Mini 441 - Flavourless Mafia. Game Over!

[Aimee]

Vote: Cum Grano Salis

Hey again. How are you?

[Aimee]

Bob700, good votecount.

Cum, I like your photo.

And hiya Streeflo!

[Aimee]

Erm... that should be

Unvote
Vote: Primate

Could you explain this, please? I don't really understand your reasoning because:

1) You seem pretty indecisive in your post. After being indecisive, why put on a vote?
2) You just said that Primate's actions were "for the good of the town" and "could be helpful". Why did you put a vote on him, then?

FoS: xyzzy

[Aimee]

OK OK sorry! Don't get mad with me please. I don't want to distress anybody.

This is just the type of reaction that the town was looking for. A panicky, pressured post which just screams weakness.

FoS: undo

[Aimee]

Oh, and

unvote

, random voting is now over.

In case people wonder about my FoSes, I did them because: I am waiting for xyzzy's explanations. If they aren't satisfactory, then he could get my vote. And undo already has lots of votes and I wouldn't want to add another to the mix, for the risk of scum hammering.

[Aimee]

I think undo needs to give a full defence. He has been providing defence for each of the allegations, yet not a defence on the whole. I think it is necessary. Some comments from other players:

Primate: "You need to actually start backing up some of your comments, or at least saying why you think such things, instead of stating things as fact, undo."

Cum Grano Salis refers to undo, "... throwing ridiculous (for my taste) allegations."

Bob700 also notes that undo went on, "...a paranoid rampage..."

Aimee also mentioned that undo made "A panicky, pressured post..."

Streeflo: "Undo's arguments struck me as defensive and paranoid."

undo, you really need to properly defend yourself. Sum up your argument and show why your actions are not scummy, and why we should consider you as town.

[Aimee]

I'm suspicious of his debating. If he's innocent, he won't be bringing up bad arguments to accuse someone who currently looks very good. He's acting suspiciously around undo, for pretty pointless reasons.

It has already been established that he was simply doing it to provoke a reaction, something which he got. Otherwise, why would he have put a random vote against another player if he has a guilty cop result against another? And also, how is undo looking "very good"? He has been paranoid, overtly defensive, panicky and pressured. Not things usually found in town.

[Aimee]

Aimee:

Perhaps undo is a special role, trying to release information without looking like it; he can't really say, "I really am a cop, and you're really scum!"; that would look horribly suspicious, and he'd be immediately killed by any intelligent scum.

Maybe. However:

1) We shouldn't be blatantly rolefishing this early.
2) That is unlikely, because this ir a mini normal, not a theme game, meaning the roles have to be fairly standard.

[Aimee]

How is a cop a non-standard role?

Sorry, I thought by "special role" you were meaning something more unusual than a cop.

[Aimee]

And by process of elimination, he's not a townie.

Crap logic. Um, how? Because he claimed townie means he isn't townie? Where did this come from? So you are saying that undo's roleclaim means he isn't a townie?

[quote = "xyzzy"] Me and undo scum or masons? Laughable. If that's so, I've been predicting my own actions this whole time. I try not to dig my own grave. [/quote]

This seems strange. Predicting your actions implies that you have been trying to be careful throughout the game, and not make anything too controversial. It backs up a statement made earlier that you thought Primate was safe. This is a strategy employed more by scum - be careful what to say, and don't leave too many suspicious notes.

Vote: Xyzzy

The logic here is... horrendous. Until there is a proper explanation, my vote stays.

[Aimee]

Wow, welcome Raffles and The Fonz (who I see has actively posted).

I agree with some of The Fonz's points, but I would say that Primate's actions have benefited us, in the way that we have discovered undo's paranoid and emotional tendencies, xyzzy's faulty logic, and there can be an analysis about the bandwagon's that formed as a result of this. As a result, it is highly beneficial for the town, as it has pretty much led directly or indirectly to almost all of the information we currently have.[/b]

[Aimee]

Yes, Raffles that is very true (and I love your avatar!), bob700 got my attention by pushing undo pretty hard for a roleclaim, which I didn't really see as justified.

[Aimee]

FoS: Bob700

Yes, details can be needed for some roles, especially in more complex Theme Games. This, however, is simply a Mini Normal Game. Everyone knows what a townie does and what their win condition is, and therefore it was completely unnecessary to pressure undo into quoting his PM, which he luckily didn't do.

[Aimee]

Primate's move definitely benefited the town. Absolutely no question about it. I do, however, want to know what Primate thinks about this new found suspicion against what he did.

[Aimee]

I find CGS's post slightly troubling, just because undo and Xyzzy seem the towniest to me at this stage. I find Xyzzy's explanation in 184 satisfactory- it's an opinion I share, that Primate might well be audacious scum. I think that his trying to claim that he wouldn't possibly risk doing what he did if he were scum is WIFOMy.

I also think that he made an excellent point about Bob, which makes me pretty sure the latter is scum.

May I ask, what point?

The point that your asking undo for 'backstory' on his townie PM means that you can't possibly be townie.

Errr... what if Bob700 was just being a complete moron by asking that? He could be stupid, not scum?

[Aimee]

I disagree. Why would anyone be stupid enough to ask for flavour when their own role PM was supposedly of the same type, and contained none? That's off the charts stupid.

Besides, that's not what Bob claimed- he claimed by backstory, he didn't actually mean flavour, but things like win condition. I don't believe for a second that's plausible, and hence I'm pretty convinced he's scum. If I weren't, I'd still be voting Primate- the only thing can make me not push for the application of LAL is the even more useful metagame policy of 'lynch blatant scum.'

I agree with this. I was merely pointing out that she may not have been scummy asking it, and instead was being stupid. But you have pointed out a very good case against this.

Bob700, I remain uneasy about you. Why suddenly become "neutral" on the topic of undo's role? If you are town, it fundamentally makes no sense to hide your opinions and keep quiet. You understand that, right? We need to share all our thoughts and suspicions as a group. The fact you aren't doing this provides additional evidence that you aren't town.

[Aimee]

I have finals this week. Access will be sporadic at best, so don't expect any long posts. Sorry this is a bad time, due to the deadline, and I will have a longer post by Friday or Saturday. Sorry about this. StallingChamp, I don't need a replacement.

[Aimee]

Prods on Bird1111, Primate and Raffles please.

[Aimee]

Personally, I think we should move past the Primate issue, for now. We are under a deadline, and I may move my vote to Bob700. I am not convinced. Practically no evidence for her actions, or reasoning. Now, he has moved onto mindlessly agreeing with the Fonz, perhaps as an attempt to avoid suspicion. But I am still suspicious.

[Aimee]

Ouch.

[Aimee]

Wow, this game is finally over! Poopies, another loss for my record (*updates wiki*)

I have to say, this was a bit of a disaster from us. bird1111 and I discussed lying low, which quite obviously failed - both of us went on the first night! D'oh!

Scum, did you choose to kill me, or bird1111 that night? And why did you choose whoever you chose?