Event Card Mafia (Game Over)

[Juls]

Alright let me put it this way - Venmar wants to lynch me - why?

Is this directed at me?

[talah]

Ugh TIP I'm out for the night but on the off chance you're town:

- why then did you say I'd be newb scum before I mentioned it in-thread (this is provable)
- if your cult meta is asking a bunch of questions, then why isn't you asking a bunch of questions your cult meta
- why am I a hypocrite if I say you're scum for emulating my scum meta, when you're scum reading me for emulating *your* scum meta? Isn't that just putting a fine point on an incorrect argument?
- why is Iecerint scum?

latez, it's after midnight and Michael Jackson is here with Gremlins and they both want to be fed. So I have to find a shotgun.

[talah]

Alright let me put it this way - Venmar wants to lynch me - why?

Is this directed at me?

Yes.

[TheIrishPope]

Let's see, my null reads...
AD
AGar
the lurkers

[zMuffinMan]

It's more that she only focuses on people surrounding her. I tend to think she is not pushing me because it would be a hard sell.

logically, that makes sense though, given there's maybe 10 people in this game that have produced content and all of them have given a read on talah

i mean, OK, yeah, her primary scum reads seem to be people scum reading her and most of her town reads seem to be town reading her, but i don't think it's fair to look at things like that and think there's some ulterior motive here.

also some people just have a fairly OMGUSy way of scum hunting

[Juls]

I'm not sure why you are asking me and not Venmar but again, this is you focusing on you. I felt there was an exchange between you and Venmar in which Venmar came out looking more town than you. I don't always agree with reasons that people give for people being scum and Venmar intentionally keeps his cards close to his chest. While I am not a big fan of the play style, I learned a long time ago that I can't make people play the way I want them to and I can't necessarily lynch them for it either.

P-edit: and that is why I asked her to provide me evidence of her best scum game and best town game. She couldn't be bothered to do that. I don't have time to wade through all her games. I have two of my big town reads thinking she is town. I am trying to find reasons to believe that she's town but she really isn't giving me anything.

[TheIrishPope]

Ugh TIP I'm out for the night but on the off chance you're town:

- why then did you say I'd be newb scum before I mentioned it in-thread (this is provable)
- if your cult meta is asking a bunch of questions, then why isn't you asking a bunch of questions your cult meta
- why am I a hypocrite if I say you're scum for emulating my scum meta, when you're scum reading me for emulating *your* scum meta? Isn't that just putting a fine point on an incorrect argument?
- why is Iecerint scum?

Dude you're just scumreading me because I'm scumreading you, admit it

1. I said you were newb scum becaaaaause you were acting like newb scum; warming up to the best players and being safe
2. When people talk about meta, they refer to a collection of games over a certain long period of time with recurring trends. This was only one game where I tried this one thing and it was similar to what you were doing. "Cult meta" might have been the wrong term you wanted to use
3. That's the thing, I did thing X, you called me out for thing X and then you do thing X nonchalantly
4. A real Townie would consider the possibility of the both of us being Town. Iecerint is not a real Townie.

[KingdomAces]

VOTE: Venmar

A: I don't have a townread on him.
B: He's been at least marginally more active than some of the other options.
C: Even if he's town, he's doesn't seem to want to actually help.

Unless we just want to go for a lurker lynch, I don't think anyone else in the game would be a better option right now.

[Juls]

VOTE: Venmar

A: I don't have a townread on him.
B: He's been at least marginally more active than some of the other options.
C: Even if he's town, he's doesn't seem to want to actually help.

Unless we just want to go for a lurker lynch, I don't think anyone else in the game would be a better option right now.

We can also lynch this badness. Sheep goes baaaaa

[KingdomAces]

Erm, it's less than three days to deadline. More people need to be sheeping right now.

[TheIrishPope]

VOTE: Venmar

A: I don't have a townread on him.
B: He's been at least marginally more active than some of the other options.
C: Even if he's town, he's doesn't seem to want to actually help.

Unless we just want to go for a lurker lynch, I don't think anyone else in the game would be a better option right now.

Is it a scumread or a nullread then?
And don't you think lynching a lurker is far more efficient if we're looking at people who don't help

[TheIrishPope]

VOTE: Venmar

A: I don't have a townread on him.
B: He's been at least marginally more active than some of the other options.
C: Even if he's town, he's doesn't seem to want to actually help.

Unless we just want to go for a lurker lynch, I don't think anyone else in the game would be a better option right now.

We can also lynch this badness. Sheep goes baaaaa

Damn good point

Erm, it's less than three days to deadline. More people need to be sheeping right now.

Damn better point

[zMuffinMan]

i'm not married to the idea talah is town, but none of the arguments for her being scum are convincing to me and i see a lot more reason to think she's town than scum (plus, i mean, the fact she seems to be one of the only players who really seems to give a shit about the game is something in her favour)

i'm also starting to get cold feet because of how many people are basically saying "i'm voting venmar because muffin said to". i understand deadline and stuff, but :/

[Juls]

In post 607 you just don't like his play style now you want to lynch him. You have been fence sitting with no true-scum reads this entire game.

[TheIrishPope]

i'm not married to the idea talah is town, but none of the arguments for her being scum are convincing to me and i see a lot more reason to think she's town than scum (plus, i mean, the fact she seems to be one of the only players who really seems to give a shit about the game is something in her favour)

i'm also starting to get cold feet because of how many people are basically saying "i'm voting venmar because muffin said to". i understand deadline and stuff, but :/

Then how do you explain her being a major wagon at a point

[Juls]

Exactly muffin. When people start swaying so quickly it gives me pause.

[zMuffinMan]

Then how do you explain her being a major wagon at a point

are you asking me to explain to you how mislynches occur?

[talah]

Ugh TIP I'm out for the night but on the off chance you're town:

- why then did you say I'd be newb scum before I mentioned it in-thread (this is provable)
- if your cult meta is asking a bunch of questions, then why isn't you asking a bunch of questions your cult meta
- why am I a hypocrite if I say you're scum for emulating my scum meta, when you're scum reading me for emulating *your* scum meta? Isn't that just putting a fine point on an incorrect argument?
- why is Iecerint scum?

Dude you're just scumreading me because I'm scumreading you, admit it

1. I said you were newb scum becaaaaause you were acting like newb scum; warming up to the best players and being safe
2. When people talk about meta, they refer to a collection of games over a certain long period of time with recurring trends. This was only one game where I tried this one thing and it was similar to what you were doing. "Cult meta" might have been the wrong term you wanted to use
3. That's the thing, I did thing X, you called me out for thing X and then you do thing X nonchalantly
4. A real Townie would consider the possibility of the both of us being Town. Iecerint is not a real Townie.

I'm scum reading you because trolling and taking a strong, obstinate stance on a townie being scum is a safe play for scum
1) you shouldn't know whether I'm newbscum or not, but somehow you press that as an argument - given that we played together in Oakhaven I'd think you would definitely not presume that I'd be newbscum given how long ago it was
2) correct regarding meta. how am I your strongest scumread based on that? I've seen town base scumreads on their own meta before, I've done it myself before, so far it's been 100% wrong at my end. Why is it a good scumtell?
3) illustrating a point is hypocrisy?
4) I don't know that he hasn't considered that possibility and he's not voting you I don't think



Can you do me a favour and stop trolling if you're town?

[KingdomAces]

He's the closest thing I have to an actual scumread right now. The main thing stopping me from flat out saying he's a scumread is that I fear emotional reasons may be getting in the way of logic right now.
Lurkers have the possibility of not being lurkers later. Venmar has been active enough that it's clear that he's not planning on ever doing any more than he actually is.

Some of my vote is that it appears to be one of the bigger wagons right now and deadline, but I also really think that literally no one else in the game would make a better one.

And no, I don't have any true scumreads. That's because I find that I work far better when I get townreads and PoE from there.

[talah]

i'm not married to the idea talah is town, but none of the arguments for her being scum are convincing to me and i see a lot more reason to think she's town than scum (plus, i mean, the fact she seems to be one of the only players who really seems to give a shit about the game is something in her favour)

i'm also starting to get cold feet because of how many people are basically saying "i'm voting venmar because muffin said to". i understand deadline and stuff, but :/

Look I legitimately don't give a fuck who you vote right now I'll sheep it, so don't feel bound to Venmar but I'm bound to feel/read something into whoever you target so I mean it's a responsibility. I am so so tired of Day 1 in this game and I want a flip.

[TheIrishPope]

Like the one you started with Venmar, muffin?
Please do

Talah it's only trolling from your point of view because confirmation bias bla bla
Since when is "taking a strong, obstinate stance on a townie being scum" safe play

1. You're acting like newbscum and you said you were newbscum so the conclusion is easily reached
wtf was oakhaven
2. I have other reasons to scumread you, such as the ones previously mentioned
just because you've done Y and it hasn't worked doesn't mean Y doesn't work at all, I just do it correctly
It's a good scumtell because psychology
3. You didn't illustrate it, the way you asked was you being serious
4. He said he would lynch me solely on having a stronger townread on you which makes absolutely zero sense

[TheIrishPope]

KingdomAces is Town

[talah]

Since when does scum have confirmation bias?

[zMuffinMan]

Like the one you started with Venmar, muffin?

Then how do you explain him being a major wagon at a point

[TheIrishPope]

Since when does scum have confirmation bias?

To appear town you have to fake it

Like the one you started with Venmar, muffin?

Then how do you explain him being a major wagon at a point

Because it was a wagon started by you.
The talah wagon was started by me.
See the difference?