meanwhile this is the most obvious scum/scum interaction ive ever readIn post 225, toolenduso wrote:Not sure whether I've used this particular way of looking through things in an MS game before...I'd lean toward no. I think I actually approached it this way because I'm fresh off a game night where me and a couple other scummers played Resistance. I won't go into the details of how that game differs from forum mafia, but suffice to say that when scumhunting in that game you need to look at things a little differently. Specifically, you have to watch for ways that people make choices that seem to align them with certain other players.In post 206, Keyser Söze wrote:This is an interesting way/reason for town-leaning Tyler the Creator [based on the nature of him being mass-town-read]. I kind of switch off to the popular town/scum reads on D1. Have you found this observation-method accurate in previous games?
Mini 1787: Peruvian Nightclub Mafia (Game End!)
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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toolenduso Mafia Scum
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Didn't look it into it nearly as deeply then.In post 2548, Tyler the Creator wrote:tool you used that same exact case on me day 2
Three days between the post you're talking about and my next vote (which was on xyzzy). And I was posting in the interim.In post 2548, Tyler the Creator wrote: - fucked off for a week
Well, a couple things. First, you made good arguments against a couple of my points in #772 and successfully talked me back on the read a little bit. Second, I was in the middle of doing a bunch of game research when I posted that -- looking back at interactions with HA and vice versa. What I came away with was that other people looked worse than you.In post 2548, Tyler the Creator wrote:and came back to see town wasn't buying into it and dropped that read like a bad habit the rest of the game
And then D3/gambits/claims happened and blew everything up.
Third, I never really tried pushing you. So it's not that I was pushing to get you lynched and nobody responded. It's that I was doing research and found you looked worse than I thought, but still not as bad as other players so I pushed them instead of you.
I'm not saying you lurked out D1, I'm saying you lurked at very specific moments of the game. And I'm not talking about Keyser at all right now in fact, I'm talking about HA. So I'm not sure how your interactions with Keyser are supposed to make a difference here.In post 2549, Tyler the Creator wrote:also your theory about me lurking out day 1 is first of all bs and also falls apart to reason when you look at how i was perfectly comfortable interacting with keyser from very early on in the game and questioning him sometimes relatively hard on shit"Half of the game is figuring out who the scum is. The other half is convincing everyone else that you're right." -- PlaysWithSquirrels, in Newbie 437-
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toolenduso Mafia Scum
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All right gonna look at the Dunn gambit now. Timeline: Dunn claimed cop in #1634, Jake cc'd in #1638, Bins claimed voyeur in #1691 and Dunn retracted in #1693.
Tyler's immediate reaction is fine:
He does research, engages with both, generally seems to be trying to get one of them to admit that they're wrong. After Dunn retracts, Tyler asserts that Dunn is town:In post 1656, Tyler the Creator wrote:so no respectable setup review would sign off on two cops
jake's hammer gave me more PR vibes than scumvibes
his investigation is more believable than dunn's (hip gunning here)
brb gonna check how they progressed with their reads on robert day 1 and 2
Eh I'm not finding anything really that scummy-looking here unfortunately, he played it well. The only thing is that Tyler sorta maybe searched around for a way to think Dunn was scum in this bolded part:In post 1730, Tyler the Creator wrote:the first thing i do if im godfather, have a good idea of who the cop is, pretty much know that they're checking me, well, it wouldn't be to CLAIM COP
it'd probably be something like
jump up and down for about five minutes
then coast to endgame on an undeserved win
something like that
Ugh why couldn't the last scum have just been jaack.In post 1751, Tyler the Creator wrote:if dunn's town i could see him being new and coming from a different site meta where bonkers shit like this happens all the time
the thought process "let me be the fall guy for the cop" isn't so ridiculous outside the MS bubble (it's only bad play in a very LAL environment)
i just wish his N1 check lined up more"Half of the game is figuring out who the scum is. The other half is convincing everyone else that you're right." -- PlaysWithSquirrels, in Newbie 437-
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toolenduso Mafia Scum
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Creature lynch. D3 was from #1614-#2255. Tyler's votes during the day were on jaack (#1802), xyzzy (#2020), Jaack (#2066), xyzzy (#2141) and Creature (#2252).
So that's right. Tyler was actually the hammer on Creature. Now to go back and look over his interactions with the slot throughout the day. I'm gonna start toward the end of the Dunn-Jake stuff, because that dominated discussion for the first part of the day.
Tyler kinda pokes at Creature here:
...but still defends him:In post 1764, Tyler the Creator wrote:sidenote; creature has posted since replacing in but has given zero content
He actually comes out against Creature, but the tone is kinda jokey:In post 1793, Tyler the Creator wrote:creature needs to post - thought keyser was town not sure what you guys are seeing there
And of course he never votes Creature until the end of the day. In fact Tyler's next vote after this one was a switch from Jaack to xyzzy. He keeps pushing creature:
Continues pushing Creature in #1871 and #1876, and more after that. Defends Creature based on Keyser-HA interactions:In post 1868, Tyler the Creator wrote:mmm yea creatures probably scum
Closest thing I see to an explanation for why he didn't vote Creature during all this is this post (the "barrier" he's talking about is Keyser hardbussing HA):In post 1880, Tyler the Creator wrote:thing is im isoing keyser and calling his push on ha bussing is sorta hard to swallow
He gets super close:In post 1909, Tyler the Creator wrote:well don't laugh because if you want me to go the creature route over jaack today then you gotta help me break that barrier
im kinda almost at that point though after looking at things
...and then votes xyzzy, because:In post 1970, Tyler the Creator wrote:pretty down to lynch creature i think
This post sums up the scum explanation for Tyler's D3 pretty nicely I think:
That gives him two options for mislynches and one for a bus in case he needs it. Throughout the day he mostly goes for the mislynches, and then at the end of the day Creature looks like the lynch so he hammers him. And it looks like it happened right up against deadline too:In post 2094, Tyler the Creator wrote:day's obviously dragging. ill vote any of jaack, xy and creature. current preference put in order for convenience.
"Half of the game is figuring out who the scum is. The other half is convincing everyone else that you're right." -- PlaysWithSquirrels, in Newbie 437-
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toolenduso Mafia Scum
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Also I am going to be going on vacation starting Friday. I'll be driving all day on Friday and I'm going to a place where I will only be able to get on the internet once a day at most. So if the game is still going by then I will take a while to respond to things."Half of the game is figuring out who the scum is. The other half is convincing everyone else that you're right." -- PlaysWithSquirrels, in Newbie 437-
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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bins can you not feel how fake this is?In post 2552, toolenduso wrote:Ugh why couldn't the last scum have just been jaack.-
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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you guys are gonna call me crazyIn post 2341, toolenduso wrote:
I mean, I agree, but why say it now if Jaack is the only scum left? As in, why say something he doesn't really need to say until later when he's at L-1?In post 2339, Tyler the Creator wrote:i mean playing into GF paranoia is one of scums very few plays to make right now so im not all too surprised
but this is the post that truly woke me up to tool scum; well just what he ended up doing around this time anyway this post was just a slap in the face catalyst kinda thing-
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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it's a boring question that tool doesn't care the answer to and that isn't logic a guy like tool would write someone off for in the first place because it's literally null
if jaack's the last scum there he'd of been saying whatever shit would stick to break out of a lynch the fact tool didn't have any paranoia about that detail..
and completely brushed off xy town telling super hard to keep right on tunneling that just doesn't come from town-
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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Tyler the Creator
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Bins Survivor
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you guys have been equal to me this whole fucking game well played
jesus why did i let this happen
even creature made you guys equal
his posts he made to the both of you were the same pretty much
he read you the same
i read you the same like "eh town but the paranoia might get to me sooner or later"
i'm probably going to end up voting for tool jfc-
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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toolenduso Mafia Scum
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Are you serious? You went back over your own ISO to find places where you thought you did a good job of looking town?
And it's working?"Half of the game is figuring out who the scum is. The other half is convincing everyone else that you're right." -- PlaysWithSquirrels, in Newbie 437-
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Bins Survivor
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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gotta be your own hypeman sometimesIn post 2562, toolenduso wrote:Are you serious? You went back over your own ISO to find places where you thought you did a good job of looking town?
And it's working?-
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toolenduso Mafia Scum
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All right lotta problems in that post about Jaack.
It's not a boring question and the answer to it wasn't null. ScumJaack didn't really need to make that argument yet, it looked scummy and when you're the last remaining scum at L-1 you usually don't do things that'll make you look even scummier.In post 2557, Tyler the Creator wrote:it's a boring question that tool doesn't care the answer to and that isn't logic a guy like tool would write someone off for in the first place because it's literally null
And further, I was pointing it out specifically because you brought it up as an argument that I didn't understand. Turns out there was a reason for that -- you wanted to justify mislynching Jaack.
This does not make any sense to me. TOF would not have made sense as a mislynch at the time. He was perhaps the least-suspected player in the game. Hence why trying to get TOF lynched was a move that might have made it more likely for Jaack to get lynched, not less likely.In post 2557, Tyler the Creator wrote:if jaack's the last scum there he'd of been saying whatever shit would stick to break out of a lynch the fact tool didn't have any paranoia about that detail..
I'm not sure what you're talking about here. You mean xyzzy's AtE? Because that was not towntelling. It was AtE.In post 2557, Tyler the Creator wrote:and completely brushed off xy town telling super hard to keep right on tunneling that just doesn't come from town
Jaack was towntelling, and you literally brushed it off. Here, look at how you responded to my question:
In post 2361, Tyler the Creator wrote:¯\_(ツ)_/¯"Half of the game is figuring out who the scum is. The other half is convincing everyone else that you're right." -- PlaysWithSquirrels, in Newbie 437-
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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Number one thing about this post and tool's posts all throughout this lylo and the last couple days even. Notice the tone.
Very defensive. A LOT of oh this logic doesn't make sense. Fuck feelings. Black and white going on.
even the initial line is scummy; the tone here is of a "oh here we go again it's so obvious all the problems with anything that have to do with my being scum"In post 2565, toolenduso wrote:All right lotta problems in that post about Jaack.
but then why respond to it in this way?
who's the audience of this post?
Yea it was. That's a very surface-level thing to read someone town for. You know it is.tool wrote:It's not a boring question and the answer to it wasn't null.
The reasoning is literally; jaack is town because scum wouldn't say "don't forget TOF might be godfather"
Your question was "why does jaack even say that as scum"
My initial post was neutral anyway - you weren't challenging any position and the answer to it bordered on rhetorical.
The answer is "why do scum do anything."
Or a shrug.
You literally put off posting content because you wanted my answer to that?
Yea, no. Please.
Oozes the fake.
1) wasn't on that mislynchIn post 2565, toolenduso wrote:And further, I was pointing it out specifically because you brought it up as an argument that I didn't understand. Turns out there was a reason for that -- you wanted to justify mislynching Jaack.
2) i invented the jaack wagon
3) i invented the xy wagon
there's a reason they still went through without my help; SCUM FUCKING INVOLVEMENT
it's because you're scum and are purposely taking my good points and weirdly trying to understand them wrongIn post 2565, toolenduso wrote:This does not make any sense to me. TOF would not have made sense as a mislynch at the time. He was perhaps the least-suspected player in the game. Hence why trying to get TOF lynched was a move that might have made it more likely for Jaack to get lynched, not less likely.
it's k
we aren't talking about mislynching TOF; we're talking about how you tried to enter into jaacks mind and instead of using a spoon to actually dig in you scrapped at it with sandpaper and collected a small sample of shavings
one of the townest posts in the thread - you not recognizing that spoke a lot about how scum you wereIn post 2565, toolenduso wrote:I'm not sure what you're talking about here. You mean xyzzy's AtE? Because that was not towntelling. It was AtE.
we've been over this within this post alreadyIn post 2565, toolenduso wrote:Jaack was towntelling, and you literally brushed it off. Here, look at how you responded to my question:
i guess now i understand why all your posts have so much volume to them; you repeat the same shit over and over again, take posts out of context and add weirdly play-by-play commentary while stretching tinfoil scum motive to it; preview it about 100 times while editing, maybe with a coffee, possibly a donut, with some jams playing in the background, laughing maniacally (like all scum do)
In post 2361, Tyler the Creator wrote:¯\_(ツ)_/¯-
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toolenduso Mafia Scum
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OK this is getting transparent af now. I'll get into the rest of it but this really stood out to me:
That is such a technicality. Look at this:In post 2567, Tyler the Creator wrote:
1) wasn't on that mislynchIn post 2565, toolenduso wrote:And further, I was pointing it out specifically because you brought it up as an argument that I didn't understand. Turns out there was a reason for that -- you wanted to justify mislynching Jaack.
Oh, you weren't on that mislynch? That's because the mislynch didn't happen that day. But you jumped on the xyzzy wagon at the same time as Dunn did and put it at L-1.In post 2329, Zulfy wrote:
This is stretched reasoning so you can argue against things you know are true."Half of the game is figuring out who the scum is. The other half is convincing everyone else that you're right." -- PlaysWithSquirrels, in Newbie 437-
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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toolenduso Mafia Scum
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And Bins, Tyler is trying to directly appeal to you in a sneaky way right now. Look at the narrative he's trying to build in this post:
Now let's look at some of the stuff Bins has said this game oh I don't know how about:In post 2567, Tyler the Creator wrote:tone ...
Very defensive ... Fuck feelings ...
i guess now i understand why all your posts have so much volume to them; you repeat the same shit over and over again, take posts out of context and add weirdly play-by-play commentary while stretching tinfoil scum motive to it; preview it about 100 times while editing, maybe with a coffee, possibly a donut, with some jams playing in the background, laughing maniacally (like all scum do)
In post 141, Bins wrote:I have a tendency to be paranoid of people who act like they know what they're doing.In post 1026, Bins wrote:WHY ARE ALL OF MY READS BASED ON GUT WE HAVE SO MUCH TO GO OFF OF
He is directly appealing to the fact that you've been paranoid and explicitly relying on your gut all game. He's openly attacking me for using logic and describing me as something insidious that youIn post 2465, Bins wrote:I'm only townreading Tool because of what he has done. Not his tone, his mannerisms, his presence.shouldbe paranoid about."Half of the game is figuring out who the scum is. The other half is convincing everyone else that you're right." -- PlaysWithSquirrels, in Newbie 437-
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Tyler the Creator
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Tyler the Creator Goon
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toolenduso Mafia Scum
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There is a reason I play this way. I've spent literally the last 11 years of my life involved in things that call on you to look at the facts before you say something. So I don't just spout off, I go back and look at what's happened in the game before I post. I do my best to make sure I'm not misremembering things. I let the evidence guide my arguments."Half of the game is figuring out who the scum is. The other half is convincing everyone else that you're right." -- PlaysWithSquirrels, in Newbie 437
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