Micro 382 - CREDIMVS PAVONI DEORVM (Game Over!)

[BlueBloodedToffee]

You've got heart man. You've been caught and you're still trying hard. I can respect that.

Can you continue your reads-list please, starting with Wake and then Vettrock after.

[Josh_B]

I haven't pushed any case on Vettrock and you, I'm pushing you only. I don't know why you're referring to other people's posts when you're addressing me. I am not pushing any associatives at all, just you.

...with the same case that Asher made against Vettrok.

Are Tier and Scripten not also pushing the same points as to why you're scum? Is it only me and Asher? You should rethink that.

No. I'm not talking about pushing the same points as to why a single person is scum. I'm talking about two different players pushing the same case against two different players. It's

the case

that links Asher and You together. Look at 258 and 267. I've linked them together in post 419 for your convenience. It's inventive, it isn't perfectly sheeped, but it does appear to be rehearsed/planned.

Did Tier not say he liked my first initial attack post on Wolfy D1? Is he not scum with me? He basically sheeped me right after my vote on Wolfy, so he used my reasoning. Why are me and Tier not a team but me and Asher are? What's the difference?

Yes, Tier did. I even liked the case against Scripten. Scripten said he liked your case against me. There is a lot sheeping going on in this game. But is it agreeing with the points that others have brought up(the normal town thing that happens)? or is it people who are trying to be dishonest about their reads(a scum tactic). I think it's the former. There is town sheeping and there is scum sheeping. You know the difference right?

I'm not particularly interested in any of your questions, but I don't remember not answering any?

I'm waiting for your flip before I pursue other avenues. Have I not made my reads clear enough for you?

Fair enough, now that you've answered what you are doing to get better reads on other players. Let me just make sure I understand.

You Aren't.

but no you haven't made your reads very clear at all. What are your reads? can you link me to them?

[TierShift]

huh.

Josh, what was it that prompted your read on scripten and BBT to change?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

How is that reads-list coming along?

Still waiting on Wake and Vettrock.

[Josh_B]

You've got heart man. You've been caught and you're still trying hard. I can respect that.

Can you continue your reads-list please, starting with Wake and then Vettrock after.

Thanks. You have heart, too. I'm considering putting you in for a "rising star" nomination actually, and at some point if we keep running into each other like this, I'd think it would be fun to hydra with you.

Vettrock is done. Wake is easy.

Wake, you came in really strong with your questions to all of the players. It generated a lot of content and discussion. But you haven't really engaged any of those responses. Some feed back on that would be nice.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Vettrock is done?

Can I have an updated read on both Vettrock and Wake please.

[Josh_B]

huh.

Josh, what was it that prompted your read on scripten and BBT to change?

Do you mean from BBT/Scripten to BBT/Asher?
An ISO PbPA on Asher. My case really just started with Asher's contradiction to his feelings on Vettrock. First he said he thought Vettrock should have tried to defend Wolfy more if Wolfy was a town read, then he said that he didn't like it that Vettrock was defending me.
If I'm one of Vettrock's town reads, doesn't it make sense that vettrock would defend according to that line of thinking?
I thought,

If Asher didn't like the way Vettrock handled the Wolfy wagon, wouldn't he be more inclined to appreciate the way that Vettrock is handling the Josh wagon?

But while I was doing that deja-vu hit me. What Asher said that he didn't like about Vettrock in the first place was nearly identical to the thing that I've been battling from BBT. /case solved.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Associative cases are bad without flips.

[Josh_B]

Associative cases are bad without flips.

And you should have let that case go when Tier told you to stop.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

What case?

[Josh_B]

What case?

The one where

you

said I had a town read on wolfy.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

What's that got to to with you producing associative cases?

[Scripten]

Do you mean from BBT/Scripten to BBT/Asher?
An ISO PbPA on Asher. My case really just started with Asher's contradiction to his feelings on Vettrock. First he said he thought Vettrock should have tried to defend Wolfy more if Wolfy was a town read, then he said that he didn't like it that Vettrock was defending me.
If I'm one of Vettrock's town reads, doesn't it make sense that vettrock would defend according to that line of thinking?
I thought,

If Asher didn't like the way Vettrock handled the Wolfy wagon, wouldn't he be more inclined to appreciate the way that Vettrock is handling the Josh wagon?

Keep in mind our perspective: Vettrock should have defended Wolfy more because Wolfy was town, but he did not. In fact, all the way back in (137), he was defending you. That's most of his contribution so far: white-knighting lynch targets... and you. We want to see him scumhunt, but he's not really asking questions or doing anything except saying "Let's lynch someone else! Who? I don't know. But somebody!" It's non-committal, safe, and therefore scummy.

What made your read on me switch from scum to town? It was very similar to BBT's switch earlier, which you did not like at all.

[Josh_B]

Oh man. I just wrote a post that was really rude and hateful toward you Scripten. This is a rewrite with the same information pared down a little.

I don't think you are scum Scripten because I found the Holy Grail of scum tells.

AN INFORMED MINORITY

I am willing to forego my ego in favor of accomplishing the wincon. That means, it may be that I just don't like your playstyle.

I usually call a person on white knighting when they are trying to prove that they are town because of a lynch. Do you see either Vettrock or I trying to convince anyone that we're town because of Wolfy's lynch? What I see is two players(BBT/Asher) trying to convince others that we both knew that Wolfy was town prior to the lynch and pushing this case that we should have done something about it. TWO towns were already convinced that Wolfy was scum. Mr. Ree thought he was town, and still hammered. What do think about that?

I also wish Vettrock would ask questions and scum hunt more, but as you can see here, that's just the way he is.

As far as read flips go, is what I did any different than..

Anyway, BBT actually seems relatively town to me at the moment despite the butting of heads.

[Asher Kendrell]

Sorry guys, some thunderstorms yesterday left me without power so I haven't been able to post. I'll do a re-read tonight and hopefully post some more.

[TierShift]

So josh, your case is two people pushing the same points?

[TierShift]

Nevermind, I'm done with this day. Dragging this out any longer will just lead to apathy.

VOTE: josh

Scripten, please hammer.

[Wake1]

Scripten, if you hammer Josh and he flips Town, it won't look good for you. *Fair warning.

*Swamped with work, and client just died, so off work tomorrow. Life's been crazy.

[Josh_B]

So josh, your case is two people pushing the same points?

the points are rehearsed points against two different people.

[Scripten]

Asher Kendrell:

What are you intending on posting about? I don't like the game's activity hinging on just one(two?) players.

Wake88:

I don't intend to quicklynch. Do you have something specific to say when you are less busy or was that just a general statement?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Scripten, what are you hoping to gain from prolonging the day?

[TierShift]

So josh, your case is two people pushing the same points?

the points are rehearsed points against two different people.

And you've seen scumteams exhibit this behaviour before?

[Josh_B]

And you've seen scumteams exhibit this behaviour before?

Did you just ask me if I've ever seen scumteams make plans?
I think it was a good plan, it was just over played.

[Scripten]

Scripten, what are you hoping to gain from prolonging the day?

We have two players looking to have something said before the end of the day. I don't see why we should need to cut them off.

[Asher Kendrell]

huh.

Josh, what was it that prompted your read on scripten and BBT to change?

Do you mean from BBT/Scripten to BBT/Asher?
An ISO PbPA on Asher. My case really just started with Asher's contradiction to his feelings on Vettrock. First he said he thought Vettrock should have tried to defend Wolfy more if Wolfy was a town read, then he said that he didn't like it that Vettrock was defending me.
If I'm one of Vettrock's town reads, doesn't it make sense that vettrock would defend according to that line of thinking?
I thought,

If Asher didn't like the way Vettrock handled the Wolfy wagon, wouldn't he be more inclined to appreciate the way that Vettrock is handling the Josh wagon?

But while I was doing that deja-vu hit me. What Asher said that he didn't like about Vettrock in the first place was nearly identical to the thing that I've been battling from BBT. /case solved.

I do think vettrock should have defended wolfy. I also think that if he believes you're town, he should defend you. What I didn't like about it was that the first (non-quoted) line of his first post in ~40 hours was defending you. That seems to me to mean that he's extremely focused on protecting you. Which is quite a 180 turn from how he handled the wolfy wagon, which means there's something different about you. Either he's utterly convinced you're town, or you're working together. I don't think that's much of a contradiction on my part.