Lynching townies just because they're going against "the system" is anti-town, Stoofer. It's unfortuante, but townies WILL sometimes ignore the town and go off and do what they think is best. Attempts to deter them from doing that by saying "kill anyone who ignores it", like you were doing, is only of limited effectivness as townies will often be willing to put themselves at risk in order to do what they think is good for the town.Mr Stoofer wrote:Actually, there is another reason why I have been suspicious of Yosarian2: his behaviour on the Battle Mage wagon. Yosarian2 was very pro "the System", and yet he seemed to regard Battle Mage's subversion of it with equanimity. And, when Battle Mage started acting scummy (quite apart from subverting the System), he defended him, going after me instead.
Find me ONE example of a game where the town was able to "enforce disipline" of the type you're suggesting, and I'll consider it. As far as I know, that's never actually worked, and it's been tried many times.
Not only that, when I disagreed with you, you actually attacked ME for disagreeing with you, trying to suggest that me just saying "don't vote to lynch BM unless you actually think he's scum" was somehow scummy. I don't trust people who call me scummy because I disagree with their stratagy.
Besides that, if we just let it be acceptable for everyone to say "well, BM broke the rules, let's lynch him", then that discussion creates much less information then the discussion I wanted to see, a "who's more likely to be conservative scum, Battle Mage or Van Damien".
And by the way, how, exactally, was Battle Mage "starting to act scummy quite apart from subverting the system"?
We won't actually know if Battle Mage's actions WERE pro-town or not until we find out if Van Damien is conservative scum. If he is, then Battle Mage was actually correct in going off "the plan" and challanging him.Yosarian2 is in favour of lynching pro-town people who are harming the Town: as this post demonstrates:So why didn't he adopt this policy with Battle Mage, who clearly fell into this category?Yosarian2 wrote:That being said, while I won't vote someone just because they're not playing well, there are times I vote for someone because of anti-town play; if a person is acting in such a way that it directly harms the town, which could be lurking, or hammering people without giving them a chance to claim, or some other anti-town behaviors, then the town needs to make them stop doing that, either by pressuring them with votes or if they won't stop by lynching them, even if you're not sure of their alignment.
Now, if someone was challanging people right at the start of the day before any discussion had happened, that would be anti-town. But that's not what happened. On the other hand, I do consider the the early votes that cut off discussion on Battle Mage prematurly to be an anti-town action, just like a quick hammer in a normal game would be.
Ok...as soon as you start trying to take WIFOM that far, and trying to make it sound like your attack on a townie was pro-town and my "defense" of a townie was anti-town, it just makes me more suspicious of you.I have a suspicion that the reason Yosarian2 was defending Battle Mage was that he knew he was a Townie, but knew equally well that Battle Mage was going to get lynched. He did it to look pro-Town. If you look back at his play yesterday, it seems to me that he is making it clear that he does not support a Battle Mage lynch, but he doesn't make any real effort to push to Town in any other direction. [/qutoe]
Actually, I did not actually defend Battle Mage before the lynch happened, unless you consider my "let's vote for whoever's scummier" argument a "defense'. I was still waiting for you to put together a single coherent argument for why Battle Mage was scum (Note: NOT "why we should lynch him" but "why he is scum"); when you had done that, I would have considered it, responded, disagreed with any points I didn't like, and then said what I thought. I've played and am currently playing a lot of games with Battle Mage, and he didn't really feel scummy to me in this game, but I was keeping an open mind. And then the day ended prematurly before I got a chance to DO any of that, which was incredibly frustrating, and I would also argue anti-town.
Any experienced player knows that defending a doomed Townie is a win-win situation for Scum -- as long as they don't defend them too hard, of course. After everyone started screaming for Battle Mage's blood yesterday, I think I might well have done exactly what he did if I were Scum.