Mini 442 - Beast Wars Mafia Game Over

[ryan]

unvote Fraggle/Teffc

... hi!

Jordan and Ryan, what is involved in your case against Lowell, ignoring a few jokey posts? Have you thought that this is maybe Lowell's playstyle at all?

And what about Fraggle? You understand he can't justify any of Teffc's actions at all, and should be judged - almost - independently from Teffc, although granted, Teffc's actions still have some bearing.

So to conclude - what's your case?

If you choose to call his posts "jokey" thats fine, I posted all my suspicions of Lowell on page 7 (or 6 I believe)

[FraggleScum]

Will I survive all the fights and the darkness?
Trouble sparks, they tell me home is where the heart is, dear departed
For multiple years, witness peers catch gunshots
Nobody cares, seen the politicians ban us
They'd rather see us locked in chains, please explain
why they can't stand us, is there a way for me to change?
Or am I just a victim of things I did to maintain?

I will have many more thoughts on other players coming up...but Albert's posts are very interesting.

If it is a certain restriction he has...then he probably has some sort of special role. I went back and read his posts/poems and they really hint at a possible vigilante or serial killer role. A lot of them are "I'm all alone against the system" kind of writings....just a thought.

If it is just the way he really decided to post this game....then that is a waaaay strange decision and strikes me as very unlikely.

Either way, I think it's a cool idea....in a game-setup kind of way.

I'll be back with more.

[Sweenytodd]

Okay guys... first of all...

If it is a certain restriction he has...then he probably has some sort of special role. I went back and read his posts/poems and they really hint at a possible vigilante or serial killer role. A lot of them are "I'm all alone against the system" kind of writings....just a thought.

That is ridiculous.... NO ONE in any frame of mind would breadcrumb SK... That makes no sense...

Secondly... this is what I would like to see in the next day or so (RL days)... What I'm waiting on are:

Lowell to respond to post #175
TrustGossip to detail the Teffc/Fraggle case for the benefit of HackerHuck
Fragglescum to defend himself against that case...

I think those are the points which have yet to be addressed... I would ask Albert more about his PR but I figure if he was going to he would have done so already...

"Mr. Rampage, can you please explain the meaning behind your violent lyrics?"

Explain tha meaning?? What tha f*** these **** talkin about...

[FraggleScum]

Okay guys... first of all...

If it is a certain restriction he has...then he probably has some sort of special role. I went back and read his posts/poems and they really hint at a possible vigilante or serial killer role. A lot of them are "I'm all alone against the system" kind of writings....just a thought.

That is ridiculous.... NO ONE in any frame of mind would breadcrumb SK... That makes no sense...

I didn't say he had a choice about it...for all we know he doesn't...or he could just be crazy. All I was saying is that it struck me as interesting.

-Also, deezr and OvertheUnder have not posted anywhere on site for at least 10 days. Both their votes are from page 1 and I think still stand...which is definetely not helpful for figuring out anything.

[HackerHuck]

unvote Fraggle/Teffc

... hi!

Jordan and Ryan, what is involved in your case against Lowell, ignoring a few jokey posts? Have you thought that this is maybe Lowell's playstyle at all?

And what about Fraggle? You understand he can't justify any of Teffc's actions at all, and should be judged - almost - independently from Teffc, although granted, Teffc's actions still have some bearing.

So to conclude - what's your case?

Just look back through mine and Lowells posts and you'll find all the evidence you need to see him as scum.

As for Fraggle, what do you mean he should be judged independently from Teffc? They're the same player, Teffc couldn't handle the scum role, why should we ignore this when judging Fraggle?

Are you simply incapable of summarizing and presenting your cases against Lowell and Teffc?

[JordanA24]

unvote Fraggle/Teffc

... hi!

Jordan and Ryan, what is involved in your case against Lowell, ignoring a few jokey posts? Have you thought that this is maybe Lowell's playstyle at all?

And what about Fraggle? You understand he can't justify any of Teffc's actions at all, and should be judged - almost - independently from Teffc, although granted, Teffc's actions still have some bearing.

So to conclude - what's your case?

Just look back through mine and Lowells posts and you'll find all the evidence you need to see him as scum.

As for Fraggle, what do you mean he should be judged independently from Teffc? They're the same player, Teffc couldn't handle the scum role, why should we ignore this when judging Fraggle?

Are you simply incapable of summarizing and presenting your cases against Lowell and Teffc?

No, I'd just be repeating myself if I did summarize.

[TrustGossip]

Wait a second. You just said you didn't like Albert's post restriction ("because it makes it tough on him and makes him post less") BUT than said "I can't think of why any of us would be post restricted?" Huh???

ryan, you are seriously hindering me, oh my gosh. In case people haven't noticed this, but I tend to have a bit of an underdog complex. I tend to lean heavily against the first bandwagon being accurate. ryan, you made a few good points in the beginning against Lowell's incendiary and uncooperative playstyle, but your constant misinterpretation of people's posts is eroding my trust in you.

IGMEOY: ryan

The case against teffc is that the sum of her testimony is either; worthless (posting just for the sake of activity), vague (innumerable 'too' statements), or nonexistent (the long period of lurking until asking for a replacement).

But like I said earlier, her getting replaced is generally bad because now we have to wait for fraggle to post enough to analyse.

Unvote: teffc/Fragglescum

[HackerHuck]

unvote Fraggle/Teffc

... hi!

Jordan and Ryan, what is involved in your case against Lowell, ignoring a few jokey posts? Have you thought that this is maybe Lowell's playstyle at all?

And what about Fraggle? You understand he can't justify any of Teffc's actions at all, and should be judged - almost - independently from Teffc, although granted, Teffc's actions still have some bearing.

So to conclude - what's your case?

Just look back through mine and Lowells posts and you'll find all the evidence you need to see him as scum.

As for Fraggle, what do you mean he should be judged independently from Teffc? They're the same player, Teffc couldn't handle the scum role, why should we ignore this when judging Fraggle?

Are you simply incapable of summarizing and presenting your cases against Lowell and Teffc?

No, I'd just be repeating myself if I did summarize.

How is it repeating yourself when you never made a case to begin with?

Since you seem to have forgotten why you think Teffc is scum, try using the view all posts by user function at the bottom of the page. If that doesn't jar your memory, you might want to at least make something up.

Targeting lurkers/inactives on day one is a copout and a hallmark of opportunistic scum. Replacing an inactive is generally good, since inactivity

is not

a scum tell.

[JordanA24]

unvote Fraggle/Teffc

... hi!

Jordan and Ryan, what is involved in your case against Lowell, ignoring a few jokey posts? Have you thought that this is maybe Lowell's playstyle at all?

And what about Fraggle? You understand he can't justify any of Teffc's actions at all, and should be judged - almost - independently from Teffc, although granted, Teffc's actions still have some bearing.

So to conclude - what's your case?

Just look back through mine and Lowells posts and you'll find all the evidence you need to see him as scum.

As for Fraggle, what do you mean he should be judged independently from Teffc? They're the same player, Teffc couldn't handle the scum role, why should we ignore this when judging Fraggle?

Are you simply incapable of summarizing and presenting your cases against Lowell and Teffc?

No, I'd just be repeating myself if I did summarize.

How is it repeating yourself when you never made a case to begin with?

Since you seem to have forgotten why you think Teffc is scum, try using the view all posts by user function at the bottom of the page. If that doesn't jar your memory, you might want to at least make something up.

Targeting lurkers/inactives on day one is a copout and a hallmark of opportunistic scum. Replacing an inactive is generally good, since inactivity

is not

a scum tell.

Oh for God's sake there's so many things wrong with that post.

My case against Teffc was because of her very contentless posts and her unfounded suspicions of you, and I think you, for now, is the most pro-town player here.

And for the record, I was asking the mod to prod the lurkers, hardly targetting them is it? And I didn't say replacing a player is a bad thing, it's just that Teffc acted scummy before Fraggle replaced her, and we shouldn't just completely ignore that.

[HackerHuck]

Since I didn't know why you found Teffc suspicious, the second part of my post was mostly directed at TrustGossip. See his post directly above mine.

[JordanA24]

Since I didn't know why you found Teffc suspicious, the second part of my post was mostly directed at TrustGossip. See his post directly above mine.

(I really do end up using that too many times.)

[Sweenytodd]

Just for the record, I asked our mod to prod Deezr and OTU yesterday so I am sure he has done so and if they fail to pick up their prods they will be replaced, so lets try and focus on the actives...

Since no one else seems willing I will go through and try to outline what I have percieved as the case against Teffc....

Good morning again now! i see i got my first ever vote on Cooney Island. YEY!
anyone not posting?

p.s. I am a she:D

hiya there. i'm back just wanted to drop by to say i'm still alive Mr. Green

morning, my computer crashed yesterday and i had to have it fixed...sorry i couldn't post earlier
there are a few persons i would like to see post.
so i'm sticking to my first choice, deezer.

A lot of lurking in plain sight, posting without adding any real content....

Why the bold statement, HackerHuck? Seems to me you are trying to get someone's attention with that. Is there any particular reason for it? Being immune to investigations sounds like a good reason for saying it.

Takes a benign statement of yours and twists it. Also role-fishing...

too me it does seem you are trying to play it cool and way too safe. Are you waiting for an opportunity to bandwagon or even hammer someone? YOu have been keeping count of posts and posting and awful lot of theory but no real substance in those posts of yours. You seem to be prodding to see who cracks so you may cling on.

This is Teffc addressing Jordan but it sounds like he's describing his own posting style with "but no real substance in those posts of yours"... To me Teffc comes across as new to the game and trying to be helpful but at the same time not actually adding anything to the discussion...

[ryan]

Wait a second. You just said you didn't like Albert's post restriction ("because it makes it tough on him and makes him post less") BUT than said "I can't think of why any of us would be post restricted?" Huh???

but your constant misinterpretation of people's posts is eroding my trust in you

.

I looked at that comment and it looked scummy, so I questioned him on it, that doesn't mean I'm not trustworthy, that at least shows I'm trying to figure out each post instead of just skimming through it

[TrustGossip]

Wait a second. You just said you didn't like Albert's post restriction ("because it makes it tough on him and makes him post less") BUT than said "I can't think of why any of us would be post restricted?" Huh???

but your constant misinterpretation of people's posts is eroding my trust in you

.

I looked at that comment and it looked scummy, so I questioned him on it, that doesn't mean I'm not trustworthy, that at least shows I'm trying to figure out each post instead of just skimming through it

I'm still trying to decide whether or not you're just a little overenthusiastic about finding scum, or you are one. Most of the rest of us *cough* *cough* are also trying to find scum, though maybe not as zealously as you are, to the point of a great deal of misreadings.

The crappy awful thing is that I don't think we'll really get anywhere if we still have those two lurkers and if Fraggle doesn't post more.

[Lowell]

I've got two scum now. Ryan and Albert. Discuss.

I can't talk now (internet cafe), but will write more when I get back to work on Tuesday.

[Sweenytodd]

Lowell: I will be voting for you if you do not respond to my questions in #175... Discuss....


Albert is on my list of suspects as are well, a lot of people.. But having (or claiming to have a post restriction) does not exempt you from activity, I expect more participation.... And voting for lowell for this post:

Good post. This guy is town.

Now comes the part where opportunists jump on me!

My bolding for emphasis... Seems counter-productive... It was obvious he was making a point about using posts like that to draw reactions... Why would you vote him for that?

And for the record we can't possibly KNOW his restriction is real... I was trying to put together a meta-game perspective on Ryan and read part of a still active game (not going to discuss it)... Not saying more, just that I don't assume just because there is an "obvious" post restriction in effect doesnt mean it is legitimate...

[Albert B. Rampage]

Supreme ideology, you claim to hold
Claimin that we all drug dealers with empty souls
That used to tempt me to roll, commit to violence
In the midst of an act of war, witnesses left silent

unvote, vote jordan

for being scum.

unvote, vote Trustgossp

to bandwagon a newbie and make him crack.

How's this, just tell us your scumbuddies and I'll let you live.

unvote, vote Trustgossp

to bandwagon a newbie and make him crack.

How's this, just tell us your scumbuddies and I'll let you live.

WHY would you bandwagon a potential townie? I'm not sure I like your tactics

My apologies. That bandwagon was totally unnecessary.

unvote, vote ryan

. FEEEAAR me...

All that said, I'm no longer sure you're scum, if for no other reason than because this connection between you and Jordan is becoming too intense-- I would have expected a little distancing by now if you were both scum. Let me find another wagon to join.

unvote, vote teffc

. I have no idea what the case is against him, but other people seem to like it, so I'm there!

Wait, do I still have someone's random vote on me? Screw this:

unvote, vote OTU

. I can OMGUS with the best of them.

I'm going back to

unvote, vote ryan

. Your last few posts have been a bit off, in my opinion. Something about the way you wrote "us townies" and argued that quiet players are actually HELPFUL doesn't sit right.

I've got two scum now. Ryan and Albert. Discuss.

I can't talk now (internet cafe), but will write more when I get back to work on Tuesday.

Confirm vote Lowell

[ryan]

Why is it that when the heat gets turned up on Lowell he throws a couple names out and than disappears? Sweenytodd has been asking you questions Lowell, why don't you answer a few instead of posting a quickie and bailing on the game? If you can't post why you have suspicions why post? Seems like you're throwing out a few names to take the eyes off of you

[TrustGossip]

Post restriction or not, Albert is playing a very solid game.

For the first time, I'm considering Lowell as scum. ryan's been drawing my attention simply because he posts often and says a good amount per post. Still unsure about whether teffc was inexperienced scum or just inexperienced.

I'd still REALLY LIKE some status updates on OTU and deezr.

[Sweenytodd]

So I am willing to give Lowell until Tuesday:

will write more when I get back to work on Tuesday.

I still don't see a lot of his posts as scummy but need him to respond to our concerns.

Also Fragglescum needs to post: We replaced Teffc and will not allow another non-contributor...

I believe that OTU and Deezr were prodded on Thursday

MOD

would you confirm this and if they haven't picked up their prods when can we expect replacements?

Primoris: I don't think I've seen you comment since I entered the game... What are your thoughts on Teffc/Fraggle, Ryan, Lowell as of now?

Trustgossip: Was the case I outlined for Teffc what you had in mind or do you have additions to that? What is the order of your top 3 suspicions at this point? Do you see the interactions between Jordan and Ryan as suspicious at all? (Specifically psts #124 and 125) Those two posts bother me because I looked like Lowell was making another joke post to get a reaction and they immediately bit and in ver similar fashion. I am not suggesting that Ryan and Jordan are scum together but the interaction just seems odd to me.

Aimee: I attempted to lay out what I see as the case for Teffc and asked Trustgossip to add anything I missed... Who are your top suspicions at the moment?

[TrustGossip]

To Sweenytodd:

I'll do one better, here's a revised list of my opinions on all the contributing players (from most suspicious to most trusted).

Lowell

: a great deal of vote hopping (didn't realize the extent until Albert pointed it out), comments only for the purpose of provoking ryan further, throws out names of people he 'trusts' and people that he suspects as scum without much extended reasoning, a generally detached style of play.

Fragglerock

: extended lurk period after replacing, no urge to establish town-ness even though his predecessor has/had a bandwagon on them. Why?

Primoris

: put ryan at the closest to lynch yet (besides yours). Left it there for around two days, even after multiple people expressed concern. At least you had the good sense to retract your vote after I made it clear that I did not agree with it out of possibility of quick lynch. He has also not contributed much (I know HackerHuck stated that inactivity is not a scumtell, but not actively sharing theories and looking for scum

is

)

Jordan

: looks increasingly like a piggybacker. In the beginning of the game I didn't think much of his support for ryan because I was also supporting ryan's innocence. But he seems to be unable to vocalize an opinion that dissents from ryan's unless someone like HackerHuck points out a logical fallacy and Jordan quickly backtracks but doesn't really explain himself.

ryan

: contributes often but seems to have blinders on as he continually focuses on Lowell and not really considering anyone else (he had suspected HackerHuck, but after the presentation of other interpretations of HH's posts, has seemingly abandoned this campaign). His misreading of people's posts seems more like overzealous scumhunting, as I imagine a scummer would adopt a more complacent attitude and wouldn't adopt such an unpopular philosophy as "bandwagons are unproductive".

aimee

: she's this low on the list mainly because I feel like she'd be a much greater asset if she was just more active. I'm seeing her as a non-entity simply because there isn't that much she's provided that we can draw inferences from.

HackerHuck

: uses his experience to benefit the town has spent a great deal of time trying to teach ryan to use his time more efficiently than a simple crusade against Lowell. Hasn't done any questionable voting and starts helpful lines of questioning.

SweenyTodd

: well first of all you like a great play (haha j/k). In the short amount of time you've been in the game, you've actively compiled evidence without skewing it for personal gain and generally have been the leader in questioning ever since the bandwagon against ryan has looked increasingly useless.

Albert

: displays unusual levels of prescience in his actions. Although he's cryptic and the post-restriction is unusual, it seems sufficiently annoying that he wouldn't just do it for fun. In my opinion, all of his actions have been very spot-on.

TrustGossip

: well of course I'm the most trusted, as I'm still the only person that I'm certain is town.

I'm simply providing my opinion of people at this point in the game. People's most recent and most prominent actions weigh the heaviest (meaning that people who do more things tend to have a positive bias on this list). Please try not to use this list as a basis for voting. I'm actually discouraging voting because I feel there's a great deal of information missing because of the two inactives (three if you count Fraggle, four if you count Primoris). Sorry for lack of quote evidence, but I did not want to create a behemoth, and I am also somewhat lazy.

[FraggleScum]

Fragglerock

: extended lurk period after replacing, no urge to establish town-ness even though his predecessor has/had a bandwagon on them. Why?

I can understand your concern. I did not intend to be away so long and do apologize...replacing in on Memorial Day weekend became more difficult than I anticipated.

To start I should say that I came in unconcerned about Teffc's bandwagon...from my readings she made almost non-sensical posts and then fizzled out, so I could understand why the town would find her suspicious. I promise to be different.

I think that, as a replacement, it is very hard to simply state "town-ness"...and that it must be earned through actions. I will do my best to be worthy in my scumhunting.

I'll be working on my quotes, responses, and impressions....more to follow.

[JordanA24]

I've got two scum now. Ryan and Albert. Discuss.

I can't talk now (internet cafe), but will write more when I get back to work on Tuesday.

Why Ryan, and WHY ALBERT? (And if you're, as I'm suspecting, OMGUSing again, you're dead meat.)

[JordanA24]

Jordan

: looks increasingly like a piggybacker. In the beginning of the game I didn't think much of his support for ryan because I was also supporting ryan's innocence. But he seems to be unable to vocalize an opinion that dissents from ryan's unless someone like HackerHuck points out a logical fallacy and Jordan quickly backtracks but doesn't really explain himself.

And how am I piggybacking? I'm the one (with help from Ryan), that came up with Lowell as scum in the first place, and I've not changed my vote since. And I'm vocalizing opinions, I've made numerous good points about Lowell, me and Ryan just happen to have the same opinion, but I've already said, there's absolutely no connection between us. And the only reason I backtracked the last time was because HH wasn't adressing me when he made that rather strong post.

[Sweenytodd]

Okay Jordan, here are my questions for you...Let's pretend that Lowell is innocent, or even if we lynch him and he comes up innocent, then who do you suspect... I mean thats my problem with this kind of one sided crusade... Here are some questions for you... If Lowell is scum, who would you suspect next to go after tomorrow, and if he is innocent, who should we go after... Who else is suspicious and do those suspicions tie into the results for lowell...?

TrustGossip: Ty so much for putting that list together, that helps me a lot to understand where you're coming from...

Fragglescum: I'm not going to argue that Teffc made no sense.. That much is obvious... What I want to know is, having read this game as I am going to assume you have done at this time... What do you think about the current cases? How do you like the Lowell wagon? How about Ryan? Aside from the idea that Albert is breadcrumbing SK or Vig, do you think he makes good points with his posts despite the restriction? What do you think of Aimee or Primoris?