Mini 495 - Mafia on a Plane! GAME OVER! =)

[Oman]

Hey the game started!
I'm here, I'll read the last 7 posts and post my random vote.

[Oman]

Okay.

1) Originality looks BAD! Contradiction, eager to lynch, LEAPS to defence. Almost worth a -2 vote.

2) If Originality is scum I'd be expecting a coach in there. But everyone looked clean.

3)

Vote: orginality

I just want to see what pops up scum should jump on him

[Oman]

And after a very short re-read >_> i'll first Unvote: Oman Random voting time is over. .

Who said I random voted?

[Oman]

EBWOP:
If you look at my post originality is a claculated vote, with actual reasons.

[Oman]

Oh right, I thought he was citing it as a reason to vote me.

[Oman]

Okay well that went for a while and nothing popped up.

If you copy the last line in my 1,2,3, post:

3) Vote: orginality I just want to see what pops up scum should jump on him

Unfortunatly, it was less effective than I had hoped.

Unvote

Early townie vibes from: shaft.ed

Early scummy vibes from: spurgistan. I put on a -2 vote, and he didn't even acknowledge it. Maybe hoping the lynch goes through?

[Oman]

Elais, highlight my post. You'll see there is some size 1 white text at the end that clearly states I was only looking for scum to jump on. Yes, i was taking the oppertunity, but not to lynch orginiality, but to see if I could catch the scum.

I unvoted when that didn't happen.

[Oman]

You're reaching.

[Oman]

Okay, so maybe it wasn't the best setup ever, but I at least put the text in to make sure you guys could check it if you were wondering why I was doing it.

Unfortunatly, it seems to have made me look dishonest (WTF?) I accept that it looks sneaky, but at least I gave you some point of reference. I didn't lie to you at all.


Blackstrike jumped on me for being "Vote happy" after voting only once.

Fos

Care to explain?

Yeah sure AlyG: I put on the vote because scum would probably see a giant wagon mounting and see the oppertunity to get on and put some votes down.

The whole idea was to see them vote and then unvote and catch them out. I checked the forum every 20 minutes, so a quicklynch wasn't a problem in my mind.

I think Elias is town going at the early move, and Blackstrike looks bad for jumping on like that.

[Oman]

Originality has lied and contradicted himself a few times. AlyG's post contains most of them.

I'd put it down to a newbie floundering after finding himself under heat, but the eye is on.

And Shaft.ed, you're right, scum do try to give evidence, but mostly scum give evidence after they've been caught out, to explain themselves. I stated my intentions at the time of the vote.

[Oman]

and his OMGUS attack on Shaf.ted.

WTF? I didn't attack shaft.ed at all.

You're reaching here, I suggest that vote was just to get on the latest bandwagon.

You and Blackstrike look like a pair, especially after you voted me and FoSed him, even though your reasons for me were rediculous.

[Oman]

But you didn't vote me, perhaps waiting to see if the town approves of your new stance?

Regardless, I can accept that you and the good doctor are not conclusive, but this early on, I'll look for anything.

[Oman]

Firstly:

I'm accusing you of being town.

A violent accusation. I can't believe you'd do such a thing, do you have evidence? [/Joke]

Also, I never did an OMGUS attack on spurg, Lucienne, can you cite this for me so that I can defend against it, I've reread and I'm drawing a blank.

Yeah I know that, I'm basically just saying that putting little tiny white text saying this is a trap could be done by either side as it is premeditated. In my mind it has no bearing on the action itself. If I really wanted to get WIFOMy, I could reason that it was a scum signal for your "partners" not to bandwagon the vote to. But either way, I don't think the white text matters one way or another.

Completly true, it could be done by either side. Hypothetical=Omanscum: It would be pretty stupid to communicate with scumpartners this way though. Firstly because you guys didn't notice it, so my scum partners wouldn't, and secondly that type of communication (if found) could be refered back to at any time and used to incriminate me.

Right, now onto the goodstuff:

My first thought is that Dr. Blackstrike is scummy as all get out at the moment.

1. Claims without pressure:

Um, no scum here. Just a plain old townie.

Well done! A vanillia townie claim page three is certaintly what town would do.

2. Calls me "vote-happy" after 1 vote, which is less than almost everyone else.

3. I don't like his interaction with Lucienne, the FoS from

him

her and then Blackstrike saying "I wouldn't be suprised if she was scum trying to frame me" pretty much setting up for an early bus with the eventuality of "Lucienne was scum, so I must be town".

I don't really know which to vote between them, the only thing that tips it is that claim, its such an anti-town move.

Finally, I don't think Elias is scum here. Starting the wagon on me when originality had a wagon going strikes me an quite pro-town. Scum probably would've tryed to keep the wagon going (as per my phailed trap)

Unvote (if I was) Vote: Dr. Blackstrike HoS: Lucienne

[Oman]

Streeflo, I checked it wasn't in the rules first. Thanks for not modkilling me.

Elias, what makes it a scumtell is that any townie would have to be an idiot to do it. Basically it tells the scum two things (and this is assuming the player is a vanillia townie) 1. They are not a powerrole 2. They are not worth a NK.

It basically benefits only the scum, do you feel like you know a whole lot more knowing that he is a vanillia rather then a doc or a cop?

If Blackstrike is town, he's foolish. But I'm more sold on the idea of a scum trying to look town, than a town.

[Oman]

Its the same as lieing, bad town do do it sometimes, but 90% its scum.

I'd be willing to bet that this is the same thing sometime townies roleclaim early, but 90% of the time, its scum.

[Oman]

Why, AlyG, because it was a setup. But no-one would belive me if I said it later. I was essentially breadcrumbing, but not a role. I was breadcrumbing an idea and an action.

I don't see why everyone is so against it.

[Oman]

You and Blackstrike look like a pair, especially after you voted me and FoSed him, even though your reasons for me were rediculous.

Um, no scum here. Just a plain old townie.

Though I wouldn't be surprised if Lucienne was scum trying to frame me that way.

Please explain how this scenario has any merit.

Well if you come up scum (which is a pretty large IF at the moment) then everyone says "Oh she buddied up to blackstrike, they must be partners" The other scenario is if he comes up town you look more townlike.

Also, Oman didn`t put originality at -2? Oops. Nonetheless, at the time, I never saw why he voted for originality, since he wasn`t giving any of his own reasoning, just bandwagoning, it seemed.

....Yeah. You're 100% right. It was a bandwagon. Tell me, whats one thing that makes you 99% sure someone is scum? Hammering on a quicklynch. -1 on a quicklynch is pretty close after. My goal was to get the scum to bandwagon behind me and catch them out. "Just bandwagoning" is pretty much the point of what I did. Bandwagoning is one of the most useful tools at the towns disposal.

If Oman could give a more thorough explanation of his originality vote now, I would be greateful.

Bandwagon...thats all it is.

[Oman]

If Blackstrike is town, he's foolish. But I'm more sold on the idea of a scum trying to look town, than a town.

So I guess I'm stupid then...

No offence, I mean if you're town its a stupid play, not you're a stupid person <3!

So I lied. I'm not a townie. I'm something else. There, happy now?

-Doc "Watch, I'll get in more trouble for that" Blackstrike

So...you're a psychic.

Seriously, you claimed V townie and that was bad enough, cause it gives the scum a better chance at hitting REAL powerroles. And then you claim a powerrole...which is even worse. I'm gonna assume you were joking about not being a townie.

My vote still stands

[Oman]

His name is Dr. Blackstrike he wasn't claiming doc......I hope :gasp:

[Oman]

....Oh god! We're screwed. Either way Blackstrike is not making things easy.

Now he's claiming Post restrictions.

[Oman]

This is because he is pretty much defending himself with an attack. That is scummy IMO.

Actually this is how I swing it as town. Basically I want to know that even if I'm lynched or NKed everyone knows my thoughts. Really, scum prefer to defend themselves (they only care about staying alive) rather then risk letting scumbuddies slip for when they're lynched.

I disagree with this on premise, and feel he is merely attacking me and originality due to the fact we are the biggest wagons so far.

IGMEOY vamp

Why is that not a vote? Because its not always a scumtell. And I want more then just lurking to hang someone pg 6

[Oman]

"I want to lynch someone" ......!!!!!!


!!!!!!
!!!!!


I'm voting this guy right? Good.

[Oman]

Its in his sig, its the same for each post.

[Oman]

I can't beleive that everyone thinks scumhunting while under attack is scummy. If I was scum (as I've said before) staying alive is a number one priority. Dybeck, I don't think your situation is logical as to go after eachother D1 to the point that one of us gets lynched would be dumb if we were scum.

[Oman]

Wait I missed that.

Oh, he does say that. I like how vamp is making aggressive assumptions on me without even knowing whats going on. Really town work.

[Oman]

Okay, I've been mulling it over, whether Vamp really did think my attacking while defending was scummy or whether he was scum merely looking for a reason to jump on my wagon...my result is this:

Unvote blackstrike

Still very suspicious of him though.

I'd like to vote vamp but -1 or -2 or whatever it'll put him at is too close page 6.

[Oman]

Yes scum distancing happens. But D1 and this intensly, it doesn't seem logical. Vamp has jumped on me and hasn't really looked elsewhere (a small glance at originality). I doubt a distance would be so intense so early with the exclusion of all others.

I understand our misunderstanding in the "scumhunting under attack/jumping on wagons" but I'd like to point out that since I've been attacked I haven't jumped on one easy wagon. Except maybe for my look at vamp, but i didn't even put the vote down. I was the first (and only) to vote for Blackstrike, so don't acusse me of jumping on wagons to save my own ass, cause I'm quite simply, not.

[Oman]

I could see spurg trying to save vamp here. I know I'm town, so no worries, but vamp is looking scummier, much scummier, than me.

[Oman]

Another theory: (hypotheticalvamp=town) Spurg is scum who is trying to defend me and vamp so if either of us die he can say: SEE I TOLD YOU. Which gets him town cred.

If hes doctor, he's hurt our chances. If he's vanillia, hes crazy.

[Oman]

The other option AlyG is to say "unvote but will go back on if vamp doesn't talk" clearly states your intention, keeps pressure on, and avoids "mislynch" (which I doubt with vamp)

[Oman]

Look, i'm gonna assume this is one of your first games, (join date), so you're still learning (as am I, shows by my horrible traps). Its nice that you admit mistakes though

[Oman]

Lucienne didn't replace Karen....dybeck did.

[Oman]

/Agree.

Just reinforcing.

Quick note, AlyG could be using this to get heat off a scumpartner. Not accusing yet, as checking lurkers is a protown move.

[Oman]

Who and where was I accused of bandwagoning to save my own arse. Point out the accusation? Well I've called you on it, now I want evidence to prove you aren't just piggy-backing off others.

[Oman]

lol no

the idea is that all my scumchat jokes die cause no-one gets the australian context i make a lot of them in (except mole, who is aussie) so I started following each joke with the phrase: aussies get me.

The moogle is there cause A) moogles rock and B) as an abstract idea that people will see and say "aussies must get it".

[Oman]

yeah of course

[Oman]

1) Yes, it prevents metagaming such as "Oman was online when the night ended so he must be scum having sent in the kill"

2) I did a thing on Vamp but got PHP'D when I posted it, it basically described his inconsistancies and consistant lurking (one thing he was consitant at)

3) The number of spanners in a sidchrome toolkit (well, only the fun aussies anyway). Also, and related, Cricket.

Dop you have anythoughts you have yet to say?

[Oman]

"You haven't seem to considered that yet"

Because me and shaft.ed aren't a pair, so why would i consider that? I got early town vibes from him because he was resisting the bandwagons and looking at the wagon-ers which is a protown move. If you wnat to give more specific evidence, I'd be happy to look at it.

AlyG is quite hoppy with her votes, voting and unvoting a lot. She doesn, however, accompany them with reasons, so its sorta null atm.

[Oman]

She does, however, accompany them with reasons, so its sorta null atm.

I realise the n at the end looks like doesn't but my finger was bandaided, so sorry.

[Oman]

What do you think it was?

[Oman]

I agree with shaft.ed, further reinforicng my feeling he is town: Originality is blatently rolefishing. I also don't feel good about AlyG (and don't accuse me of bandwagoning, I was looking at her earlier if you read it), but not voting yet.

[Oman]

Yeah, rolefishing means fishing (or searching) for players roles. Its not good because if you said for example: What is your role Blackstrike and he said "Doctor" then he's NKed for sure, or if he's lieing the real doctor might inadvertantly reveal himself by not beleiving the claim. Basiccaly, It doesn't help the town one bit.

[Oman]

One thing is that we can never be sure if he claims whether its real or not.

Also I hate this

Hey guys. After I'm dead, check out my bandwagon for a few scum who want an easy lynch.

-Doc "I'm not afraid to die" Blackstrike

Its often said by scum to avoid getting lynched as townies don't want to be painted as scummy.

Watch me Doc.

Unvote Vote: Doc "I promise I wont self-vote" Blackstrike

[Oman]

Who were you going to change it too?

[Oman]

Honestly, how does knowing whether or not he provable help the town?

Well, if he can prove himself, then we let him live. He proves himself to us N1 and we know for sure that he is said powerrole.

It helps the town in that we don't well...:

are you in the habit of lynching proven protown powerroles?

[Oman]

No, I don't buy that. Info helps town, no matter what. It might help the mafia to some degree, but most of the time, the town wil benefit.

Of course this is not an endorsment for massclaim.

[Oman]

It was my bad on the whole info thing. What I ment was more the...speculation sort of info. Like if we knew there WAS a doc we'd be better off. As the mafia would WIFOM their kill around.

Getting specific is probably where it shifts the balance, knowing WHO the doc is.

so I'm going to say speculation = town and fishing=scum. Of course, this is so broad, generalised, and untested I really don't know how accurate it is.

I'd like to second Ryan's questions on dybeck's post.

[Oman]

My appologies but: I'm not feeling an originality wagon. ATM I would swing further towards VH/Ryan.

Why am I not feeling originality AlyG might ask. Well, he seems to be a bit wrapped up in the mob mentality, a byproduct of a newbie.

Basically, he's thinking for himself, but not acting on it. I get newbie vibes from him, but no newbiescum slips. It just doesn't work for me. At this point you could probably call it gut.

[Oman]

What do you think of that post Lucienne?

I'm not Lucienne, but I don't like carrotcake's post either.

Fos: AlyG and Carrotcake

[Oman]

I did not place a death date, as I am aware that through a night action he might have a chance to prove himself.

Yeah sure...a night action will clear him. Lets go through the main ones and how it would "prove him":

Cop- claims an innocent probably (more likely to hit town than scum), which scum can easily fake.

Doc- Impossible to prove either way. He could defend someone who isn't killed. Or if there is no kill it could be down to RB, jailor, or any of a few others (not to mention scum No killing)

Vig- Could easily be SK

RB- Impossible to prove, really.

Tracker- Harder to fake a result, I'll admit, but its not really a common powerrole. Also, he could say he got a null result.

Hider- Impossible to prove.

Nah...I don't think we can rely on night actions to convict/clear Doc.

[Oman]

Gah

Unvote

I don't really have a place for this yet but suffice to say my fos on carrotcake and AlyG make it look like its going that way.

[Oman]

It's obvious i just believe that we should hang Blackstrike tomorrow and leave him to see if he really is the doctor and hope he can give us some benefit during night.

Tell me how you will see if he really is the doctor, assuming he's not NKed (it would be obvious he was doctor or not if he was NKed).

[Oman]

You did not answer my question one bit, you are strongly tempting me to vote for you.

My question: "How you will see if he really is the doctor? How is it going to prove him town?"

[Oman]

Vote Ryan

No this is not based on whatever originality was saying (WTF?)

This is based on your obvious ineptitude to read, and serious scumtells.

1 Scumtell is your attempt at bullying dybeck into not defending originality.

Players who defend another player unless they know 100% they are innocent had better be able to deal with the consequences if that said person ends up being scum

I'd be more worried about someone who defends a townie despite all evidence to the contrary (obviously informed) defending scum is something townies do, espeically if they play well. Threatening him won't solve it.

Back on Page 9 you hint at a power role, now you say you aren't claiming anything?

He claimed non-vanillia, and if you read either that post or the one above it you'd see HE'S NOT CLAIMING DOC. and also

My name is Dr. Blackstrike I didn't claim doc

is so obviously not claiming doc yet you think he's claiming vanillia.

You are rolefishing, and trying to control the town.

[Oman]

If paraphrase make sure you note its a paraphrase.

[Oman]

Yeah its just a precaution. And thanks for the compliment.

[Oman]

@AlyG:
Where do you fall on ryan so far?
Has originality done anything recently that looks scummy?

[Oman]

You want to talk about controlling the town or TRYING to control the town, let's check door #1...........ah yes its Oman.

OMGUS gets you nowhere friend.

Why am I controling the town now?

I'm trying to find out who's the scum, so if you think me making sure I don't place a vote on a power role is role fishing than I'm guilty as charged.

Firstly, what does it matter if you're voting a town powerrole or a vanillia townie? They're both town.

I had a quote paraphrased and attempted to use against me and it's laughable how Oman nor dybeck are realzing that

You fail at reading text.

No this is not based on whatever originality was saying (WTF?)

And I hate to defend other people, but dybeck never even mentions the fact that you were rolefishing.

So nice try, read the arguments on you before you defend against them and OMGUS me less.

[Oman]

EBWOP: I fail to see originalties paraphrasing as a deliberate attempt to trick the town, its too obvious and traceable.

Also:

Confirm vote ryan

[Oman]

Second modprods

LAL is different to Lynch all paraphrasers. I (again) can not attribute originality's move to malicious intent when Hanlon's Razor gives me the perfect reason not to.

[Oman]

How is this NOT trying to steer the town?

Well i asked the opinion of one player, how does that steer the town?

You are trying to get suspicion on me and off of orginality

I don't feel originality is scum atm. I feel you are. I'm trying to get PRESSURE on you. I merely asked about originality as AlyG stated her vote was standing, when I felt there were better places.

ou are blatantly trying to get people to see if I've done enough scummy things (which I haven't) to get lynched.

Then you have nothing to worry about if you are so innocent. And you mean I'm trying to get the town to scumhunt? SHAME ON ME! [/sarcasm]

Re-reading a game might help you out a little if you don't find orginality's comments early in this game very scummy

I find them noobish.

I like how a wagon started against him and than suddenly died off.

Why should it have stayed? People didn't feel he was the best choice. Are you seriously suggesting we should lynch originality?

He paraphrased a post of mine and you let him off of it without even a FoS. Why are you backing him? Scum partners possibly?

1) scum partners are more likely to FoS as a distance attempt (disclaimer: I know...WIFOM). 2) I didn't give him a finger of suspicion for it becuase....wait for it....I DIDN'T FIND HIM SUSPICOUS FOR IT! Imagine that. I assume he saw another player do it in another game and thought it looked good, upon the mimic he didn't say it was paraphrased and I cannot see that as a well thought out scum strategy! I've seent that done in other games like for example:

I'm a tool!

Its merely a new way of expressing an opinion.

Also why not include Dybeck with me and orginality, take this OMGUS thing all the way?

I'd like to finish with a strong point:

How is this NOT trying to steer the town?

Perhaps we should compare:

Players who defend another player unless they know 100% they are innocent had better be able to deal with the consequences if that said person ends up being scum

Bullying another player into voting with you (whether dybeck is town or scum I can't call this early, but as you're attempting to force him to vote with you I'd say he's town and your scum)
and mine:

@AlyG:
Where do you fall on ryan so far?
Has originality done anything recently that looks scummy?

I don't control AlyG in any way! AlyG, did you feel controlled there?

Ryan, you're not helping yourself in anyway OMGUS is not a town move.

[Oman]

@Oman: Just because originality hasn't been scummy recently doesn't mean all scummy acts in the past go down the drain. My vote stands because of what he's done earlier. And about Ryan, his blatant misinterpretation is worrying and his rolefishing earlier was also bad.

This response is heartily pro-town. Whether AlyG is or not is uncertain, but many townie-brownies in AlyG's bank for this comment

Oh and ryan just made this game a whole lot harder for us, killing on four votes. Its quite possible any number of scum is on that lynch, including 0, 1, or 2. G'damn it!

[Oman]

Sigh, this is not going to look good after vollkan got into me for defending but:

Vote AlyG

That post sat all wrong with me. It was basically saying "look, doctor blackstrike is still alive, lets lynch him" when there are many possibilities:

1) He could be scum lieing to us (Possible)

2) He could be a doc, protecting the wrong person (Possible)

3) He could have forgotten to send in a night choice (unlikely)

4) He could have been RBed (unlikely, though possible)

5) He could be any other role like a cop/hider/tracker that we don't see the results of (possible (likely))

6) The scum didn't kill him in the hope that some would say what you did, or to say it themselves (likely)

So there are 6 options, and you only looked at one.

[Oman]

Regardless of whether he was doctor or not, he could have protected someone else, and you've disregarded that part entirely.

So even if you thought he was doctor, why did you think he would protect carrotcake or spurg?

[Oman]

dybeck, there are so many other solutions to that that I am tempted to vote you for being irrational. Two things saved you: The unvote and the fact that AlyG's post is still worse.

[Oman]

Because yours is full of gappy logic I thought we cleared up D1.

[Oman]

The thing about AlyG is that is smelt overly (to me anyway) of scum with a plan. Post the NK and say to scumbuddies "We'll go for BS, this disproves his claim".

The other problem I had was that the night actions did NOTHING either way of BS' claim. Like I said earlier, a myriad of possibilities are there, and you jump on one.

You think its all covered up by you thinking he was a doctor - fine, but remember that he never claimed doctor, and there are a million other roles. I would also like to point out this backtracking:

i never said or thought that because Blackstike is alive lets lynch him

.Oh Snap...

Blackstrike wasn't NKed,

we ate up his claim, he hasn't helped us at all

and now i believe his claim was a lie. He is probably scum.

I never campaigned against him

we ate up his claim, he hasn't helped us at all and now i believe his claim was a lie. He is probably scum.

and i never just looked at one option

he hasn't helped us at all and now i believe his claim was a lie. He is probably scum.

Some of the other options are the reason i didn't straight away arouse suspicion.

we ate up his claim, he hasn't helped us at all and now i believe his claim was a lie. He is probably scum.

I hope you understand.

I don't believe I do.

As you can see. By only quoting that one post I could show you where you have in fact, done every one of those things. Nice attempt.

[Oman]

Yeah shaft.ed, I'm so glad that my entire scumplan was to vote for AlyG after I planned that he make a horrible post and then stay there. My oppertunistic scumplan is gettin him under serious pressure.

:eye roll:

[Oman]

Thank you shaft.ed

I'm still extreemely suspicious of A) Dybeck for that SK comment, which his reasoning is severly flawed (in fact I can think of about 3-4 other scenarios which make more sense). One thing I'd point out is that an SK would usually open with "Hmm.. a protown vig" to leave the claim open later. B) AlyG same reasons. C) Dr. BS. He mostly fits there because he's been scummy and lurkey, but I would not support or condone any wagon on him. Its nowhere near enough.

Yes, Dybeck is A and ALyG is B and we all know what that means? .....

unvote vote Dybeck

.

[Oman]

This:

It just sounded like something a serial killer would say.

In fact, I'm pretty sure that you're a serial killer playing innocent. However, our day would be much more productive if we left you alive and concentrated on finding mafia.

Firstly, its BS that an SK would be better left alive. Nobody directs an SK and lives to tell about it, and the SK increases NKs by one. Chances are any SK will clear out many town before going down or even hitting a mafia member. This statement is NOT pro-town. Secondly, I thought the unvote meant that he realised a few things (like the countless other possibilities avaliable besides SK), but it on reread I see he was looking for "another candidate" meaning another player to be the SK.

The whole last post just rubs me the wrong way.

[Oman]

Also

Mod can we get another prod on BS please. I know he posted in the last 48, but it was only to say he got the prod

In the event that request is denied: Doctor Blackstrike: More posties please!

[Oman]

I'm still extreemely suspicious of A) Dybeck for that SK comment, which his reasoning is severly flawed (in fact I can think of about 3-4 other scenarios which make more sense).

Why not share them with the town?

1. Protown Vig
1.5 1-shot vig.
2. Jack of All Trades
3. CPR doc
4. 2nd scumgroup.

etc. etc. I admit that these are not as likely as an SK (except maybe protown vig) you didn't even think to consider them. You were definate that there was an SK.

One thing I'd point out is that an SK would usually open with "Hmm.. a protown vig" to leave the claim open later.

I'm not accusing you of deceit, but this statement is actually wrong. The first person to mention a role after it's been revealed, or done good work, is very frequently it. And that's a real tell that you can take to the bank.

Okay, but the role was not revealed. A KILLING ROLE was revealed, which means it could be (looking at the likely ones) a protown vig or an SK. Now, my comment was if he was involved in any way 10 to 1 he's say it was a protown vig. Also, by your logic. Congradulations all pro-town memebers for not being NKed. I am now a confirmed Pro-town character due to my congradulating that role.

I love the fact that you'd vote someone for being pro-SK though. Like they could be in a scum group with him

I never did so, I voted you for being anti-town.

Seriously though, if we lynch shaft.ed today, we are left with 7 alive tomorrow, and it's highly likely that 3 of them are mafia. Which would mean that it would only take one mistake, and we're dead.

Umm. You said 7 alive. So now shaft.ed isn't an SK? You said 7 alive. We have 10, so you're saying we're 1 down from the lynch (9) and 2 down overnight to 7. Dude, is shaft.ed an SK or not? You're everywhere.

Also, we're most likely at 10 total 6/3/1 or 7/3. Town/scum/SK. If we lynch town, hopefully mafia and SK go eachother and leave us in peace. If they both hit town its mafia v SK (alternativly we're at 5/3 Lylo tomorrow).

Now you must be thinking, what is his point. My point is this. Stop speculating on when we hit lylo or what happens tomorrow, start focusing on lynching scum. We have no-where near enough info to start this train of thought.
We need to find mafia today, giving them a probably voting block of 2 out of 6 tomorrow, which is a lot better for us. Seriously, shaft.ed can wait.

Does any of this make sense? I am honestly just trying to act in the best interests of the town. I know it's counterintuitive to leave an SK alive, but it's a numbers game, and it makes sense to do it here.

If we leave an SK alive, than thats 2 kills the first night. Then its another day to lynch him and another mafia NK. That means 2 NKs will come about that shouldn't've due to not lynching an SK. Its a numbers game.

[Oman]

So I suppose I'm not only the SK but also all of the pro-town powerroles.

OHNOES! Is Smalltownz!

[Oman]

Also, you need to reread my post and check your math in your last post.

Probably, do you mind if I just say you're right on the numbers and call it quits for math.

To add to Vollkan, directing the SK as if it were a vig is stupid because A) whats to stop the SK killing the town and saying "well we thought he was scum" and B) it could just be a vig. I'm sick of saying this, You have no evidence this is an SK.

Wishing AlyG posted more too.

Dybeck is still my most suspicious.

[Oman]

For once I will write this with no sarcasm: You're logic astounds me.

Unvote

Town lynch and 2 town NKs loses this for us.

[Oman]

Recounted and I can confirm: 9 alive - likely scenario:

5/3/1 (Town/Scum/SK)
Lynch
4/3/1 (Town/Scum/SK)
NK Town/Town NK Town/Scum
2/3/1 Scumwin basically. 3/2/1 Very, very dicey for everyone.

...Sigh, this will not be safe.

[Oman]

1:1:1 (we lose unless maf and SK NK each other)

Prisioners dilema. I almost wanna see it .

Seriously though...Whats the thought? Hunt scum or hunt SK? The whole town needs to go the same way on this, or we lose our "majority" part of it.

[Oman]

Good point. Very good point.

Well I don't feel like my case on dybeck or AlyG has a whole lot of power behind it, perhaps a little. But I want more than a strange accusation to lynch dybeck in a dangerous position like this (unlike vollkan I believe it to be 3 scum 1 SK). I think AlyG looks like a better candidate for SK just from the NK (although, that could be the scum NK instead of SK, in which case AlyG looks bad anyway).

And so

Vote AlyG

IGMEOY: dybeck

I feel AlyG could be either scum or SK, whereas dybeck could be scum/SK/or townie relying on a bad tell.

[Oman]

UNVOTE

! Sorry I AlyG posted her claim whilst I wrote.

[Oman]

And if you guys don't believe then go ahead and lynch me. I dare you. if you do then you have lost a valuable pro-town role.

Scummy as hell.

So is does anyone know if there is an RB or not? It would help.

Stop fishing

Guys, i'm your tracker. I tracked originality during the night and my result was that he targeted CarrotCake.

Your lack of vote on him so far says otherwise.

a) Doctor (Maybe)

He's not, and you're stupid to suggest it. Remember Carrotcaking dieing? Yeah, docs stop that.

b) RoleBlocker (Highly Unlikely)

Why so? I like the way Doctor is higher than this

c) Mafia (Biggest chance)

I agree that this is a big chance too

d) Serial Killer (Unsure of)

Also agree there is a possibility of this (I would call this second choice)

i was planning to keep my identity secret and if i immediately put a case against him then it may have looked that i know something about him and it could of may given away my pro-town role.

You didn't post any case on him today. Not a vote, not a case, and that opening post is still scummy.

unless someone can prove that a claim from Orig would be unhelpful.

I can't prove it, but I'll be Orig fakeclaims.

I doubt AlyG's claim (wow thats two this game). I doubt it for a few good reasons:
Lack of case/vote on originality.
AlyG's first post calling for lynch on someone else.

I could find examples if you want, but basically AlyG has done nothing against originality today. I see this as one thing right now: a bus brought in to get the heat onto originality and if a lynch occurs "clear" AlyG.

Vote AlyG

I don't need to hear orig claim, I'd prefer to keep our roles in the dark.

[Oman]

Gah! Sorry, that last line under Vollkan's quote is wrong:

It should read: I can't prove it, but I'll guess Orig fakeclaims (due to the bus theory, yeah?) (I shouldn't post and type in scumchat at the same time)

Also add to the doubt list:
Threatening the town.
Unprovoked claim.

[Oman]

Aye I'm with you Vollkan.

Now here is my question to everyone:

If AlyG comes up town/scum what does that mean for orig?

If Orig comes up town/scum what does that mean for AlyG?

[Oman]

You're right, without orig claiming we can't make a decision. But I'd rather lynch AlyG (firstly as he is more scummy but also) because it gives us more info and I can't think of a protown role less helpfull than a tracker (Busdriver or Gaoler maybe).

Has anyone found any powerrole tells from orig in his posts that could have given AlyG the hint and allowed a fakeclaim gambit (I admit its a rough gambit, but if he really is a powerrole it almost clears AlyG)?

[Oman]

Unvote

Just to clarify first:

Later, you do say you simulposted... what was your initial post here referring to?

Vollkan 399

I think could be a deadly gambit or true fact. I think its possible our best move would be to lynch originality if noone else comes up of course.

One reason is that his ammount of scummy so far leads me to think SK, and if he is, than we can clear AlyG. If he's town, we can clear AlyG, but if he's scum I'd be almost willing to bet this is a gambit.

I just think orig is the best option out of AlyG and Orig.

Now onto dybeck:

Can somebody please tell me why are we going for the tracker and not the scum?

This reeks of inside information. If dybeck is scum AlyG is not in my mind. He knows, or at the least accepts, AlyG isn't lieing.

ertainly I don't think I want to lynch AlyG,

Well, do you or don't you? You "think"?

the reason originality claimed vig is because he knows he'd be counterclaimed if he claimed cop,

Well, firstly, if he was scum a cop counterclaim would be what he wanted wouldn't it? And BTW there were two kills, a vig claim is increasingly stupid to make at this point. Even if he's alive today,the real vig will get him tonight. If he was an SK a vig is the only logical choice for a claim

Killing N1 doesn't bother me on a daystart game, except D1 for us was horrid.

I agree that the choice for vig was not a good one.

Right now, I believe AlyG to be town-ish other than that I'm not sure. Originality is so...all over the shop.

[Oman]

Only changed a while later when it had mostly died off.

I usually forget where my vote is and end up posting things like unvote if i was.

I'm in like....8 games now, a lot of them with the same players, its hard.

[Oman]

Vollkan, this line is what swayed me:

If Orig is scum, then we can reasonably infer we have no vig (no counters). Therefore, Orig will very likely be NKed by the other scum faction

Its stupid to lynch him when he'll die tonight anyway.

I like AlyG's chances of being town now, even though he's crazy!

Vote Dybeck

[Oman]

dybeck does make a good point about the strangulation flavour, and i don't really thing Carrotcake was that bad...but I don't really want to lynch a orig for that as this is his first vig role and its possible he's not a great target chooser.

[Oman]

Ah, a fantastic catch vollkan.

my thoughts: if dybeck is scum, orig is not (not sure how it works with dybeck =town) Its just that here: "my gut says he's not scum" he is claiming personal responsibility and here: "It's not like we didn't think he was scum yesterday." He's using a "we" to put blame on the whole town. Something? Nothing? I don't know.

[Oman]

1. You won't know if its an SK or not in twilight, I mean, they're not likely to own up are they?

2. I'm hesitant about getting the powerrole to claim when they could be mafia killed overnight, which would WIFOM AlyG.

3. Safest powerrole to claim? I'd say probably cop and the doc can protect them (assuming we have both).

4. I'd like to know who Orig's intended target is today so that we don't have to track him. This also keeps him honest, i.e. if he says he is targeting someone scummy and two really townie people die than he's at fault.

5. I understand if we lynch an SK, but what happens if we lynch town or mafia?

[Oman]

Ignore point one, I was thinking D2 lynch SK Twilight2 Powerrole claims, N2 AlyG tracks etc.

When it should be D2 lynch SK Twilight 3 powerrole claims, N3 AlyG tracks

I don't like this as A) Why doesn't the role just claim first thing that day? B) It lets AlyG live too long with no threat of a lynch. C) if we're wrong we lose days.

[Oman]

I'd hate to say it, but mini normals usually contain 3 mafia and an SK/vig. Meaning I bet its A or D and we're pretty much at lylo tomorrow.

Now...I think the best course of action would be to lynch originality based on this theory. Orig is another kill, another kill puts us in LyLo even if we hit scum today (originality is not known for his excellent vig choices). If he's SK it even worse. Based on orig's alignment either dybeck or AlyG (I'd say town heavily implicates Dybeck and scum heavily implicates AlyG).

I know we are likely to be in LyLo, but based on mini trends, we will be no matter what.

Unvote vote originality

Oh and yes vollkan, your first plan sucked .

[Oman]

We're pretty much in LyLo anyway, and yes I am assuming 3 scum cause we can go in circles looking at possibilities but I'm looking at likelyhood.

Also: SK would have target Carrotcake as carrotcake would not have implemented them at all, that is, there was no danger due to the kill. Mafia look for dangerous townies cause they can afford to lose a member due to NK link, the SK can't. Also, was carrotcake really scummy enough for you to say it was right to vig him.

[Oman]

Yes I am, an SK doesn't want attention...period (his claim also indicates something about this). Orig got pretty lurky today, and carrotcake didn't really point to anyone (someone linked to AlyG, but I hardly buy that).

I'm saying no SK would kill someone scummy if there was a someone they could kill and get away with it. The thing that really gets me is this: How scummy is carrotcake, really? And if thats his choice of targets, can we afford to give him another kill?

[Oman]

Oman's interesting notes on a late night re-read

Warning, severly under the influence of vodka

All post numbers are individual's rather than whole game counts.

Vote: originality

Carrots first is attacking orig

Carrot's second is explaining quote tags

Carrot's third is explaining future absence

Carrot's fourth is discussing my size 1 writing, saying I look town, and discussing

Carrot's fifth is discussing/building a case on AlyG

Carrot's sixth defends Blackstrike. This post (230 for reference) looks very townie to me (merely pointing out lack of scumtells). There is only one possible scumtell here "Lets just hang him tomorrow." Which isn't really a protwon statement, however, it is a drop in the ocean of scumtells out there.

Carrot's seventh is anti-LAL.

Thats it.

So tell me orig, what exactly was so scummy about carrotcake?

Also I'd like to point out that the fact that carrotcake was attacking AlyG makes this seem even more of a scumgambit to me ("I'll claim tracker, bus you and I'm clear, better yet, you claim vig and we're both off")

I could be wrong, as I could be drunken.

Carrot's seventh hits AlyG a bit.

[Oman]

On your last point, never, ever, ever rely on help from another faction. Their win condition is different to yours, and the only actions they can take are those to further said condition.

Basically, we're not in a good spot.

The best bet is to lynch orig (i say it again) the guy is a confirmed killer, which means if we don't lynch him WCS he loses the game for us and BCS we are still in Lylo.

I'm just playing the numbers now as the two other main suspects, Dybeck and AlyG will not give us such a bad ratio if left alive (maybe if dybeck is the SK instead of orig [however the vig claim would be deadly by originality there, thus unlikely]) but we can't confirm today that dybeck has a killing role.

Maybe AlyG should track him Tonight?

[Oman]

Maybe AlyG should track him Tonight?

Yes.

As such,

Vote: Originality

If he is scum, then we are in lylo or 3:2:1. If he is vig we are in LYLO.

IF HE'S SK WE'RE IN F'R:THREE LYLOU

[Oman]

ZOMG! Either are LyLo!

We can still win in LyLo though.

[Oman]

Lol...whoops.

I'm rather drunk disclaimer again.

what does that BCS include? Doc protect etc?

[Oman]

Oh right, you mean best case and worst case in terms of setup not in terms of night actions. The point is still valid (actually perhaps more with your way as it isn't variable based on player actions).

[Oman]

Okay, thanks for the confirm.

[Oman]

Vollkan, lets assume you're right. Orig is a vig.

Now: Why did he kill carrotcake?

[Oman]

Thats all well and good Shaft.ed, but whats your conclusion? What do YOU suggest?

[Oman]

I think letting a killing role live the night will only lead to pain. Vollkan's done the math, read up on that.

[Oman]

Which is sooooo pro-town!!

I'm not going to follow you on this one vollkan, I think orig is an SK.

[Oman]

As mafia I do not prioritise vig, they often kill townies N1-2-3.

Regardless:

If he claimed cop he'd likely get counterclaimed
If he claimed doc we'd know he's lying
If he claimed RB he'd likely be counterclaimed.

Plus if he was the SK he would have known vig was 100% guarenteed safe claim(who puts and SK a vig AND a scumgroup in a game)

[Oman]

AlyG what is your stance on originality?

[Oman]

but not if he claimed weak doc.

I can count the number of mini normals with a weak doc on one hand I bet.

RB is probably quite significantly safer

Hell of a lot more common than a weak doc.

LOL! Wait, Vollkan was voting for originality, and even posted points on why he was an SK and not a vig and now you want to let him live?

[Oman]

Right, perhaps I was slightly wrong in my sentence, allow me to ammend:

and even posted points on why he was an SK

and mafia

and not a vig and now you want to let him live?

[Oman]

You know what...I think you're right. Regardless of his alignment, he's more than likely dead tomorrow (baring RBs and Docs).

unvote

This will go on AlyG or dybeck.

[Oman]

I'm 100% certain that originality is scum,

this line sucks. Unless you're claiming cop with a guility on him, or siblings or something.

No, I did not ask you to claim.

However, I beleive there is no danger at this time in

vote

ing

dybeck

[Oman]

I'd prefer you didn't, but as you said, if we mislynch you might as well I guess, we're put in that same odd/even ratio.

[Oman]

Another thing. I've asked this before:

DOCTOR BLACKSTRIKE! I do not ask for a claim I simply ask: Did your night action or the result of it give you any information that can help us go towards a scum lynch?

[Oman]

Sorry about my mind changing, but that was all within the context of numbers and vollkan and I both messed them up a lot.

[Oman]

and we need to know what he did during the night!

No we don't stop fishing. We need to know IF his night action has any bearing on today (i.e. if he's doc, it really doesn't. If he's cop with a guilty on you or orig...it really does)

[Oman]

and we need to know what he did during the night!

No we don't stop fishing. We need to know IF his night action has any bearing on today (i.e. if he's doc, it really doesn't. If he's cop with a guilty on you or orig...it really does)

Why are AlyG and orig the only people who matter if a guilty investigation turns up.

And yes that is rolefishing AlyG

FoS

On the Dr. BS side of things I think he's AWOL. Five days without a post anywhere on site. Any chance for a re-prod?

They're the only ones that matter because they prove/disprove eachother's claims. If he's a cop with a guilty on anyone else I'd prefer he kept it to himself.

[Oman]

I am too Vollkan I want to hear from Blackstrike if he has something to help us (if he doesn't a "no info" would suffice)

Dybeck is choice #1 for a lynch, but AlyG could help us confirm Orig mafia if(when:lol:) AlyG comes up mafia.

Then we're left at...something:1:1 (Didn't do the math) In a WCS
Yeah, I reckon either AlyG or Dybeck.

[Oman]

I want to hear Dybeck's new opinion of AlyG/Orig.

[Oman]

but Oman is actually suspicious and I would certainly not place him on my "confirmed townie list".

I don't think I've earned that place, but if orig says he sees that I'm town, I'm not going to argue. Just to clarify, I'm not saying I'm not town, I'm merely saying I agree that I shouldn't be "confirmed".

I'm very happy that originality is actually thinking about this hard now, it means he's more likely to hit scum.

Also, I've been in mini's with 8:3:1 (SK) They suck for town.

I'd also like to get on this "Wasn't Elias in the Game?" Wagon

unvote vote elias

[Oman]

Unvote

I missed that post.

Thanks for pointing it out Vollkan.

[Oman]

HAI GEMELLI!

[Oman]

Confirming that Streeflo should give all of BS's previous choices and results to Gemelli.

[Oman]

Mass game message: Finished schooling, gonna be out tonight and hungover tomorrow. I should post.

[Oman]

What a terribly rude question Dybeck.

Anyway, from the last two pages, Dybeck is actually writing stuff, and starting to look town.

However, I believe this is not because he IS town, but because the town is beginning to share his views (Evident in the Dybeck: Town: sketch). Thus I believe Dybeck to be as scummy as ever, and the town is merely parrallel.

[Oman]

Also, Oman, do you think we should lynch Orig?

I'm unsure, I can see the argument for him being vig, but, Jesus, Carrotcake? Not my top 5.

I guess the idea is what is more dangerous, a NK or a large voting block?

The optimum answer to me is this:
Do not lynch orig, but put a no-kill bar on him. That way, we lose the danger of the SK, and retain the benefits of finding scum and taking down their collective vote power.

BTW in my previous post, the town hasn't accept dybeck's views, they are just coming up with their own similar ones (hence "sharing").

[Oman]

If you want to look at it all, I actually change my stance halfway down after thinking about it and say do not lynch orig.

[Oman]

Only if it was on a scummy target, or else one chosen by a secondary vote (I understand an SK would be fine with it, but it at least gives the town majority some control).

I'd usually be agaisnt directing the vig/SK, but carrotcake?

Yes, conditional upon him presenting absolutely no threat to the mafia.

Or town.

[Oman]

EBWOP: If I was scum (and I know how WIFOM this would get) I probably wouldn't worry so much about orig because his track record isn't great, and he could almost be a lynch target tomorrow conditional on a bad NK.

[Oman]

I just want to make it noted that AlyG is only going after me since the bandwagon formed on me.

Hypocrit much?

[Oman]

I'd like to make a comment that shaft.ed's "if they';re town" "if they're scum" will not benefit the town at all. Its much better for us to respond to scumtells and comnnections between players.

My list:
1) No Kill



















2) dybeck
3) Elias
4) AlyG

[Oman]

Also, Oman, just because i attacked you i'm then recomended to be NK'ed by you. Even though i'm confirmed as your tracker. A bit bitter perhaps?

I was suspicious of you pre-your attack on me. And you're not confirmed, stop pretending you are. Also, you're number 4 on my list.

Listing a confirmed tracker for NK is just ludicrous.

NOT CONFIRMED

Orig's post on Luc is correct.

What you want the confirmed tracker NKed.

I'm sick of this

More for Orig's input on Luci rather than this outburst about my actions

4) AlyG is replaced by Lucienne.

This is simply because 4) was AlyG, not because it was AlyG.

[Oman]

Is it because you have come under fire for it?

No, my point was:

AlyG was 4)

Lucienne should be 4)

Thus Lucienne replaces AlyG. As vollkan said, entirely independant of the fact that AlyG's spot on my list got me attacked.

Its not back pedalling its simple fact.

[Oman]

A change of opinion, based on a good post by orig and the subsequent reread.

[Oman]

Yes!

AlyG is by far not #1 material, and if dybeck killed her with me having him at 4 and you guys leaving him off, I'd be into him (thats not a town play).

No Kill should be #1 as far as I see.

#2 should be dybeck, or if you are convinced he's innocent either Elias or lucienne, I'm really not sure wether cronic lurking or chronic lurking +1 scumtell in an effort to "help" the town (might not be helping ) is worse.

[Oman]

Sorry that was a mistake, switch dybeck for orig. We're contextually talking about orig anyway.

[Oman]

Because I'm not goign to tell people to put dybeck as #2 if they think he's town. Its their choice.

And AlyG may be scummy, but I put him at #4, I still firmly believe that he is not #1. You're twisting this, saying that I am denying an AlyG kill by not puting him #1, but supporting it by putting him #4. The simple fact is, if he's on my list, I want him there (Though he's not).

[Oman]

Actually the context of this discussion was other people's lists:

As in, if

we all had AlyG at 1

, would you be opposed?

#2 should be dybeck, or

if you are convinced

he's innocent either Elias or lucienne, I'm really not sure wether cronic lurking or chronic lurking +1 scumtell in an effort to "help" the town (might not be helping ) is worse.

Just a few short ones to highlight what I mean.

[Oman]

WRONG WRONG WRONG.....WRONG!

You still haven't picked up on the fact that you are assuming AlyG is protown because you are saying that killing AlyG would be something that you would go after Orig for.

The reason I would go after orig is because AlyG is so far down the preference list that he's not a logical pro-town night choice.

You're estimating my motives, and you're....WRONG!

[Oman]

But you are assuming AlyG is protown. The other option is that AlyG comes up mafia, in which case, Orig is a likely scum partner (despite how nonsensical THAT would be). But this is not even entertained by you. You assume, prima facie, that a NK of AlyG is anti-town here, despite you allowing for AlyG as a NK candidate.

NO I'M NOT!!

I'm saying if we take a vote on what orig does and he goes against it regardless of his target (town or scum) he is an SK and/or mafia, there is no reason for a town player to go against it. REGARDLESS OF ALYG'S ALIGNMENT!

You could have put nobody in there if you were as convinced about her being pro-town as you now imply.

I'm not implying anything.

You're reading too deep.

[Oman]

I'd like to appologise for all the caps too, you just didn't seem to get what my actual point was

[Oman]

That me saying that orig killing AlyG was bad meant AlyG was protown in my mind.

[Oman]

FTR: I see your argument as crappy, not scummy

[Oman]

Ranks have to be important in the count, not just that its there, but where they stand in relation to others.

[Oman]

Aye, you guys did fall off my radar, I was working too hard on my mini-essay and so I was playing in the games most requiring my attention. The town here is strong, and we have lots of players, plus activity is high so this took a back seat (all my C9s got priority ).

Sorry to do it to you, the idea was that you'd catch scum without me. I'm going to bed now, (0400) but tomorrow this is my first game I promise

[Oman]

The town here is strong...

*blink* I really cannot see your basis for saying that unless you are mafia

No its, "we need to find scum, other games cannot do it without me, but teh town here is strong enoiugh without my input".

Rereading

[Oman]

And yes I am prepared to die tonight. But if our kindly doc decides to protect me I promise I won't hold it against him.

This phrase sets off alarm bells to me. In my experience asking for a doc protect is usually a "GIVE IT TO ME!!!" situation.

The lose originality thing went by me, as if dybeck things orig is town, that word choice implies he is town. Him saying "lose" implies orig is on the same team

I don't like the way Gemelli removes AlyG from orig's list in 757. We discussed the possibility the two were scum together, or whatever. I admit its not a huge probabbility, but the point is he completely discounts it.

I'm maintaining my Oman vote because it seems that he is very concious of who is on his list, what order they are placed on it,

and whether or not the town finds this acceptable.

I fixed it, basically I am conscious of where people are. These are possible kills you know!

Vollkan jumps on the global identifier thing way too hard. I'll say he's town, but jeez, its really unneccesary.

Gemelli skips over nokill in every convesation about orig's power.

Gemelli conmpletely changes sides to be on the same stance as Shaft.ed

Oman, You've stated a few times now that AlyG is not a confirmed tracker. I can only think of one wildly outlandsih scenario whereby AlyG is not a tracker. Since you seem to be more indifferent than the rest of the town towards losing AlyG, care to explain why you don't believe the tracker claim and how do you account for him knowing about orig's NK?

There is the fact they are two scum trying to help clear eachother. I admit this is outlandish and unlikely. I think its unfair to say that I don't believe, I prefer the euphamism: I have doubts about..

I'm dissapointed in the reception of my explaination, especially shaft.ed saying that I'm trying to "blend in" when its evident I haven't even been reading.

The previous posts make more suspicious of Gemelli and Lucienne (she's in this game right?)

[Oman]

Ok like i've said i'm waiting for Elias to post and to see what he has to say. I also don't like Oman's comment about our town being strong. We townies possibly are outnumbered in the amount of active posters. So we need as much help as we can get, we can't have anyone slacking off. And answer me this: Why isn't your contribution as important as others?

Do you really think Vollkan and Shaft.ed are THAT anti-town? The two strongest posters game wide, and recently Gemelli (not convinced he's town). The point is, these three posters seem pretty pro-town, and they're doing well. Therefor the town seemed strong enough for me to leave for a day or two.

[Oman]

It wasn't that mine is unimportant, it was that mine was unavaliable. At the time I was putting lots of work into my mini essay so I didn't really have time for all 8 of my games.

[Oman]

although I am puzzled by why you're grouping me with Lucienne in 793, since NONE of the posts you quoted had anything to do with her in the slightest.

You're not connected, you are just two players who went down in town-ness. I'm not suggesting your connected in any way.

"woops I forgot you guys!"

I just want it know I didn't forget this game, I just had no time for it. I still love you shaft.ed.

[Oman]

Carrotcake hardly acted protown, I don't think for a SECOND she was the likely choice for vig, be she certainly wasn't uber protown.

[Oman]

Regardless of what I think about orig, a vig can choose the wrong target. And do we need to dig up shaft.ed's look at how protown Carrotcake was?

[Oman]

Indeed, you don't mention Lucienne at all other than saying she is becoming more suspicious.

I thought I posted something like "isn't she in this game" the idea is that the chronic lurking makes me uneasy.

[Oman]

The previous posts make more suspicious of Gemelli and Lucienne (she's in this game right?)

The idea is that her chronic lurking makes me uneasy.

[Oman]

*sigh* are you really going to be that pedantic on whether I say posts or lack thereof.

The original line was just Gemelli, but I added Lucienne in when I caught a look at her name, i just didn't fix the sentence.

[Oman]

Okay, this so proves you're not paying attention to the game.

Erm, I'd say more lurker than "Most Pro-Town Player Ever!" Exaggeration?

Yeah, it was an ironic comment, made like, 2nd page of D2.

[Oman]

As with vollkan I think the blanket is the best way to prove a vig over SK. And No Kill wins the poll rather convincingly too (being almost double the second). I agree with everything vollkan said re-SKOrig and how to determine which he is.

[Oman]

Sorry, unavaliable next 48hrs, Australian weekend.

[Oman]

Okay I'm back. I shall attempt to scale the WALLZ OF TEXT tonight.

[Oman]

AlyG, you want an explaination of my bandwagoning? I'm a bandwagoner, its what I do. My playstyle: BANDWAGON! My scumhunting method: BANDWAGON! My favourite colour: BANDWAGON!

I've been lynched for it before, but its like....like....well its like Albert B Rampage's playstyle being absolute insanity, he gets lynched for it, but he won't change it.

I simply feel that pressure from votes is the most effective tool in outing scum. Voting paterns, etc.

[Oman]

Yeah, I think you need to see my other games if you don't believe that. I have not played a single game (bar my first one) where I didn't wagon prolifically.

[Oman]

I want to know if Orig is killing or not. Who he kills, as vollkan stated, should remain an element of wonder and mystery. But whether or not he kills is different.

[Oman]

Were you in my town games where I did this? You seem to have broken knowledge.

[Oman]

1) gives us great reward (almost confirming orig) for little loss (unable to kill mafia)

2) Gives great reward (Dead mafia) for great loss (possible dead town, possible SKorig)

[Oman]

lol, you can't use an ongoing game on me either way.

[Oman]

@Oman, you still haven't addressed my post about your statement that "the town is doing so well hunting scum."

I happen to think Dybeck is obvobv scum, you guys almost had him, at that point I thought I'd come back to a nice relaxing N2

Oman, can you give me the link of a recent game you have finished as town, and one as scum?

The only completed game I have as scum got me dayvigged D1 by our very own Vollkan The Interrigator. It was my first scum game and I had a brain fuck in the middle of it. I shoulda done better.

I'm on nearly every wagon there in the one Vollkan set.

A town game in which I wagon
I'm on pretty much every wagon up until the scum NK me.

[Oman]

I swear I was voting Dybeck... oh wait I took it off when we got into the whole numbers thing didn't I?

Vote Dybeck

[Oman]

what is the difference between Gemelli's tool and the Find posts by link below?

[Oman]

Hey I just tried that tool, its awesome. Does it just pick up bolded phrases?

[Oman]

No by find posts by I mean "display posts from previous" below this post.

[Oman]

lol you've never seen it?

[Oman]

Guys, It become obvious to you no doubt that I've got my HSC coming up and I can no longer confront the walls of text in this game. If you're still going on in 2-3 weeks I'd be happy to replace back in to any role if neccesary. I'm sorry but I don't feel I'm doing this game justice.

Just so you don't all feel betrayed by my playing of other games, I'm staying in my newbies and a mini that requires much less time. They are in a different league.

I appologise again for my chronic lurking

Mod

for reasons stated above I would like to formally ask for a replacement. Sorry man!