NY 169: The EPIC XD Mafia Game of Greatness (Game Over)

[Brian Skies]

Ceph is conftown.

KoreanBBQ is confscum. We're lynching this with fire.

VOTE: KoreanBBQ

[Brian Skies]

F-0 is scum too.

[Brian Skies]

You're scum doing this with only your best intentions in mind. It's anti-town. You need rope, but I'm already voting my other scum-read.

[Brian Skies]

17 pages?

[Brian Skies]

Brian, I think you're trying too hard.

Sometimes. I have been told I think too much.

Brian Skies is town.
geists is town.

F16 is town.

Generic is town.

Discuss.

It conflicts with my Page 1 scum-read. I'm also a little bit concerned that you're already town-reading me, but you have your reasoning, I guess.

Don't worry I'll just vig them once they've given their reads and we'll go from there.

Town?

He may not like meta but he knows how to manipulate his own.

Not necessarily town, but an interesting observation. I don't hate meta, considering I'm more than happy to give mine out. I just think some people try to use it as a basis for reads and make bad decisions off of it cuz they don't know what they're doing.

Can you link me to the game that you played with Brian?

I feel somewhat more important than I should be.

Yo'd be surprised how big name games can fall apart. Go look at scummies invitational. Keeping egos off the thread will probably be an important method of town powerkeeping.

Nacho's in this game.

I can't lose ^_^

How about we just lynch you now and get the game over with?

At least two of them are not Town.

Which ones and why?

I've gotten aggravated with you, but if you can find one person on this site I haven't gotten aggravated with, I'll bake you cookies.

Do I count?

Best prize ever! I am liking you already.

Why? Are you townreading her? Because this doesn't feel like a townie thought.

Brian's entrance bothers me too.

What about it bothered you?

This. Why have you not answered this yet, Pitoli?

*Some townblock application form that I'm not filling out.

I feel the itch to meta something, but I'm still absurdly short on sleep. Maybe tomorrow.

You can always try to meta me. That's always interesting.

Tammy, Brian is not a new player. How did you get that impression?

Compared to the rest of the players in this game, yes I am. I've just played in a shit ton of games cuz I take on heavy game-loads.

Awkward entrances are not a scum tell for Brian. Nor are they a town tell. I'll take my time to form a read on Brian. From what I remember in a recent meta dive you also badly misread him not too long ago in a game.

Welcome to my meta. Which has been molded to my liking.

Although my off-read on Brian was mostly based on in-game actions as opposed to meta which indicated he was town.

So, what you're saying is, I'm a scummy town player.

And what are your thoughts about Brian? I think it's too soon to try to sort him. F-16's comment about in thread tells is intriguing, but I feel like proceeding with caution.

This much concern from three posts?

What i dislike about that post is that he completely negates BOTH reads on the two heads.
Starts with a comment that he can read nero quickly - then negates that with a comment that he has never seen nero as scum, then that he sits him in the null waiting room until he gets a proper read on him. So neither a quick read then nor a read that can be held up to great scrutiny since he has never seen neros scum game.
Then moves on to GIF who again he apparently reads quickly - then COMPLETELY negates that by pointing out he often townreads him when he is scum.

That post is literally nothing. You cant make a claim to be able to read two people and then immediately caveat that with a list of contradictions.

And the follow up to my comment about not liking it is horrible, basically boils down to 'im playing to my town meta, ask those currently townreading me'.

Geists has gone from a decent town read to my opening suspicion. And all through a few questions being posed to them and a bit of scrutiny.

This post feels town.

Casso and I agree that your push here was pretty sad. It saddens me because your reaction to it is the complete opposite to my reaction, and it saddens my lovely bearded partner because you didn't drop your RVS push for something better when you found it.

I've been gone since my third post, and I agree with your lovely bearded partner.

I also had no idea that he stole that post from other games. :shrugs:

You're scum doing this with only your best intentions in mind. It's anti-town. You need rope, but I'm already voting my other scum-read.

How is it antitown? The plan essentially gives him three days freedom as scum. This freedom is also time that I'm left alive to rampage all over the scumteam in typical Nacho fashion when he could instead just dodge me for a day and kill me in a night. He has also demonstrated the capacity to read me pretty fucking well based on the past few times we've played together, so it makes sense he would want to buy extra time to figure me out (considering he tends to be a kill priority for scum-Nacho).

Maybe, but my perspective is different.

It's antitown because it works in his favor if he's scum, which you pretty much outlined. You know you're a popular target for a NK. If he's scum, then why wouldn't he bribe you into an early truce so he can get rid of you before he's put into any real danger?

I know I've said this before, but to me, Mafia is a game about distrust and deceit. Treating someone as functionally conftown for X amount of time without actually sorting them just rubs me the wrong way. You also know that I don't like buddying, so I don't know where this is coming from.

Brian's initial posts almost always look strained and uncomfortable.

It's because I'm trying to move the game somewhere.

Give me some time to work through it. I may be off base, but Nati also thinks Nacho is looking scummy.

Not really, I just think there's a small falling out between us.

I don't think Brian has a tendency to look weak early game. I thought there was clear motivation in F-16s opening to stay alive to sort out Nacho-scum, and I thought that it was strange Brian immediately attacked that, especially considering the mentor mentee game that recently ended which proves F-16 can read me pretty competently.

It's not always about you. And I don't see why I wouldn't attack that post.

And note: Brian didn't question, he attacked.

And I regret nothing. Serious votes move the game faster, and this discussion could/should have happened earlier.

I thought I was going to have this discussion with F-0, but it never happened.

*I* dislike his 285.

I'm interested too considering I just said I thought it was town.

Firstly, Nacho in Buzzword went up against Orc because your slot (squared) did. He immediately dropped suspicion on Orc once he returned from a brief period of inactivity – the scum motivation clearly being he didn’t want to go against you. Here on the other hand, you indicated that Brian suspicion is unjustified – or at least, that is the implicit vibe I received from you. Tammy opposed the push as well. Assuming she is town, Nacho as scum would be pushing a player that could alienate his biggest threats – this is something I haven’t seen a parallel with in Buzzword. Let’s say he wants to push the Brian lynch, who will help him? Not you, Tammy, or even Cephrir who despite saying that Brian was trying too hard now has a townread on him. Probably not Pitoli who he is voting. Perhaps he expected me to help but I made it clear I am not sure either way about Brian. So, I am not seeing the same parallel w.r.t Brian and Orc. What did I miss?

Nacho has this weird infatuation with attacking lurkers. He also has had a pretty big influence on me and has played a ton of games with me. He could probably sort me without your help, and push me as either alignment. Revisit Cash Cabd (my second game on this site) and look at his uncomfortableness with me even though he treated me as complete newbtown in my Newbie game (which he was the IC in).

*And some other stuff happened.

[Brian Skies]

UNVOTE

Because I'm not caught up, I'm tired of reading, and my RVS scum-read is getting wagoned and I don't know why.

[Brian Skies]

Will post after my exams are over (tomorrow or Friday).

And I'm not even close to caught up in this game right now.

[Brian Skies]

T_T

I need to dedicate a whole day just to catch-up in this game. That day is going to be Sunday (because Saturday is generally the day I don't look at this site). Sorry if my presence has been low. A combination of Thanksgiving apathy, large game-load, and Finals has been bogging me down. I'm also considering replacing out if this is unacceptable for some of you guys.

[Brian Skies]

Okay, so, I lied. My game-management plan didn't go according to plan and now I'm using tomorrow (technically today, Monday) to catch up in this game. The good news is that I'm only one prod away from getting replaced (which moves this game directly towards the top of my priority list). So if I pull this shit again, I'm gone.

[Brian Skies]

Oh hai! I can hang out for a bit, but my knowledge of this game is superrrrrrr low considering I've only made it to like page 27 (and I've already forgotten a lot of stuff T_T). Plan on a full catch-up tomorrow where I can actually be useful.

Town reads:
Generic - Because he feels town and I can see myself working with him if he is.
Tammy - Town. One of her earlier posts resonated with me a lot.
Geists - I don't know what page, because it was during one of my prod dodges or something, but I think Ffery mentioned something about me opening up this game with edginess. I think it's pretty isolated to this game, so I'm townreading her on this statement.

[Brian Skies]

Not yet. Working on my catch up right now, but nothing has leaped out at me. You guys have 83 pages though...and some people still haven't done much with where I'm at in the game (myself included).

[Brian Skies]

and this game isn't that hard to catch up on, so I dunno why everyone is complaining about it

It's really not, I just haven't gotten around to it. Too much apathy flooding this thread, and I'm contributing to it.

Although, my issue with Giffy's slot early on makes sense now that I'm provided with a list of Nero's posting. If there's anything I'm concerned with up to this point, it's that Giffy is letting Nero ruin his slot for me. One of them needs to start signing their posts.

Didn't like Pie's initial push against Sakura. Don't know where he was going with that and Sakura came out looking town to me based on her defense. I also don't like how he keeps asking people which of his reads they think are wrong (especially the null-reads, it looks like a feigned attempt at scumhunting), but it could just be him trying something new.

Here's the post from Tammy that resonated with me. I had similar reads at that point in the thread, but I still disagree with her F-0 read. I didn't like the interactions between Mara and Tammy, from either player.

I was going to try to make a dent in this thread right now, but my head kind of hurts because I've been looking at a computer screen all day. So I'm going to do it when I wake up. The content in this game looks like it's easy to follow so I don't think it will take me all that long.

Here's some recent scum-meta for you to look at. So now you have two things to look at instead of just one.

[Brian Skies]

Anyone want to tell me what a gak is so I can continue my re-read without wondering what it is?

[Brian Skies]

Brian apparently has scumreads on F-16 and Bro.

Since when have I been scum-reading bro?

This is good.
So, the original reason why I offered the deal to buldermar and buldermar specifically is because buldermar struck me as the type of player who wouldn't back off from a challenge when it didn't directly conflict with his win condition. One of the markers of having good scumplay is the freedom to kill a variety of threats. When there is a player who has such a meta angle on you that you HAVE to kill them, then this is a giant glaring flaw in your play that needs serious, serious work. When a townie makes this offer to a scum player, it's an attack on ego, not on honor.

I appreciated the offer because I am not a significant meta threat to F-16 scum. I can read him, but the rift between his town game and his scum game is large enough where I'm not even close to a person with meta authority on him and he realizes that.

But he's been getting closer to figuring me out, just needs time to do it. The offer gives him that time. Do you see where I'm coming from with this?

I didn't understand the bold part because it's contradicting the message I think you're trying to send. But context-wise, then yes, I do see where you're going with this.

Dude there's a difference between "a lot of activity that's good for town" and "so much activity that shit gets lost in the mass."

This game is moving towards the latter.

I don't give a fuck what anyone says or if I get lynched for it, this guy is town. /sarcasm
I do agree with him though.

the lack of hammerable wagons concerns me

Every fiber in my body wants to say you're scum, but I just can't see the scum-spin on what you're doing this game.

You may remember me from that one time I ruined your game and no one bought anyone a pizza.

I don't know you, but I have a feeling this game will qualify.

What do you think of bbq/ceph/DOMO as scummates?

I'm confused. Why not just join one of the existing wagons?

care to give me your thoughts on DOMO?

why not hop on the SC wagon?

Pieguyn sees the same thing I do. This pleases me.

VOTE: Casso

This is where we want to be.

I actually don't like this vote, but mostly because I like the slot you're voting. I'd love to hear why though (because I feel like a lost puppy and throwing towncred at anything that I agree with or makes sense to me).

except that doesn't make any sense. it's telling because conveniently not posting in a thread, but posting in others, is scummy as fuck. thus, even if Varsoon hasn't done it before, I still consider it to be telling. and now you're trying to infuse meta into the mix here when by your own words no such meta even exists

I'm just going to disagree with you on this being a scumtell without saying why. Even if you ask, I won't tell you. Deal with it.

But Mac has been posting out of that slot, so I don't understand why it matters that Varsoon wasn't.

Because for him (skies), I feel activity levels ARE alignment indicative.

Well, if I remember correctly, things didn't end up too well the last time this was used against me.

yo since when does effort = town?

these scum reads blow cabd

Kind of hard when a handful of players haven't done shit (speaking from experience).

Only one way to find out~

Good luck. I'd love to see you create a theory, test it, and be completely wrong about it. You're basically recreating Ffery's meta case on me from Giffy's game.

If you want an example, see the mutual tunnels between me and Brian in Mentor and Mentee

But we were both town that game, and I did end up with a townread on you right before the game ended.

*Up to page 54 and I've realized that I am no longer paying attention to what I'm reading. This is extremely bad. I'll clear my thoughts and revisit this later.

Town (in no particular order):
Geists
Seal thing
Desp?
Generic
Tammy?
Giffy

[Brian Skies]

Was going to finish my catch-up today, going to have to do it tomorrow.

[Brian Skies]

Could you sheep us, Brian?

it would be awesome

Can I just proxy my vote to you until I catch up?

[Brian Skies]

Vote: MuffinMan

Going to try and catch up tomorrow and figure out what's going on this game.