Open 10 -- C9: Game Over! - before 400

[ChannelDelibird]

Allow me to explain, although this is later than I was hoping.

First off,

unvote: No Lynch

.

Spectrumvoid - yes, there were 5 pages of arguments or whatever there. But don't you think this game could use 5 pages of serious discussion? That's why I did that, to stir up discussion.

Ripley - I intend to post those lessons in every newbie game I IC in, because I believe them. I had no intention whatsoever of going through with a No Lynch today, but I wanted to see what people would say.

So while I expect to get some votes for this, it should at least get us going.

I was going to vote Spectrumvoid for not being concerned with the actual night-and-day implications of a No Lynch, but I think I probably misread that, looking at it a second time.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Silly Channel, when will you learn?

[Fritzler]

unvote, vote: delibird

[ChannelDelibird]

Silly Channel, when will you learn?

Probably when one of you or Fritzler hammers me.

But at least I tried.

Mod:

could we have a vote count please?

[IH]

.... = | If CES AND Fritz wasn't here I'd put you at -1. (I dunno if he'd actually do it, but I don't wanna risk it)

Seriously. I keep expressing why I hate this phrase

But don't you think this game could use 5 pages of serious discussion? That's why I did that, to stir up discussion.

It's a catchall phrase that can cover anything you do, and is essentially a way out WHICH I DON'T LIKE.

[ChannelDelibird]

.... = | If CES AND Fritz wasn't here I'd put you at -1. (I dunno if he'd actually do it, but I don't wanna risk it)

Seriously. I keep expressing why I hate this phrase

But don't you think this game could use 5 pages of serious discussion? That's why I did that, to stir up discussion.

It's a catchall phrase that can cover anything you do, and is essentially a way out WHICH I DON'T LIKE.

I agree, it's scummy. But I'd prefer for me to be scummy and therefore there be some discussion than for the game to fall flat on its face because nobody is saying anything.

[Ripley]

I can understand someone wanting to get discussion going, but this does seem like a weird way to go about it. Whether CDB is scum or town, I can't see what he hoped to achieve other than a load of people yelling that he was scummy.

But don't you think this game could use 5 pages of serious discussion? That's why I did that, to stir up discussion.

Yes, but surely the whole issue of no-lynch on Day 1 with this particular setup has been discussed to death already? It's one of the standard things discussed on Day 1 of newbie games, why no-lynching is a bad idea. So was anybody ever going to support it in this game? If not, what kind of discussion would you expect?

So while I expect to get some votes for this, it should at least get us going.

"I expect to get some votes" - seems a very casual attitude to be taking in a game where you only need 4 to be lynched. Especially if you're pro town, it seems reckless to be presenting scum with a soft excuse to vote you.

[Patrick]

Heh. A vote for no lynch. I'm not going to pounce all over him, though I think it's always bad play to do something you believe is scummy. I don't think CDB would be more likely to do this as scum.

[IH]

.......eeehhhh

unvote, vote:Ripley

DEADLINE STOPPER!

I don't know about Ripley just offering up his opinions like this. I don't see to much actual... suspicion or whatnot, just wanting to know what he thought he would accomplish.

I still don't like the excuse. = |

I'm not sure how scummy I think CDB is. Mostly I believe him on starting conversation, mostly from the wording, and then it doesn't seem to be a frustrated unvote from it.

igmeoy:SV

[Ripley]

I don't know about Ripley just offering up his opinions like this. I don't see to much actual... suspicion or whatnot, just wanting to know what he thought he would accomplish.

You're voting me for

offering opinions

? Well, that's a first...

What exactly is your problem with my post? I have reservations about CDB's use of the No lynch issue and about his somewhat casual attitude to picking up votes in such a small game. So I posted these reservations. What on earth am I supposed to want to

accomplish

, other than contributing my thoughts? If you disagree with what I said, ok, let's discuss that, but you seem to be objecting to the fact that I said anything at all.

Would you have objected less if I'd voted for CDB? A bit hypocritical if so, since you yourself were unwilling to risk putting CDB at lynch -1.

[IH]

No, it's more... more than a random vote. Also, I feel a little more inclined to believe CDB more now that I've gone over the wording of his initial post.

[spectrumvoid]

FOS: IH.

I totally didn't understand his post, which is very un-IH. It smells to me like an excuse to vote Ripley. I don't think discussion is a scum-tell, it's lurking/non-commitalness which is a scum-tell.

Ripley: I didn't realise you were Ripley because you changed your avatar.

[Ripley]

I totally didn't understand his post, which is very un-IH.

Actually I've seen this in other games lately, IH making posts that are hard to understand and being wildly incoherent and voting for what seem like absurd reasons, and in one at least he turned out to be town.

So although I think his reason for voting me is

totally

absurd, I'm not at this stage going to vote him back. Though if he keeps on dropping hints like "it's more than a random vote" without actually saying why, that may change.

I like my vote on Fritzler, because he's contributed absolutely nothing.

[Patrick]

Hmm yeah weird move by IH. Not necessarily scummy as I usually see IH in my minds eye going for the easier targets as scum, and I don't think Ripley has done anything to make himself an easy target, but still needs explaining better.

[IH]

I just got kind of a weird vibe from his post. Kind of noncomittal, kind of... I dunno.

If gameplay was picking up I wouldn't have said anything about it, which is where post 85 came from.

BAMBAMBAM

Sorry, trying to call Fritz for some posting.

[spectrumvoid]

Hmm yeah weird move by IH. Not necessarily scummy as I usually see IH in my minds eye going for the easier targets as scum

Possibly wifomish. (Only possibly though, I agree that IH scum could choose easier targets.)

Actually I've seen this in other games lately, IH making posts that are hard to understand and being wildly incoherent and voting for what seem like absurd reasons, and in one at least he turned out to be town.

Metagaming. I don't think IH can be metagamed. I've played many games with him and I can't say he has a consistent playstyle.

Clarification: Just pointing out flaws in the argument here, I don't really think IH is that scummy at the moment.

[Ripley]

If what Patrick is saying is that in his

experience

, not just in his mind's eye, IH as scum goes for easy targets, then that's a valid and possibly useful comment.

I don't think IH can be metagamed. I've played many games with him and I can't say he has a consistent playstyle.

Just because you personally haven't found a way to distinguish between IH-as-Town and IH-As-Scum, I don't think that's a good enough reason to dismiss the notion altogether.

Every completed game I've been in with him (3), he was town. Patrick seems to have had the opposite experience. It's not out of the question that we might learn something useful by comparing notes, though it's an approach that should be treated with caution.

One more thing about IH is that when I (and you, spectrumvoid) played with him in that first newbie game, it was his first game and he devoted a lot of time and care to it. Now he's in a

lot

of games and spreading himself very thinly, and it shows. So some differences in playstyle I would attribute to that.

[Patrick]

If what Patrick is saying is that in his experience, not just in his mind's eye, IH as scum goes for easy targets, then that's a valid and possibly useful comment.

Yes, possibly experience is better than saying minds eye there. I'm not sure if it's IH specific what I'm saying, so much as a feeling that scum in general go for the easy targets. In attacking you like that, he did something which he most likely knew would attract attention, since his post looked really weird, like an attempt to put a gut feeling into words where he pretty much didn't make anything coherent.

[spectrumvoid]

I get where the 2 of you are coming from. I still disagree. I am not referring only to the newbie game. Probably the difference is I've played with IH in almost every game he's played here, and I've seen him as town, as scum, and as a whole lot of other roles. If I remember correctly, we've also been scum buddies/masons or some kind of 'group' roles. I take notes on players I've played more than a handful of games with, and he's inconsistent.

[Patrick]

What are your notes on me?

[spectrumvoid]

I'm not telling. It might affect the way you play in future. I don't use metagaming solely as a reason to attack or defend, but it helps me quite a bit in endgame. You do feature quite a bit in my notes though, along with Zindaras and IH.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

What about me?

[IH]

CES's meta.

Vote
Vote
Vote
Nugget of wisdom
Good play
vote
vote
HAMMAH
Day2
Rinse, repeat

= )

[spectrumvoid]

I totally didn't understand his post, which is very un-IH.

Just thought I'd clarify this. This has nothing to do with playstyle or whatever. This has to do with IH being a long poster, and me having a headache reading his posts.

[spectrumvoid]

*pokes*