SMITE Role Madness Mafia (OVER AT LAST!)

[Cephrir]

FT if scum could easily bus PV. If he thought that PV was a liability to his team, he'd sooner bus than claim that past experience with PV made him cautious of PV. And I looked through his games: he did in fact play with town and scum PV and PV's play was fairly low-activity in both games as far as I recall. I'm not as sure in my townread of FT though and that's bugging me a little but not enough to vote him today.

i don't know how you could even begin to think you could predict something like this w/ any kind of accuracy

I don't understand this post!

[Cephrir]

Heartless has been a little more proactive in the neighborhood than they have been here, and that makes me feel a little better than I would otherwise, but they still worry me a bit. Nonetheless, it isn't really at the brim of my radar (pretend this analogy made sense please thanks) and I expect I'll have a lot more to read them on by the time I would start to get worried about things as they are now. If that makes any sense.

[T S O]

Okayyy.

[Heartless]

Heartless has been a little more proactive in the neighborhood than they have been here, and that makes me feel a little better than I would otherwise, but they still worry me a bit. Nonetheless, it isn't really at the brim of my radar (pretend this analogy made sense please thanks) and I expect I'll have a lot more to read them on by the time I would start to get worried about things as they are now. If that makes any sense.

that's b/c in here is a fucking madhouse and nothing gets done. we can at least find SOME common ground in there.

[T S O]

Spoiler: Yesterday's wagon interaction on Peregrine

Vote: Peregrine

I'd love a flashwagon but not on myself or Beast. I don't know why the Vyse wagon derailed - his replace-out doesn't make sense.

is anyone up for a TD speedlynch

pedit: my man this question is just fr you

VOTE: peregrine

is anyone up for a TD speedlynch

I'm not.

I am, and I think anyone reading his switch from you to the mastin wagon should also be.

nope!
let's lynch peregrine.

I'd love to hear why you're not.

Do we have to lynch Peregrine? He's a completely null read.

yes.

No, I don't particularly feel like Peregrine. My apologies.

VOTE: TiphaineDeath

i'll type up a town case when i have time.
why not compromise on a null read? TD isn't getting lynched today.

Hey guys, having problems irl, don't want it to spill over in to game, but don't REALLY have time to post right now. I've looked terrible this game and this move is not going to help. I think cephrir is scum UNVOTE: VOTE: cephrir I'll try to explain this when I get back, promise.

I think Cephrir's scum!

1579+1580=cephrir scum. He responds to my same post in two different, both derogatory ways. He planned and wanted to respond and make sure I got shut down and lumped in as scum with ace, he also forgot he had already done so, not town play. See, ace has been incredibly scummy, but he can't be scum as long is cephrir is unless we are in multiball, so cephrir is the lynch.

Still going with Cephrir-scum!

I do not like this interaction Sam-I-Am. Note to self, Stick-With-Your-Gut, and logic and everyone else be damned. VOTE: Solar Wind

My gut said it was Solar Wind all along!

Ceph is almost certainly town at this point.

Cephrir is so town!

Ceph and solars talk was crappy, Solars vote and unvote stinks of scum trying to make something happen and backing off quickly when it doesn't. Ceph's gambit is town.

Ceph town, Solar still scum.

Hi magua! .

And no, no particular reason to have a read on Rach either way, but in my experience scum rach super lurks, though that may just be rach-rach XD.

I would love to lynch mastin today, that would make me happy, it just doesn't seem likely :/.

I support mastin as well!

Ya know what, fuck it this lynch is more likely than a lynch on Solar XD, why the fuck not. VOTE: mastin

Mastin is scum!

Didn't include points on PV but he supports that dying too.

But, even if you feel it's weak - it's still far better than Peregrine.

Because the case on Peregrine is ??? right now and ??? does not lead to a scum lynch.

At the same time, your case on Peregrine is

still

???, and you've clearly been reading the thread! So I'm waiting to be blown away.

Okay.

I am still waiting for why Peregrine is scum.

Not interested in the D1 lynch of anyone I consider to be lynchbait just because they do lynchbait things. That's what makes them lynchbait.

This includes both PeregrineV and TiphaineDeath.

In particular, I see nothing in TSO's 2265 that says TD-scum to me rather than TD-just-being-his-goddamn-normal-self. If anything, TD jumping his reads over like that makes me more likely to read him town because scum just wouldn't need to.

Do want to vote Imperium, though, for pre-emptive buddying, but this is past RVS so I won't even though I should.

Oh, so basically:

My case on TD is, apparently, bad and so we are not doing it.
Your case on PV is, quite clearly, non-existent and yet we ...are doing it?

I'll admit it - the TD case is solidly mediocre. It's still the best thing we've got right now.

TD is town and so we are not doing it. In addition, the case on him is bad.
Peregrine is ??? at BEST and so we are doing it. There is no case on him.

*bashes head through screen*

What you will see if you click above is the interaction once Nacho started to try to push for a Peregrine lynch yesterday. (yes, he backed off, Peregrine pulled that same exact you should lynch me eventually to help town as a town beloved princess in cap com where Nacho and I were scum, we thought he was doing the same thing.)

But, as Nacho starts pushing Pere and Cephrir jumps on, TSO starts ramping up his lets lynch TD, what's the case on Pere. I included the Magua interaction because it's also twitch worthy for the reasoning. He considers Pere lynchbait so he doesn't want a lynch there BUT rachmarie is also lynchbait so I'm not sure why he considered her a fine lynch, so.

Anyway, didn't pick this up in Peregrine's iso but when TSO complained about trying and not getting a TD lynch, I didn't remember him even pushing TD so I looked and voila.

I think this makes him more likely scum. (I'd say definite scum, but in Once Upon a Winter's Night, I thought Beast could be scum for refusing to help me lynch scum Antihero on day one because he didn't like the case on him.)

Can you explain this post? I'm misinterpreting something here.

*interactions between TSO/Imperium quoted where TSO is against a Pere lynch because it's a complete shot in the dark*
"As we pushed Pere, TSO pushed TD."
"I didn't remember TSO pushing TD so I looked it up - turns out TSO did push TD!"
"And, therefore, TSO is scum."

[T S O]

Like I have no idea how that post was not called out for the shoddiest of reasoning if I'm correct.

[T S O]

ankamius, we're never going to get a td lynch. tried and failed.

It only failed because YOU gave up too early.

Which incidentally I have never known TSO to do~

Well, yeah, but I didn't really feel convinced TD was scum, like Triforce and amateur a while back. I still don't - if you look at my stances recently towards TD they're "would lynch, but not superscum".

[mastin2]

Heartless has been a little more proactive in the neighborhood than they have been here, and that makes me feel a little better than I would otherwise, but they still worry me a bit. Nonetheless, it isn't really at the brim of my radar (pretend this analogy made sense please thanks) and I expect I'll have a lot more to read them on by the time I would start to get worried about things as they are now. If that makes any sense.

Funny, because it makes me feel the opposite.

HERE.
ACTIVITY.
IN.
HERE.

(Unless you have

damn

good reason not to.)

[Heartless]

lol, i love this retroactive thing about how ppl thought pere was scummy and he never was in danger of being lynched

[Cephrir]

I don't think talking in neighborhoods is detrimental as long as you actually remember to talk in the thread too.

[T S O]

TSO could easily be scum; I didn't like his buddying of AP or a lot of his other posts.

Did I even talk to AP this game? Like, I think I quoted one of his posts once agreeing with it.

I'm not sure if scum-TSO would derail a lynch on his buddy D1 though. He knew Peregrine was lurking and therefore that Peregrine is dead weight who will eventually flip. He's not going to think he can make it to endgame with PV. So, he'd be trying to look good for the flip and going out on a limb to derail it doesn't seem like the best move.

If he was townreading PV, it wouldn't have looked so bad. But he specifically called PV "null" and refused to lynch him which is classic wiki-scumtell behavior means he's either a) absolutely horrendous as scum, b) WIFOMing as scum so people like me would think what they are thinking or c) town.

I don't think (b) is that unlikely though.[/quote]

a) I would bet if I checked my record I'd win as scum 70% of the time - if you only count ones where my play directly let me down, I can think of maybe 2 in 2 years.

I am not a horrendously bad scum player.

b) is just fucking stupid - like you can literally justify anything saying that. "oh he led lynches on 4 scum, but he COULD be WIFOM'ing!!!". No. Take that bullshit somewhere else.

c) is true.

[T S O]

TSO could easily be scum; I didn't like his buddying of AP or a lot of his other posts.

Did I even talk to AP this game? Like, I think I quoted one of his posts once agreeing with it.

I'm not sure if scum-TSO would derail a lynch on his buddy D1 though. He knew Peregrine was lurking and therefore that Peregrine is dead weight who will eventually flip. He's not going to think he can make it to endgame with PV. So, he'd be trying to look good for the flip and going out on a limb to derail it doesn't seem like the best move.

If he was townreading PV, it wouldn't have looked so bad. But he specifically called PV "null" and refused to lynch him which is classic wiki-scumtell behavior means he's either a) absolutely horrendous as scum, b) WIFOMing as scum so people like me would think what they are thinking or c) town.

I don't think (b) is that unlikely though.

a) I would bet if I checked my record I'd win as scum 70% of the time - if you only count ones where my play directly let me down, I can think of maybe 2 in 2 years.

I am not a horrendously bad scum player.

b) is just fucking stupid - like you can literally justify anything saying that. "oh he led lynches on 4 scum, but he COULD be WIFOM'ing!!!". No. Take that bullshit somewhere else.

c) is true.

[Heartless]

Heartless has been a little more proactive in the neighborhood than they have been here, and that makes me feel a little better than I would otherwise, but they still worry me a bit. Nonetheless, it isn't really at the brim of my radar (pretend this analogy made sense please thanks) and I expect I'll have a lot more to read them on by the time I would start to get worried about things as they are now. If that makes any sense.

Funny, because it makes me feel the opposite.

HERE.
ACTIVITY.
IN.
HERE.

(Unless you have

damn

good reason not to.)

well ok mastin YOU want to talk about anything specific?

here, i just wrote this in the neighborhood, i'll post it out here:
seriously, i think the only productivity we've gotten out of solar wind is for them to defend themselves from us

it's starting to piss me off b/c tth had presented reads () and f16 hasn't said jack of shit. he also demands for her to follow this bullshit rule of OMG WHY DON'T YOU JUST ASK and he's not doing the same thing himself he just wants to crack out the big red "SCUM" stamp on us whenever tth pipes up.

we've also spent a pretty great deal talking about THEM. but... i don't know apparently we're just sledgehammering on that b/c lol contrarianism

[Heartless]

Ffery, I agree with your strong town list. I'd add ooba, farside, and iHouse to it. What did you think of my analysis re: TD? Also, I agree with this:

18. The Mask - this is a pretty null read. I feel like the abrasiveness is an over the top affectation, and there's very little meat beyond that in his iso.

I've been trying to get a read on Mask since he made his first appearance. There isn't much of a long-term scum strategy behind insulting everyone, so that feels more towny than scummy. But his emotion and content absolutely feels empty. As far as I can tell, he's scumreading me based on my style, so it's almost like he's setting up a dichotomy between his mode of communication (over-the-top emotion) and mine (understated emotion). Or, for example, he says my posts are "polished/prim," which I suppose means he thinks I'm putting effort into the game. He's not putting effort into the game, apparently hates everyone and hates reading through the game, so again he's setting up a dichotomy between my play and his. I dunno if that's a scum-tell (i.e. a very mechanical approach to "scumhunting" draped in an over-the-top expression of emotion definitely rings scummy), or if it just reflects a shitty townie's "FT's style is opposite mine, he must be scum"-style of scumhunting.

11. PeregrineV - I feel like pere always winds up here on day 1 due to heavy-duty lurking. It seems like even heavier duty than normal, though, with very little content

6. Beastcharizard - reading his iso, it's all posturing with no reasoning whatsoever about his stances. I could say the same about Mask, but in Mask's case I don't have any experiential meta to say this is off his usual town play. In beast's case I do.

Re: Pere -- I'm not lynching him Today. I think he's one of the easier players to read when he starts posting more (at least in my experience), so I'd rather wait on this.

Re: Beast -- I agree. His townread on TSO and vote on iHouse suck, especially in the absence of any other substantive content or vote. I'd be willing to vote there.

after the flip:

Pere was by far the most scummy in our neighborhood, so that flip doesn't surprise me.

so....... when was FT going to start this push????? he obviously was looking for something AS INDICATED IN 3649, HE FOUND IT. i don't know

[mastin2]

well ok mastin YOU want to talk about anything specific?

No, but keeping content, ACTUAL CONTENT, in the 'hood for only your (potentially-not-even-town) neighbors to see, instead of everyone, ticks me off because then only THEY have access to it, and that means only THEY use it. Inversely, if you're scum, it also makes it easier to manipulate the 'hood because only THEY see the content which if posted in-thread would be subject to the scrutiny of all.

There are things to keep in the 'hood. Game content is not one of them. (With maybe one or two exceptions.)

Also, much better.

[Heartless]

ACTUALLY
COUNTERPOINT TO SOLAR WIND

pv's role was that everyone on his wagon would be ROLEBLOCKED the following night.

THAT SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD KIND OF DETER BUSSING TO ME

[Solar Wind]

ACTUALLY
COUNTERPOINT TO SOLAR WIND

pv's role was that everyone on his wagon would be ROLEBLOCKED the following night.

THAT SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD KIND OF DETER BUSSING TO ME

This is a good point.

You still haven't acknowledged that thing.

[Solar Wind]

so....... when was FT going to start this push????? he obviously was looking for something AS INDICATED IN 3649, HE FOUND IT. i don't know

I have some thoughts about this, but I'd like to see FT's response before I post them.

[Solar Wind]

Mastin I feel like you're ignoring something I asked.

[Imperium]

Spoiler: Yesterday's wagon interaction on Peregrine

Vote: Peregrine

I'd love a flashwagon but not on myself or Beast. I don't know why the Vyse wagon derailed - his replace-out doesn't make sense.

is anyone up for a TD speedlynch

pedit: my man this question is just fr you

VOTE: peregrine

is anyone up for a TD speedlynch

I'm not.

I am, and I think anyone reading his switch from you to the mastin wagon should also be.

nope!
let's lynch peregrine.

I'd love to hear why you're not.

Do we have to lynch Peregrine? He's a completely null read.

yes.

No, I don't particularly feel like Peregrine. My apologies.

VOTE: TiphaineDeath

i'll type up a town case when i have time.
why not compromise on a null read? TD isn't getting lynched today.

Hey guys, having problems irl, don't want it to spill over in to game, but don't REALLY have time to post right now. I've looked terrible this game and this move is not going to help. I think cephrir is scum UNVOTE: VOTE: cephrir I'll try to explain this when I get back, promise.

I think Cephrir's scum!

1579+1580=cephrir scum. He responds to my same post in two different, both derogatory ways. He planned and wanted to respond and make sure I got shut down and lumped in as scum with ace, he also forgot he had already done so, not town play. See, ace has been incredibly scummy, but he can't be scum as long is cephrir is unless we are in multiball, so cephrir is the lynch.

Still going with Cephrir-scum!

I do not like this interaction Sam-I-Am. Note to self, Stick-With-Your-Gut, and logic and everyone else be damned. VOTE: Solar Wind

My gut said it was Solar Wind all along!

Ceph is almost certainly town at this point.

Cephrir is so town!

Ceph and solars talk was crappy, Solars vote and unvote stinks of scum trying to make something happen and backing off quickly when it doesn't. Ceph's gambit is town.

Ceph town, Solar still scum.

Hi magua! .

And no, no particular reason to have a read on Rach either way, but in my experience scum rach super lurks, though that may just be rach-rach XD.

I would love to lynch mastin today, that would make me happy, it just doesn't seem likely :/.

I support mastin as well!

Ya know what, fuck it this lynch is more likely than a lynch on Solar XD, why the fuck not. VOTE: mastin

Mastin is scum!

Didn't include points on PV but he supports that dying too.

But, even if you feel it's weak - it's still far better than Peregrine.

Because the case on Peregrine is ??? right now and ??? does not lead to a scum lynch.

At the same time, your case on Peregrine is

still

???, and you've clearly been reading the thread! So I'm waiting to be blown away.

Okay.

I am still waiting for why Peregrine is scum.

Not interested in the D1 lynch of anyone I consider to be lynchbait just because they do lynchbait things. That's what makes them lynchbait.

This includes both PeregrineV and TiphaineDeath.

In particular, I see nothing in TSO's 2265 that says TD-scum to me rather than TD-just-being-his-goddamn-normal-self. If anything, TD jumping his reads over like that makes me more likely to read him town because scum just wouldn't need to.

Do want to vote Imperium, though, for pre-emptive buddying, but this is past RVS so I won't even though I should.

Oh, so basically:

My case on TD is, apparently, bad and so we are not doing it.
Your case on PV is, quite clearly, non-existent and yet we ...are doing it?

I'll admit it - the TD case is solidly mediocre. It's still the best thing we've got right now.

TD is town and so we are not doing it. In addition, the case on him is bad.
Peregrine is ??? at BEST and so we are doing it. There is no case on him.

*bashes head through screen*

What you will see if you click above is the interaction once Nacho started to try to push for a Peregrine lynch yesterday. (yes, he backed off, Peregrine pulled that same exact you should lynch me eventually to help town as a town beloved princess in cap com where Nacho and I were scum, we thought he was doing the same thing.)

But, as Nacho starts pushing Pere and Cephrir jumps on, TSO starts ramping up his lets lynch TD, what's the case on Pere. I included the Magua interaction because it's also twitch worthy for the reasoning. He considers Pere lynchbait so he doesn't want a lynch there BUT rachmarie is also lynchbait so I'm not sure why he considered her a fine lynch, so.

Anyway, didn't pick this up in Peregrine's iso but when TSO complained about trying and not getting a TD lynch, I didn't remember him even pushing TD so I looked and voila.

I think this makes him more likely scum. (I'd say definite scum, but in Once Upon a Winter's Night, I thought Beast could be scum for refusing to help me lynch scum Antihero on day one because he didn't like the case on him.)

Can you explain this post? I'm misinterpreting something here.

*interactions between TSO/Imperium quoted where TSO is against a Pere lynch because it's a complete shot in the dark*
"As we pushed Pere, TSO pushed TD."
"I didn't remember TSO pushing TD so I looked it up - turns out TSO did push TD!"
"And, therefore, TSO is scum."

Like I have no idea how that post was not called out for the shoddiest of reasoning if I'm correct.

It's not shoddy reasoning at all.

My search started because you went "shucks ank we tried to lynch TD and failed" while you weren't even voting him or trying to get him lynched, especially when he's one of only three people we can lynch today.

I didn't remember you even pushing TD, so I searched and found that you did push TD.

What is interesting is that you went for the TD push when Pere!scum was being pushed by nacho. That's when you started making a case against TD, arguing against nachos push on pere and trying to get him to go for TD instead. It continues after I stopped quoting, as nacho does make a case against pere that you dismiss. It looks like you were trying to derail a wagon on your partner by offering up another solution.

This is especially key considering anyone on his wagon would be roleblocked and that PV was actually better off for scum if nightkilled.

When nacho found Peres soft claim and started backing off you were then willing to work with nacho on the lynch and dropped your desire for TD.

That's suspicious and I don't think you for one second misinterpreted the point of my post and discredit it that way. It doesn't guarantee you as scum, but it is a red flag.

[Solar Wind]

Why Ffery specifically?

Because ffery's more nightkillable.

:/

Well, it's true.

I've seen both of you in like 10-30 games or so. Somewhere in the middle for F-16, somewhere in the high range for ffery.
Only once or twice have I seen F-16 get nightkilled.
Only once or twice have I seen ffery

not

get nightkilled.

I'm wondering how that looks as a graph over time. I know where mine is trending. Not that it's game-relevant.

[T S O]

The fact is Peregrine's wagon was complete bull. Peregrine's scumcase was ???, as I said. I am completely unapologetic for that.

In regards to being roleblocked - I didn't have that knowledge. It makes me look bad afterwards, I'll grant, but it's just an unfortunate set of coincidences.

[T S O]

Can you honestly say you expected Peregrine to flip scum?

[Imperium]

I was thinking about pv's role and a day being skipped if he was nightkilled.

That implies the presence of a VIG and/or another scum team/sk.

Which means the scum team knew there was other scum out there and maybe that's why finding a strong scum read has been difficult. I'm also wondering if his role would be present with only a VIG/1 racist. My first thought is more. He would have been hoping for a crosskill/nightkill in that case.

[Imperium]

Can you honestly say you expected Peregrine to flip scum?

I didn't have a read on pere. I didn't have great feelings about him, but honestly the only time I've ever had a read on him early is when I've thought he was town on day one and both times he turned out to be the serial killer.

And I mean, no it doesn't make you certain scum. I've been there. I've derailed scum lynches day one more times than I can count, but I'm not going to not point it out and try to get a read because it could be coincidence.