Mini 388: DOOMsville II {Game Over!}

[klebian]

The order is fine, but I don't see a consensus on massclaiming at all. It seems like you're trying to make it seem as if we agreed on a massclaim without anyone else saying they wanted to.

[ShadowLurker]

The order is fine, but I don't see a consensus on massclaiming at all. It seems like you're trying to make it seem as if we agreed on a massclaim without anyone else saying they wanted to.

Well Patrick and kilmenator did not raise any objects, we've gotten a partial claim from MBL and kilmeantor already. Do you object to one? If you don't, the only objecting people might be Turbovolver who's 2nd to last and geraintm, who hasn't been making any contribution at all.

[Adele]

I'll need to think a bit about it (sorry, I'm in a hurry but I think that this is all moving very fast so if I want you to know my concerns I've got to raise them not), but my knee-jerk reaction is that a mass-claim does not seem like a great idea right now, necessarily.

I'd like to put in a tentative

objection to a mass-claim

; I might withdraw that later, but I'm not liking your steamrolling, SL, although I do think you're town - I think you're being too enthusiastic,

[ShadowLurker]

Ok, I may be a bit overenthusiastic as I think we have the game won =/ Perhaps it might be better to take it slow and let me get a few more investigations?


MBL and kilmenator: Do any of you have information that can be used to basically break the game?

[MrBuddyLee]

Kil can apparently only confirm my night target, at least that's what it reads like. Problem is, there could be other explanations for the lack of nightkill besides my action. So I don't see any way to confirm me or the alignment of my target today. Kil appears protown due to "enthusiasm" alone--a tracking role could theoretically be scum.

If ShadowLurker realizes his last remaining scumpartner got caught making a kill, this could be his best move. Establish trust with the townies he confirms and "believe" the claims of the others. Lynch the unclaimed/unconfirmed. The final scum will probably need to get us to make three mislynches in order to win. I'd bet on SL being town, but it's not a certainty.

Massclaim? Pie would be proud of you for proposing it, but I think it's a tad premature.

[geraintm]

Hello all, am here. It went to day on Friday and i rarely post at weekends. So my lack of posting so far is the reason for that, not that i have been lurking.
Firstly, seems like so far this game couldn't have gone any better for townies. Got godfather day one through fluke, and then no kills last night.

Now, on with the game.
This is my first game outside the newbie room, so never been involved in a mass claim before. Not sure how to proceed, but i wouldn't want to be rushed into anything.
Right now, i'd like to to just plain lynch up Ozy again and let all the cops keep on going. If we have two cops and presumably only one night kill to worry about from the mafia, we will get at least one more investigation and possibly two if no one dies overnight. And even getting somone killed overnight is as good as an investigation.

[Ozymandius]

Nanyate?!?!?! You want to attempt to lynch me... again? Ohhh I see... You want to lynch me right now, to bring the day into night, then have cops investigate into the night. I didn't quite understand that at first. For a second there, I thought you were trying to kill me... like yesterday... I think it shortens the day, and the chance for disscusion. If there are innocent results we may not have too much to go on later. Plus, just because there was no night kill doesn't mean that there can't be more than one night kill. I think that this mass role claim idea is an important thing to think about whether or not it is implemented, speaking of which...

I suppose I wasn't quite clear, maybe more thinking aloud before, but I am objecting to a mass claim at this point. SL's enthusiasm for one is interesting, but I'm not sure that the idea is nessecary, or helpful at this point in time, plus I certainly didn't see a consensus anyway. The lack of respose isn't nessesarally a thumbs up. Turbo has not mentioned his thoughts on this subject, and he doesn't strike me as someone who would have difficulty voicing his opinions.

[Adele]

Seems to me that, in a balanced game, mafia have the advantage in night-choices and town in day-choices, so throwing the lynch away (btw, we could just as easily go to night by voting "no lynch") seems foolhardy to me, regardless of whether we have 2 cops or (much more commonly in a mini) just the one.

[Patrick]

We should not rush into a massclaim. Looking at how the claims are going, and looking at the previous Doomsville game, I would be prepared to bet that everyone has a powerole of some sort. Getting a load of claims out there will create a bit of a mess. The other problem is that any elaborate plans we put together may be messed up if the mafia have certain abilities too (which seems quite likely to me if we really are all non vanilla). For example, say we all claim, and a doc claim is part of that. If the mafia have a roleblocker, all they would need to do tonight is block the doc and kill Shadowlurker. And we've lost our daycop without any real benefit.

My thinking is that kilmenator and Shadowlurker are probably town, as MBL said, down to enthusiasm alone. I'm pretty sure scum would not be falling over themselves to come out and give a fakeclaim, unless they thought they had an absolutely amazing one. But in this case they seem enthusiastic to come out and break the game wide open for the town.

I'm thinking that possibly if another cop exists they should come out, with everyone's consent. If one does come out, we would know that one of the cops is likely not sane, and we could work on sorting which one is. If no other cop comes out then Shadowlurker is likely sane.

And about lynching Ozy, well I agree if we planned to no lynch then that would be the way to do it (rules out Ozy being one shot unlynchable scum), but it's not clear that we should be doing that at all yet.

[geraintm]

Seems to me that, in a balanced game, mafia have the advantage in night-choices and town in day-choices, so throwing the lynch away (btw, we could just as easily go to night by voting "no lynch") seems foolhardy to me, regardless of whether we have 2 cops or (much more commonly in a mini) just the one.

Ozy - sorry if i seemed like i was advocating going to a lynch you right now, but if i remember i think i was the one who voted last for your lynch yesterday because i was very hapyp then in testing your claim and seeing what exactly we could get from the night. We seem to have got two cop investigations and no deaths.
Right now, i think we as a town would gain more from testing your claim again (because like someone else said, i am not for saying you are town 100%, i could see you as a scum who could get saved once) and seeing what our cops will tell us and if anyone turns up dead.

Adele - voting no lynch is much, much worse than lynching Ozy assuming his claim is true.

[Adele]

Adele - voting no lynch is much, much worse than lynching Ozy assuming his claim is true.

??? I followed your point up to here - and you had a fair point. But this, I don't get at all. If Ozy's claim is

true

, how is lynching him functionally different from no-lynching? Or was that a typo; did you mean "a lie"?

[Patrick]

Lynching him, or attempting to confirms him even more.

[Machiavellian-Mafia]

Every player has posted since the start of Day 2, so no prods are needed at the moment.

[geraintm]

Adele - voting no lynch is much, much worse than lynching Ozy assuming his claim is true.

??? I followed your point up to here - and you had a fair point. But this, I don't get at all. If Ozy's claim is

true

, how is lynching him functionally different from no-lynching? Or was that a typo; did you mean "a lie"?

if ozy's claim is true, then there is no difference between the two.
If Ozy's claim isn't true, it makes every bit of difference.
I would hope that even Ozy wouldn't mind us testing his claim a second time if the situation arose.

[ShadowLurker]

If ShadowLurker realizes his last remaining scumpartner got caught making a kill, this could be his best move. Establish trust with the townies he confirms and "believe" the claims of the others. Lynch the unclaimed/unconfirmed. The final scum will probably need to get us to make three mislynches in order to win. I'd bet on SL being town, but it's not a certainty.

Except if we massclaimed like I originally suggested, that trust would probably be blown right out of the water if I was lying

---

We should not be lynching Ozy unless we have decided on a No Lynch. I do not believe a No Lynch is the best way to proceed. Right now I am content with a

Unvote Vote geraintm

to see where that leads us

[Turbovolver]

I don't know about this mass claim stuff. I can see the

potential

to break the game open but that's only if things fall the right way, and it has the downisde of exposing the doc with a claimed cop already out there. Is it really worth leaving things to luck?
Also ShadowLurker I didn't understand your ordering post at all, it looked like there were three sepearate lists

[Turbovolver]

Vote: klebian

He's scum.

[klebian]

well, considering the fact that i'm not,

fos: turbovolver

...?

[MrBuddyLee]

Kilmenator, I have a question for you.

You knew there was no kill last night, you knew my night target, and yet you assumed I was scum? Can you please explain why you jumped to that conclusion based on your result? It just struck me that your decision doesn't make a lot of sense.

[ShadowLurker]

Unvote Vote klebian

[klebian]

Er, is this because turbo claims I'm scum?

[kilmenator]

MBL- in my opinion i have found your play to be scummy. when i asked about your role, i assumed you would claim townie. i also assumed who scum would target last night and after i said what i did, i realized not only scum would target him but others also. Obviously someone else targetted the victim as well, so I was not sure in my own mind whether or not you were scum or something else. So, with all the being said, when you said you were not a vanilla, I layed off because now I know what your role is. Maybe it was stupid of me, because I was assuming you were scum all along and that just fueled my fire, but I realize now I was wrong. Sorry about that.

[Ozymandius]

ShadowLurker, is a vote on Klebian where the Geraintm vote led to?

[ShadowLurker]

ShadowLurker, is a vote on Klebian where the Geraintm vote led to?

A single vote = No pressure and does not help


I'd like everybody to start saying who they think is scummy and why as I'm reasonably sure we can get this game over tommorow if we make informed decisions.

[Ozymandius]

Tommorow, wow, you seem pretty confident. The pressure thing is true, but why the pressure on Klebian?