Open 585: Jungle Republic (ended)

[Lyserg-Zeroz]

^I was asking because I wanted to avoid that (also, conversation, seeing what others that know her think about what you say blablabla) ;-;
Also, I'm gonna be super nitpicky and annoying here, but what I didn't get about your reactions to Orci's reaction test is: If you didn't know they were reaction tests or something like that, what did you mean when you said the "somebody had to bite so I went for it" lines? The "necessary vote" line also sounds like you were taking credit for starting the convo in a way that sounds to me like you are trying to say you knew what was up.

[Lyserg-Zeroz]

^I was asking because I wanted to avoid that (also, conversation, seeing what others that know her think about what you say blablabla) ;-;
Also, I'm gonna be super nitpicky and annoying here, but what I didn't get about your reactions to Orci's reaction test is: If you didn't know they were reaction tests or something like that, what did you mean when you said the "somebody had to bite so I went for it" lines? The "necessary vote" line also sounds like you were taking credit for starting the convo in a way that sounds to me like you are trying to say you knew what was up.

[Aristophanes]

I think I was just trying to take credit for something I hadn't done because I felt dumb for not realizing in the moment that he was going for reactions. Also, I mean, someone had to vote for him. I'm not wrong when I said that. I was just trying not to feel as dumb about it. #RealTalks

[Lyserg-Zeroz]

(my internet connection sucks, sorry about that double post)
Screw you Ari, I'm pretty sure this is actually you being honest (alingment non-indicative anyways I'd say) but fuck that AtE >.<

Continuing: On the other hand, look at her response to me on 187 about the werewolf thing, that strikes me as a townslip (maybe in this case it's more of a non-werewolf slip, but I was thinking that a mafia would know it'd be easy to check for the wincon on the public role pms or something) because what she's saying was like assuming the werewolf had no other wincon besides the "at least one protown role" one. It didn't pass the second check I tried to apply when I asked more about that (I kinda expected her to be like "Oh, my bad, misunderstood their wincon" or something) but it still caught my eye; am I misreading what she meant or making too much out of that? (because besides that townslippy feeling of it, the "werewolf" thing is part of what makes me feel like some of her points are a stretch). @Other_people should also tell me if I'm being dumb about this.

[Lyserg-Zeroz]

(Eh, w/e, I'm just dumb, "full majority" scenarios still go through "at least one protown role", I still found that strange)

[Aristophanes]

(my internet connection sucks, sorry about that double post)
Screw you Ari, I'm pretty sure this is actually you being honest (alingment non-indicative anyways I'd say) but fuck that AtE >.<

Hey, you were the one who wanted to be nitpicky!

Continuing: On the other hand, look at her response to me on 187 about the werewolf thing, that strikes me as a townslip (maybe in this case it's more of a non-werewolf slip, but I was thinking that a mafia would know it'd be easy to check for the wincon on the public role pms or something) because what she's saying was like assuming the werewolf had no other wincon besides the "at least one protown role" one. It didn't pass the second check I tried to apply when I asked more about that (I kinda expected her to be like "Oh, my bad, misunderstood their wincon" or something) but it still caught my eye; am I misreading what she meant or making too much out of that? (because besides that townslippy feeling of it, the "werewolf" thing is part of what makes me feel like some of her points are a stretch). @Other_people should also tell me if I'm being dumb about this.

I don't quite get what you're saying here, Lys.
She had the wincons right in this post, no? She mentioned a majority and the "at least one protown role" thing in that as a werewolf wincon.
In that post specifically, I thought it was weird that she specifically said something about still having "no clue who the seer is yet". This seemed like a scum slippy-wording imo. I had forgotten about that until I read that post again. What are your thoughts on that? And like I say, please elaborate on your thoughts on this being townslippy.

[Lyserg-Zeroz]

Forget it. I just found it weird that she emphasized the "at least one protown" point, to where she assigned the werewolves a kind of third-party behavior (of "pitting mafia and town against each other"); I see this as something that could either be done by both scumteams or even moreso by mafia instead, since they have no NK and are therefore subject to the werewolves kill, but yeah, I'm prolly just being dumb and this is getting to theory talk-y.

I found it strange too, but it also somehow strikes me as something a scum would be too nervous too say, so I went null on that.

[orcinus_theoriginal]

Orcinus – Hasn’t posted much

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... rt_order=d

[prawneater]

Care to expand at all on why Lyserg is town, I'm your scum read, and everyone else is neutral?

I think Lyserg is actively scumhunting. You on the other hand seem to jump to whatever popular bandwagon is going. First with orcinus_theoriginal, next with Aristophanes. The reasoning behind your votes amounts to "seems scummy" with no further elaboration. It just seems like someone who wants a fast lynch to me.

[Metalcyanide]

Care to expand at all on why Lyserg is town, I'm your scum read, and everyone else is neutral?

I think Lyserg is actively scumhunting. You on the other hand seem to jump to whatever popular bandwagon is going. First with orcinus_theoriginal, next with Aristophanes. The reasoning behind your votes amounts to "seems scummy" with no further elaboration. It just seems like someone who wants a fast lynch to me.

A) The orcinus_theoriginal vote was to get the reason for his random votes. I missed a post which if I had seen would of made the vote unneeded.
B) Ari has felt off to me and this being a game of mafia especially in D1 sometimes relies on a gut feeling based off of the past. And I am keeping my vote on him unless someone can convince me otherwise.

But on another note: You have had 4 posts (thank you orcinus_theoriginal) 1)voting for Vyse 2)Saying Lyserg is town / I'm scum 3) voting for me 4) quoted. Why the lack of posts? You've been on the site and commenting on other subjects are you trying to just lurk through D1? Also, are the other people who voted for Ari after me (farside and lal) just looking for a quick lynch? Also, your town read is still voting for Ari what does that say to you? We need some info out of you man

[Metalcyanide]

@Prawneater I read the vote list incorrectly your town read is not voting for Ari, sorry. But we still need more info out of you in general.

[prawneater]

I'll admit it, I'm kind of a low-content poster compared to a lot of you guys. You can check the other games I'm in and hopefully you'll see my lack of posting is not alignment indicative.

Anyways, I don't have a problem with farside and lal having votes on any specific person. They look like they're actively trying to figure out the game.

When you say things like "gut feeling" and throw out a vote, it feels like you're doing the opposite.

[farside22]

I thought they came from another site that plays mafia. I recall one said something about lal always killing them.

Yeah, but not knowing OMGUS and other cues makes me think Lal is still pretty newish. Now, personally I think that parts can be attributed to that, but I still think she's scum.

Knowing she has only played one game on their site, do your feelings change?

No.

There is a case she made on orc read as cherry picking a case for crap reasoning.
Her vague response can be put under newbish.

[Metalcyanide]

Okay so big post time. But I've decide to rework how I'm looking at everything . So I'm going to post reads and/or question based off of peoples current votes (also @Mod your vote count is wrong prawn is voting for me not Vyste)

People voting for Ari:
West: What is your current thoughts on Ari? Your vote started as a joke, then you later justified it by analyzing his wording (post 102). You also suggested an Ari&myself team, can you elaborate on this more if you still think so. (we are voting for each other as of this post). For everyone else I think West is flying under the radar a bit. Not based on the number of posts but the substance. Most posts have to do with Ari. I'm leaning slightly towards nontown on West atm.

VysePresident: Well based off Vyse comments so far, real life has apparently prevented him from participating. However, before he left he was also wary of Ari's town and wording. Null read just not enough there right now.

Metalcyanide: I don't belive Ari is playing his typical town game but some of his recent posts have been a return to form. Not sure if that's because he is just more focused or trying to fix tone.

Farside22: I really like post 166. It really sums up his and other peoples vote/suspicion of Ari. He also is pushing for a Lalendra scum read but no vote on her yet, no comments after myself and others confirm she is new to mafia so this may change. My read on Far is null, not enough there for me to theorize on teammates

Quick note: Just to address Lal, myself or others being biased towards friends it won't happen. In a competitive game Lal would sell me out for a nickle just to "beat" me, as for everyone else I've seen them go after each other for the smallest of things. I forget who brought it up but please don't worry about that. So onto

Lalendra: Scum, the scummiest of scum, so scummy the scrubbing bubbles can't get rid of her. Okay but seriously, she is playing a very noob or very elaborate game (damn English major). I've read her posts several times am having trouble following her train of thought. She oddly defends me from Ari by voting for Ari. Justifies the vote more by pointing to West's reasons. Lal, has anything changed for you since Ari has answered your question? Who is your next scum read. My read on lal is noob town atm

Just a side note, this group of voters doesn't fill me with the most confidence. I do believe we are all after a scum player but my vote is most likely is aligned with a mix of town & mafia or wolf players (not both).

People voting for Lal:
Ari: He is voting for her based off of his reaction test that really only she responded to. The post between his "Vote Metal" and his next post were Lal's vote on him and people questioning Lal. So the following doesn't make much sense to me as he had one reaction in a reaction test

Of the responses, I like Lalendra's the least. I actually had a kind of scum inkling on Metal, but this is much better than I expected.
VOTE: Lalendra
She switched so quickly to a scum read on me and her best argument thus far was "West made a good point, I just didn't see it before" which just sounds off to me. I feel like she was just waiting for a good moment to pounce, and I gave it to her.

Anyways my thoughts on Ari I feel like are well documented at this point. Scum read.

Acryon & Orcinus_theoriginal: I'm grouping these guys together because I still think they are working together knowing they are on the same them. One of them basically reminded the other to vote post 219, post 222 and post 223 to try to distance themselves a bit. I know I said town on them earlier but they are still doing more of the same and it's not because they can't conversation out of anyone else. Feels like they are trying to steer the game. Scum team read.

Voting for Glinko:
YYR is easy. Not enough to go off of. Only 2 posts one which he says people aren't giving enough info and votes for Glinko because of reasons I can't see.

It's 530 am and I've been going over each post way longer then I wanted to. I'll finish up on everyone else after I look at some house tomorrow. (people I need to comment on are lyserg, glinko, and prawn)

[farside22]

Metal: I have one vote and think both ari and lal are scum.
I don't believe they are on the same team.

[farside22]

Also scum reading pawn and the hydra of cheetory.

[Lalendra]

(my internet connection sucks, sorry about that double post)
Screw you Ari, I'm pretty sure this is actually you being honest (alingment non-indicative anyways I'd say) but fuck that AtE >.<

Hey, you were the one who wanted to be nitpicky!

Continuing: On the other hand, look at her response to me on 187 about the werewolf thing, that strikes me as a townslip (maybe in this case it's more of a non-werewolf slip, but I was thinking that a mafia would know it'd be easy to check for the wincon on the public role pms or something) because what she's saying was like assuming the werewolf had no other wincon besides the "at least one protown role" one. It didn't pass the second check I tried to apply when I asked more about that (I kinda expected her to be like "Oh, my bad, misunderstood their wincon" or something) but it still caught my eye; am I misreading what she meant or making too much out of that? (because besides that townslippy feeling of it, the "werewolf" thing is part of what makes me feel like some of her points are a stretch). @Other_people should also tell me if I'm being dumb about this.

I don't quite get what you're saying here, Lys.
She had the wincons right in this post, no? She mentioned a majority and the "at least one protown role" thing in that as a werewolf wincon.
In that post specifically, I thought it was weird that she specifically said something about still having "no clue who the seer is yet". This seemed like a scum slippy-wording imo. I had forgotten about that until I read that post again. What are your thoughts on that? And like I say, please elaborate on your thoughts on this being townslippy.

Not sure how it would be a scum slip, no one had mentioned anything related to the seer yet and the role is right in the mods post at the beginning.

[acryon]

Metal: I have one vote and think both ari and lal are scum.
I don't believe they are on the same team.

I also believe this.

@Lyserg: I get where you're going with some of the points and digging you're doing, but I would caution that you seem to be putting too much emphasis on possible scum-slips. They don't actually happen that often, and I think it's going to worsen your scum-hunting effectiveness if you are focusing on the possibility of it so much. Behavioral scumminess is a far better thing to look for than slipping.

[acryon]

I'll admit it, I'm kind of a low-content poster compared to a lot of you guys. You can check the other games I'm in and hopefully you'll see my lack of posting is not alignment indicative.

Anyways, I don't have a problem with farside and lal having votes on any specific person. They look like they're actively trying to figure out the game.

When you say things like "gut feeling" and throw out a vote, it feels like you're doing the opposite.

Hopefully I'm not being too harsh, but be more helpful to town then. You've posted essentially 3 times in 11 pages.

Your couple posts that do have content seem like they would be good for town in greater quantities, so if you want us to win you should share more

@Metal: Do you think I am going for the low-hanging fruit in going after Lal? Also, this struck me as odd:

Quick note: Just to address Lal, myself or others being biased towards friends it won't happen. In a competitive game Lal would sell me out for a nickle just to "beat" me, as for everyone else I've seen them go after each other for the smallest of things. I forget who brought it up but please don't worry about that. So onto

Lalendra: Scum, the scummiest of scum, so scummy the scrubbing bubbles can't get rid of her. Okay but seriously, she is playing a very noob or very elaborate game (damn English major). I've read her posts several times am having trouble following her train of thought. She oddly defends me from Ari by voting for Ari. Justifies the vote more by pointing to West's reasons. Lal, has anything changed for you since Ari has answered your question? Who is your next scum read. My read on lal is noob town atm

So you think that Lal would sell you out to beat you, implying you know something of her games, but then you call her noob town? This doesn't seem to line up to me. If she is a newbie, then how would you know she would sell you out just to beat you?

[Ginko]

Quick post of thoughts from one head not consulting the other -

he tunneled in on me, West and Metal

This is funny to me

Lyserg, you're noticing similarities with her scum game, which is fine and dandy, but have you checked to make sure she's not like that as town as well?

Slips are pretty meh.

@farside do you think confirmation bias is alignment indicative?

Willingness to rethink reads strikes me as townie from Metal.

waiting to discuss with other head before making a vote. The best vote in the game is farside's based on 166, but I can't agree with it because I can totally see Ari being more willing to put up with our shit than a stranger's. The testing the waters thing is a bit hard to believe though.

bbl~

[Ginko]

^Johnny btw

[Ginko]

@orci

, can you link me your last scumgame? Struggling to find something more recent than february.

-Cheetory6

[acryon]

@Mod: V/LA over the weekend as normal.

[orcinus_theoriginal]

@orci

, can you link me your last scumgame? Struggling to find something more recent than february.

-Cheetory6

Yep, that's it.

[farside22]

Confirmation bias?
I've heard the term but don't recall what it means.