Mini Normal #1838 Mod/Dead Thread

[Grendel]

I feel like I played absolutely awful this game.

There were several times I had some "maybe boring is scum" moments, but I kept writing it off as paranoia. I could say the same thing for LUV too, where I thought he was suspicious for a long time but ended up dismissing him as "too easy".

The amount of times I dismissed my (correct) unvoiced gut reads is incredibly dissatisfying.

I also wished I'd finished my Prism re-read now. I might not have come to this conclusion he was scum, but at least I could have put some more valid thoughts out there.

[Grendel]

^Lets hope that Zoronos makes that right aggressive block tonight. Because Scum are certainly going after Penguin.

Subject: Mini Normal #1838 - Day 3

@Grendel - I'm going to remember Belgian waffle peddler for a long time.

1st - you seem like you're resigning yourself to being lynched. Not a fan :/

When you read this later nn30 I want to remind that I had a sinus infection. Being under the weather really hurt my motivation to play.

I'm also of the opinion that my lynch was the correct lynch at that point in time. If i kept living then Zoronos would likely continue to be useless, and as the least likely conftown player to be night killed, scum would almost certainly want to bring us both to lylo. I believe that this playing out would have been pretty likely given that Dierfire could have easily been pushed through today. Then nn30 next. Then it'd just be me, Zoro, shadow, boring, prism.

Which would be an auto-lose scenario, so letting my wagon happen prematurely takes this opportunity away from scum. I could also think of several other scenarios where me being alive could actually be a detriment to town as well so... yeah.

[Grendel]

@podoboq

Give me your honest opinion. Did my play this game suck from your PoV?

[Grendel]

btw, there was another layer to the "creating reasonable doubt" on shadow bit. I actually did think that shadow was town, and hoped that this maneuver would grantee he makes it the lylo.

I also thought that there would be a good chance that scum would pick up my argument about shadow and run with it. Which, incidentally scum (boring) did, the issue is that I picked the wrong slot (nn30) to scum read for it.

I didn't address this in the thread proper because i figured that doing so would remove shadow a garnteed ride to lylo. Though I suspect now that I could've and it would have fallen on deaf ears anyway.

Maybe nor such a great play in retrospect since i had to lie about my Shadow tr. Also didn't see the repercussions of the mass claim lining up all the town power. At this point it is likely that Shadow would have not been in any danger of being the night kill regardless what i did earlier. :/

It will be pretty awesome though if Shadow gets into lylo and rips the game apart. Which was what i was counting on originally.

[Grendel]

@mod that's fine.

Gamma, can you forgive me for tunneling you into the ground two games in a row? D:

I legit thought that Shadow was an investigative pr softing a guilty on you!

[Grendel]

Yeah, I Wifom'd myself away from that one didn't I?

Are you really a child poster MariaR?

I thought you were like, in your late teens.

[Grendel]

^Except that Zoronos ignores sorta clears remember?

[Grendel]

He replaced shadow. Which is good because Shadow has been incredibly toxic, even though he had some p good reads his pushes and interactions were awful imo.

Black void being on point with his scum reads is an added bonus. I think things may be changing in town's favor again.

This is a nice feeling.

[Grendel]

Alright, that basically removes any doubt I had about the Shadow slot. Black gave that list in 30 mins, there's no way he faked it. Those reads were legit and I doubt it was convenient to keep the same reads as scum. Maybe he could have gone back and revised just one/two but there's no way the whole thing is fake.

I feel bad for DF since I literally have barely read anything he's said and basically haven't even given him a chance, but at this point I really don't think I need to. If boring flips town then I'll be forced to as that means I'm wrong on one of Zoro/nn but I'll cross that bridge if we get there.

VOTE: boring

^Example "A" for why keeping buddies as back pocket reads are a bad idea. In a situation were your buddy is about to be lynched you pretty much have to be on their wagon, otherwise your gonna look really suspect.

So to maintain the status quo Prism has to give boring up, which means that who ever Zoro jails tonight will be conf!town tomorrow, and Prism will be stuck in an auto-lose situation. Basically once boring is lynched Prism will lose the game, yet all that distancing he did from boring makes him contractually obligated to bus her. Prism has dug his own grave with either option.

All that needs to happen now is a boring lynch...

[Grendel]

Idk whether to find nn30's accusations against Zoro humorous, or cringe worthy.

Hey, at least boring is caught scum now.

[Grendel]

Usually when I push a highly unlikely scenario, its to work my way to a better position for myself, or for another player. I'm secretly hoping that nn30 has an extra motive, but I doubt that's the case.

That reminds me.

@Shadow, What did you think of my rb conspiracy theory?

At the end I couldn't tell if you still thought it was funny, or if you were actually getting annoyed.

[Grendel]

I thought you were talking about rb the player for a second

Well, I can't help rb having a common abbreviation for a username. Also can't say I know the guy beyond a couple games I followed that he was in. People talk him up enough that I'd be worried about playing against him if I rolled scum though.

p-edit: FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, NO ONE LYNCH ZORONOS!

I want to talk about this right here.

It makes me think Boring may actually be town. The scum motivation here is to 1) throw a hail mary and throw us off the scent if Zoro is actually her partner. The other scum motivation is would be to MAYBE not die today, but I find this unlikely.

The town motivation says 'here is my last will and testament. When I flip town, let it be known that I SUPER town read Zoro.'

The town motivation weighs SO much more than the scum motivation in my eyes.

This is gonna be so awks when boring flips mafia.

I feel... kinda bad for him.

Pre edit-

Both and after the MC it was obvious scum can't have an RB.

I was hoping you'd figure out that was the point behind it. I guess you took it all at face value then?

(I was hoping you could see where I was going, but I wasn't counting on it)

[Grendel]

Yes, podoboq, if I had my druthers, I would have killed Shadow N1 because he was going to be seen as conf. town, and I don't like to kill people openly scum reading me. I prefer to discredit them.

---

Also, Dierfire and Black Void are beautiful. I'm really impressed by both of them and their thought processes.

Ah, see I was thinking that going directly after your biggest critic wouldn't be your style. But, I didn't take into account what your buddies would have wanted to do N1.

Dierfire is a really intelligent guy, but he doesn't have much pull/presence compared to other players. So he seems to get over looked more then he should be imo.

Thank you for playing with me Grendel! I'm sorry we had to be on different teams!

I really wanted us to be town together.

It was still fun though. Doesn't this make... four games in a row you rolled scum?

[Grendel]

Was a fun game. I was in an unfortunate slot but it was still fun sorting everyone among it.

Pretty nice knowing I was right about all my town reads and scum reads but I don't think I cared enough since I knew I was going to be lynched.

You can be proud in knowing that it took the whole scum team on your wagon to get you lynched after getting cc'd!

Usually no more then two put themselves on the EoD lynch. But you got the whole team!

[Grendel]

I thought you were talking about rb the player for a second

Well, I can't help rb having a common abbreviation for a username. Also can't say I know the guy beyond a couple games I followed that he was in. People talk him up enough that I'd be worried about playing against him if I rolled scum though.

I played with him as scum once and flew under his radar (though we n1ed him so it wasn't hard)

Yeah, I read desperation day.

[Grendel]

So zoronos' play this game has been shutting down the LUV wagon day 1. Ccing Luv.
Having Boring and Prism as town. Hmm

I was going to share what I disliked about Zoronos play in the post game, but since he is likely to join us here soon I might as well voice my discontentment:

1) I didn't appreciate the tangents about how "x" play style is

undeniably bad

, when such things are largely subjective. If everybody played mafia one way, then half of what makes mafia interesting for me would be gone.

2) When LUV was at L-1, Zoro choosing to counter claim instead of hammer was really awful.

3) Zoro declaring that I'm not less likely to be scum despite getting a negative on me was bad. I have been lynched off of the premise of "If Grendel got a negative result last night why did he go into today scum reading x slot?" Like the example of a tracker I used in post 2263 was me. I fake claimed tracker in a lylo and one of the reasons it didn't hold up was because I voted to same person that I claimed to have gotten a negative result from the night prior. The player, Infinity, reasoned that if the player I thought was most likely to preform the kill didn't then it should have made me less inclined to scum read him the next day.

4) I have seen no evidence of the scum tells he used in post 2264 being things only scum do. Most of them just seem indicative of somebody who is frustrated. Last time I checked scum aren't exclusively inclined to frustration under pressure.

5) Him agreeing on several of the points I brought to the table while continuing to scum read me was what made me stop taking him seriously altogether. What more is that I'm suspicious that he simply wasn't listening to me anymore since he was agreeing with the points I made through _other_ people. Namely Implosion.

6) I will admit that the LUV assossiatites were pretty condemning. Outside of that though, him pushing my lynch with, "Grendel is using what I consider to be bad play therefore Grendel must be scum". Looked a whole lot like, "If Grendel isn't scum then he is bad town", from my perspective. It does not incriminate me at all, and just makes voting me easy even if he started getting paranoid that I might actually be town. He could ride it off as, "at least he wasn't a decent town player".

Points 4, 5, and 6 also fuel the my feelings that Zoronos want for my blood

was

personally charged. Scum reading me for Night analysis when Prism not only did the same, but was much more adamant about it. Saying that outside of me Dierfire was most likely scum when

I was the one who brought Dierfire onto every bodies radar

. Tacking largely Non-ai tells onto a response just because I was frustrated. Ignoring many points I made over the course of the game. I'm pretty convinced that Zoro forced himself to believe that I was scum out of sheer want, and not based in actual evidence.

In the end though I'm not too angry. I do hope that if Zoro bothers to acknowledge this post he'll explain his thought processes behind his plays this game. Also, hope he is not so quick to scum read somebody just because he doesn't like how they approach the game in future.

[Grendel]

Yeah, with the exception of that very brief hydra I mentioned, I'm 100% scum on this site. Like, I'm too busy to play properly, but I feel compelled to play at least one goshdarned town game before I disappear for a while. Also, playing town is easier, time-wise.

Idk, I think I get lazier as scum then town.

[Grendel]

If I was zoronos, I'd probably CC LUV doc claim with a doc claim inspite of being a JK so that scum have to come after me first and Gamma could have got another clear or a guilty.

hmmm, that sounds like an interesting play.

Have you been in any games where the jk fake claimed doc before?

It makes sense, but I don't think I've ever seen anybody try it.

I think that the only negative coqusquence would be the scum team seeing through the claim, and killing the cop anyway. (b/c cop +doc would be an unlikely combo)

[Grendel]

If you'll recall, he almost instantly regretted outing himself. I think he realized that he played into our hands.

True, but he also said that he was willing to talk about it once the game was over.

[Grendel]

missed 158 point 3 was a game I played

Giving credit where credit is due; Gamma played the biggest part in getting me lynched in that game. He was the cop.

Its just that Infinity was the lylo kingmaker, and his first reason of believing Gamma's claim over mine was that I voted a negative result at day start.

[Grendel]

Uhh, this game should be an auto win for town since Deirfire is mechanicaly clear.

Scum have already flipped a pr, why is town expecting scum to have more then one pr in a game where town only has three prs?

Town has two ascetics, scum wouldn't have a strongman. Town has jk, scum wouldn't have a role blocker. And if they were "x"-shot they would have expended their shots by now.

I'm going to be really disappointed if town loses just because they botched their set up spec.

[Grendel]

You mean you wouldn't get a "You were role blocked" result?

[Grendel]

Assuming that Dierfire is lynched today then that should leave nn30, Black Void, and Prism tomorrow.

Prism and nn30 vote each other, Black Void gets the deciding vote. Town has a good chance to win (75%?).

Prism and Black void vote each other making nn30 kingmaker. Nn30 is incredibly fickle, probably 50% chance (or less) of a town victory.

The event where Prism has the last vote is an obvious auto lose.

Hopefully Prism will lead with his vote tomorrow instead of hanging back.

[Grendel]

Hey boring, do you know what Prism's plan going into lylo was?

Was he planning on going after nn30, or Black void?

[Grendel]

rn it looks like Implosion, and Black void are the only ones considering a Prism lynch. Unfortunately Dierfire and nn30 both seem to have a strong tr on that slot. Mostly likely scenario is that Implosion goes ahead with the Dier lynched, but stresses that Prism needs to go tomorrow. If Implosion can make some good posts then that would sway nn30 to sheeping him on Prism, if not today, then tomorrow. Nn30 did say he trusted Implosion's opinion over everybody else right?

Town still has a good chance to win. At first I was put off by people voting a mechanically clear Dier, but as long as Implosion lines things up well today then town should still win.

[Grendel]

@Grendel - I don't know Prism's plan. My goal, since I had so much heat out the gate, was to last as long as possible as a distraction and good, solid bus so that Prism could throw the Hail Mary from as sqeaky-clean of a position as possible. I wish I had lasted one more day, but hopefully, he can finish the play alone. He's in as good a position as possible, considering the obstacles all the PRs and conf. towns presented. Beyond that, you'll have to wait for the Mafia PT. I made a whole bunch of ridiculously unrealistic and speculative plans, though. The thread is littered with them. He is a little more restrained.

Haha, half of my notes usually end up being unrealistic scenarios, and speculative ploys!

Great minds think alike!

[Grendel]

I also must implore town, in the event that I die or survive into tomorrow, to ignore any WIFOM related to BV. He could leave me alive because he knows I'll advocate for him or he could kill me because he knows I'll advocate for him.

We have no good way of rigorously proving this one way or another... so it's moot.

lol, oh N.

Implosion's gonna die, not you.

[Grendel]

Why is Implosion being so lazyyyyy...

I was counting on him + Shadow's slot to carry the game when I was mislynched.

I should have never assumed town knew what they were doing. I should have fought my mislynch harder. I should have pressed my Prism paranoia further.

I should've I should've I should've I should've I should've I should've I should've I should've I should've I should've

Sigh

[Grendel]

Subject: Mini Normal #1838 - Night 5

Mafia doesn't have an ascetic for reasons listed by Implosion. I obviously disagree on the strongman point-scum having no counter to not just one but two cops and a jailkeeper does not seem balanced to me. X-night/oneshot strongman seems likely to me and while I hope Zoro jailed DF but the way he said "If boring flips a blocking role" does not inspire me with confidence that he didn't jail me or BV instead. People seem to be viewing ascetic as a negative utility role which is not necessarily true-any separate title for role has power in itself, but there's more. Purpose of the ascetics was to counter the scum neopolitan. While it works against town's cops too, I find it difficult to see a setup in which scum only has neo, where it has town counters via ascetics and JK (three ways to block), and scum has no counter to cops or JK except through JK jailing a cop.

Gee, I can't wait for the remaining two townies to completely miss the post where scum!Prism drives home that "Zoronos probs didn't jail Dier last night", and that "Dier is probably a strongman anyway so..."

Also notice how hard Prism pushes Night actions/kill speculation on previous days, but here he just out right dismisses it! lol.

Outside of that post, and 3126, Prism contributed nothing of substance to the game D5.

[Grendel]

@Dierfire

Great job defending yourself?

I mean, I wasn't much better, but...

[Grendel]

Subject: Mini Normal #1838 - Night 5

He's not a full strongman. That's *WAY* too powerful. Makes the jailkeeper a negative-utility PR until he dies.
He's not a full roleblocker. Also way too powerful, and mutual roleblocks are often avoided as a design principle.
He's not an x-shot strongman because he'd likely have used his shots already and I still think it seems too much.
He's not an x-shot roleblocker for the same reason, he'd already have blocked on previous nights I think.

I've been burned way too recently by taking the paranoid approach of "well, this person would have to be a mafia strongman to be scum, but that's probably the case." Literally that exact line of thinking got me to mishammer at 3p lylo, and it got me thinking about pr pseudoresults in general. That game was somewhat different because it turned out that the jailkeeper claimant was scum but the principle is the same. I think we need to trust the jailkeep. My instinct is that {cop, deputy, jailkeeper, ascetic, ascetic} vs {neapolitan, goon, goon} is balanced enough. It's only three town power roles; that's basically the bare minimum that will be accepted in a 13p mini normal anyway.

I'm gonna need to re-evaluate everything here, I think. Which is a little awkward since I'm V/LA Sunday-Friday. But hopefully I'll be able to find time/energy during that. If not then I will afterwards.

HOW CAN IMPLOSEN MAKE A POST LIKE THIS THEN ACTIVELY WORK AGIANST IT BY VOTING THE PERSON THAT _THIS_ POST SHOULD HAVE CLEARED???

AND NOT HAVE BEEN AT ALL SUSPOUS OF HIS TERIARY SCUM READ PUSHING AN OPPOSING CASE TO GET DIER LYNCHED?

HOLY BALLS IMPLOSEN!

Like this game should have been a cakewalk for you!

You also didn't hard defend BV nearly enough because that is 100% the target mislynch tomorrow imo.

[Grendel]

I'm nominating Prism for MVP win or lose.

Speaking of which, I'm looking for recruits for his cheer squad. Signup in thread.

#teamprism

B-but he said I w-was nonsensical, and got me lynched

Really tho, you guys are underplaying Prism's play pretty hard. I think that he did a good job staying under everybody's radar. He also presented some good pseudo logical cases against ppl, and effectively identified a town tell D1 (at least people viewed it as such this game) which he took advantage of into D3 (The "why isn't anybody sorting me" bit). Basically I think that he did a really good job appearing unassuming, and townly, with out going so over board that ppl begin wondering, "why is this dude still alive". While I'm not a fan of bussing, I think he did it hard and long enough that its helped him in the long run.

I still want town to win tho. Sorry boring.

Re: the replace out thing. Yes, I think Prism over reacted, but no, I don't think it was intentionally done for town cred. It was the unfortunate side effect (for town) that Prism soft skinned reaction to Shadow lead to Prism getting town read.

[Grendel]

Regarding your replace out, everyone wants to be townread for their awesome play and not because of some silly reason like saying they replaced out. But when something like that happens, as town I can't ignore it. I really don't think that if you and Boring were the scumteam and Shadow kept insisting that you be lynched back to back (even if he was a little overconfident about it), I think you'd find some way to wiggle out of it rather than decide to replace out because you got caught. But as town, I could see you in the heat of the moment thinking "that's it, I'm done with this guy" and post a replace out request.

Whelp you guys were right, the entirety of Town!Prism boils down to "Scum wouldn't replace out". I guess I just had too much confidence in Black void. He clearly isn't evaluating Prism at all, or at the very least, just enough that he can justify hand waving him.

Is it just me or is the most successful scum strategy lately been, 1)Garner as much towncred as possible the first couple days 2) Lurk into lylo 3) Flood the thread with content 4) win

Look at Prims play. He gets solid town reads the first couple days due to his pushes, desire for interaction, and ending with bussing LUV. After that his productivity drops significantly on days three, four, and five. Now he is in lylo and spamming the thread with content. And at this point... I really don't see him losing.

[Grendel]

This

should

have been town's game yesterday.

In the post game I'm going to congratulate town for losing an auto-win situation. That takes

real skill

.

...idk if I'm finding this whole situation so absurd that it is funny, or so absurd that it is insulting.

What I do know that if I lose this game I'll be on a four game losing streak. Which hurts a bit.

[Grendel]

If Shadow was scum, he likes to fly pretty close to the sun.

Also, his actually subbing out would never happen if he was scum.

Spoiler:

That's a weird kill.
Definitely made to frame boring.

Brilliant, all the lynch baits got all the good PRs :/
VOTE: Nn

Mind=blown

Lil Uzi Vert

,

Mafia Goon

, was lynched Day 2.
It is now Night 2. Please PM all night actions to me by the deadline, or bold them in your associated private thread.

Deadline

: (expired on 2016-10-29 08:44:00)

Only if bastars mod hadn't put 2 town ascetics, had this scum fuck day 1.

Boring is most likely town.

I've been giving boring a free pass so far because people seemed to be a soft target and people voting her because of her previous games as scum.
When I attacked LUV on day 1, boring had a "problem" with it.
I think one of [boring, prism] has to be scum because of LUV's readlist.

I pretty much am confirmed town.

This Boring defense parallel struck me as strikingly similar. When she defends herself from both me and Shadow, her first instinct is to ask 'are you even paying attention?' 'Are you trying?'

Spoiler:

Not out of character. DF lynch wasn't likely to happen and I wasn't going to no lynch.

So you think both scum were voting Df but you still vote him anyway?

Are you even trying at this point?

1) I had already stated intent to hammer DF, and he was at L-1. It was absolutely going to happen. Why do you think people fell for your stupid fake-hammer? Remember? You fake-hammered DF, and then

you

hopped off the wagon

first

at the least suggestion from Implosion, taking Dier from L-1 with intent to hammer to nothing special.

2) I was talking about the Grendel wagon having 1-2 scum on it. You know, the one that had the conf. town support, and was a counterwagon to DF? The one ripe for sheeping? The one you sheeped? That wagon. Grendel's. Grendel's wagon.

3) I'm voting Dierfire because I think he's scum with you, and I'm waiting for you to ditch his wagon just before the lynch

again

. Of course, there's also the problem that for reasons far beyond my comprehension, no one seems open to the idea that you're scum. Even if you're just really, really bad town, he remains likely scum. I figure having everyone watch you leave his wagon again will help my case. If you do somehow follow through this time, that's great too. I see it as a win-win.

From before the CC:
Boring was doing little / no scum hunting. She joined the Zoronos wagon (3rd there). Aside from questioning his logic once or twice, she loses interest in Zoronos fairly quickly. She joins the Penguin wagon (also 3rd) and aside from her rainbow read list (putting Penguin as her top scum read) she spends the next 15 posts without engaging with Penguin again.
After the CC:
She votes Eager with little to no thought about the CC (literal minutes between SS announcing and her voting Eager). She drops Eager (previously a 2nd to top town read) to her biggest scum read with little to no explanation, thought, consideration... nada. This feels very opportunistic.
Also, this:

@town? - eager has been coasting,

and the only thing in the way of my gut scumlean was the fact that he had an uncc'd claim.

A cc from an obvious town player was more than enough reason to vote him.

She is specifically referring to the period of time

before

the Shadow CC that she had a scumlean on him. This directly contradicts her read list from that period of time (where snake was her second to top town read).

...
If you bothered to open an ISO, you'd see that I've been pretty clear about my feelings regarding eager's claim.

That being, he was an uncc'd town claim, which left unchallenged, left him as a prime night kill target

(because of the probably confirmed town status).

As I also stated several times, if he lived to tomorrow, I'd re-evaluate. So for Day 1, uncc'd regardless of how untown he seemed, I didn't feel like I had much choice but to accept him as confirmed town.
...

Further contradiction. He's probably confirmed town without a counter claim - yet in 1037 (when there was still no CC) she has a scumlean on him.
Fishy. Fishy fishy.
I had a slight scum read on Boring before the CC. The most quantifiable thing is that her read list felt hinky to me (like she was posting it instead of actually scum hunting). There was also a gut feeling, which is more difficult to quantify.
Snake also pointed out that he parked his vote on Boring the entire day - and nobody nibbled - meaning 0 scum tried to hop onto the wagon and test the waters (implying that Boring herself is scum, causing the lack of interest in her wagon). I like this logic a lot.
Fin.

So, you haven't been paying attention like, at all? Hopefully when this trip is over, I'll have time to go through and show you point-for-point where you've clearly glossed, ignored, and misrepped. I realize this isn't the first time you've gotten totally confused in this game, but geez.
It's like you're pretending to be Zoro, except Zoro actually brought up some valid concerns (unfortunately for me).
Anyway, my request stands. Please wait for me to come back and post if y'all get to the point of intent to hammer on me. Or just lynch eagerSnake. Either one works.

As for Prism:

The bolded in the first quote reads as helly manipulative.

He's apparently forgotten 2927, too.

Spoiler:

The only thing scummy from BV so far to me is what I stated above so

this 3 way is a lot more about either convincing me you're town or convincing me Shadow showed he was scum.

This was supposed to go at the very end of that post, directed at nn, rather than in the middle and directed at BV.

Alright, that basically removes any doubt I had about the Shadow slot. Black gave that list in 30 mins, there's no way he faked it. Those reads were legit and I doubt it was convenient to keep the same reads as scum. Maybe he could have gone back and revised just one/two but there's no way the whole thing is fake.

I feel bad for DF since I literally have barely read anything he's said and basically haven't even given him a chance, but at this point I really don't think I need to. If boring flips town then I'll be forced to as that means I'm wrong on one of Zoro/nn but I'll cross that bridge if we get there.

VOTE: boring

Yeah I'm seriously considering this path.

@BV - can you explain why you had a scum read on Prism before you entered the game?

I re-read the sub out fiasco. At the moment, it looked like Prism may have wanted to leave because of Shadow's aggressive treatment. Maybe he felt this way because he felt personally attacked - and wanted to sub out - even though he was scum?

That, coupled with the fact that Shadow was a ballsy jerky player all game, why the hell would he sub out if he were scum? The's the kind of person that would LOVE teeing off the town as scum.

Plus there's this.

Also, playing with clueless newbies like nn isn't really thrilling either.

You don't say this on your way out as scum. If you're scum, you're secretly happy that I'm lost because you're taking credit for confusing me. You're not going to insult me because you successfully confused me - doing so undermines any confidence you (rightly) should have derived for sending me through so many loops all game if you were scum.

@BV - I think we've been scum reading each other incorrectly. I think that I'm still alive because I'm a bit of a VI (meh...) - Prism felt he could manipulate me with a hard town read on me.

wait, wait, what?

Does this mean that nn30 is self aware enough th realize that he has been pocketed by Prsium up until now?

Like whoa...

[Grendel]

This could change everything. o.o

[Grendel]

I knew pp was town by his tone all of day 1 I forgot what I had gamma as

You were worried because Gamma didn't look as ob!town as you had expected.

Where's implo.

Yea!!!

We could have gotten potential auto if you guys didn't decide to run me up all the way to L-1 AFTER PP threatened hammer. Now we're a couple guys short. I still think my cop choice was okay; people were suspecting implosion for the reasons I chose him.

Will you ever forgive me Gamma?

I feel like I screwed you over really badly this game.

[Grendel]

Yeah it wasn't an auto win.
But you guys deserve to lose after lynching the guy who couldn't have made the kill.
Why you voted DF after you had convinced yourself he wasn't scum, I'd never know.

B/C he assumed that Zoronos decided to block somebody else... for some reason? B/c his tertiary scum read said so?

lol

Late to the party, podo forgot to send me the invite for a little~ not reading most of this though. This was never auto-win. Calling it that and saying town lost it is silly. At 9p it was me (confirmed), Zoronos and PP (pseudo-confirmed but not technically confirmed) and six unconfirmed townies. Calling it autowin means that you're trusting in townreads on at least two of the unconfirmed... and that is not what autowin means. If we'd lynched scum that day, Zoronos or PP could have "cleared" one more person, and it still wouldn't have been autowin. Have some more thoughts but alas I'll probably post more in here later.

Please do. I was very disappointed with how D5 went down, and want any commentary I can find of why those actions took place.

I simply can't understand why everybody would assume that Zoro wouldn't block the person he announced he was going to block.

And I can't understand how

you

could come to the conclusion that there is no more scum power, but still lynch the slot that was most likely to be blocked that night.

[Grendel]

Also, Implo, you yourself recognized that the D1 gymnastics Shadow would of had to do to be scum would be monumental. That would have put Shadow off the radar. Given Zoro's playstyle I would view it as extremely unlikely that he'd go after somebody other then his previously stated target. So that should have taken DF off the table. You were Con!town. So that would have left Prism, and nn30.

While it wasn't _technically_ an auto win, it was close enough. Common sense, and going with probable conclusion, would have won the game for town.

[Grendel]

I was always under the impression that your name was an oxymoron boring.

[Grendel]

BV's posting has gotten really good lately.

Just wish he didn't take so long to kick it into high gear.