STEVEN UNIVERSE 2 - GAME OVER

[Reasonably Rational]

Question: How sure are we that this is single-ball?

V never gives confirmation of single-ball, but I'll eat three eggs in one bite if this game turns up multiball.
I'm positive it's not.

Plus, you people who keep on thinking, "X is scum, and Y also is scum, but they're attacking each other" keep jumping to the wrong conclusion. It's not "opposite scum". It's not even "bussing scum", not yet anyway.

It's that you're wrong about one of your scumreads, and might be right on the other one, but are definitely wrong on at least one.

Go ahead and ask me how I know this.

How do you know this?

-Cerb

[Not Chara]

Firebringer is tone-reading and his townread of me didn't warrant any examination, in my opinion. he's still very town.

[Firebringer]

It probably is single all, I am guessing 5-6 scum team with possible SK but doubtful

[Not Chara]

It probably is single all, I am guessing 5-6 scum team with possible SK but doubtful

what about a third party with a win condition independent of town and scum? i'm just thinking of examples, i don't want to start guessing what Varsoon might do based on nothing.

i'm treating the game as one with a single scum team until i see evidence to the contrary.

[Firebringer]

Faction wise I don't know how you make two scum groups from this flavor wise.
Unless you split home world factions by gem allegiance.

I see it as just home world vs Earth, with possible SK of Jasper

[Firebringer]

Actually jasper being against home world wouldn't make sense much in flavor either I think.

[Yume]

Faction wise I don't know how you make two scum groups from this flavor wise.
Unless you split home world factions by gem allegiance.

I see it as just home world vs Earth, with possible SK of Jasper

Do not mention Jasper in front of me. >.>

[Almost50]

Probably a dead Mcmenno.

Almost love, I would 1v1 you.


Your OMG wha!!! post was really really fake. Again if you thought he accidentally claimed lie detector, In what world town you says so ? and why?

P.edit

Bleeeeeh

Either you're very very bad SCUM or just plain very VERY bad a player in general, and I don't think you're a bad player.

Like, some addressing the MOD .. in PUBLIC .. asking them to CONFIRM A ONE-SENTENCE CLAIM. Who THE FREAK would be missing that? Now even if one scum player was too busy staring at their own toes, others won't be.

On the other hand, a TOWN DOCTOR who has also been too busy watching the stars to read through the entire thread would have, and they wouldn't have had someone else to point it out for them.

This is but just ONE example of a town motive to out the LD, but it clearly was NOT the reason why I reacted that way. I'm going to hold on to my own reason of that reaction, but I'll tell you it was genuine and had a touch of disbelief.

[mastin2]

Fuck it, further preview time.

Varsoon very much dislikes the swinginess inherent in multiball, but this is the first game of ths size that he's ran, so it's certainly possible.
-Cerb

See this comment?

This comment is literally everywhere in his iso.
EVERYWHERE.
Not this exact words.
This exact type of comment.

People will be asking all these questions about things.
Cerb will try to appear helpful, useful, by answering them...
...But instead of actually giving a hard stance on them, he gives a nonanswer.
He gives something noncommittal, something that looks like it is answering the question but is meant to leave the player with just as much doubt as what they had before, only with the impression Cerb was helping them.

And it's not just on mechanics.
On players? Same thing.
On reads? Same thing.

He will take the fence.
He will stay in the middle.

There's a difference between him keeping cards to his chest, there's a difference between him being cautious, there's a difference between him having a slow start, there's a difference between him carefully considering issues to come to an eventual conclusion...

...And him doing literally fuckall of nothing.
He is doing nothing. He is trying to appear like he's doing something. But he is doing. absolutely. nothing. Nothing. Nothing of substance. When Cerb is town, he has the close reads to his chest, caution, slow to start, with him carefully weighing issues...but he actually comes to hard stances eventually. All of his prodding and poking (which he DOES, mind you! He prods and he pokes, he asks questions, he tries to make inquiries here and there) has a point, has an objective, as he fact-checks, as he tries to find answers, as he tries to progress the gamestate.

But here, instead of that proactive self...his play is completely, and entirely, REACTIVE. His play is completely and entirely without push. He is doing nothing but answering. He isn't asking. Just answering.

And that pattern has been in the game for FAR too fucking long for this to be an abnormality in Cerb's towngame.

This is Reasonably Rational as scum.

This is a dead repeat of what he did in Gistou. Look there at the non-Bins posts to get a fair idea of what he did and wasn't doing.
He tried to appear helpful.
He answered mechanical questions.

But he didn't scumhunt.

He's not scumhunting here.
He hasn't been.
Just answering.

[SnarkySnowman]

Well, now I'm like 35 pages behind wp guys

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

Fuck it, further preview time.

Varsoon very much dislikes the swinginess inherent in multiball, but this is the first game of ths size that he's ran, so it's certainly possible.
-Cerb

See this comment?

This comment is literally everywhere in his iso.
EVERYWHERE.
Not this exact words.
This exact type of comment.

People will be asking all these questions about things.
Cerb will try to appear helpful, useful, by answering them...
...But instead of actually giving a hard stance on them, he gives a nonanswer.
He gives something noncommittal, something that looks like it is answering the question but is meant to leave the player with just as much doubt as what they had before, only with the impression Cerb was helping them.

And it's not just on mechanics.
On players? Same thing.
On reads? Same thing.

He will take the fence.
He will stay in the middle.

There's a difference between him keeping cards to his chest, there's a difference between him being cautious, there's a difference between him having a slow start, there's a difference between him carefully considering issues to come to an eventual conclusion...

...And him doing literally fuckall of nothing.
He is doing nothing. He is trying to appear like he's doing something. But he is doing. absolutely. nothing. Nothing. Nothing of substance. When Cerb is town, he has the close reads to his chest, caution, slow to start, with him carefully weighing issues...but he actually comes to hard stances eventually. All of his prodding and poking (which he DOES, mind you! He prods and he pokes, he asks questions, he tries to make inquiries here and there) has a point, has an objective, as he fact-checks, as he tries to find answers, as he tries to progress the gamestate.

But here, instead of that proactive self...his play is completely, and entirely, REACTIVE. His play is completely and entirely without push. He is doing nothing but answering. He isn't asking. Just answering.

And that pattern has been in the game for FAR too fucking long for this to be an abnormality in Cerb's towngame.

This is Reasonably Rational as scum.

This is a dead repeat of what he did in Gistou. Look there at the non-Bins posts to get a fair idea of what he did and wasn't doing.
He tried to appear helpful.
He answered mechanical questions.

But he didn't scumhunt.

He's not scumhunting here.
He hasn't been.
Just answering.

Yeah, we've been engaging his reads in the hood. He's about where you are, minus of course your God awful read on him.

If he is scum, he's going to bus NC or Cakey soon. No point in eliminating the scum that will bus. That's even supposing RR is scum, which he's not.

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

Well he's pro Creature scum though too.

[Reasonably Rational]

Fuck it, further preview time.

Varsoon very much dislikes the swinginess inherent in multiball, but this is the first game of ths size that he's ran, so it's certainly possible.
-Cerb

See this comment?

This comment is literally everywhere in his iso.
EVERYWHERE.
Not this exact words.
This exact type of comment.

People will be asking all these questions about things.
Cerb will try to appear helpful, useful, by answering them...
...But instead of actually giving a hard stance on them, he gives a nonanswer.
He gives something noncommittal, something that looks like it is answering the question but is meant to leave the player with just as much doubt as what they had before, only with the impression Cerb was helping them.

And it's not just on mechanics.
On players? Same thing.
On reads? Same thing.

He will take the fence.
He will stay in the middle.

There's a difference between him keeping cards to his chest, there's a difference between him being cautious, there's a difference between him having a slow start, there's a difference between him carefully considering issues to come to an eventual conclusion...

...And him doing literally fuckall of nothing.
He is doing nothing. He is trying to appear like he's doing something. But he is doing. absolutely. nothing. Nothing. Nothing of substance. When Cerb is town, he has the close reads to his chest, caution, slow to start, with him carefully weighing issues...but he actually comes to hard stances eventually. All of his prodding and poking (which he DOES, mind you! He prods and he pokes, he asks questions, he tries to make inquiries here and there) has a point, has an objective, as he fact-checks, as he tries to find answers, as he tries to progress the gamestate.

But here, instead of that proactive self...his play is completely, and entirely, REACTIVE. His play is completely and entirely without push. He is doing nothing but answering. He isn't asking. Just answering.

And that pattern has been in the game for FAR too fucking long for this to be an abnormality in Cerb's towngame.

This is Reasonably Rational as scum.

This is a dead repeat of what he did in Gistou. Look there at the non-Bins posts to get a fair idea of what he did and wasn't doing.
He tried to appear helpful.
He answered mechanical questions.

But he didn't scumhunt.

He's not scumhunting here.
He hasn't been.
Just answering.

So, after answering grapes post, I resolved to ignore the wholly specious case against our slot, but I'll address this part at least:

This thing you're pointing out? This emptiness of things, and mechanical helpfulness in the early game?

This is what I do early game. You know why that was my play in gistou? Because it was early game.

Look at *any* of my games mastin. You're somehow scumreading me based on a trait of my play which you know exists throughout all my early games(with the possible exception of Bloodborne, because I was actually trying really hard to be townread there so I could go on adventures). Self meta is bullshit, of course, but you can do your own examination. Hell, EVERY single one of you who has been talking about how we're scum EASILY has enough experience with our play to know this.

ALSO.

In Gistou(like in this game) I had a job where I can't just sit around and spend all day "probing" more, until the evenings(which have been busy), and the weekends(like now, which is when I'm planning on actually attempting to accomplish something. I can see why that might make it more obvious that I'm mainly making posts of the sort that bother you, because the posts that take work are less frequent, but it doesn't change the fact that insightful deep scumhunting is NOT anywhere close to what I do early game.

An accusation that I'm scum because I'm not scumhunting in a "standard" manner D1 is worthless, and you *should* know that.

-Cerb

[mastin2]

Also, I just did a brief skim of my past games with Cerb.
Past-me agrees with present-me.
Past-me has a perfect accuracy at reading Cerb.
Past-me saw the exact same things as present-me is seeing.
As town, as scum, I did check both, and these were Reasonably Rational games (not Cerb as an individual games), and the readings couldn't have been clearer.

I mean.
I could do a much more thorough readthrough, to confirm absolutely that I'm not misattributing things, but I'm pretty damn positive I haven't lost that touch.

This is not the same RR from Steven Universe.
This IS, however, the same RR that I saw in SC's game.

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

Also, I just did a brief skim of my past games with Cerb.
Past-me agrees with present-me.
Past-me has a perfect accuracy at reading Cerb.
Past-me saw the exact same things as present-me is seeing.
As town, as scum, I did check both, and these were Reasonably Rational games (not Cerb as an individual games), and the readings couldn't have been clearer.

I mean.
I could do a much more thorough readthrough, to confirm absolutely that I'm not misattributing things, but I'm pretty damn positive I haven't lost that touch.

This is not the same RR from Steven Universe.
This IS, however, the same RR that I saw in SC's game.

And this is not to me.

Meta can kiss my ass.

Now, if you'd let me do my thing or compromise to your highest priority lynch (SC) we can lynch scum....or you can wreck my plans. One or the other.

[Reasonably Rational]

Also, wtf mastin? I *DON'T* have firm stances on thing this early fucking ever. There is NO evidence of, well, ANYTHING. How many kills have we seen? How many flips have we seen? 0. You know what that means? I can't make *any* proper speculation about the setup other than vomiting out what I've chatted with Varsoon about privately regarding multiball(generally when I was bitching to him about someone elses multiball game).

I mean, at least now I understand *why* you're misreading my play, it's entirely because of my fucking job keeping me from actually playing mafia, so that's something I guess.

-Cerb

[mastin2]

Scum excitation would be trying to look as helpful as possible.

(Psst. Guess who's done this all game?)

I should clarify something, btw: the point I made against Reasonably Rational applies

almost

as well to SirCakez. He's been on the defensive, the reactionary, all game long. There's been no prodding, no poking, from SirCakez. Iso him to see this for yourself. It's nonexistent. Everything he does has a disconnect: he'll post, and then post more, and all his posts are words which look good...but lead nowhere. He's doing nothing with what he's saying.

That's why SirCakez is scum.

[mastin2]

As for the event triggering the -2 stress: an extension of me being a miller I suppose is that my event power instead of raising stress lowers it by two. That was my trigger. (I know, Varsoon said that in general, town events will raise stress and scum events will lower stress. But mine didn't. Dealwithit.) It was a pro-town power, I assure you, best used early rather than later especially given that I'm going to die early this game regardless.

Generally, anti-town Episode Events and outcomes will move the stress meter towards 'Tragic Destiny.'
Pro-town Episode Events and outcomes will move the stress meter towards 'Slice of Life'.

Quoted From the first post. Why did you lie there ?

Um.
I didn't?
Read again.
Generally, anti-town events move the stress towards Tragic Destiny.
My power moved it 2 towards Tragic Destiny.
Generally, pro-town events move the stress towards Slice of Life.
My power didn't function that way.
Negative stress is tragic destiny, isn't it?
I was under that impression.

[Reasonably Rational]

As for the event triggering the -2 stress: an extension of me being a miller I suppose is that my event power instead of raising stress lowers it by two. That was my trigger. (I know, Varsoon said that in general, town events will raise stress and scum events will lower stress. But mine didn't. Dealwithit.) It was a pro-town power, I assure you, best used early rather than later especially given that I'm going to die early this game regardless.

Generally, anti-town Episode Events and outcomes will move the stress meter towards 'Tragic Destiny.'
Pro-town Episode Events and outcomes will move the stress meter towards 'Slice of Life'.

Quoted From the first post. Why did you lie there ?

Um.
I didn't?
Read again.
Generally, anti-town events move the stress towards Tragic Destiny.
My power moved it 2 towards Tragic Destiny.
Generally, pro-town events move the stress towards Slice of Life.
My power didn't function that way.
Negative stress is tragic destiny, isn't it?
I was under that impression.

(I'm going to do the thing you're scumreading me for yay!)

Negative stress means LESS stress which means town is not stressed which means Slice of Life.

Positive stress means MORE stress which means town is extra stressed which means Tragic Destiny.

(See Varsoon. I totally told you that was confusing and needed clarification)

-Cerb

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

Scum excitation would be trying to look as helpful as possible.

(Psst. Guess who's done this all game?)

I should clarify something, btw: the point I made against Reasonably Rational applies

almost

as well to SirCakez. He's been on the defensive, the reactionary, all game long. There's been no prodding, no poking, from SirCakez. Iso him to see this for yourself. It's nonexistent. Everything he does has a disconnect: he'll post, and then post more, and all his posts are words which look good...but lead nowhere. He's doing nothing with what he's saying.

That's why SirCakez is scum.

Full heartedly disagree. Every post is doing something from SirCakez. They scream he is failing scum. His whatever it is towards our slot is not solving the game, but rather giving him an excuse to hide. He's filtering everything through that impossible lens so he can walk back his reads later.

we agree that Cakey is not progressing the game forward but not in any way but he does convey things when he talks.

[Almost50]

I also dislike Almost50's unexplained townread on me (and Skybird, to an extent). If you don't/can't comment because neither of us have posted much, fine, but why is that worthy of a full townread? Townlean on Xk is also bad.

pedit: Someone explain the Almost50 townreads to me? Is it just because of the joyride?

I'm starting to get annoyed by TOWN players sticking their noses where they don't belong.

1- My reads are MINE, and mine alone. If you don't like them, go get your own read list.

2- Sometimes explaining shit is anti-town. You don't NEED to know the WHY if you don't know it already. We're not talking in our own PT -because we don't have one to start with- but rather talking to the whole list of players, both town and scum.

3- I'm not always right, and I never claimed I was. If I'm wrong about someone in my town reads though, that might as well be you. Then someone else will ask the same questions about any given set of players.

Why don't you ask Yume why she put you in her town pile? Why not as farside/grapes why they put you in null-town?

Fine. I took a wild guess and figured you might be a specific character that's definitely town-aligned, and the degree of towniness is related my degree of certainty you rolled that particular character.

Where would YOU put YOU on the list if you were me??

[mastin2]

What the fuck is wrong with you?

Her alignment. (No, it's not town.)

[McMenno]

So McMenno has not answered my question about his claim. Noted.

Farside, if you still wanna ally, I'm totally up for it. You could also go with Skybird, she's town.

I also dislike Almost50's unexplained townread on me (and Skybird, to an extent). If you don't/can't comment because neither of us have posted much, fine, but why is that worthy of a full townread? Townlean on Xk is also bad.

pedit: Someone explain the Almost50 townreads to me? Is it just because of the joyride?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... er_sort=Go

VOTE: Reasonably Rational
Since Klingon isn't happening

good fire, good fire

VOTE: Klingoncelt

This is an acceptable wagon.
Basically, the lynches that I'd want today are SirCakez (highest), RR (second), Klingoncelt (third), Cooldog (fourth), Xkfyu (last I'd desire), or as a last resort, Not Chara.

So, not my first preference.
But definitely lynchable if we can't get majority on better options.

Scum lynches are scum lynches, so as long as it's one of the above being wagoned, we're mostly good. (Mostly, in that one will flip town.)

what happened to your desire to lynch not chara?

[mastin2]

Won by murdering us because we were the only slot suspecting them.

Don't bring up a game where I'm scum and expect me to let you paint it in that light, no matter the reason, Titus.
I killed you because you were conftown and I couldn't let you live.
Otherwise, never woulda touched you. Your 1v1 with me was IMMENSELY helpful: it created so much noise, so much friction, so much heat, that it was doing nothing but making me look townier with every post. Attacking me was only damaging your rep. Attack me was only HELPING me.

So, take my advice, Titus: Please trust me, don't attack Not Chara.
You're not doing yourself any favors with it.

[Almost50]

Dude you called creature sheeping me after calling me scum for having no posts distancing, in what world ? How does that makes any sense other than I am trying to force something hastily in my narrative?

I'm not quite sure if you're talking about global warming here or about the struggle in South Sudan, but I assure you my smoking has no effect on the OPEC oil pricing. And this will be the end of this conversation. Thank you very much. Next, please.