NY 169: The EPIC XD Mafia Game of Greatness (Game Over)

[geists]

I'd trade this zmuffin in on the Cash Cabd Rail Tracer in a heartbeat.

:/ i spent the entire D1 tunneling town players in that game and D2 onwards i was leveraging a PR result on scum to get better reads. i actually really disliked my play in cash cabd (at least prior to the part where i knew one scum). if you wanna talk about things here, we can talk. i'm in observation mode at the moment but if there are specific reads you want me to talk about, i'll go over them.

You were pushing people, demanding they take stances and clarifying their positions with questions from the get-go. Even with your suspicions wrong, your play provided a lot of data for analyzing other players later in the game.

You differ strongly on the Casso read and there's not much to be gained from rehashing that probably. Which other of my reads do you think are wrong?

[Titus]

Geists, what is your read on Casso? His play suggests town to me but the VCA troubled me a fair amount. What is zMuffin's position?

[Titus]

Casso, strong lean town but he's likely scum whiteknighting me if Sakura isn't scum

if your thoughts on casso being town are really that strong, why would sakura's alignment change things?

Geists, townish... I would probbly be scumreading him but for the gs. He could be a mafia doctor given we have a vig.

how do you have geists as "townish" if they'd be scum but for the gunsmith result?

also, what happened to your read on me / why wasn't i mentioned in your reads list? or what was with the whole fence-sitting accusation and how did things change there?

For the read on you, one fence sitty post does not warrant a read. Both town and scum can make a fenceshit. I usually fence sit more often as town than I do as scum. I gave a reads list for players I felt I at least had a somewhat handle on. You weren't included in that list because I didn't have a read on you fully. Both you and Pie are right to follow up in that regard. When Pie asked for a read on you, I gave one as tentative as I had been feeling on you. I don't put reads stronger than what I feel at the time.

As for Geists, his play for awhile was just focused on me, I don't see much depth there. I can see why the GS "copped" him. Paranoia suggests mafia doc or that DOMO was RBed. I almost always read someone wrong as town though so I'm thinking he SHOULD be town but my gut screams he's scum. If that doesn't make sense, please ask more reasoned questions.

As for Casso, Thor whiteknights me as scum sometimes. See Walking Dead. Overall, I like his play as town, but Thor looked town in Walking Dead to me too. A deadline lynch should go to the most popular wagon remaining if it's not pushed by scum. So my gut tells me that one of Sakura/Casso must be scum given the fact both of their wagons were skipped at the end. Casso and SH could be scum together possibly too with the VCA suggesting SH scum and Casso's unvote. If SH is town, I almost certainly will believe Casso is whiteknighting me again.

[Titus]

Oh and whoever said Sangres in Walking Dead, I probably didn't excuse Sangres's excuse for not claiming either. I probably wanted him lynched for a good part of the game. So yeah.

[geists]

Oh and whoever said Sangres in Walking Dead, I probably didn't excuse Sangres's excuse for not claiming either. I probably wanted him lynched for a good part of the game. So yeah.

Point being while rules of thumb like this are convenient (especially for scum needing to work up a quick basis for a vote), when applied out of the context of a player's overall play in a game, they are often wrong.

[geists]

Geists, what is your read on Casso? His play suggests town to me but the VCA troubled me a fair amount. What is zMuffin's position?

We posted a full reads list less than 24 hours ago and we've answered several questions about our Casso read since then. If you have something specific to ask, do so. I'm not going to regurgitate a read I've discussed at length.

[Titus]

Oh and whoever said Sangres in Walking Dead, I probably didn't excuse Sangres's excuse for not claiming either. I probably wanted him lynched for a good part of the game. So yeah.

Point being while rules of thumb like this are convenient (especially for scum needing to work up a quick basis for a vote), when applied out of the context of a player's overall play in a game, they are often wrong.

Then it wouldn't be a rule or a policy lynch. Period. Yeah, I may be wrong, but I want that behavior eliminated as it is very detrimental. People need to claim.

I'll go try to find that discussion after a nice long nap. I've had a bad day and I really don't want to take it out on the game.

[Sakura Hana]

but I want that behavior eliminated as it is very detrimental. People need to claim.

Things like this make it pretty easy for scum to rolefish.

[Titus]

but I want that behavior eliminated as it is very detrimental. People need to claim.

Things like this make it pretty easy for scum to rolefish.

Well if scum keep putting people to L-1, wagon analysis should out them. So yeah, not changing that. If that leaves me prone to the occasional wagon rolefish, so be it.

[geists]

but I want that behavior eliminated as it is very detrimental. People need to claim.

Things like this make it pretty easy for scum to rolefish.

Well if scum keep putting people to L-1, wagon analysis should out them. So yeah, not changing that. If that leaves me prone to the occasional wagon rolefish, so be it.

Yeah it's just awesome that your town-play works so well to advance a scum agenda when you're scum.

[Empire]

Day 3, Votecount 21

MafiaSSK (6)

-

Sakura Hana, RadiantCowbells, Norlkaz, Ms Marangal, Titus, Ser Arthur Dayne

Titus (2)

-

goodmorning, pieguyn

Norlkaz (1)

-

KoreanBBQ

Not Voting (7)

-

F-16_Fighting_Falcon, MafiaSSK, zMuffinMan, geists, Prophylaxis, Casso the King of Seals, Generic

With 16 alive, it takes 9 to lynch! Deadline is on January 26th at 4:30 PM EST or in (expired on 2014-01-26 17:28:18)

Mod Notes

-

N/A

Prodding Prophylaxis.

[Titus]

Geists, that statement is of no help whatsoever. You completely ignore the fact that scum just driving up wagons leaves them exposed to being caught in VCA and thus isn't helpful at all to them because I will find the scums. That is if you actually let me do that aside from just shouting I'm scum all the damn time.

[geists]

Make up your damned mind what your stance on me is.

[Sakura Hana]

Since they are so exposed, assume me and Casso are town, who's scum then.

[Generic]

If I could intervene for a moment, Proph is starting to join the front runners for scum. He despises drawing scum and tends to post very little due to a lack of motivation and concerns his dislike of being scum will stand out in his play.

Already being prodded is strike one right now.

[Titus]

Make up your damned mind what your stance on me is.

I am scumreading you based on play but the gs is pretty damning evidence I am wrong. So yeah, that's my thought on you. Don't act like I am not giving a reasoned opinion because I highlight my gut is disagreeing with the facts. Scum would likely just townread you and be done with it.

SH, who the hell is they?

Generic, I would hope he shows up with that VCA we promised to work out. He likes vca. I like it and I'd like a second opinion on that.

[Sakura Hana]

If I could intervene for a moment, Proph is starting to join the front runners for scum. He despises drawing scum and tends to post very little due to a lack of motivation and concerns his dislike of being scum will stand out in his play.

Already being prodded is strike one right now.

That's not surprising I was scumreading Bert anyway.

[Titus]

SH, Bert was perfectly willing to sheep the three dead townies when they were voting SC but not when they were voting you. What is your take on that? To me, it reads you as scum but I don't want to death tunnel if wrong.

[Sakura Hana]

SH, who the hell is they?

The scum. You said it yourself, driving wagons to L-1 on town will leave scum exposed so assume Casso and I are town, who's scum?

P.Ed: My take on that is buddying, and speaking of Bert, perhaps you should check what happened during the last few pages of Day 2 with regards to voting, or ISO me and look for my case on Bert and his awful response to it.

[Ms Marangal]

dodge

[Sakura Hana]

Bert was perfectly willing to sheep the three dead townies when they were voting SC but not when they were voting you.

Bert put me at L-1 and asked me to claim btw.

[Titus]

SH, let me pull up your wagon, and the other wagons day 1 and see who is the common denominator.

True, but that was when Bert put you to L-1 when you looked like an obvious lynch. After Mastin's wagon fell apart, and you two were skipped, that's when Bert didn't sheep and I'd expect Bert to sheep Tammy + Desp if y'all weren't scumbuddies.

[Sakura Hana]

After Mastin's wagon fell apart, and you two were skipped

You mean SSK right?

Anyway, if we were really scum that wagon would have gone through more easily instead of getting dismantled, well at least that stands true for me but im strongly townreading Casso so yeah.

[Sakura Hana]

Aditionally, if you think SSK and I are partners, i suggest you read Ace Attorney Mafia, we were both scumbuddies there. He started an unwarranted bus on me to which i replied in the same way. I couldn't escape the lynch at all on D2 despite me yelling and stuff.

[Titus]

Casso the King of Seals (5) - zMuffinMan,

goodmorning

, pieguyn, Generic,

Bert

MANY POSTS LATER

Sakura Hana (10) -

Tammy

,

Casso the King of Seals,

DOMO,

Ser Arthur Dayne,

Sakura Hana

,

geists

,

Desperado

,

KoreanBBQ

,

MC Maraca

,

Bert

Supposing you two are both town and scum drove up your wagons (which is an assumption I do not agree with), then Ser Arthur Danye and Bert would have to be scum.

However, let's look at the composition of the SH wagon.

I've color corded the wagons. Green is known town or mason. Yellow are players I'm supposing are town for the purposes of the question, green are known town. Orange are the players I am scumreading but for outside facts clearing them. Pink are leaning scum reads for the both of us.

Bert couldn't drive up the wagon from the rear, as he's not that skilled as scum. The only player left from Sakura POV (provided you don't suddenly agree with me that Korean crumbed vig) is Ser Arthur Dayne. Scum couldn't have driving up the Sakura wagon. If Sakura was town, they would have echoed my reasonings for lynching Sakura and have been done with her as a mislynch.