Mini 416 - AM Mafia - Game Over D:

[CoG888]

12.) Instead of "Town or Mafia" alignments, players have "Work or Sleep" alignments. They may also be other alignments in play. For the purposes of this game, Work = Good, Sleep = Bad.

Vote: Nai

for not reading the rules.

[CoG888]

When is wagoning ever a good stratetgy... unless you are SCUM?

Unvote Nai, VOTE: Thestatusquo

for wagoning on page One.

[CoG888]

Alas, sarcasm doesn't always come through in forum posts.

--------------Votecount as of the top of this page------------------
Nai -3- (Elias_the_thief, IH,Thestatusquo)
Thestatusquo -2- (Nai, CoG888)
Panzerjager -1- (bird1111)
massive_goonery -1- (Ripley)
IH -1- (PBug)

Not voting - (massive_goonery, Panzerjager, Sailor Jerry, trestain)

With 12 alive, it will take 7 votes to lynch someone!

[CoG888]

Sarcastic votes, random votes, OMGUS votes... its all good on page one...
Now page TWO, thats different... *puts on serious hat*

[CoG888]

Unvote: Thestatusquo
FOS: Sailor Jerry
FOS: trestain

48 hours in guys... lets post something.

[CoG888]

There is a lot being said, but nothing of significant content, with 30.487% of the posts coming from TSQ. 25 posts that try to justify your tactics of page 1 band-wagoning and early day one claims. And whats with the short doubling posting? Is your role "Joe's Snooze Button" and you can only type a certain number of characters per post?

(Note: TSQ's posts 1-5 have exactly 45 characters (not including spaces) and post 0 has 46... posts 1 and 2 have "45" at the end... this makes me suspicious enough to keep counting)

[CoG888]

EBWOP: that holds true for posts 1-15 (except post 8 is only 44 characters).... 45 characters exactly, and odd usage of periods and exclaimation marks to adjust the totals....

[CoG888]

EVERY TSQ post (cept his 0th and 8th) are exactly 45 characters. I am sure his role has this stipulation. What Sleep or work related annoyance could this imply? this could really help us determine his allignment. I am thinking alarm clock or snooze button. what does everyone else think?

[CoG888]

No, it was 45, and he has not broken his restriction "about 20 times," he has only broken it the two times I already mentioned.

VOTE: IH

for not bothering to count before he made his previous post, and being so dismissive of the evidence at hand.

[CoG888]

Just to let you all know, I will have limited access until Monday... moving and all.

[CoG888]

/back

FOS: PBuG

, I don't see any real thought behind any of your votes. Please explain why you are pushing so hard for a lynch on MG. Perhaps I will vote for him if I see a good reason to do so, but so far I only see a case based on fluff from you, elias and Nai.

[CoG888]

Nai: What has panzer said that makes you think he is scum? I do not see where he doubts your case against MG, only where he asks you why... "Why are you sold?" in post 140.

Please expand on your suspension.

[CoG888]

I made a post a biut ago, but the boardhad a CPU error and my post got swallowed up, or something...

I think I said that we should look closely at Ripley if MG turns up scum, as it appears he may be distancing himself from MG

I also said that TSQ is looking very pro-work to me.

[CoG888]

----6:08:01 AM - Vote Count-----

“For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.”

~ 1 Corinthians 11:30

massive_goonery - 5 - (Ripley, Thestatusquo, Sailor Jerry, Nai, PBuG)
Panzerjager- 1 - (massive_goonery)
IH - 1 - (CoG888)
Elias_the_thief - 1 - (IH)

Not voting - 4 - ( trestain, bird1111, Elias_the_thief, Panzerjager )
It takes a majority - or

7

, to lynch.

Trestain is asleep at the wheel - looking for his replacement.

-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

Why, because I asked for a legitimate reason for the MG bandwagon? I am suspecting MG more and more, but I still don't see a strong enough case to lynch him this early in day 1. Personally, I am now seeing you, PBug as more scummy then MG due to your constant pushing for a lynch. You have not provided any actual evidence yourself, you simply agree with what others say or react to anyone who questions your motives.

VOTE: Pbug

.
I will drop this vote and vote for MG if you provide the following:
1. I better reason to lynch MG other then his actions regarding Nai's bandwagon (specifically MG's vote after the wagon disbanded).
2. Well thought out opinions on panzer and myself, who you have pegged as day 2 lynchs

[CoG888]

On that note, Sailor Jerry has only posted once, and is posting elsewhere on the site.

[CoG888]

OK, elias, I will drop my first request. You have provided some great insight on MG and I am just irritated that pbug is using your posts as a way to hasten his agenda (at least, thats how I see it.)
Pbug, I still want to know why panzer and I are scum in your eyes.

[CoG888]

I have never defended anyone in this game. I have merely asked you and Nai to expand on your reasons for going after MG, and I have said that if you do, I might vote to lynch him. Nai immediately answered my question, and I reviewed the thread considering what he said. You, instead of supporting your own vote and humoring me with a logical post, you attacked me.

I am a man of my word, so

Unvote: Pbug

. I will support a lynch if that is what the majority decides, but I will not vote now and put him at -1. I would like to hear what the rest of the town has to say.

[CoG888]

*_*_*_* Top of the Page - Vote Count - 6:09:01 AM *_*_*_*

"On Friday in eastern Seoul, a 16-year-old girl died from suffocation after she fell asleep in her room with an electric fan in motion."

~

Korea Herald, July 28, 1997.

Panzerjager -1- (PBuG)

Not voting -8- (Thestatusquo, Panzerjager, CoG888, Elias_the_thief , bird1111, Ripley, Fircoal, Jingolaw)
It takes a majority - or

5

, to lynch.
-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

I was a bit confused by panzer's hammer, considering he was in the same boat as MG. I stand by my statement that it was too early to lynch MG, and I felt PBug was the driving force behind the lynch. I wanted a more detailed explanation and more discussion, but Panzer hammered 44 minutes after Elias put down the -1 vote. Yes, he said he would hammer if the town agreed, but I don't think we were in agreement.
So,

Vote: Panzerjager

...

And Pbug, I don't think you need to claim right now. We rushed into a mislynch, but its not like you were solely responsible. Don't claim unless you have information that could help us now.

[CoG888]

If TSQ has the post restriction he claims, he should be modkilled right now. If he does not get modkilled, He needs to be lynched.

[CoG888]

Unvote, Vote: Thestatusquo

[CoG888]

You lied about having a post restriction. Why else would you lie?

[CoG888]

I did answer your question: YOU LIED.

[CoG888]

Why would they? If they got caught in the lie, they would be lynched, right?

[CoG888]

The result of being caught in a lie is being lynched because the town can not trust you. A pro-town player could not fulfill his/her win requirement effectively by lying. They are, in a way, throwing the game. Unless their win requirement happens to be different. That would suggest, however, that their allignment is not pro-town.

Thus, logically, you are not pro-town. If you are scum, it is to my benefit to lynch you. Likewise if you are a serial killer. If you are a jester, then it is in your best intrest to get lynched, and mine so we can move on with the game.

[CoG888]

Frankly, I can't see why anyone would do what you did, TSQ, let alone a scum player. perhaps some light will be shed on this when/if you are killed.

[CoG888]

Logically, I agree with you, panzer. TSQ is making my head hurt. perhaps we will be more enlightened about him tomorow, so for today,

unvote

[CoG888]

ebwop

unvote TSQ

[CoG888]

bird1111 has flown under the radar day one, and seems to be lurking now. Doesn't look like anyone else mentioned this. I just noticed that he was still in the game, I thought he was replaced.

I don't like sailor jerry's only post on day one, and I can't see much in fircoal's posts now. But what I think is really odd is that SJ made one post, voted for MG, when his fate was pretty much sealed, and got away with it.

[CoG888]

Jingolaw: I have a hunch that pbug is not one of our killers. Mostly based on who he was voting and FOSing yesterday, and who turned up dead this morning. Of course I could be wrong... I could be blind to something obvious, but pbug is seeming pro-town to me... aggressive, but town none the less.

Panzer: That is true, but jingolaw was against the lynch, I was not ready to call it a day yet, and IH said he was not sold on it. Also, Sailor Jerry's vote was cast ten days earlier with his only post in the game. If he was playing, he may not have wanted to lynch yet. That leaves Seven that were ready to lynch. That is a majority but the town was clearly not in "agreement" yet.

[CoG888]

PJ: My apologies. I thought you said you would hammer when the town was in agreement, but apparently you said you would hammer when elias put him at -1.

As for pbug, I did not mean that I expected to see one of his FOSes die, but that I expected some logical connection between the dead and those he called out on day one. I guess what I am saying is I am trying to rationalize the deaths and I don't see motivation for pbug killing either Nai or IH... And not because they were not good targets, but because their were others that seemed more likely targets....

I am way over analyzing this, but I am not getting scummy vibes from anyone at the moment, and that makes me nervous. We could be at lynch or lose today, depending on the number and type of killers.

[CoG888]

bird reads too slow.

FOS: bird1111

for lurking. 5 posts in 13 pages?

[CoG888]

Two votes on both of you... -3...
People have stated reasons to lynch both of you, and frankly, I am on the fence.

Welcome, Captain, and General! What are your thoughts on things? Cpt_Fantastic, have you had time to read the thread?

[CoG888]

Let me clarify my previous post.... I am not "on the fence"... More like I have no reason to vote for either of them yet.

[CoG888]

*_*_*_* Vote Count - 6:12:59 AM *_*_*_*

“There are two types of people in this world: good and bad. The good sleep better, but the bad seem to enjoy the waking hours much more." ~ Woody Allen

PBuG -3- (Jingolaw. Panzerjager, Cpt_Fantastic)
Panzerjager -2- (Fircoal, PBuG)
Fircoal -1- (Thestatusquo)
Not voting -3- (Elias_the_thief, GeneralCF, CoG888)

With 9 alive, it takes

5

to lynch.

-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

FOS: Cpt_Fantastic

Wow, thats a quick vote. Care to elaborate, or do you just want to lynch someone?

[CoG888]

Check!

[CoG888]

TSQ: If you want to lynch captain, maybe you should vote for him?

Vote: captain fantastic

[CoG888]

TSQ: so you have nothing more to say to elias about your lack of content posting? I find that scummy.

fos: Thestatusquo

[CoG888]

...I think TSQ was successful in contributing under a post restriction....

Panzer, this point is null, because if TSQ had any desire to contribute to the game beyond what little he did, he could have broken his self created post restriction any time on day one. He chose to continue with his "handicap" until day two where most of the town wasted a alot of time arguing about his intentions for falsly assuming a post restriction. Now he defends himself by claiming that he did contribute.

I feel that TSQ's lack of contribution was masked by his fake post restriction, and that he is hindering us in finding scum.

Unvote captain fantastic, Vote: Thestatusquo

[CoG888]

TSQ: If you have lynch-immunity, it would greatly benefit the town for you to fully claim now, at -1. If you can not be lynched due to your role, we will likely be down to 7 tomorrow, and most likely at lynch or lose.

[CoG888]

TSQ, I am a little angry with you. If you had fully claimed, you would not have been lynched, and the town would have had a shot at making a scum kill yesterday. Instead, you kept up with your half-assed "you are wasting your vote" arguement, which honestly felt to me like you were scum. It took a wasted lynch to reveal that you are most likely the alarm clock, and protown. And I think we may be at lynch or lose today. So, congrats, you have succeeded in making this game more difficult. I hope you won't wreak havoc on this game anymore.

[CoG888]

It is not uncommon to have a role that can not be killed in a certain way, such as un-nightkillable or un-lynchable. TSQ was un-lynchable, and he claimed it was a one time-deal.

Panzer: I don't know why TSQ did not die at night. I am still trying to figure out why only one person died instead of two (like night one). Did the Vig wise up and ease off the trigger? Did the Doctor protect some one who was targeted?

I have no insight on this matter right now, so its all speculation.

[CoG888]

I wasn't certain either way, but his posting was suicidal to the town. Maybe his latest challenge for himself is to sabotage the town and come out as the hero. I am 99% sure he is town, so yesterday wasn't a complete waste. We can move on to the next suspect: Captain and Panzer were next on my scum list, so I will post my opinions on them tomorrow.

[CoG888]

TSQ: You weren't going to claim, so thats a crap reason to suspect pbug...

Well, I promised some scummy info on captain and Panzer, but I have much more to post about Jingolaw.

Panzer

: I suspected you mostly based on other's suspicions of you, and the hammer on MG from day one, as well as your tendency to follow other people's logic. However, I am now thinking that you are just a very logical consistent player, and you have not posted anything that proves otherwise. You are now off my scum list.

Captain

: You replaced Ripley, who did not seem scummy to me, but you acted very scummy at first. Most of what you said seems to be lost in the crash, and I believe you would have been lynched had the board not gone down. The only evidence that remains is you being too lazy to read the full thread and comment on it, and you tried to get a pbug wagon rolling just because Ripley suspected him. Thats all I have, and not enough to vote on.

Jingolaw

: I think you are the serial killer, or scum fishing for a serial killer/vigilante. The first thing that jumps out at me is your desire to direct MG's one shot kill. That really sounds like you wanted another kill for the night: MG's vig, your own kill, and the scum kill. Next up is you joining the first TSQ bandwagon and hopping off when it was apparent that he wasn't going to be lynched (yet). Then you vote for pbug, and when I semi-defended him, you claim that I proposed he was the serial killer (in post 307). I never said that. In fact, you have brought up the topic of serial killer in 3 of your posts prior to that, while the only time I ever mentioned it was in post 241 when I was considering different alignments that TSQ might have.

In post 322 you condemn General because bird hadn't been paying attention to the game? You are really grasping at straws now. Sound like you are desperate for a kill, however you can get it. Lucky for you that the town ganged up on TSQ so quickly that you were not associated with the kill.

Today, you are floundering. You are still after Pbug, who looks to be a prime target, but you are changing your story to match what the rest of the town is saying (that pbug is scum because of his hammer). For all of this:

FOS: Jingolaw

[CoG888]

*_*_*_* Vote Count - 6:16:59 AM *_*_*_*

“Death's brother, Sleep." ~ Virgil

PBuG -1- (Panzerjager)
Not voting -7- (Capt_Fantastic, CoG888, Elias_the_thief, Fircoal, Jingolaw, PBug, Thestatusquo)

With 8 alive, it takes

5

to lynch.
-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

I have never backed up pbug. I only stated my opinion that the events of night one and pbug's motives did not line up in my mind. Panzer pointed out to me that scum wouldn't want their kills to make sense.

[CoG888]

Fair enough argument, Jingolaw. I just have one question for you: Are you saying pbug is the serial killer, or are you saying he is either the serial killer OR scum?

A clarification about jumping off the TSQ wagon part one... I think if its clear that someone is not going to be lynched despite many votes, scum/SK will remove their vote and try to find a different bandwagon as soon as possible, so as not to look like they are vote hopping after the first wagon dies off. Doing so does not make someone scum, but I think it does make someone look scummy, when taken in context with other signs.

[CoG888]

EBWOP: Nevermind that question, Jingolaw, you said "...he’s anti-town either way."

[CoG888]

No, I am still pissed at TSQ and his refusal to claim.
Capt, are you saying that TSQ was going to claim after several times refusing to do so, and misguiding the town into a no-lynch situation by refusing to defend himself?

[CoG888]

TSQ's reason for suspecting pbug is that he quickly hammered and did not allow TSQ a chance to fully claim.

PBuGs hammer seemed like he was rushing to avoid my actual claiming

That's BS because TSQ was not going to fully claim. He said exactly that.

I'm not claiming to this rubbish...

So TSQ says he won't claim, pbug hammers, then TSQ whines that pbug didn't give him a chance to claim. Replace pbug's name with anyone's name, and I would still be pissed about what TSQ did.

[CoG888]

True. I am only trying to discount your connection between pbug and a full claim, because you were not going to full claim until after the non-lynch. pbug's quick hammer is a different issue entirely, and honestly, I don't know how I feel about it. So far, the three people who have commented on it all agree that it was suspicious. If pbug comes up town, those reactions could be giving something away.

[CoG888]

Before anyone hammers, lets discuss this. We had two quick hammers in this game that got us to where we are now. Last thing we need is another dead townie. In fact, there are likely only 4 townies left.

I, for one, believe the claim. Pbug's play style and embarrassment at the beginning of day two seem consistent with this role.

[CoG888]

pbug: was that directed at the "no vanillas" comment?

[CoG888]

Jingolaw is far scummier then anyone else to me right now.

Vote: Jingolaw

[CoG888]

Jingolaw, I think you should claim now.

[CoG888]

I think you are "far scummier" because of your posts from earlier in this game, not from whether you believe pbug's claim or not. Elias and panzer don't buy it either, yet I have pro-town opinions of them.

I was not quick to vote. I suspected you two pages ago at the start of this day. You became aggressively defensive towards me, and that reaction is why I voted for you. You are one of two SK possibilities in my opinion, and unlike my other suspect, I think you will turn up scum if you are not the SK.

[CoG888]

I have gone out on a bit of a limb with my defense of pbug, although seeing as how town likely has 4 members, and anti-town likely has 4, I believe anti-town has manipulated this vote quite succesfully. What I am most curious about is that Jingolaw stopped fingering pbug as the SK about the same time I suspected Jingolaw of being it himself.

If Pbug is scum, Jingolaw is certainly the SK. It would be to the SK's benefit to lynch mafia right now. It would be to the Mafia's benefit to kill the SK tonight.

[CoG888]

My world has been rocked with pbug showing up as serial killer. Logically, i didn't see how that was possible. If I was wrong about him, maybe I'm wrong about panzer as well. Maybe he IS scummy.

[CoG888]

Panzer. Can you provide me with some information about Jingolaw? "He's the most scummy" is not a good enough reason to vote on Day 4, IMO. My case against him yesterday focused on him being the serial killer (because I thought pbug was NOT the SK). Jingolaw was right about pbug, and I had egg on my face. So why are you now coming out against him with your first post?

[CoG888]

Why are you linked to me anyway? You have pointed that out a few times now. I am not linked to anyone. If you are scum, you are clearly trying to connect me to yourself to get me lynched if you die. If you are vanilla, Then you must just share my logic, as you said before. If you have some type of role, I fear you are drawing attention to yourself, cause you are certainly making me suspicious of you.

[CoG888]

I think Jingolaw has a very good case agianst you and you dismiss it as weak without properly defending yourself. Yesterday, you latched on to my theory about Jingolaw being the SK. I had very good reasons to suspect him, you just followed me onto the bandwagon. Pbug had a good reason to vote for him, he WAS the serial killer... he was motivated by death! You didn't bring anything else to the table, you just followed me, agreeing with what I said, like you have for the whole game. I wish I would have paid more attention to your quick vote on him after I voted. I think you are scum. Do you still agree with my logic?

[CoG888]

I would like comments from other players before I say anything more.

[CoG888]

OK then, I think you are scum, and I think you had something to do with TSQ's death. So, what were you doing with him last night?

[CoG888]

Vote: Panzerjager

I don't buy that claim. Here is why.

I am a tracker. (I am a kitten, flavor wise). I tracked Pbug night one, and came up with nothing. Because the serial killer struck that night, logically I eliminated Pbug from being the SK, which explains my defense of him. He could still be scum, which explains why I wanted to be clear on Jingolaw's accusation of him being the serial killer or scum.

When he came up as serial killer, it was evident that I was role blocked night one. But you say you blocked Ripley night one. So logically you must be false claiming.

FYI, I tracked Elias night 2, and he didn't do anything. I don't think I was blocked again, as only one kill was made, but he may still have been non-killing scum. No clear info on him yet.

[CoG888]

Panzer being scum is far more likely then two roleblockers, IMO.

[CoG888]

If you can't commit to the game, please request a replacement.

[CoG888]

I targeted Pbug night one, no result
I targeted Elias night two, no result
I targeted Panzer night three, he targeted TSQ (who died that night)

Gaurdian, I really don't like your tone. You come out swinging before you even read the thread. No lynch? Why would you even suggest that before reading the game? Directing night kills? What, are you fishing for more power roles?

You and Panzer could be Scum together.

[CoG888]

I am

really

bothered by this accusation:

You (cog) said Panzer must be the mafia role blocker...

No, Gaurdian, I

NEVER

said that. You are lying. You are accusing me of saying something I never said. I flat out said that I did not believe Panzer's claim of role blocker. No where did I say he was a "mafia roleblocker" which seems to be the key to your delusional theory.

[CoG888]

I am now very confused as to how you got no result on PBug. How do you explain this?

Gaurdian: Read my post where I claimed again, You will find the answer to your question.

I am not unvoting. I think we found scum. Elias, Gaurdian is not cleared, he may be reluctant to bus his buddy panzer.

Makes sense that Panzer is scum with 3 votes... No one has hammered, If Panzer was a townie scum would have hammered already.

Gaurdian: If Elias had relevant information to claim with, he would have by now. He doesn't need your last-minute-role-fishing, and neither does the town.

[CoG888]

Gaurdian: You want a mass claim?

You start it.

[CoG888]

Unvote

need to read past 567...

[CoG888]

Elias: If you can provide an insight on the "PJ tracked TSQ" fact that suggests to me that he is scum, I might be inclined to change my vote. We can deal with PJ tomorrow.

And, I don't think I mentioned this before, but I thought PJ saying 'TSQ might be a godfather' was a load of BS, especially when most of the town thought TSQ to be confirmed townie and there were other scummier people to roleblock, like Jingolaw.

[CoG888]

No lynching today is looking more and more appealing, as the scum will likely remove another scum possibility, and it will be easier for the town to make an informed decision.

With claimed power roles out, we will lose a power role, and lose the information they may have to add.

FOS:Gaurdian

for suggesting a very bad play. (I think Jack brought the idea up as hypothetical)

[CoG888]

I know I unvoted last page... Skruff's incorrect vote count confused me, which is why I thought I was still voting PJ in 585.

Unvote: Panzerjager

because I already did last page, and because PJ and I must be missing part of the big picture. From my POV, he is lying, but until more info comes to light, I can't be positive.

You mortals confuse me - the vote count takes your unvote at the end of the last page into account. You were not voting before this post - were you?

[CoG888]

There were quite a few things I learned going through the re-read, but I don't want to share them at this time, as it will only help your confederate decide who to NK.

You are just itching to call out other power roles in this game, aren't you? All that pressure for mass claiming, and now this statement...

Vote: Gaurdian

.
Right now I am thinking the scum pair is PJ and Gaurdian.

[CoG888]

Why are you scum? BECAUSE WE ARE AT LYLO, I HAD A CHANCE TO HAMMER YOU, I DIDN'T HAMMER YOU, AND YOU ARE STILL TRYING TO CAST SUSPICION ON ME. DOCTOR OR NOT, THE PLAY IF I AM SCUM WAS OBVIOUSLY TO HAMMER YOU IN A REASONABLE SOUNDING FASHION, AND THEN GET A NK OFF, PUTTING THE TOWN AT 2-2, and a SCUM WIN.

Total WIFOM here, Gaurdian. You need a stronger case against someone to lynch at this stage of the game.

[CoG888]

You are ignoring the possibility of a second roleblocker or a doctor. If either of those roles exist, and play correctly tonight, we can still win. You are NOT cleared just because you didn't hammer.

[CoG888]

Sorry, Gaurdian. I had so many doubts about panzer in the back of my mind due to being half-wrong about pbug.

Panzer: Remember when I said I thought you were scummy, and when I re-read I changed my mind about you as I couldn't find a strong case against you? Actually, I thought you were the doctor at that point. Then, I read in the wiki that if someone has a power role and thinks another player is a doctor, that player is likely to be scum. I then realized you were scum and that you had to be on to me as a power role. I fully expected to be capped that night, so I targeted you night three. I wish I played better after that point. Curious, did you suspect me to have a power role at that point?