California Trilogy - Dantès in Fresno (Game Over!)


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Post Post #1725 (ISO) » Thu Nov 15, 2007 8:40 am

Post by Gaspar »

Talitha wrote:You think Thesp wouldn't ass-kiss a scumbuddy? Why? I think he would be trying not to treat his scumbuddies any different to how he treats the townies.
In my experience, talented & experienced players who buddy up to me are somewhat more likely to be scum (such as MoS in a recent game, where he died as scum and I died as town). I've also been shown to not really pay attention to people who aren't pinging on my scumdar but who

At any rate, to address your point: If you're claiming to believe that Thesp treats scumbuddies and townies in the same way, then you're admitting that interactions between Thesp and anybody aren't a strong (or even particularly viable) tell. To say "Well, this seems like something Thesp would do to a townie, but he could have done it to a scumbuddy" or vice versa destroys the whole point of analyzing the interactions.

I already pointed out that Thesp didn't really try to get on anybody's bad side, so I'm mostly looking for what makes you distinguish a Thesp-Glork interaction from, say... Thesp-Talitha or Thesp-CES. Since you were talking about Thesp/Glork using a single post, I took a look at what Thesp said about you:
Gaspar wrote:In fact, Tally, I think he mentioned or interacted with you less than just about anybody. Literally the
ONLY
interactions are where he quotes you and says you win here and indirectly defends you here and here (note also more "let me buddy-buddy up to Glork" behavior in this post as well) while attacking DaniBanani.
...and I took a look at your interactions towards him (which I just cited in the above post).



I guess, to sum up, my ultimate point is that your attacks on me make no sense from my perspective because A) PWS made perfect sense; and B) Your attack based on Glork/Thesp relations is indistinguishable from Thesp's interactions with multiple other living players in the game, yourself included.
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Post Post #1726 (ISO) » Thu Nov 15, 2007 11:52 am

Post by Mr. Grey »

Deadline:
Approximately 23.5 hours from this post.

Vote Count:
6 to lynch.

Zindaras: 3 (Gaspar, PookyTheMagicalBear, Sarcastro)
PookyTheMagicalBear: 2 (foolinc, Talitha)
Dragon Phoenix: 1 (Setael)
Sarcastro: 1 (Dragon Phoenix)
Setael: 1 (IH)

Current Condorcet Winner:
None. Current Smith Set: Dragon Phoenix, Gaspar, IH, PookyTheMagicalBear, Sarcastro, Setael, Silent Lee/the silent speaker, Talitha, Zindaras

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Post Post #1727 (ISO) » Thu Nov 15, 2007 6:26 pm

Post by Silent Lee »

DP wrote:Please state where I said what you are attributing to me (DP implied that if one dies, Skruffs must hang next)?
DP wrote:Still a very dangerous gambit, because the moment a mafia role blocker dies, Skruffs hangs.
I probably should have said "looks like" instead of "is", I'll grant you that.
Then you concede that you meant to accuse me of concocting a frame job of Talitha? Then I repeat my demand that you put up or shut up.

Little splinters like that make me more comfortable with the idea of DP-Talitha scumgroup. By extension Setael moves down. By the way, i find the criticism of me for not voting bizarre; I
have
a condorcet, after all, and Zin is not at the top of it. Remembering that DPscum was a probable consequence of Gasparscum, the establishment of DPscum would make Gasparscum more likely, so my new condorcet:
Vote: Talitha
, DP, [Pooky, Gaspar], Setael, [Zindaras, Sarc], IH, foolinc, no lynch, me
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Post Post #1728 (ISO) » Thu Nov 15, 2007 7:52 pm

Post by Dragon Phoenix »

Learn how to read, Silent Lee. Looks like =/ is. And the fact that you do not vote but ooooh have a condorcet means squat. It is also because of non-voters like you that we are possibly heading to another stupid no lynch. A Talitha vote at this stage does not contribuet either. I also note that you carefully avoid the question in my post from which you quote snippets.

I prefer a Pooky lynch clearly over a Zindaras lynch, but will switch to Zindaras before the deadline if that's what it takes to get as lynch. So:

Unvote Sarcastro
Vote Pooky
, Sarcastro, Setael, Silent Lee, IH, [Gaspar, Zindaras, Talitha], Foolinc, DP, No lynch
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Post Post #1729 (ISO) » Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:38 pm

Post by Sarcastro »

Pooky is clearly pro-town. Zindaras, Foolinc, and Gaspar are all better lynches than Pooky, although I suppose only Zindaras is really realistic at this point.

For future, we should probably work on trying to lynch people before the deadline.
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Post Post #1730 (ISO) » Thu Nov 15, 2007 11:02 pm

Post by Talitha »

Now Glork there's two different things there. I didn't say I believe Thesp treats townies and scumbuddies in the same way. He is a good player so it would be close, but I would expect subtle differences (keyword = subtle). Buddying-up is not subtle and I would expect a good player to only do this based on what is written in the thread, rather than buddying differently with town than with fellow scum. JMO.

Why have two people now said that Pooky is pro-town like it's a fact? I feel like I'm missing something.
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Post Post #1731 (ISO) » Thu Nov 15, 2007 11:20 pm

Post by Talitha »

Damn.. I'm starting to think DP is right about Sarcastro. Sarcastro instead of Silent Lee.
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Post Post #1732 (ISO) » Thu Nov 15, 2007 11:27 pm

Post by Talitha »

I don't know how to / whether to try and change my vote. I'm scared that it's me and Pooky in a tie right now. I don't think Zindy is going to get lynched by the condorcet method. The last condorcet info Mr Grey posted showed a tie between PookyTheMagicalBear, Sarcastro, Silent Lee/the silent speaker, and Talitha.

If it's me, goodnight and so long everyone. I hope foolinc is not evil and the town gets to fight for one more day.
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Post Post #1733 (ISO) » Thu Nov 15, 2007 11:30 pm

Post by Talitha »

Last positive action:
unvote
vote: Pooky
, Gaspar, [Silent Lee, Foolinc, Sarcastro], Zindaras, IH, Setael, Dragon Phoenix, No lynch, Talitha
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Post Post #1734 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 3:14 am

Post by Setael »

Can someone summarize the case on Pooky? I've felt he was town all game. It feels like every wagon is on a townie... I don't want a mislynch but I hate that I'm only given crap options for deadline lynches.
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Post Post #1735 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:28 am

Post by Mr. Grey »

Deadline:
Approximately 6 hours from this post.

Vote Count:
6 to lynch.

PookyTheMagicalBear: 3 (Dragon Phoenix, foolinc, Talitha)
Zindaras: 3 (Gaspar, PookyTheMagicalBear, Sarcastro)
Dragon Phoenix: 1 (Setael)
Setael: 1 (IH)
Talitha: 1 (Silent Lee/the silent speaker)

Current Condorcet Winner:
None. Current Smith Set: Dragon Phoenix, Gaspar, IH, PookyTheMagicalBear, Sarcastro, Setael, Silent Lee/the silent speaker, Talitha, Zindaras

To view the complete table of pairwise results, put this information in this form.
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Post Post #1736 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:52 am

Post by Gaspar »

That's quite the Axis of Evil post. I don't like it one bit. Vote stays on Zindaras; somebody is almost certainly protecting him at this point.
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Post Post #1737 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 7:47 am

Post by Setael »

Ok. I did a quick reread of Zindaras and Pooky. I'm really not seeing Zindaras as scum, and though I think there are 2 players (you know who I'm talking about) that are WAY better options than Pooky, there's a chance Pooky is scum. More so than Zindaras anyway. I especially don't like his arguments against Zindaras late today. If he's being apathetic across the board, it's hardly a scum tell.

Anyway. More comfortable throwing my weight behind a Pooky lynch than a Zindy lynch.

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Post Post #1738 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 7:52 am

Post by IH »

I dislike the way that this pooky wagon has started up literally right before the deadline. DP is going second in an attempt to make sure there's a condorcet leader.

unvote, vote:Zindaras
, DP, Setael, Talitha, Sarcastro
Untrod Tripod (7:27:18 PM): you enjoy whoring
xcaykex (7:27:24 PM): yes
xcaykex (7:27:26 PM): i know that
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Post Post #1739 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 8:24 am

Post by Zindaras »

I found Gaspar's defiant requests for me to claim very interesting, especially since I was nowhere near a lynch. Gaspar is reaching, and he's trying to force a claim where none is required.

Vote: Gaspar
, Silent Lee, [IH, Sarcastro, Talitha], Pooky, Dragon Phoenix, No Lynch, foolinc
Show
Finished: 159 (120 Town, 33 Mafia, 5 Other, 1 Cult, 4 Cultivated)
68 Wins, 71 Losses
Town: 52 Wins, 54 Losses (2 Wins as Cult)
Mafia: 13 Wins, 15 Losses (1 Win as Cult)
Other: 3 Wins, 1 Loss (1 Win as Cult)
Cult: 0 Wins, 1 Loss
Cultivated: 4 Wins, 0 Losses
59 Survived, 31 Lynched, 60 Killed
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Post Post #1740 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 8:35 am

Post by Mr. Grey »

Deadline:
Approximately 3 hours from this post.

Vote Count:
6 to lynch.

PookyTheMagicalBear: 4 (Dragon Phoenix, foolinc, Setael, Talitha)
Zindaras: 4 (Gaspar, IH, PookyTheMagicalBear, Sarcastro)
Gaspar: 1 (Zindaras)
Talitha: 1 (Silent Lee/the silent speaker)

Current Condorcet Winner:
None. Current Smith Set: Dragon Phoenix, Gaspar, IH, PookyTheMagicalBear, Sarcastro, Setael, Silent Lee/the silent speaker, Talitha, Zindaras

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Post Post #1741 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 8:39 am

Post by Sarcastro »

Claim please, Zindy.
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Post Post #1742 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:42 am

Post by Dragon Phoenix »

Why claim please Zindy? Why not Pooky?
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Post Post #1743 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:56 am

Post by Zindaras »

Sarcastro wrote:Claim please, Zindy.
No.

No.

No.

Get it?

No.

I see absolutely zero reason to claim.
Show
Finished: 159 (120 Town, 33 Mafia, 5 Other, 1 Cult, 4 Cultivated)
68 Wins, 71 Losses
Town: 52 Wins, 54 Losses (2 Wins as Cult)
Mafia: 13 Wins, 15 Losses (1 Win as Cult)
Other: 3 Wins, 1 Loss (1 Win as Cult)
Cult: 0 Wins, 1 Loss
Cultivated: 4 Wins, 0 Losses
59 Survived, 31 Lynched, 60 Killed
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Post Post #1744 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:58 am

Post by Zindaras »

And, yeah, I agree with DP on this one. A Pookslynch is more likely than a Zindielynch at this point, since I'm not voting him and a switch in votes there puts him at Lynch-1.
Show
Finished: 159 (120 Town, 33 Mafia, 5 Other, 1 Cult, 4 Cultivated)
68 Wins, 71 Losses
Town: 52 Wins, 54 Losses (2 Wins as Cult)
Mafia: 13 Wins, 15 Losses (1 Win as Cult)
Other: 3 Wins, 1 Loss (1 Win as Cult)
Cult: 0 Wins, 1 Loss
Cultivated: 4 Wins, 0 Losses
59 Survived, 31 Lynched, 60 Killed
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Post Post #1745 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:59 am

Post by Silent Lee »

Learn how to read, Silent Lee. Looks like =/ is.
You did not repudiate your use of the extraordinarily loaded word "frame". My reading comprehension is fine, thanks for asking.
And the fact that you do not vote but ooooh have a condorcet means squat.
BS. It means my opinion is counted at deadline. In other words, it's essentially as good as a vote.
A Talitha vote at this stage does not contribuet either.
So I'm wrong for voting my suspicions because it's not helping you steer the lynch where you want it to go? No thanks.
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Post Post #1746 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:00 am

Post by Talitha »

Condorcet Method Results
There has been a tie. The winners are: Gaspar, PookyTheMagicalBear, Silent Lee/the silent speaker, and Talitha.
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Post Post #1747 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:02 am

Post by Talitha »

There's approx 1.5 hours until deadline, I think. Let's at least get a lynch.
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Post Post #1748 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:09 am

Post by Gaspar »

OH MY GOD, ZINDARAS IS SUCH SCUM. FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, SOMEBODY KILL HIM PLEASE.

He has been one of, if not
the
leading vote-getter all day, except right until now, and he asserts that a claim hasn't been necessary? If Saetel wasn't so damned stubborn, and if MBL/TSS didn't insist on putting their vote somewhere useless (sidenote: This fits with my meta on MBLscum, and I've definitely noted it -- assuming I survive the night, I'll actually go through and point out the specific reference to my meta on him, but for now I'll just point to Mr Stoofer's "Face-To-Face Mafia" in New York -- you can find it all there), you would probably be DEAD already. I mean, I know it doesn't matter because you're scum, but if you're town, you should have claimed long ago so we wouldn't be in yet
ANOTHER
single-digit-hours-to-lynchy situation with nothing in place.

Zindaras, you are
OBVIOUSLY
content to let this town just sit around in their stubborn rifts. No claims, no lynches, keep on killing people off at night. And now, instead of doing something productive, you throw OMGUS at me less than 24 hours before day ends. I cannot believe that other players are so blind to this. It really seriously infuriates me.
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Post Post #1749 (ISO) » Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:10 am

Post by Gaspar »

SiLee wrote:So I'm wrong for voting my suspicions because it's not helping you steer the lynch where you want it to go? No thanks.
No, you're suspicious because it's the protown thing to do to try to secure a lynch. You have Pooky above Zindaras on your Condorcet, and it is obvious that Tally is not going to be lynched.

By the way, is this MBL or TSS?

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