New York 185: Freshwater Frenzy!

[House]

By the way, when dragon flips scum, I'm going to need a doctor on my ass tonight, please.

[Varsoon]

Why do you think you'll be killed, House?

[House]

Why do you think you'll be killed, House?

~reasons~

[House]

Oh screw it.

I'm a JoAT

1x Gunsmith
1x Tracker
1x Bodyguard

And I want dragonspawn killified so I can work with my neighbors on where to use my abilities.

[Varsoon]

What would happen if you used Bodyguard on a Doctor who targeted you? Would both end up with protection?

[House]

What would happen if you used Bodyguard on a Doctor who targeted you? Would both end up with protection?

I throw out a d1 claim with no pressure

that

is your question?

[Varsoon]

My first question, at least.
I figured that you claimed to give more leverage to your Dragon's push and to ensure that you draw a protect tonight.

Why did you full-claim?
Did you claim earlier in your neighborhood?
Do you think being a JoAT in a neighborhood makes it more likely that there's scum in your 'hood?
What makes you so sold on Dragons?

[Skybird]

I can't believe you claimed House. Why put a big ass target on your back like that? It really makes me wonder if you are being truthful.

[SilverWolf]

What the ever loving fuck did I just read?

[House]

My first question, at least.
I figured that you claimed to give more leverage to your Dragon's push and to ensure that you draw a protect tonight.

Why did you full-claim?
Did you claim earlier in your neighborhood?
Do you think being a JoAT in a neighborhood makes it more likely that there's scum in your 'hood?
What makes you so sold on Dragons?

You asked a question. I decided to answer it.
No, because scum would have had that information without all of town having it.
No, I believe all hoods have a minimum of one scum, with two scum being a possibility.
I'm psychic. Lynch the bastard.

[Egg]

Anen, TSO is the only one of your town reads I understand. How is posting style alignment indicitive? Why is Varsoon town if you don't like his Ozgin stance? Why is genuine scumhunting a town tell in a game with multiple teams?

Titus, what makes you think my scum read on you is random? Why is Boon lynchable?

Varsoon, I don't think Kitz didn't understand there were multiple scum teams. I think Kitz just didn't know the numbers were a ratio to represent that. Kitz, am I right?

Boon, sometimes doing VCA too early without flips can lead to bad conclusions. Those conclusions can lead to confirmation bias getting in the way when it's the right time to VCA. I think I understand what you are getting at though.

Guys I'm not so sure we should be lynching dragonspawn.

[SilverWolf]

After re-reading a few things, I'm having my doubts that dragon is a good vote. I'm not doubting my Ozgin scumread though. He's still scum.

VOTE: Ozgin

[Cheetory6]

scum tend to announce they are not scum at the beginning.

This reasoning looks showy and I have a really hard time believing that dragon actually believes that something like this is going to be used to catch scumTSO of all people.
You just saw how convincing TSO can be as scum, right? Was this vote more just to apply pressure to see how TSO would react than it was because you actually believed how scummy TSO is, or what?

forth on a wagon in rvs or close to it. Like that for scum better

Andddd the odds of his TSOvote being for pressure goes down because he's switching votes for more really surface level reasoning. Why is scum more likely to join a wagon in RVS than town?

I tend to think cheetory is town at this point. He was alot more lurky last game.

course it could be the fact that their are two scum teams this game.

Hedgey surface level reasoning for me being town. "This person is possibly town but nvm actually they might not be."

So, just curious, if everyone is supposed scum hunt, which makes perfect sense in the set up, what should we think if someone wasnt?

I like this question. It's an interesting angle to be thinking about. Like, "why isn't this person scumhunting, they must be scum", is an okay indicator as to whether someone is scum or not, but it's not without its blindspots, you know? But I think this is something worth talking about and multiball generally makes scumhunting a very different kind of beast to deal with.
I have a hard time understanding why he isn't applying this level of critical thinking to his reasoning for his reads though.

So tso claims to be town off the bad and I vote for it in random voting and my reasoning is bad.

Ozgin claims to be a citizen and he's scum.

How are these two things equivalent? Like, unless you aren't closely reading what people are saying and the implications of what it means to claim Citizen?

Wait a second. Wasn't taly the first one voting for house? Now all of a sudden he doesn't want to lynch house today. Taly defending house just seems weird to me. Especially since I've seen how you guys don't get along as town.

And how are you feeling about this interaction in terms of alignment?
How're you reading House/Taly atm?

Scum having daytalk means they are more likely to slip up by doing things in unison

Can you talk at me about what you mean by this? How exactly does scum slip up by doing that? Have you ever actually seen that happen?

And also little cautious of varsoon because of my upclose view of his recent scum game

Which game was this?

I'm also eading oz as more townish.

What are you finding more townish about him?

@Cheetory, what do you think of Varsoon sleeping you earlier with sky? What about his push for ozgin?

Varsoon will get shit done if he keeps playing like this.
There's no reason to even worry about him until we're past like D2 or something.
I could really easily see him being a scum-mastermind and his engagement levels here could really easily point to him being scum, but I really just don't care atm. There's bigger fish to fry!

Boonskies is towniest there can be.

No.
>:c

dragonread pending answers to shit.

Ozgin

>

Kitz

>

Sky

[SilverWolf]

@boon-wagon analysis is not the same in a multiball set-up as it otherwise, there is likely to be scum on any large wagon that forms, the person could be either scum or town that is being wagoned, I doubt a lynch will happen early game without scum influence

@Egg-regarding your question on my bookitty read, there were a couple posts that kind of pinged town and seemed different enough from her scumgame but after re-reading there really isn't enough for that to be a strong townread, it's weak and kind of gut/meta at this point and I need to hear a lot more from her before I can solidify it

@Titus-why is boon added to the will lynch pile again?

@Varsoon-Yes, I had a theory they were on the same team, but associative tells without a scum flip seems kind of pointless and that theory is out the window right now

[Egg]

Silverwolf, weren't we talking about Bookitty's Ozgin stance?

[Boonskiies]

I'm in a neighborhood called Central Windgale with dragonspawn (and some others), and I want him dead so I can participate in it, please.

kthx.

Oh, this changes things. This makes sense now. House, vote someone else in the neighborhood if you have to do someone from the neighborhood. Dragon is not scum.

Dude, you don't know him. I do.

He's scum.

No. he's town.

[RadiantCowbells]

Dragon mafia!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Boonskiies]

I'm in a neighborhood called Central Windgale with dragonspawn (and some others), and I want him dead so I can participate in it, please.

kthx.

Does he have to be dead for you to participate in it? if so, that is you just wanting what you want, and not actually wanting scum lynched. If not, then why does it matter if he's in it?

[Boonskiies]

If he flips town then I really, really need to talk to him in Twilight.
That's about all.

He'll flip town. Please, Varsoon, you are smart enough to see why.

[RadiantCowbells]

It's causing me great anguish to resist the urge to claim lyncher with Dragon as my target right now.

[RadiantCowbells]

This is a long shot but Dragon, can you confirm or deny his claim about being a part of a neighbourhood?

[House]

I'm in a neighborhood called Central Windgale with dragonspawn (and some others), and I want him dead so I can participate in it, please.

kthx.

Does he have to be dead for you to participate in it? if so, that is you just wanting what you want, and not actually wanting scum lynched. If not, then why does it matter if he's in it?

Yes he has to be dead for me to participate in it. Because it's not worth having scum in the hood to try to work out the best use of my abilities.

I refuse to use any night actions until he's dead.

Period.

[Ozgin]

Oh screw it.

I'm a JoAT

1x Gunsmith
1x Tracker
1x Bodyguard

And I want dragonspawn killified so I can work with my neighbors on where to use my abilities.

Did... Did this just happen?
I go out for one day and there's 2 hood claims, and a JoAT claim... Holy. Shit.

I want to trust House on the dragonspawn thing. Also, I wanna buy his claim, because

what would he have to lose from claiming? What scum motivation is there for fake-claiming JoAT D1?

Especially multiball, because even if he is a scum, one scum team doesn't know that and will still try to kill him. I don't see any reason to not believe the claim. VOTE: dragonspawn

@House - JoAT typically has 4 abilities that are 1 shot. Did you start with a fourth ability? Don't answer if you don't wanna, but it's strange to me to see only 3.

As for Ozgin, he seems to approach the game with an abrasive, kind of I-am-right mindset and has it dead-set in his head that buddying/sheeping is scummy, but those things seem to genuinely come from his playstyle rather than him trying to aggressively scumpaint me and others as I was thinking before. The fact that he was willing to enter a dialogue with me rather than just deafly tunnel away also indicates that he's trying to come to common ground and understand the game rather than push advantages. Furthermore, if he was on a team with other players, I suspect that I would have been thrown a lot more shade, and yet, most people seem to be townreading me for one reason or another. Even furthermore, his Citizen claim checks out, and I genuinely believe that he actually may be a Citizen and that Titus is likely scum based on the fact that Titus wasn't fully aware of the disparity in Role PMs. The short of this is that we'll know the truth very soon but we can put good stock in Ozgin being town.

You know, I think you've actually got me pegged. I'm kinda hard-headed, and I get really abrasive and defensive. I lose control fairly easily when people come after me with (what I feel are) very stupid reasons for a lynch, and then the way I act makes other people (Like Anen) think I'm scum, not for the (stupid) case but for my reaction to it. I don't honestly usually engage in a dialogue, though. I only did it with you because I felt like I had to prove something to you (because you were so fucking cocky). I kinda wish I could take that post back, it was kinda stupid (the citizen one). I honestly Townread Titus for a long time, and think she's just misguided. I don't think her reasoning holds any water, and it's not worrying me anymore. I've calmed down a little now, and just wanna focus on the game and cut the stupid shit. I'm gonna stop making dumb posts (or try), and try to stop insulting/offending people. I should just do what I did in 180 and chill out with some "medical aid," it seems to help a lot.


PEdit:
@Silverwolf - What's your scumread on me, exactly?

[SilverWolf]

Silverwolf, weren't we talking about Bookitty's Ozgin stance?

Maybe? LOL

I checked the post again and thought you were responding to the first part but really it must be the second.

Other reads: Bookitty seems different from her last scum game to me in a way that looks town

Egg-You pointed out you didn't like how you think I'm avoiding the Oz wagon. Why is that a problem on me specifically but not on Bookitty or Taly or anyone else who is not voting Oz but has expressed suspicion of him?

Silverwolf, can you show me what you mean as far as Bookitty?

You already addressed Taly but here's what I was talking about with Bookitty.

With two scum teams in play and a suspected SK, I could easily see Ozgin as scum trying to ensure that everyone knows he's a CITIZEN and not a Scummity-Scum-SCUM. It's odd. I don't get it.

But she voted dragonspawn.

Anyway, Ozgin read this post for my read on you 643

Also people, if you re-read boon again, you will see that dragon is not a good vote. I'd recommend you do that.

[Egg]

Fair enough