Prisoner's Dilemma --- Congratulations to Sudo_Nym and Tamuz

[Xdaamno]

'Fox River' is filled with corrupt officials and guards with a grudge against a group of criminals. After capturing these notorious members, they were shocked to find the prisoner's files erased and no evidence remaining against them.

Guess they'll have to make it themselves...

Prisoners:

Alive: 2/11

-------------------------------------------------

Sudo_Nym

Health:

2

/10
-------------------------------------------------

Tamuz

Health:

1

/10
-------------------------------------------------

Replacements: The Greg (After the 30th June)

Dead: 9/11

. Needs more cowbell.
-------------------------------------------------

blahgo

-------------------------------------------------

Korran

-------------------------------------------------

JDodge

-------------------------------------------------

Mokina

-------------------------------------------------

somestrangeflea

-------------------------------------------------

Jordan

-------------------------------------------------

Yagami

-------------------------------------------------

Khelvaster

-------------------------------------------------

Guzame

-------------------------------------------------

[Xdaamno]

The Rules:

This game plays like the classic 'Prisoner's Dilemma'; but with multiple players. Each convict begins with 10 HP.

There will be three alternating stages: Reveal, Discussion and Action.

-------------------------------------------------

In the

Reveal

phase, the guards will issue a charge against all living players. This charge contains details about how much HP is lost or gained by each action (See the action phase). Apart from the first reveal phase, results on the previous action phase will also be given.

-------------------------------------------------

The

Discussion

phase lasts 24-48 hours (eligible to change). During this time, players can talk about strategies and moves.

-------------------------------------------------

The

Action

phase is when the thread is locked and actions are sent in. It ends when all actions have been recieved; I may set a deadline.

During the action phase, you may choose to do one of two things:

Defect:

If you defect, you must specify a player. You will lie by saying they performed the crime given in the reveal phase, and they will lose health, while you will be given a free pass. If another player defects against you, your sentence will be lessened.

Co-Operate:

By co-operating, you are placing your trust in your fellow players. You will not lose any health (but actually gain some in the earlier stages). If you are defected against, however, you recieve the maximum penalty.

A random, low number of players will also be randomly chosen as 'Top Dogs'. These players will recieve the ability to, once per game, use their manipulative skills to avert all charges and HP loss during that round, and redirect half (rounded down) of the maximum sentence against the players who defected against him/her. This can not be used in conjunction with another action.

Damage against players

does not

stack (Changed this after running statistics in excel). Only one defect against each individual counts, so multiple defects against 1 person only counts as 1 defect.

-------------------------------------------------

The game then once again progresses to the reveal phase and a new crime is charged. The last player to survive is the winner (Or, if multiple players survive all twelve charges, the game is considered a draw).

For further reading, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisoner%27s_Dilemma

Open for questions, of course

[Xdaamno]

Just came downstairs to finish something off.

Before I definitively state anything, I need to know more about how you plan to adapt the game to more than two players, especcially if we don't all cooperate or betray. If there are ten players, and three cooperate and the rest betray, what happens?

In this game, the only way I could adapt it was you had to betray

someone

, and if they're co-operating they'll recieve the maximum sentence (HP Loss). See:

Defect: If you defect, you must specify a player.

Just to clear things up, whenever I talk about sentencing people etc I'm reffering to how much HP they lose, it's a metaphor for all purposes. Hopefully it will become clearer as the game is played.

And for further clarification, this is an example of a 'crime' given at the reveal phase:

'Insert Crime Here'
+1 HP for players who Co-Operate
-1 HP for players who defect, and are defected against
-3 HP for players who Co-Operate, and are defected against.

You may, therefore, wish to change your playstyle based on different charges against you.

I'll leave signups open for a while and see how many players I get.

[Xdaamno]

Taking 12 people - 3 more places left

Edited a rule: Damage against players stack. If one player co-operates and two defect against him, he will recieve double the maximum sentence. EDIT: After two players have defected against someone, any further defects against that person will not count (I.e. they can't take more than double the normal damage).

Double Edit: After running some charts in excel, I'm gonna change the ruling AGAIN so that no matter how many people defect against you, you only take 1 defect's worth of damage/HP loss.

[Xdaamno]

Ending signups tonight around 9-10pm GMT, then I'll start with who I have.

Out-Of-Thread communication will be allowed, but if you don't NEED to use it, it'd be a lot better to post here.

[Xdaamno]

Also... a brief question. Can you defect against multiple people? Think this over carefully.

While I admit this isn't going to be exactly the same strategic-wise as 2 player prisoner's dilemma, the answer is no. By doing so you'll be doing damage to more people, and there isn't really a penalty I can give to balance this out.

[Xdaamno]

No problem. I'll put you on the replacement list, but I'd prefer not to waste anyone else's time by making them temporarily replace you.

[Xdaamno]

OK, 11 players will be fine.

Starting the game, and sending out all roles (I.E. whether you're normal/have the ability to manipulate once per game).

I'll start the reveal/discussion phase shortly.

[Xdaamno]

All PMs have been sent out, no confirmations needed.

Starting Reveal Phase 1

The porticullus grind against the cold, brick walls. Looks like you'll be in here for a while. Hopefully.

First Charge:

Petty Theft

Gain 2 HP if you Co-Operate, and are not defected against
Gain 0 HP if you Defect, and are not defected against
Lose 1 HP if you Defect, and are defected against
Lose 3 HP if you Co-Operate, and are defected against

Starting Discussion Phase 1

Out-Of-Thread communications are allowed, but for the sake of the game, please do not talk out-of-thread in the action phase. You will now have 24-48 hours to discuss tactics, strategies or tigers.

[Xdaamno]

For the record, I'd like to point out you can only defect against one particular person, and, for that reason, if you don't think anyone's going to defect against you individually, co-operation is the best option.

[/modtalking]

Edit: Yes, I'm aware the game theory for this is different than the game theory for the actual prisoner's gambit, and the game could be done in a majority-loses kind of defect/co-operate style, but that's not what I'm doing. If I hosted this again, I'd probably try that out, though, with a few extra twists.

[Xdaamno]

The chart's numbers are correct.

[Xdaamno]

Yagami, I added the rule that only 1 defect counts against a single person.

Otherwise the game would be over sooner than I wanted it to, I wanted a slight time for players to retaliate, and it's a little more realistic.

[Xdaamno]

All the results will be 100% public in the reveal phase, including who defected who.

Remember, ideally, you're playing to win alone. If you like, I'll devise a scoring system to give players a rank of 'how much they won', at endgames, so it's not singularily last-man-standing.

[Xdaamno]

I'm talking too much.

For rule clarification, I'd like to point out

If you defect, the damage done to you if you are defected against is -1, regardless of who you defected against. You can defect against player A, an if B defects against you, you'll still only take -1 damage

[Xdaamno]

Oh. I'm going to edit the chart to reflect that; hope it's okay...

I'm not the one playing here, so it's fine with me. I was just doing that so you don't all blame me if you start having more HP than you're supposed to.

[Xdaamno]

Oh, right, I have no policy on edits. Edits are fine, since you're PMing your actions (And even then you can Re-PM me them and change them).

[Xdaamno]

Mod: what if two people use top dog ability at once??

Anybody who targets either of them will get damage redirected. They both can't betray each other on the same turn as the Top Dog thing is an action, but anyone who betrays either of them will get the effect.

[Xdaamno]

Now's a better time for the 24-hour limits for me personally, and discussion 1 dosen't have much more to give, so...

Starting Action Phase

Send in your actions now; Co-Operate, Defect (Player), or Manipulate.

Prodding Guzame for the next phase.

[Xdaamno]

Starting Reveal Phase 2

Action Phase 1 Results:

After interrogation,

Tamuz

and

Korran

break under the pressure. They finally 'admit' to having seen their fellow convict,

Mokina

steal the carpet and wallpaper of a new house. Apparently.

Mokina has lost 3 HP

Someone else thinks differently, however.

blahgo

decides to fend for himself and says

Korran

stole the wallpaper/carpet. You can't find these furnishings anywhere else, you know. However, Korran has had his sentence reduced due to his honesty.

Korran has lost 1 HP

Finally,

JDodge

has the last word. Dismayed at the 1HP loss of his closest friend, he backstabs blahgo. The prison now believes this was a joint-heist of Mokina, Korran and blahgo.

blahgo has lost 1 HP

All the other convicts, however, have co-operated.

All Co-Operators (Save Mokina) have gained 2HP

Second Charge:

Tax Evasion

Gain 1 HP if you Co-Operate, and are not defected against
Gain 0 HP if you Defect, and are not defected against
Lose 1 HP if you Defect, and are defected against
Lose 2 HP if you Co-Operate, and are defected against

Starting Discussion Phase 2

[Xdaamno]

Posting seems to have died down for a while. If you really want to say anything, since I'm doing the action phase early again, just PM me and I'll edit it into this post.

Starting Action Phase

Send in your actions now; Co-Operate, Defect (Player), or Manipulate.

[Xdaamno]

Starting Reveal Phase 3

Action Phase 2 Results:

Under the impression the others would lay off,

Mokina

was prehaps too forgiving.

JDodge

once defected the co-operating Mokina, who has been convicted of Tax Evasion.

Mokina has lost 2 HP

Elsewhere,

blahgo

decided to repeat his defect against

Korran

. He confessed without conviction, but Korran chuckled. blahgo was grabbed by the arms and taken back to his cell with an increased sentence; the guards had been manipulated. Seeing his chance,

Jordan

defected blahgo in an attempt to increase his popularity with the guards.

blahgo has lost 2 HP. Korran may not use his manipulate ability again.

Sudo

cracked under the second day of interrogation, and defected

Jordan

. Unlucky target, as Jordan's sentence had been reduced.

Jordan has lost 1 HP

With his trust in the other convicts,

Yagami

has co-operated. Unfortunatly for him,

Tamuz

was not so merciful, and defected.

Yagami has lost 2HP

Everyone else, however, was lucky this time off, and co-operated without loss.

Khel, Flea and Guzame have gained 1HP

Third Charge:

Arson

Gain 2 HP if you Co-Operate, and are not defected against
Gain 0 HP if you Defect, and are not defected against
Lose 2 HP if you Defect, and are defected against
Lose 3 HP if you Co-Operate, and are defected against

Starting Discussion Phase 3

Officials worry about the overcrowding of prisoners, due to a new crime spree. However, many believe the problem will settle down in the future.

[Xdaamno]

I've devised a scoring system that gives everyone a share of 5500 (11*500) points in my excel sheet for this game, so your score will be relative to other people's, and it's based on a number of factors. It'll be useful once the game's over so it's not just a winner-takes-all screnario.

[Xdaamno]

Starting Action Phase

Send in your actions now; Co-Operate, Defect (Player), or Manipulate.

[Xdaamno]

Sorry about the rather long wait.

Starting Reveal Phase 4

Action Phase 3 Results:

blahgo

, for the third time in a row, has defected against

Korran

. Some are worrying he may be enacting a grudge, but the guards have no problem with it. Korran retaliated, with the help of

somestrangeflea

, to pin the blame back onto blahgo. Both are being charged.

Korran has lost 2HP. Blahgo has lost 2HP

JDodge

has kept up his streak of seemingly random defections, this time against

Jordan

. Jordan, however, did not take it so lightly, and defected back.

JDodge and Jordan have lost 2HP

Tamuz

, once again, has chosen a different defection target. This time,

somestrangeflea

was on the recieving end.

Yagami

, having an unusual fetish for insects, retaliated for him.

somestrangeflea and Tamuz have lost 2HP

For all this time,

Guzame

has been managing to fly under the radar. This time, however, he was not so lucky, as

Sudo_Nym

spotted this weakness.

Guzame has lost 3HP

Khel

and

Mokina

, however, have succesfully co-operated.

Khelvaster and Mokina have gained 2HP

Fourth Charge: Bribary

Gain 1 HP if you Co-Operate, and are not defected against
Gain 0 HP if you Defect, and are not defected against
Lose 2 HP if you Defect, and are defected against
Lose 3 HP if you Co-Operate, and are defected against

The charges will start to get a little harsher from now on.

Starting Discussion Phase 4

After the repeated increase in sentences across the nation, some have felt the concern to reduce punishments if the problem becomes too severe.

[Xdaamno]

Whoops, co-ops are supposed to get 2HP... going fixing >.>

[Xdaamno]

Simul-post

[Xdaamno]

Considering merging all phases into 1, where you can post and send actions at the same time so cnoversation can be boosted/the game sped up. Views?

[Xdaamno]

As many actions changes as you like, but I'll reveal once they're all in as if the phase ended. In the case of you being the last to send it in, I'd advise you to think about it as you may not have time to change before I reveal them.

[Xdaamno]

I'll probably continue this one (Round 4) as normal, then Round 5 will be merged. Depending on how it goes, I'll decide on rounds 6 onwards.

[Xdaamno]

Starting Action Phase 4

Waiting on blahgo and Korran.

[Xdaamno]

Starting Reveal Phase 5

Action Phase 4 Results:

Korran

and

blahgo

refused to enter the interrogation cell. As a result, the guards have treated this as confessing the the crime. They have both defected against themselves and have recieved the maximum penalty.

JDodge

also jumped on the wagon to avoid maximum penalty.

Korran and blahgo have lost 3HP

Khelvaster

remained a pacifist in the hoped of letting the other convicts rip each other apart. His luck ran out, however, due to

somestrangeflea

.

Sudo_Nym

saw his chance, however, and backstabbed the flea.

Khelvaster has lost 3HP and somestrangeflea has lost 2HP

Guzame

,

Yagami

and

Tamuz

, however, did not approve on

Sudo

's puzzling antics. They agreed to form a convincing story proving Sudo's guilt.

Sudo_Nym has lost 2HP

Everyone else, however, was lucky this time off, and co-operated.

Jordan and Mokina have gained 1HP

Fifth Charge:

Forgery

Gain 1 HP if you Co-Operate, and are not defected against
Lose 1 HP if you Defect, and are not defected against
Lose 2 HP if you Defect, and are defected against
Lose 3 HP if you Co-Operate, and are defected against

Starting Merged Phase 5

Sorry for the very long wait, I should of enacted upon the deadline quicker.

[Xdaamno]

Feel free to send in actions.

[Xdaamno]

For those interested, I'm waiting on Tamuz, blahgo, sudo and Korran but I don't want to end the phase yet anyway.

[Xdaamno]

Thanks for the actions all. I'll give blahgo and Korran until early tommorow, to be fair.

[Xdaamno]

Starting Reveal Phase 6

Action Phase 5 Results:

JDodge

and

Jordan

knew the drill. Wake Up, Eat, Hang Around, Defect

blahgo

, Sleep. The plan was solid. blahgo was so resigned he didn't even defend himself.

blahgo has lost 3HP, and is metaphorically dead

Yagami

and

Tamuz

are more of the pacifist type, however. After reviewing the situation, they decided to try and overthrow

Jordan

, one of the more scheming convicts.

Jordan has lost 2HP

Sudo

and

Mokina

weren't so impressed with

Yagami

and

Tamuz

. As it was obvious those like JDodge weren't going to come quietly, they opposed the straight co-op tactic and defected Yagami.

Yagami has lost 2HP

Further on in the congo line of defections,

Guzame

saw his opportunity to enact revenge upon

Sudo_Nym

once again. Hilarity ensured, as

somestrangeflea

jumped on the bandwagon, and defected Guzame.

Sudo_Num and Guzame have lost 2HP

I'm truly out of flavour to describe what

Khelvaster

did next.

somestrangeflea has lost 2HP

Korran

was feeling the pressure, though. Medics thankfully recovered him from a suicide attempt through hanging, but it was not without loss.

Korran has lost 3HP

This time,

no-one

co-operated, and no-one has gained any health. I suspect the next charge won't change that.


Sixth Charge:

Kidnapping

Gain 0 HP if you Co-Operate, and are not defected against
Lose 1 HP if you Defect, and are not defected against
Lose 2 HP if you Defect, and are defected against
Lose 4 HP if you Co-Operate, and are defected against

Starting Merged Phase 6

Due to the 'death' of only one convict so far, the government has decided not to relax current sentences.

Merged phases are faster, I'm using them.

[Xdaamno]

Modnote: I've not listed those that weren't defected against, but defected, and therefore lost HP. It's reflected in the player HP though.

[Xdaamno]

Anyone want me to post the current leaderboard?

[Xdaamno]

Yeah, it's obvious the discussion dosen't really here since everyone's playing independantly. I'm leaving the thread unlocked, anyway.

1st Place: Khel (761 points)
2nd Place: Sudo_Num (621 points)
3rd Place: Guzame (605 points)
4th Place: somestrangeflea (585 points)
5th Place: Yagami (569 points)
6th Place: Jordan (567 points)
7th Place: JDodge (471 points)
Joint 7th Place: Tamuz (471 points)
9th Place: Mokina (367 points)
10th Place: Korran (263 points)
11th Place: blahgo (217 points)

It's a game of survival. Minimize your own losses.

[Xdaamno]

I won't explain it all exactly, but it's dependant on 3 main factors: How high your HP is each round, how high everyone else's HP is each round, and how many other players are dead.

[Xdaamno]

Waiting on 2 players: Korran and Sudo.

[Xdaamno]

Prodding.

[Xdaamno]

Sorry for Sudo, it wasn't his fault. I deleted his message (Somehow)

Starting Reveal Phase 7

Action Phase 6 Results:

Korran

is the second dead player. He resisted restraint and shot himself with a revolver provided by

somestrangeflea

and

Jordan

. Poor guy.

Korran has lost 3HP and is now dead

All was not well, however ( ).

Khelvaster

had teamed with

JDodge

to defect

somestrangeflea

and

Jordan

respectivly.

Sudo_Nym

, unable to resist the bandwagon, saw the perfect time to stab Khel in the back.

somestrangeflea, Jordan and Khelvaster have lost 2HP

On an unrelated note,

Guzame

has one again enacted upon his vendetta against

Sudo

. This time, however, things were more gruesome. Instead of a simple defection, Guzame arranged for a complex series of traps leading to Sudo being shot in the liver. Don't know why, but he did.

Sudo_Nym has lost 2HP

Mokina

thought she was safe. Unfortunatly, her attempt to climb back up the ladder was thrwarted once again, this time by

Yagami

.

Mokina has lost 3HP

Tamuz

was the only convict who co-operated succesfully, and has therefore lost no health. All unlisted convicts have lost 1HP due to defecting.

Seventh Charge:

False Ransom

Gain 1 HP if you Co-Operate, and are not defected against
Lose 1 HP if you Defect, and are not defected against
Lose 2 HP if you Defect, and are defected against
Lose 5 HP if you Co-Operate, and are defected against

Starting Merged Phase 7

[Xdaamno]

More actions.

[Xdaamno]

Waiting on Sudo, Guz and Jordan.

[Xdaamno]

Starting Reveal Phase 8

Action Phase 7 Results:

"Gah! I've had enough of this!", shouts

JDodge

. Driven insane,

Mokina

gets the anger of his words.

Yagami

was trying to defect her, but it seems JDodge did most of that for him. Little did they know things wouldn't end as predictably as they usually do. "Wait... no! TOP DOG, SUCKERS!" JDodge and Yagami were both hauled back to their cells.

The guards had been manipulated

.

JDodge and Yagami have lost 2HP

Jordan

, seeing the declining condition of

JDodge

, decided to betray him at the best time. "The quicker he dies, the less likely he'll be able to take revenge".

JDodge has lost another 2HP

Sudo_Nym

had a stroke of genius; taking down

Khelvaster

would be the best choice, since he was being the quitest player and the most likely to survive. Little did he know Khel was just as ruthless. What goes around, comes around.

Sudo and Khel have lost 2HP

A new experimental tactic was being tried by the authorities; journalists were beginning to investigate the prison and the convicts needed to be put away for life, quickly. They locked

Guzame

,

Tamuz

and

somestrangeflea

in a room, and any of them who wished to escape would have to defect. Guzame saw this as the perfect opportunity to seek revenge on somestrangeflea for a previous defection, and was the first one out. 'The flea' thought on it's feet, and knew the only was to escape was to defect Tamuz. Tamuz, left alone, realised his way out was to defect Guzame; he'd be able to escape, while managing to do the most damage.

Guzame, Tamuz and somestrangeflea have lost 2HP in an overly flavoured defection war

Eigth (Howdya spell it?:P) Charge:

Battery

Gain 0 HP if you Co-Operate, and are not defected against
Lose 1 HP if you Defect, and are not defected against
Lose 3 HP if you Defect, and are defected against
Lose 5 HP if you Co-Operate, and are defected against

Starting Merged Phase 8

[Xdaamno]

No, it dosen't. Mokina manipulated you, dealing 2 damage (5/2 rounded down), and you also got defected.

[Xdaamno]

*cough*

And you've taken 2 damage every round since the first one, flea.

[Xdaamno]

As the conversation died down again, now would be a good time to send actions, those that haven't

[Xdaamno]

Similarily, newbie games are unfair because sometimes there isn't a cop/doc? It's a game. No whining

[Xdaamno]

Waiting on Khel and JDodge btw.

Deadline 24 hours from now.

[Xdaamno]

You knew the rules from that start of the game.

[Xdaamno]

Starting Reveal Phase 9

Action Phase 8 Results:

Mokina

decided to co-operate, but as she very well knew, had run out of luck.

somestrangeflea

and

Yagami

tasered her repeatedly. Her partner in crime,

JDodge

, suffered life in prison due to

Tamuz

.

Mokina and JDodge are now dead

Sudo

saw the bodies pile up, and tried to form an alliance between the virtuos convicts; his first objective was to defect

Tamuz

.

Khelvaster

made sure any attempts to form a strategy that could harm his position would be defeated, however.

Tamuz and Sudo_Nym have lost 3HP

Jordan

caught

Khelvaster

with his back turned, and stabbed him. In unrelated news,

Guzame

beat

somestrangeflea

with a stick, doused him with gasoline, burned him alive and sent him into the sun.

Khelvaster has lost 3HP, and somestrangeflea has died.

All other convicts have lost 1HP due to defecting.

Ninth Charge:

Mayhem

Gain 1 HP if you Co-Operate, and are not defected against
Lose 1 HP if you Defect, and are not defected against
Lose 4 HP if you Defect, and are defected against
Lose 5 HP if you Co-Operate, and are defected against

Starting Merged Phase 9

[Xdaamno]

Just waiting on Tamuz.

[Xdaamno]

Starting Reveal Phase 10

Action Phase 9 Results:

Yagami

,

Khelvaster

and

Jordan

had all reached the end of the line. They all recieved a maximum (legal) prison sentence after rioting and killing two guards, and consequently defecting each other.

Yagami, Khel and Jordan are dead

Guzame

was also out of luck. He hoped to survive, by co-operating, but was thwarted by

Tamuz

.

Guzame is dead and Tamuz has lost 1HP

Sudo

was the only player to succesfully co-operate.

Sudo has gained 1HP

The Tenth, and almost certainly last charge:

Murder

Gain 0 HP if you Co-Operate, and are not defected against
Lose 1 HP if you Defect, and are not defected against
Lose 4 HP if you Defect, and are defected against
Lose 6 HP if you Co-Operate, and are defected against

Starting Merged Phase 10

[Xdaamno]

Scoreboard:

1st: Sudo_Nym (1141 points)
2nd: Tamuz (1031 points)
3rd: Khelvaster (1030 points)
4th: Guzame (790 points)
5th: Yagami (754 points)
6th: Jordan (732 points)
7th: somestrangeflea (307 points)
8th: JDodge (191 points)
9th: Mokina (49 points)
10th: Korran (-194 points)
11th: blahgo (-331 points)

[Xdaamno]

For the record, Khel defected Jordan, Jordan defected Yagami and Yagami defected Khel.

[Xdaamno]

He sent in the choice, otherwise I would of made him defect himself.

[Xdaamno]

Thanks

[Xdaamno]

Whoops, better put an official end to this

The last two contestants, having survived extrodanily, are finally defeated by the prisoner guards, as they defect against each other.

Tamuz

and

Sudo_Nym

are joint winners!

The scoreboard still stands, so good game all.