Mini Normal 1843 - Endgame

[Raskolnikov]

meh. sotty sounds flat, but iso could fit investigative i guess.

[Raskolnikov]

VOTE: Hoopla

lets just wagon all my nulls please

[Raskolnikov]

dont entirely clear cloud tbh but EMers are a pain in the ass to deal with

[MariaR]

dont entirely clear cloud tbh but EMers are a pain in the ass to deal with

I recent that remark
and HA TOLD YOU ALL TOLD YOU ALL
Scoty be town now lets lynch BV or Jaack ty sheep Maria 2k16

[Raskolnikov]

your scumreads are ultra bad and I wouldn't even be surprised if sotty turns out rolecop or something.

[MariaR]

your scumreads are ultra bad and I wouldn't even be surprised if sotty turns out rolecop or something.

Stfu rask and let me LIVE

[CloudKicker]

LOL this is how you can misunderstand everything and jump to conclusions in a nutshell. Jaack you have been wrong on me the whole game, i didnt actively read sotty content but she still kept throwing shade to me, like i evocated several times in my recent posts and you still somehow ignore all of this and 180% on your whole game scumread. You also didnt even left the vote on her for a claim nor did you comment on her claim but that you didnt visit. Depending on the flip means that i would probably be a good nk target if it flips scum and not if it flips town.

Heres how inconsistent you are :

-Jaack foses me all game for light reason, never go into details, he hardfos sotty and pushes on her
-I am showing intent on hammering sotty, asking a claim
-Jack unvote and ask me why i showed intent/scumread her
-I show why i felt like sotty is having a scumplay atm and how her reads on me makes 0 sens
-Jack then doesnt think about sotty being mafia from his firsts reads, he should actually tr me for being his top sr's sr, she even included us both in multiple scumpool
-He litterraly flip onto me 180d just because of a few posts, going back to all his reads and doesnt comment on sotty's claim more than that.

I asked sotty to claim, your scum read, and you fos me for it

Well, if its all a misunderstanding then you should be able to answer my questions.

First, why did you want sotty to claim if you didn't want to lynch her?

I wanted information to then evaluate if i wanted to lynch her. Sotty has been on the spotlight for a while and she got L-1 extremely fast so i wanted a claim, we both know she wouldve have to claim today anyway so nothing wrong in claiming early. I wasnt going to speedhammer regardless of her claim, if thats your question. You can disagree with my playstyle or motivations but this is exactly what happened, so take it or leave it

[BlackVoid]

On Sotty7's claim - I don't buy her night actions. It seems too much of a co-incidence to me that one of Sotty7's biggest antagonist was nightkilled and the other was tracked by her.

It seems more likely she's scum, figured out that TwoFace and Jaack were her biggest threats during the night, killed one, and rolecopped/tracked the other.

[BlackVoid]

I see the unvote but whatever.

I'm a tracker, I tracked Jaack he didn't go anywhere. It was a toss up between him and twoface. I realized twoface more of a me read and a couple of people told me that I was tunneling so I ended up going with Jaack as he was my next best read.

This makes absolutely no sense by the way.

If you've got a read that nobody is believing you on, then you use your night actions on that person to catch them and hopefully prove that they are scum. You don't switch around to a more popular scumread.

[mhsmith0]

Votecount 2.05

Raskolnikov (1)

Sotty7 ,

goodmorning (1)

Hoopla ,

Hoopla (2)

goodmorning , Raskolnikov ,

Creature (1)

VictorDeAngelo ,

BlackVoid (1)

MariaR ,

CloudKicker (1)

Jaack ,

I Am Innocent (1)

goodmorning ,

Sotty7 (3)

BlackVoid , I Am Innocent , Creature ,

Not Voting (1)

CloudKicker ,

Day two deadline is Friday November 18, 1 PM PST. (expired on 2016-11-18 13:00:00)

With 11 alive, it's 6 to lynch!

[/size]

[Raskolnikov]

Gm was voting hoopla.

[Sotty7]

I see the unvote but whatever.

I'm a tracker, I tracked Jaack he didn't go anywhere. It was a toss up between him and twoface. I realized twoface more of a me read and a couple of people told me that I was tunneling so I ended up going with Jaack as he was my next best read.

This makes absolutely no sense by the way.

If you've got a read that nobody is believing you on, then you use your night actions on that person to catch them and hopefully prove that they are scum. You don't switch around to a more popular scumread.

Check my ISO again and you'd find Jaack and Twoface were relatively even in my suspicions towards the end of the day. That's why it was a toss up.

[goodmorning]

@BV: Trackers and Cops are 2 very different things.

[Hoopla]

Eh, I'm not super sold on the Sotty claim (I'd probably believe a VT claim from her 100% of the time here, and would expect her to claim something like this as scum), but the good thing about having two PR's claimed, is scum can't really afford to not NK them if they're town, which will aid us in PoE calculations as we may not have to test either of those claims.

[mhsmith0]

Votecount 2.06

Raskolnikov (1)

Sotty7 ,

goodmorning (1)

Hoopla ,

Hoopla (2)

goodmorning , Raskolnikov ,

Creature (1)

VictorDeAngelo ,

BlackVoid (1)

MariaR ,

CloudKicker (1)

Jaack ,

Sotty7 (3)

BlackVoid , I Am Innocent , Creature ,

Not Voting (1)

CloudKicker ,

Day two deadline is Friday November 18, 1 PM PST. (expired on 2016-11-18 13:00:00)

With 11 alive, it's 6 to lynch!

[/size]

[goodmorning]

8 non-hoopla people aren't voting hoopla


i don't like it

[I Am Innocent]

I'm not sure I believe the claim either but there are other scum out there.

unvote sotty
Vote hoopla

[Creature]

Thought I unvoted, but whatever.

VOTE: Hoopla

L-2

[BlackVoid]

I still think Masons and an additional investigative role is a bit much. I'd expect something non-investigative like 1-shot BP, bodyguard, vanilla cop or some sort of weak role to counter.

With that said, I seem to be alone in this battle and there are other scum left so for now

VOTE: Hoopla (Lynch - 1)

I'd also lynch Rask and MariaR but for some reason both seemed to be getting townread a whole lot.

[goodmorning]

vanilla cop is investigative bv

also rask is probably too ridiculous to be scum

--

ugh guys stopp making wagons i like gross

[Jaack]

On Sotty7's claim - I don't buy her night actions. It seems too much of a co-incidence to me that one of Sotty7's biggest antagonist was nightkilled and the other was tracked by her.

It seems more likely she's scum, figured out that TwoFace and Jaack were her biggest threats during the night, killed one, and rolecopped/tracked the other.

With this as an assumption, you would also essentially have to assume that victor was scum as well. Neither TwoFace nor I would have been very likely mason partners for victor (I was voting him at the end of the day and TwoFace had a pretty nasty back-and-forth with victor). If sotty was a role cop, that would mean scum had two assets to find a mason and used neither of them for that purpose. I find that hard to believe.

I guess sotty could be a scum tracker with victor as a mason, but I definitely can't see sotty as a scum role cop with victor as a mason.

I'm still concerned with cloud. It seemed like for most of the game whenever someone gave the slightest whiff that they thought he could be scum, he would immediately start scumreading them back, but 1447 seemed like a big shift away from that. My mental narrative is that I actually hit something that scumcloud knows is legitimately scummy and could stick and he shifted to damage control, but I'm struggling with where to go further with this.

As for the Hoopla wagon and related breakdown of the sotty wagon, I'm actually feeling more confident in sotty being scum at this point then I was when I unvoted (where I was starting to doubt myself due to cloud's activities). D1, the BBT/GI wagon stalled and people unvoted on occasion, but it never collapsed at any point. The sotty wagon, meanwhile, collapsed as soon as I unvoted and started looking elsewhere. I think that points to some scum bussing but looking for an easy out. There's a lot of 'not totally buying that claim but whatever' going around as well which I think feeds into that theory as well. As for hoopla herself

I think lynching sotty is probably our best option at this point. There's been too much doubtcasting on sotty's claim to make it a neccessary target for scum N2 if she is town. Double that if we don't lynch scum today.

VOTE: Sotty7

[Raskolnikov]

Though, if sotty is town that doubt won't matter as much if it gets to massclaim, it can be judged there via setup spec. It would be an easier choice if the PR claim was strong, but tracker is what makes this problematic... it's weak enough that another weak role would still be considered balanced without knowledge of scum power (ex: RB). And unlike cop has almost 0 use unless actually success in track. But still.

[Creature]

I don't think we should lynch PR claims.

[Raskolnikov]

Actually, I think jaack is scum now. He was one of my top townreads but my old picks for scum don't as much sense anymore.

VOTE: jaack

[Raskolnikov]

I really liked his entrance and early analysis so I had put him away and stopped looking at him, but he feels fake to me now.