New York 180 (Endgame)

[Albert B. Rampage]

I checked the first 12 games in the Completed Games List. None of them have more than one mafia faction. None of them have a werewolf. I would go more but that would waste my time. How many do you need, a hundred?

If I claimed bulletproof miller vig, Ellie would believe me, as the odds of that are like a coinflip, and the entire site history doesn't change the setup creation process of one mod. But this is worse than that. This is a caught scum, desperate for help, being aided by someone who has ulterior motives here. Ellie isn't town, she has an agenda, she's pushing it, and wants you to believe her, follow her, be led by the nose by her. I rarely get this much emotional investment in a game, but vikingfan has pushed my credulity beyond it's limits, and this apathetic town has compounded the issue.

The only advantage to this town is that you get to see me vocal, contributing, and fighting for what is right with every ounce of patience that I have. I don't care enough as scum to put up this much of a fight, read any of my scum games. The scum can kill me but I'm expendable.

Believe in me. I won't let you down.

[Ellie]

Your emotional involvement and the fact that you seem to be arguing against

me

instead of my arguments is what is confusing me so much about you right now.

[Ellie]

Like, how does 2325 counter my point that setups are not statistical? And what does that have to do with me believing VF, except that his claim is possible?

[Albert B. Rampage]

You said:

"vikingfan is smarter than to claim something unbelievable"

I argue that he didn't know it was unbelievable given his knowledge of the site meta.

You invented a werewolf team and I've countered that by checking the last 12 games in Completed Games in New York, proving how unlikely your misinformed assumption is.

I've shown you time and time again why vikingfan has fakeclaimed, why the odds of him telling the truth are minuscule, and every time, you've proven yourself to want to support him, without a doubt, without a shred of evidence to back up your conviction. You're scum, Ellie.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Mods base their setups on previous games. ika isn't creative enough to even write flavor or an original title for this game, do you think he will go out of his way and do something outlandish that 12 or a hundred other mods wouldn't do? You think ika will step outside of the mold? You're wrong. You're pushing buttons, and it's not working on TSO, nor will it with me.

[Cheetory6]

I'm looking through his ISO and see that he has a scumread on FA_Q2, but still votes Klingon with him without reconsidering the situation based on FA_Q2 voting her and goes right back to scumreading him based off of nothing.

I didn't even really know that FA had voted Klingon at the time? I thought Klingon was scum, so I voted her.
Do you think my read on her should have somehow been mitigated by my read on FA?
I'm also not scumreading FA based off of nothing. I've tried to directly engage FA a number of times, posted a case on him and his reaction has been to sideline and indirectly take potshots at me. He's pretty aware of my pushes, I'm pretty sure he's trying to shrug me off to avoid getting attention. I also didn't like his entry to this cycle.

I have to admit that I'm a little wary of the manner in which you're pushing me, in that you're not actually giving your read on FA while basically indirectly defending him. What's your read on him? Are you intentionally trying to defend him or do you just find my play thus far lacking and don't have much of a stance on him? Why not comment on literally anything I've actually directly said about him instead of just vaguely attacking me like this?

that's not even getting into the fact that he keeps making excuses not to post and figure things out.

I'm VLA right now for a reason. This morning I wrote my third midterm of this week.

[Albert B. Rampage]

I've never played a large normal. What are the odds we have both a tracker and a cop?

This is your third post in the game. You found it hard to believe there was both a cop and tracker in one game, but didn't bat an eye at the below?

Think of the odds of the town trying to lynch the cop on day 1, then the doctor gets killed on N1 while the cop is blocked, while the doctor has a loud modifier that doesn't appear upon his death, preventing a kill from a third source, who has so far remained completely undetected by the flips.

hahahahahaha

Nice try, scumbag.

[Ellie]

I argue that it is unbelievable because he would

know

he was inventing another killer. Not because of site meta.

I do not invent a werewolf team. I say something very specific:

Agreed, but werewolves or SK seems plausible enough.

which you tried to argue against using statistics, when statistics have no bearing on setup spec.

I fight all day for what I believe, which is that vikingfan has a good chance of being town despite the case against him and that

even if he is scum it is bad strategy to lynch him today

.

You somehow turned fighting for what I believe into "pushing an agenda."

So yeah, either I'm crazy or something is up here.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Cheetory, for the love of everything that I hold dear about the game of mafia, please get your vote in line with reality.

[Ellie]

Mods base their setups on previous games. ika isn't creative enough to even write flavor or an original title for this game, do you think he will go out of his way and do something outlandish that 12 or a hundred other mods wouldn't do? You think ika will step outside of the mold? You're wrong. You're pushing buttons, and it's not working on TSO, nor will it with me.

Considering ika plays on other forums where the mechanic is common and probably wanted to try it here? Uh, yes.

[Ellie]

I've never played a large normal. What are the odds we have both a tracker and a cop?

This is your third post in the game. You found it hard to believe there was both a cop and tracker in one game, but didn't bat an eye at the below?

Think of the odds of the town trying to lynch the cop on day 1, then the doctor gets killed on N1 while the cop is blocked, while the doctor has a loud modifier that doesn't appear upon his death, preventing a kill from a third source, who has so far remained completely undetected by the flips.

hahahahahaha

Nice try, scumbag.

...I don't get what your point even is with this.

[Albert B. Rampage]

You're not good at lying, the problem is that you think you are, and it's embarrassing. Please stop.

[Ellie]

also UNVOTE: , VOTE: TSO if cheetory is V/LA

[Ellie]

I feel like ABR is pushing my buttons and this argument definitely requires input from someone else before I go crazy.

[Cheetory6]

Cheetory, for the love of everything that I hold dear about the game of mafia, please get your vote in line with reality.

I'm dancing through what you're saying right now.
Hold yer frakin horses.

[Ellie]

Does ABR play like this as scum? I've seen him this engaged with a game... once. And he was town. But I have limited meta. And I know I'm biased but his posts are so dumb.

[Cheetory6]

ABR why didn't you respond to me? :c
I'm genuinely curious why you feel/felt like giving viking a night to figure things out wasn't worth it?
I know your vote's changed now so it's a bit of a moot point, but I get the impression you'd still want to lynch him if you felt like the momentum was there.

[Albert B. Rampage]

She's playing a role. It's clear. In her third post, she was playing the role of the cynical, "oh myyy, two investigative power roles in one game, realllyyy???"

By day 2 she's singing a very different tune. "I don't see anything wrong with town suspecting the cop and forcing him to claim on day 1, then the doctor gets killed on N1 while the cop is roleblocked, while the doctor has a loud modifier that doesn't appear upon his death, preventing a kill from a third source, who has so far remained completely undetected by the flips. I'm a happy camper with an answer to everything, I'll believe anything!"

The contradictions are jarring. You don't want to lynch viking, want to leave him to his fate? Fine. Let's get this scumbag out of the way then. Meet me halfway.

[Cheetory6]

I'm getting the impression that she's saying that if he's scum he'll be alive tomorrow and if not he'll be dead. It's more or less how I feel right now as well.
I don't really understand how that translates into her believing his claim?

[Albert B. Rampage]

Cheetory, this is a story that vikingfan can tell at the bar of a scum meet one day.

"And then -you won't believe this- they didn't lynch me on day 2 either! After all that, they mislynched some poor sucker and...*struggles to muffle laughter* I didn't know if I was more drunk when I read that, or when I claimed!" *cue general laughter*

I will not be made a fool of. I won't believe lies that are this bad. There's far more evidence than needed for this guy to be lynched, and that's why I'm reluctantly willing to compromise.

[Ellie]

I don't even.

town suspecting the cop and forcing him to claim on day 1,

Happens all the time.

the doctor gets killed on N1

Happens when you have skilled scum who are good at role reads and the doctor was silly enough to crumb.

while the cop is roleblocked

Happens when you have a scum roleblocker. Obviously.

while the doctor has a loud modifier that doesn't appear upon his death,

The loud modifier was something Wake came up with. It would have flipped if it were a modifier: As the wiki article ika quoted earlier states, normal doctors can use this mechanic without any modifiers.

preventing a kill from a third source

Who else is Boon going to protect?

who has so far remained completely undetected by the flips.

Because we've only lynched once?

So yeah, there is only one thing that's hard to believe here: That he was told about being protected. But I think ika might well have included something like that, and

even if not it is still bad strategy to lynch VF today

.

Holy shit.

[Cheetory6]

q.q
That's not my point. I'm trying to understand your case on Ellie.
Is it her tone or just the fact that she doesn't want to lynch viking?

[Albert B. Rampage]

Wow. Ellie is literally crazy to keep pushing this viking line of defense. I mean, as either alignment, it's insane. Lynch it with fire.

[Ellie]

Holy mother of god. I'm putting ABR on mute for the sake of my blood pressure.

[Ellie]

I'm going to laugh so hard if you flip town, ABR. As far as puzzles go, my play here is not hard to figure out.