NY 169: The EPIC XD Mafia Game of Greatness (Game Over)

[Empire]

Day 1, Votecount 45

Stuffed Crust (4)

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Sakura Hana, DOMO, Desperado, Cephrir

zMuffinMan (4)

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Casso the King of Seals, Ser Arthur Dayne, KoreanBBQ, MC Maraca

Casso the King of Seals (3)

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zMuffinMan, goodmorning, pieguyn

MC Maraca (2)

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Tammy, F-16_Fighting_Falcon

DOMO (1)

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BROseidon

KoreanBBQ (1)

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roflcopter

Desperado (1)

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Stuffed Crust

Not Voting (4)

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Brian Skies, MafiaSSK, Generic, geists

With 20 alive, it takes 11 to lynch! Deadline is on December 20th at 3:45 PM EST or in (expired on 2013-12-20 16:44:27)

Mod Notes

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Casso the King of Seals is V/LA until the 22nd. Varsoon head of Stuffed Crust V/LA until January 25th. Cephrir is V/LA until the 22nd. DOMO is V/LA for 48 hours. goodmorning is V/LA until Wednesday. Tammy is V/LA until the 23rd.

[geists]

@ Geists, the thing that is bothering me about you is that you are very quick to criticise and scumread anyone who attacks MC but you haven't said anything at all about Mara's attack. You say you are conflict averse but you haven't critisized the instigator of the conflict. You are merely pushing at anyone that calls them out. That doesn't seem genuine to me. It seems as though in your mind, MC can create as much conflict as they want but anyone that calls them out and scumreads them for creating that conflict is discredited or scumread which doesn't make any sense.

I do defend my townreads, but I'm not scumreading anyone who attacks MC. If I were, Tammy wouldn't be my strongest townread. Afaik, the only person I'm "attacking" about MC Maraca is you.

I talked about Mara's attack in my reply to your quotewall.

[geists]

I sense fear in some of his posts. Kill him dead!

For reals?

He's reminding me of Bork's touhou game, except that he's not scumreading me yet. Maybe because I'm not making prickly replies to half his posts this time.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

UNVOTE:

on MC. I am not sure where to go from here.

[MC Maraca]

Could we just get a lynch? I really would rather not have a nolynch on d1.

I can't even push my top scumulative read atm because there is no support and there is now way its gonna be gathered in 3 days

[MC Maraca]

LIKE WE CAN'T EVEN GET A WAGON TO HQVR MORE THAN 4 VOTES

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

@ Geists, the thing that is bothering me about you is that you are very quick to criticise and scumread anyone who attacks MC but you haven't said anything at all about Mara's attack. You say you are conflict averse but you haven't critisized the instigator of the conflict. You are merely pushing at anyone that calls them out. That doesn't seem genuine to me. It seems as though in your mind, MC can create as much conflict as they want but anyone that calls them out and scumreads them for creating that conflict is discredited or scumread which doesn't make any sense.

I do defend my townreads, but I'm not scumreading anyone who attacks MC. If I were, Tammy wouldn't be my strongest townread. Afaik, the only person I'm "attacking" about MC Maraca is you.

I talked about Mara's attack in my reply to your quotewall.

I said you were discrediting (Tammy) and attacking (me) players pushing MC.

I get your point about Mara having done it before. But from your POV as a conflict averse person who is considering replacing out, it would have made more sense to me if you called out Mara for instigating the conflict. Regardless of whether her motivation was scum-sided, the ultimate effect of their push helped scum more. Your priorities seem to be misplaced in that you are defending the instigator of the conflict from players that are calling them out. Why are you okay with Mara helping scum intentionally or accidentally while pushing at anyone that question her? That doesn't seem right. It seemed as though you pre-decided that you would be "on their side" in the event of a conflict. The other thing that doesn't make sense is that Cabd is skilled enough as scum to fool you, so the lack of paranoia there is troubling as well.

[MafiaSSK]

Prod response. I'll do a post binge later.

[geists]

@ Geists, the thing that is bothering me about you is that you are very quick to criticise and scumread anyone who attacks MC but you haven't said anything at all about Mara's attack. You say you are conflict averse but you haven't critisized the instigator of the conflict. You are merely pushing at anyone that calls them out. That doesn't seem genuine to me. It seems as though in your mind, MC can create as much conflict as they want but anyone that calls them out and scumreads them for creating that conflict is discredited or scumread which doesn't make any sense.

I do defend my townreads, but I'm not scumreading anyone who attacks MC. If I were, Tammy wouldn't be my strongest townread. Afaik, the only person I'm "attacking" about MC Maraca is you.

I talked about Mara's attack in my reply to your quotewall.

I said you were discrediting (Tammy) and attacking (me) players pushing MC.

I think the term "discredit" gets overused in mafia. I think she's wrong. I understand the reasons why she's scumreading Mara, but I disagree, in part because I've been on the receiving end of something somewhat similar from her at least once, and maybe twice. If it was twice (hard to say due to a sudden end-of-day) then in both cases it was a reaction test.

I get your point about Mara having done it before. But from your POV as a conflict averse person who is considering replacing out, it would have made more sense to me if you called out Mara for instigating the conflict. Regardless of whether her motivation was scum-sided, the ultimate effect of their push helped scum more. Your priorities seem to be misplaced in that you are defending the instigator of the conflict from players that are calling them out. Why are you okay with Mara helping scum intentionally or accidentally while pushing at anyone that question her? That doesn't seem right. It seemed as though you pre-decided that you would be "on their side" in the event of a conflict. The other thing that doesn't make sense is that Cabd is skilled enough as scum to fool you, so the lack of paranoia there is troubling as well.

I am not by nature conflict-averse. Those circuits are pretty much burnt out at the moment, though the scorched smell is dissipating.

I don't agree with your premise that Mara's actions were helping scum. I think reactions/non-reactions beyond the two at the flashpoint will be revealing when people look back at day 1 further down the road. You are being every bit as one-sided about them as you claim I am being. And, that is a considerable part of what's making me uneasy about you atm.

Maybe it's the holidays. I feel like a lot of people are overreacting and underestimating others' likely reactions. And that's across the board.

As far as Cabd fooling me, he probably still can, but it's going to take some changes in tactics. And first he has to zero in on what I'm looking for in him as town right now. If he's scum, I'm pretty sure I'll figure it out with time.

[geists]

Could we just get a lynch? I really would rather not have a nolynch on d1.

I can't even push my top scumulative read atm because there is no support and there is now way its gonna be gathered in 3 days

Refresh my memory. Who is your top scumread atm?

[Tammy]

I got the opposite impression from Pieguyn's posts. It felt as if he was scumhunting constantly right from the moment he replaced in. He came in, questioning Sakura, then moved onto DOMO, and then to StuffedCrust. He seemed to have plenty of cases and he listed quite a few scumreads in his reads list. Tell me how he has done 0 scunhunting.

Yeah but like

Do you SEE those.

1) They look terribly fake.

2) They look like that thing scum do where they focus on one person and ignore everything else and so they can LOOK like they're actually scumhunting and putting effort while they are literally bouncing off thoughts with one person.

3) There's a difference between attacking people and scumhunting. Scumhunting that leads you to form a scumread on someone actually requires attempt to convince people to vote someone to create pressure and get a reaction.

Posting on a bus cuz weeeeeee

Okay falcon. This type of read is along the lines of what I would expect from Arthur!town. It's not slam dunk as he's able to fake this and if this game turns out to be multiball or have an sk then this is less definite, but this is the way Arthur thinks about and reads people or pushes people to strengthen his reads on people.

Usually when he's scum they tend to be more aggressive or aggressive in a weird way or just be really off.

[KoreanBBQ]

I sense fear in some of his posts. Kill him dead!

For reals?

He's reminding me of Bork's touhou game, except that he's not scumreading me yet. Maybe because I'm not making prickly replies to half his posts this time.

For realz.

Which aspect, exactly?
Also I see Nero moved his vote. I would move back but we haven't sync'd for a while and idk why he voted him so

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

I do think that reactions may be useful later on. I just don't like the way in which it was done.

MC's top scumread is me obviously.

Pedit: I'll keep that in mind.

[Stuffed Crust]

LIKE WE CAN'T EVEN GET A MISLYNCH TO HQVR MORE THAN 4 VOTES

I DONT KNOW, MAYBE IT HAS TO DO WITH THE INACTIVITY AND FAILURE TO BUILD WORTHWHILE CASES?

I'll probably break down and ISO dig one of my scum reads.
BBQ is pinging harder and harder for me. I think that it's awkward that he'd call for my lynch without interacting with me--especially since a lot of people put trust in GiF's reads of me. This is obviously something scum-GiF can exploit easily, and BBQ's play is very opportunistic. I could make a huge meta analysis of this, but Meta is useless, so I'll stick to my guns and present an actual case whenever I've got three hours to burn.

zMuffin wagon is populated by some of my hardest scum reads. Dunno if this could be a bus, but it PoE's zMuffin for me into town more than not.

-V

[KoreanBBQ]

You scared?

[Tammy]

Actually I'm down with Pie.

Vote: Pie

Nearly 0 scumhunting, and the only case/scumread is on the dude with the largest wagon

Like I don't actually get the feeling they have any interest of solving this game.

what the fuck?
I've been trying to sort most of the players the whole game. I started by getting a bunch of townreads and trying to verify they were all correct, and then I've been pushing on people since then. you completely left out the part where I've been pushing on other people besides SC and how I expressed several scumreads that weren't SC.

Okay so here's the problem. Getting townreads is the easiest thing in the world, especially when YOU BARELY HAVE SCUMREADS. It doesn't create conflict, and it creates this sense that you're actually achieving something. Number 2, what's more troubling is the fact that YOU TRIED TO NARROW DOWN THAT TOWN LIST. You do realize the majority of people, are, in fact town, right? And at one point you're supposed to go "okay, I have this list of like 12 townreads, now lets try to narrow down the others to scum BECAUSE WE HAVE TO LYNCH SOMEONE". Number 3, while yes, you did mention "several" scumreads, you did them in time intervals (okay there's a difference between mentioning scumreads and actually pushing them - the former is useless without the latter). My biggest problem with you is that you pick one person, huff and puff after them in what looks like an attempt to show you're

pushing

suspects, while tunneling everything out.

also, if you haven't read the thread, then how the fuck would you get the idea I've done "nearly 0 scumhunting"?

I don't know, random epiphanies just fall unto me.

2) They look like that thing scum do where they focus on one person and ignore everything else and so they can LOOK like they're actually scumhunting and putting effort while they are literally bouncing off thoughts with one person.

and why the fuck do you think this is alignment indicative?

Because... like... it literally is, most of the time?

3) There's a difference between attacking people and scumhunting. Scumhunting that leads you to form a scumread on someone actually requires attempt to convince people to vote someone to create pressure and get a reaction.

WHAT THE FUCK DOES THIS EVEN MEAN?!

It means you had/have no intention of actually pushing someone and was/is putting on a show to look like you care about "figuring" out the scum.

your reasons for accusing me are BS. your push on me is opportunistic as fuck

Lol wat. It's opportunistic... because there are 2 people voting you? And it's not like I want to create pressure anywhere,

no

, why would that be beneficial at all?

ok so how the fuck have none of you noticed that Casso and Ser Arthur just came up with this wagon on me out of nowhere? that's giving me really bad vibes. it feels like scum lining up a mislynch. I'm not sure about Casso considering Thor hadn't read a lot of the thread, but Ser Arthur is scum and I'm sure of it. sheep me plz o/

You caught us me and casso are totally partners.

I'm not cutting any of this down cuz on phone on bus So yeah.

The first point turned my head. I know Arthur values town hunting so some of that argument felt off coming from him. I think what I'm most eh on is the random all caps. I've found that sometimes people over italicize or include caps to convey a sense of feeling they don't actually have. That's a minor pint though just something that caught my eye. The rest of it looks enough like he's trying to sort pie though.

(Although the you caught me thing is something he'd do as either alignment though.)

I feel like this is a useless post but I'm posting it anyway because it was a pain to type in the first place.

[KoreanBBQ]

This is obviously something scum-GiF can exploit easily

If that was true, you would've been mislynched everytime I was scum~
But have you seen that happen? Nope!
Wanna know why? Because pushing your mislynch as scum will screw me up majorly once the flip happen!
So yeah. It's not something that I can exploit as scum.

[KoreanBBQ]

I'm good with either Muffin or SC, GIF.

[KoreanBBQ]

VOTE: SC

[KoreanBBQ]

I'll take a full responsibility if I'm wrong, so let's lynch this today.

[geists]

I sense fear in some of his posts. Kill him dead!

For reals?

He's reminding me of Bork's touhou game, except that he's not scumreading me yet. Maybe because I'm not making prickly replies to half his posts this time.

For realz.

Which aspect, exactly?
Also I see Nero moved his vote. I would move back but we haven't sync'd for a while and idk why he voted him so

The super-reactive stuff mostly. And the way he assumes that any push/suspicion of him is scum-motivated, like any town player would be able to automatically tell that he's town, too.

[KoreanBBQ]

I think that it's awkward that he'd call for my lynch without interacting with me--especially since a lot of people put trust in GiF's reads of me.

Well first of all, those two statements are irrelevant.
Second of all, if I interact with you every time as town, I'll be enslaved by the meta, so nty. (It's not like interaction is required to read you every time anyway)

[geists]

VOTE: Stuffed Crust

[Stuffed Crust]

You scared?

I GOT CHILLS

THEY'RE MULTIPLYING ~~~

Anyway since GiF evidently

can't

read Varsoon and if geists is anything to go by, the playerlist is about to follow him off the cliff, then I'm going to claim.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Varsoon from Stuffed Crust is reminding me of Bork's Touhou game as well. I think he is town. I don't think it is necessarily scummy to assume that a push on them is scum motivated. It is basically OMGUS - which is null. I have not yet read his scumgames but based on in-game actions alone, I don't think he is scum.