Kingmaker II-Game Over


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Post Post #2900 (ISO) » Sun Sep 09, 2007 5:58 am

Post by Thok »

The Official "if you guys can do 10 more posts in 5 more days, we can hold two celebrations at once" vote count


Deadline: 6 pm PDT Friday, September 28


King RafK (0):


Cavane (1):
Fritzler (1):
Lowell (0): Mnowax, ThAdmiral
Mastermind of Sin (1):
mnowax (1): MOS
petroleumjelly (0): Cavane, ThAdmiral
ThAdmiral (3):
Toaster Strudel (1): Fritzler
Yosarian2 (0): Toaster Strudel, ThAdmiral
Last edited by Thok on Sun Sep 09, 2007 7:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Post #2901 (ISO) » Sun Sep 09, 2007 6:53 am

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vote: mnowax
'cuz DeadRik - need I say more?
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Post Post #2902 (ISO) » Sun Sep 09, 2007 5:26 pm

Post by petroleumjelly »

Okay, done reading K-Scope's posts.
  • 1.)
    He seemed to not want people to listen to Glork during Day Two (in the sense that he showed 'discomfort' when players such as Pablito – who turned out to be town – agreed with Glork). Glork was largely going after Pooky (which would then cause K-Scope to shift his 'suspicions' to people who
    agree
    with Glork, since he probably didn't want to bring scrutiny on himself by opposing Glork
    directly
    ), which suggests K-Scope was willing to (indirectly) defend his partner(s).

  • 2.)
    I think Post 1044 could be fairly telling. I had directly forced him to give opinions on some of the more experienced players in the game who he had been ignoring / not talking about. His response were:
    • LuckayLuck [Townie] 'undecided; he "looks good" but he's 'unconvinced'
    • Glork [Townie] is 'undecided'
    • MrBuddyLee [Townie] is leaning towards town (and note MBL was attacking Glork)
    • Zindaras [Townie] is 'town for now'
    This suggests that K-Scope was playing a very "hedge my bets"-type strategy; he doesn't want to step on any large toes this early in the game, although he does become more aggressive as the players dwindle, as I would expect scum to do as victory was probably closer to his grasp.

  • 3.) He was very reluctant to talk about or express suspicion on spectrumvoid [Scum] in general throughout all of his posts, though he did vote for Pooky fairly early upon replacing in, and left it at that. His only votes which seemed 'serious' early on were on cb0x/Lowell [alive] and Pablito [Townie]. I would bet his 'serious' posts are indicative of scum trying to get a townsperson lynched. I will say that so far, K-Scope's comments on cb0x/Lowell bolster my thoughts that Lowell is probably town.

  • 4.) He also went out of his way to say 'he is not convinced MoS is scum' in Post 1248;, when it seems most of his other statements have been along the lines of 'I'm not convinced so-and-so is
    town
    '. This could easily be happenstance of the manner in which questions were posed to him, though.
    -->
    However, I will note that this seems to be a response to
    Glork's
    case on MoS, Post 1282 which suggests that K-Scope's main objective at this point in time was to undermine Glork. Seeing as Pooky was dead at this time, if he is indirectly defending somebody here it is most likely to be one of MoS (the person he wanted "smited") or possibly Nightson (now Toaster Strudel).
    -->
    Sidenote: He does use the same terminology when talking of me in Post 1318, though. It is noted in this post that he is propounding a very similar view of Fritz ("Fritz is just being Fritz") instead of taking a firmer stance on him – I can understand the position coming from a townsperson (obviously) but now that he's come up scum it might mean he was simply trying to avoid talking about Fritz in the first place (in the same manner he avoided talking about spectrumvoid).

  • 5.) He goes after Dead Rikimaru/Smashy almost his whole Kingship. Hmm. I will have to read through Day Four again, because this is
    awfully
    reminiscent of how he treated Yosarian2 on Day Seven – and it seems K-Scope's main 'strategy' (if I can call it that) was to 'set up' lynches for later, by subtly keeping his doors open ("I'm unconvinced") and then kicking people when they were down, as evidenced by his attack on DR-King, his attack on Zindie-King and his current attack on Yos2-King/me. He never really let go of his mnowax2 vote when DR/Smashy was replaced – reminiscent of his early Pablito vote (which he meekly dropped once Thesp replaced in, I have noticed).

  • 6.) Keeping with tradition, when K-Scope analyzed Yos2 when I gave everybody assignments, he says Yos2 "leans towards scum", and he hedges his bets with "mixed feelings" about
    me
    . As soon as I misexecuted, he jumped on me, and immediately took up the "Yos2 + PJ" chant (see Point #5 above). His interactions with Yos2 from yesterday does
    not
    look like a scum being bused by his partner – it looks like scum trying to stir trouble and then realizing he slipped up, so he tries to gloss over things by being as vague as possible.

  • 7.) Overall, it appears that K-Scope had a particular order of calling for executions. The general pattern seems to be:
    K-Scope's general pattern wrote:1.) Go
    most
    strongly after a townsperson (Pablito, and perhaps cb0x/Lowell and perhaps mnowax2).
    2.) Leave doors open to attack/defend other townspeople as the situation warrants by making vague comments about 'suspicions'
    3.) Keep a few 'non-lynch' votes on periodically, most likely to inflate the vote count on certain players without having to actually "push" on them.
    4.) Try to be vague when talking about scum-partners
    5.) Attack people who are attacking his scum-partners (as evidenced by attacking people who agreed with Glork-King when he went after Pooky, and he attacked Zindaras-King when he was going after spectrumvoid. This could also mean that when he attacked Yos-King, it was because Yos was on-track to execute some other scum-partner, but since Yos started by putting five people on his LoE it's hard to tell who K-Scope might have been trying to distract Yos away from).
    His "non-lynch" votes have mostly been mnowax2 and Fritzler – he doesn't really "push" for them per se, but rather seems to go through the motions of saying, "yeah, you ought to execute these people". This could either be for 'soft' distancing or for trying to fluff a bandwagon so it looks more substantial.
--

Overall, my reread of K-Scope has brought me to think the following of other players:

More Likely to be Town than Before

cb0x/Lowell (early attack target)
mnowax2 (late attack target)
Yos2 (attack target on final day; interaction do not look fake)

More Likely to be Scum than Before

MoS
Fritzler
Toaster Strudel

No Big Connections One Way or the Other

ThAdmiral
Cavane
RafK

--

Of course, as I noted before, K-Scope tried to largely not talk about either Pooky or spectrumvoid, so the people without connections could in fact be more appropriate to be within the "more likely to be scum" category. Point #2, however, shows that not talking about somebody unless asked directly does not mean they are scum with K-Scope, so I won't make a firm conclusion on that.

After my reread, I will re
vote: Fritzler
. The person I am most interested in doing a reread on is MoS, at the moment – I shouldn't be forgetting that he has a knack for surviving very late into games as scum, though I obviously don't that in itself is a reason to suspect him.
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Post Post #2903 (ISO) » Sun Sep 09, 2007 7:59 pm

Post by Mastermind of Sin »

Yea, I'm surprised I'm still alive. The analysis checks out, minus the part where I'm more likely to be scum, but I can live with that.

I would like Lowell and Yos2 to comment on Cavane, please.

RafK commenting on mnowax, lowell, and TS would be nice.

ThAdmiral, can you give your thoughts on Yos2 and PJ?

Cavane, what do you think of RafK, Yos2, and myself?
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Post Post #2904 (ISO) » Sun Sep 09, 2007 9:29 pm

Post by RafK »

I think we can make 10 more posts in 5 days. I can always spam, I guess.

Much as I did every day but his king day, I find mysellf liking PJ's review process a great deal (conclusions? Maybe, because I wouldn't necessarily have followed that to a sole Fritzler vote. But the process is strong, which it wasn't for the Phoebus/VR execution or the events leading up to that- in hindsight, me being right about Phoebus and SV, Yos being wrong about Phoebus and SV and PJ being right about SV but wrong about phoebus has been been the defining conflict for how we all saw each other, and it was only Yos breaking the pattern by executing KScope that has let us cut through that for the time being.

Other than that, the last page and a half have been an orgy of voting in which someone must be bussing someone. I need to shake the ring of votes around a bit and see if it breaks somewhere.
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Post Post #2905 (ISO) » Mon Sep 10, 2007 6:58 am

Post by Yosarian2 »

Mastermind of Sin wrote: I would like Lowell and Yos2 to comment on Cavane, please.
(shrug) Meh. I wouldn't rule him out as scum, but he's not one of my top suspects at this time. Probably around 3 or 4, depending on if I put him higher or lower then Fritzer.
I want us to win just for Yos' inevitable rant alone. -CrashTextDummie
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Post Post #2906 (ISO) » Mon Sep 10, 2007 9:38 am

Post by Lowell »

Hey MoS is directing the king to check me out. Sweet.

Is there a reason I can't vote for MoS? Really, I forget.
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Post Post #2907 (ISO) » Tue Sep 11, 2007 12:46 pm

Post by Mastermind of Sin »

Yos2, could you go into more depth on Cavane's actions? I feel it's unlikely that you are scum because of yesterday, but your answer seemed very non-specific. It leaves you open to both suspecting him and not voting him at your leisure.
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Post Post #2908 (ISO) » Wed Sep 12, 2007 3:49 pm

Post by Yosarian2 »

Mastermind of Sin wrote:Yos2, could you go into more depth on Cavane's actions? I feel it's unlikely that you are scum because of yesterday, but your answer seemed very non-specific. It leaves you open to both suspecting him and not voting him at your leisure.
Yeah, it was non-specific. I don't really have a strong opinion on cavane at the moment; during yesterday, he just barely made it onto my LOE as number 5, basically because he wasn't one of the people I was interested in ruling out (like I said yesterday, those were people were on my LOE basically because everyone else looked kind of pro-town to me). Mnowax and probably Fritzer now look less scummy to me, which moves Cavane ahead just by process of elimination, but I still don't really have a strong opinion on him. He hasn't said much today, which isn't a good thing, but he really hasn't said anything I object to either.

Basically, it's not so much that I suspect him for any specific reason, it's more that I've got less reason to think he's pro-town then a lot of other people and so by process of elimination he's not a bad choice.

On another note, I (and everyone else) seems to have been basically overlooking Lowell, and now I'm not sure why. He certanly hasn't done very much recently; he's posted a few times today with votes and little else, and before that he posted, what, twice in Augest? Looking back over his posts, he looks like he's basically been pushing against theadmeral and mnowax basically forever, and that's about all I get out of him. So yeah, he's another person who's basically just a big question mark at this point, and therefore a logical suspect.
I want us to win just for Yos' inevitable rant alone. -CrashTextDummie
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Post Post #2909 (ISO) » Wed Sep 12, 2007 5:33 pm

Post by ThAdmiral »

Mastermind of Sin wrote:ThAdmiral, can you give your thoughts on Yos2 and PJ?
Yos2: since his last kingship I am inclined to believe he is town. I don't think scum were under so much pressure that they felt they had to throw one of their own under a bus at that point.

PJ: He seems to do a lot of long-form analysis. Most of the time the layout is quite good and the content seems to be okay as well. I don't really know whether this makes him more town or more scum, but I am inclined to say more scum. Sort of a "trying to look helpful" thing. On the other hand he could just be being helpful.
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Post Post #2910 (ISO) » Wed Sep 12, 2007 10:48 pm

Post by Yosarian2 »

Heh...I really don't think you can say that posting long anaylses could be called a scum tell from PJ.
I want us to win just for Yos' inevitable rant alone. -CrashTextDummie
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Post Post #2911 (ISO) » Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:30 am

Post by Mastermind of Sin »

Lowell wrote:Hey MoS is directing the king to check me out. Sweet.

Is there a reason I can't vote for MoS? Really, I forget.
:not helpful:
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Post Post #2912 (ISO) » Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:50 am

Post by Toaster Strudel »

ThAdmiral wrote:
Mastermind of Sin wrote:ThAdmiral, can you give your thoughts on Yos2 and PJ?
Yos2: since his last kingship I am inclined to believe he is town. I don't think scum were under so much pressure that they felt they had to throw one of their own under a bus at that point.

PJ: He seems to do a lot of long-form analysis. Most of the time the layout is quite good and the content seems to be okay as well. I don't really know whether this makes him more town or more scum, but I am inclined to say more scum. Sort of a "trying to look helpful" thing. On the other hand he could just be being helpful.
:not helpful:
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Post Post #2913 (ISO) » Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:51 am

Post by Toaster Strudel »

Hey let's execute someone!

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Post Post #2914 (ISO) » Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:33 pm

Post by Mastermind of Sin »

Great apathy, people! Let's keep it up!
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Post Post #2915 (ISO) » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:15 pm

Post by Toaster Strudel »

Mastermind of Sin wrote:Great apathy, people! Let's keep it up!
:goodposting:
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Post Post #2916 (ISO) » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:27 pm

Post by Yosarian2 »

The big problem here, MOS, is that we're basically trying to decide which scummy looking lurker to kill here. I don't think it's a matter of apathy, as of there just not being all that much that, say, TheAdmeral has done at all for us to discuss and analyise.
I want us to win just for Yos' inevitable rant alone. -CrashTextDummie
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Post Post #2917 (ISO) » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:43 pm

Post by Toaster Strudel »

Being very result-oriented, I'd like to suggest that we execute ThAdmiral, and perform an autopsy. A sort of forensic mafia where we learn more from the corpse than from the living player.
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Post Post #2918 (ISO) » Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:17 pm

Post by Mastermind of Sin »

RafK is not helping very much. Do we even have an LoE yet? I think most players in the game are posting more than he is...
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Post Post #2919 (ISO) » Fri Sep 14, 2007 5:18 am

Post by Thok »

I will try to do some prods and stuff tonight.

However, as promised there are two things to celebrate (or not if you so desire).

First, Kingmaker 2 is 1 year old today!

Secondly, Kingmaker 2 now has the most posts of any mafia game in MS history, passing Lights Out 2 a few posts ago.

Obviously these facts may be related.
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Post Post #2920 (ISO) » Fri Sep 14, 2007 6:37 am

Post by Toaster Strudel »

Thok wrote:Secondly, Kingmaker 2 now has the most posts of any mafia game in MS history, passing Lights Out 2 a few posts ago.
Anoint me King and I shall buck that trend like no other ruler before me! My reign will be referred to as "Toaster the Brief" in all future history books. A leader of few words - yet vigorous with the axe, generous with the guillotine, and liberal with the handing out of death sentences.
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Post Post #2921 (ISO) » Fri Sep 14, 2007 6:50 am

Post by petroleumjelly »

Huzzuh! One year anniversary!

Hogwart's March plays in background... and then dies away. And there was much rejoicing.
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Post Post #2922 (ISO) » Fri Sep 14, 2007 11:44 am

Post by Cavane »

Apologies for my away-ness. I've been quite busy the past few days with life-related stuff. I'm working on my Kscope review still, I'll have it up ASAP, as well as answer MoS' question.
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Post Post #2923 (ISO) » Fri Sep 14, 2007 1:52 pm

Post by Thok »

Fritzler and mnowax have been prodded. As far as I can tell, nobody else needs prodding.
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Post Post #2924 (ISO) » Fri Sep 14, 2007 2:13 pm

Post by mnowax »

Happy Birthday Kingmaker!
Sure one more time for fun.

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