarmadog]

been prodded.

vote Jerubbaal

for being a hyprocrite and bandwagoner.not much to comment on at this point.

[jerubbaal]

Hypocrite, no.

Bandwagoner, yes.

[curiouskarmadog]

what is your case against Flay?

[NabakovNabakov]

Vote Count as of Post 959

Oman (2):

Mr. Flay, jerubbaal

jerubbaal (1):

Abstract Actuary, curiouskarmadog

Abstract Actuary (1):

Setael

Adel (1):

Oman

Mr. Flay(1):

Adel

Not Voting (2):

Sudo_Nym, Jitsu

9 alive, 5 will lynch.

(jerubbaal failed to follow proper voting procedure)

[Oman]

I don't like the way Mr Flay wont take the vote off regardless of my large post concerning Adel.

Please explain how that fits an "active lurker"

Also, i'm Limited Acess across the entire site, so don't say over the next few days that I'm lurking. My home net died (talking to the Isp about it) and so I've got to use public computers instead.

[Jitsu]

I am still rereading, but I will post my thoughts right now:

I still don't like Setael and Oman. Setael's reason for voting AA was weak, plus there is all of the other stuff mentioned previously. And I still don't think Oman has posted much usable content, and the stuff he did post today has been almost one-sidedly focused on Adel (possible OMGUS post?). I do think they are both potential lynch candidates.

At this point, I think that AA and CKD are probably town. I understand their concern about Jerubbaal, but at this point, I am willing to give Jerub a pass for today because of past good behavior.

Adel and Sudo I'm still unsure of -- they are still hard for me to get a read on, but Adel has done enough good things to stay out of my top suspect list, and Sudo, while hard to read, is not one of the better lynch candidates for today. I'd really like Sudo to post more of what he is thinking. I don't think either one is a good lynch candidate today.

I admit I have concerns about Flay as well, though I want to hear what Adel has to say about him. I will hold back on my observations on Flay until Adel posts his case.


@Adel: So was Flay your prime suspect all along then? If so, you must have been sitting on him for a while now. What specifically make Flay your top lynch candidate?

It is time to end this day. I will not be making a case against him for his partner to hide behind, but I am sincere in this vote, and I

will not move it

for the rest of this day.

Those are very strong statements. I do not discount your sincerity, but I'm afraid I need more than that to go on. If you are going to make that strong of a statement and lead the wagon against someone, you better back it up. I am less concerned about giving a potential Flayscum partner something to hide behind tomorrow than I am getting this lynch right. If you want Flay that badly, make your case against him. I will listen.


@CKD: Why specifically is Jerubbaal a hypocrite?

@Jerubbaal: Is Flay your prime suspect? If not, who is? You say that Flay is a good lynch. Who are the other good lynches for today?

@Sudo: Could you please post your thoughts on the other players you've not commented on already?

@Setael: What is your opinion on Flay?

[Adel]

Jitsu's last post is interesting.

I will not be making a case against him for his partner to hide behind

That pretty much sums it up. If you want to read someone else's case against Flay, I'd suggest pressuring Jerubbaal for one. I'm going to be pretty damn stubborn about this.

[Abstract Actuary]

Jitsu's last post is interesting.

I will not be making a case against him for his partner to hide behind

That pretty much sums it up. If you want to read someone else's case against Flay, I'd suggest pressuring Jerubbaal for one. I'm going to be pretty damn stubborn about this.

I guess I just don't fully understand the logic behind this. Do you have a case against his partner? Or do you still need to catch his partner?

If you already have a case, then you can just post who his partner is and the case against each of them and then they won't be able to "hide behind" your case against Mr. Flay, since we will all be watching for that.

If you are still waiting to catch his partner wouldn't the perfect way to do it be to present your solid case and then see who "hides behind it"? Of course this option is no longer available . . .


I spent a lot of time rereading this weekend, but haven't gotten through it all yet. Based on what I've read so far I think that Jitsu, curiouskarmadog and jerubbaal are looking more town.

Thus,

Unvote: jerubbaal

I'll continue my reread this week and post some more analysis when I finish, while keeping up with current conversation.

[Setael]

Setael's reason for voting AA was weak

Does that mean that you think this:

You may have had this piece of information in your back pocket all along and been waiting to use it until you saw that a Korlash lynch was inevitable.

is an argument likely to be made by a townie? Cuz I don't. I obviously didn't notice this until Flay pointed it out, but what Abstract accused me of makes no sense for either town OR scum. It's contrived to make me look scummy, which makes it a good argument against Abstract. He hasn't acknowledged it, which makes it look increasingly like a good argument.

re: Adel's refusal to present a case on Flay - I'm not seeing FlayScum and I think it's ridiculous to think you can successfully get the town to lynch someone without ever presenting a case on them. I won't be joining the Flay wagon.

[Abstract Actuary]

Setael's reason for voting AA was weak

Does that mean that you think this:

You may have had this piece of information in your back pocket all along and been waiting to use it until you saw that a Korlash lynch was inevitable.

is an argument likely to be made by a townie? Cuz I don't. I obviously didn't notice this until Flay pointed it out, but what Abstract accused me of makes no sense for either town OR scum. It's contrived to make me look scummy, which makes it a good argument against Abstract. He hasn't acknowledged it, which makes it look increasingly like a good argument.

re: Adel's refusal to present a case on Flay - I'm not seeing FlayScum and I think it's ridiculous to think you can successfully get the town to lynch someone without ever presenting a case on them. I won't be joining the Flay wagon.

I didn't think it needed addressing. This whole issue arose after I admitted that you presented a good reason to vote for Korlash. You asserted that that made you innocent and asked me to question the other people voting you. I said that, just because you had good reason, does not mean you are innocent. There are two scenarios in which you, as scum, could have presented this legitimate case against Korlash. (1) You had that information for awhile and were waiting until Korlash was definitely going down to present it or (2) you decided it was time to bus your partner and you went looking for a good, new reason to do it so you wouldn't look suspicious for switching without your own reason.

You think that (1) is not possible and therefore makes me scummy.

First of all, even if you think that the explanation is not valid, the conclusion that I am scummy for presenting it is ridiculous. I didn't present it as fact. I didn't even present it as the only option.

Second, it is a reasonable explanation. If you were scum and you found this damning piece of evidence against your partner, you wouldn't have presented it immediately. You probably would have sat on it until he was going down anyway. I don't see what is so unreasonable about that.

[Jitsu]

Interesting... Setael's response makes me want to reread today's comments now with a new focus in mind.

[jerubbaal]

See post 887 for the most reasonable summary of my problems with Flay's action so far.

I should be clear, I think Flay is the best lynch for today. It would take a lot to convince me that someone else was a better lynch. I sincerely doubt anyone else has committed a Korlash, especially as claim-light as this game has been.

[Mr. Flay]

I don't like the way Mr Flay wont take the vote off regardless of my large post concerning Adel.

Please explain how that fits an "active lurker"

Also, i'm Limited Acess across the entire site, so don't say over the next few days that I'm lurking. My home net died (talking to the Isp about it) and so I've got to use public computers instead.

You could have said you had limited access before this post.

Unvote

for now, but I still think you're being scummy.

Interesting how Jerubbaal is not correcting his earlier voting-format error.

Vote: jerubbaal

now that Oman has at least tried to explain himself - I don't even think jeru is scum with Adel, I think he's just plain opportunist.

Adel: Fuck you. Immovable votes are NOT pro-town, and the only thing preventing me from voting you at present is that I feel I have at least two stronger candidates for scum. You're crystallizing again. If you've got a case,

state it

.

[Jitsu]

Adel: Fuck you. Immovable votes are NOT pro-town, and the only thing preventing me from voting you at present is that I feel I have at least two stronger candidates for scum. You're crystallizing again. If you've got a case,

state it

.

Who are they? Jerubbaal is presumably one. Who is the other?

[curiouskarmadog]

this is just a side note and doesnt mean much at the moment.

I am almost positive that I have seen people say lines like "I will not remove my vote" before as communication in game to their scum partner.

Now, the reason I am not even FoSing is 1.) I am skimming through my old games to find this and not having much luck, 2.) To me, just seems too obvious, and 3.) the only other game that I played with Adel she was scum and we spent 40+ pages going back and forth with each other which resulted in me getting mislynched, translation, I am bias.

Jer, reading your case against flay now...repsonse to you (and Jitsu) coming when I get more time.

[jerubbaal]

I'm pretty sure I was the first one to formalize a case against you, and I'm being opportunistic? The Oman thing resolved alright, he posted, albeit not terribly impressively, but he's not lurking any more. I don't see a case against him other than lurking. If he goes back to lurking, I'll be happy to go after him, but as long as he's participating, I think you're a better target.

OMGUS much? You're just taking swings at the people who voted on you - how is

that

pro-town? You didn't have a problem with Adel's "calculated risks" until they came to bear on you. I would think an experienced player such as yourself wouldn't resort to "you suck" posting after only two votes during a lull in the day's conversation. I don't know if Adel's "I'm not moving" vote was just to produce a reaction, but it certainly did.

[Jitsu]

I'm pretty sure I was the first one to formalize a case against you, and I'm being opportunistic? The Oman thing resolved alright, he posted, albeit not terribly impressively, but he's not lurking any more. I don't see a case against him other than lurking. If he goes back to lurking, I'll be happy to go after him, but as long as he's participating, I think you're a better target.

OMGUS much? You're just taking swings at the people who voted on you - how is

that

pro-town? You didn't have a problem with Adel's "calculated risks" until they came to bear on you. I would think an experienced player such as yourself wouldn't resort to "you suck" posting after only two votes during a lull in the day's conversation. I don't know if Adel's "I'm not moving" vote was just to produce a reaction, but it certainly did.

Are you referring to Flay here, I presume?

[Adel]

I am almost positive that I have seen people say lines like "I will not remove my vote" before as communication in game to their scum partner.

I've developed much more sophisticated protocols for hidden communication when I am scum. I've read several white papers on steganography and its practical applications, and the existence of the "find" function within every browser means that there is no reason to ever use bold face to draw attention to a specific passage.