Space Monkey Mafia: GAME OVER!

[Thok]

I'm not happy with what I'm seeing from Zindaras.

unvote PJ, FOS PJ, vote Zindaras

[Zindaras]

I'm not happy with what I'm seeing from Zindaras.

unvote PJ, FOS PJ, vote Zindaras

Hmm? I've expressed my suspicion against inHim before. What's so bad about my posting?

[klebian]

<snip>bird would still be alive, and therefore more useful to your scum group than if he were dead. Town would have to waste a Day just to get back to lynching bird, therefore giving the scum a near free pass and extra Night. Even better, a cop might have thought to investigate bird, and that would have been a wasted investigation if the Town were going to try and lynch bird again. It may have even exposed the cop if he couldn't keep his results to himself. <snip>

You're trying to blame the possibility of a cop exposing himself over a person we were going to lynch the next day anyway on him? The hammer was going to happen. You can say that this is not known at the time, but there was no evidence supporting bird, and if some evidence did turn up, many people would unvote, and you wouldn't be able to blame pj for our having the opportunity to not lynch him. That means that any decent innocent

would

hammer because it had already been reiterated that no lynch is worse than lynch a scummy person who's not been posting.

If a cop had decided to investigate bird, he might have decided to reveal his results the next day... I don't agree with this in entirety. There aren't many cops who won't keep their results to themselves unless they are in a good position to reveal. You're assuming that the cop could be dumb enough to investigate someone we were trying to lynch but failed due to deadline, and then even reveal results the next day, which he wouldn't have got the opportunity to do, most likely, as bird would've been wagoned again.

The case for inhim is stronger than the case for pj. I don't like inhim's attacks on pj. Vote: Inhim

No. Just... no. Could you please go back and look at the context - PJ asked what possible advantages there were for not voting against bird if they are scum together. I then listed possible advantages.

I am in no way laying any blame.

Do you see any blaming? No, it's just me answering a question.

And then you make assumptions for me. Again, did I say these things were going to happen? No, I was just answering a hypothetical question.

What do you not like about my attacks? What about them merits my vote?

In essence, what I saw was hypothetical blame. You're not really answering everything I said. I agreed that bird

would

have been hammered regardless of pj's vote, which you can't dismiss and call it irrelevant for this case. By your post, I see you saying that had pj not voted bird, bird wouldn't have been lynched. Because of this, a cop could've exposed himself in the effort of lynching someone we were going to lynch anyway. This is basically blaming pj for something that could've been a side-effect of his not voting bird.

I don't like your constant reiteration of how saying is not doing, etc. When he brings up that he said he would do something, you counter with the fact that he DIDN'T actually do it. Well, he said he would do it when no lynch was the only other option. We never got there. How would his not putting his vote on bird help him if they were scumbuddies? You seem to have answered this, but I don't really agree.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I see what Zind is doing and I don't think it's scummy, personally. Thok needs to explain.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

vote Klebian

Death to Gorilla Scum!

[Thok]

Zindaras, it's more for your setup speculation then for your inhim vote (although I don't like that either)

[Zindaras]

Zindaras, it's more for your setup speculation then for your inhim vote (although I don't like that either)

Ah. I see. Sorry, but if I see only one death for two nights, and suddenly, one of them is scum, even though the doc is already dead, I will be thinking more than just "yay".

I specifically said "But, as you say, let's work with what we have."

I'm not going to let my theory influence my play until we get more proof of it. I just think it's best to throw it out as quickly as possible, so people will be able to use it later on.

And I'm not voting inHim either, I'm just saying I'm not against hammering him. I'm voting Masterchief.

[Mr Stoofer]

Vote Count

inHimshallibe: 4 (Twito, STD, Fritzler, klebian)
petroleumjelly: 3 (CES, inHimshallibe, dahen)
Mastercheif: 1 (Zinderas)
Zinderas: 1 (Thok)
klebian: 1 (Pooky)

Eight to throw someone out of the airlock.

[inHimshallibe]

klebian, I can see we're going to run this hypothetical discussion into the ground. I can understand you may not agree with everything that I proposed as possible, because we are dealing with a hypothetical situation. I just don't see how you can justify a vote based upon my proposed possibilities.

At the moment, I don't see how the angle that Zindaras is taking at the game's setup is in any way misleading, so I don't think that's worthy of suspicion. However, his constant reminder that he wouldn't mind a lynch of me is giving off some bad vibes - not the fact that it's

me

he wouldn't mind see lynched, but that it seems he goes out of his way to mention it.

[Zindaras]

I like making my stance on people clear. It prevents me from getting screwed over later on for not saying things clearly. I'll agree I may have said it a bit too often this time around, though.

[klebian]

Zindaras, it's more for your setup speculation then for your inhim vote (although I don't like that either)

I agree with inhim. Do you not wonder why a gorilla was killed last night?

[Glork]

Well I know I wonder... but I doubt that the town is going to reach a general consensus today. And even if we did, I don't see it helping us find scum right now. A couple more days down the road, when there are more nights and more bodies, we can try to figure out why a Gorilla died. But right now? I don't see us getting much use out of the speculation. We likely won't arrive at a useful conclusion, and we may just end up being misled, whether intentionally or not.

[Phoebus]

Eh...I missed the restart...

Give me a little time to catch up please.

[Zindaras]

Well I know I wonder... but I doubt that the town is going to reach a general consensus today. And even if we did, I don't see it helping us find scum right now. A couple more days down the road, when there are more nights and more bodies, we can try to figure out why a Gorilla died. But right now? I don't see us getting much use out of the speculation. We likely won't arrive at a useful conclusion, and we may just end up being misled, whether intentionally or not.

That's pretty much what I said (let's ignore it until we get more information). I just wanted the theory to be out there, because I have quite the track record for dying.

[Mr Stoofer]

Nightson has been prodded.

Having already made 4 replacements, I am likely to start modkilling players who go 7 days or more without posting, without giving me prior warning.

Click here

for the current Vote Count.

[Twito]

Sorry haven't been able to check the thread for a couple of days.

First night we had dead doctor and only one nightkill. This could be becouse vigilante was unable to kill night 1.
Secound night we only have one nightkill and this time the one dying is mafia.

There could be various reasons for this as I think it was Glork mentioned. I don't see much advance coming from trying to find the reason for this yet. We simply need more information. But it could show up useful later on so better keep it on mind. We might be able to catch scum based on who roleblocker blocked or confirm the vigilante who mostlikely made the kill.

[inHimshallibe]

Zindaras, it's more for your setup speculation then for your inhim vote (although I don't like that either)

I agree with inhim. Do you not wonder why a gorilla was killed last night?

Not exactly what I was meaning, but the sentiment is understood.

[Nightson]

Don't like the PJ wagon or the inhim wagon.

[Thok]

Zindaras, it's more for your setup speculation then for your inhim vote (although I don't like that either)

I agree with inhim. Do you not wonder why a gorilla was killed last night?

My worry about Zindaras is more of a "Why did he leap to the idea that MBL was a traitor?" It suggests he might have extra knowledge of the setup.

I do agree that it seems likely that MBL was vigged rather than killed by scum; for example, the kill types for the two night kills are different styles (one left a charred body, while the other was a complete vaporization.)

[Twito]

Don't like the PJ wagon or the inhim wagon.

Even though those are the two biggest wagons you obviously can consider voting someone else aswell

[Zindaras]

My worry about Zindaras is more of a "Why did he leap to the idea that MBL was a traitor?" It suggests he might have extra knowledge of the setup.

I do agree that it seems likely that MBL was vigged rather than killed by scum; for example, the kill types for the two night kills are different styles (one left a charred body, while the other was a complete vaporization.)

Doc's dead, and I don't see roleblocker as a viable option. And I did think of the roleblocker option, yes. The reason why I didn't state it was because, if my theory is correct, it changes quite a bit for who is scummy and who is not.

I don't think a vig would kill MBL. I honestly thought he was town. That's why I crossed away that option. Leaving me with an SK, which then made my wonder why there weren't 2 kills Night One.

[Phoebus]

vote: Twito

Unless play has changed drastically around here since last I played, I do not like the content of his last post but one.

[inHimshallibe]

vote: Twito
Unless play has changed drastically around here since last I played, I do not like the content of his last post but one.

Easy on the Nyquil, buddy.

[Glork]

Ibby only had 12 posts, and in those twelve posts, she managed to finger or vote for:
1.) MrBuddyLee
2.) Bird1111
3.) klebian
4.) Glork
5.) Nightson

Of course, if you look at

when

those votes occurred, you'll see that the first three of them came in the first 50 posts of the game. Ibby will hunt around looking for a place to vote until she thinks she can make it stick. And when she finds such a place, she pretty much looks for reasons to continue justifying her vote. Consider her play in Road to Perdition Mafia (Her posts can be found here) where she settled on TB fairly early and then found a miryad of small reasons to continue pressuring TB. I felt she did the same thing to me.

Take, for example, the following post pieces by Ibby:

We're currently talking about how you are scummy for attempting to quash discussion, became overly defensive when it was pointed out, and that you appear to possibly have knowledge about people's alignments. So yes, if you wanted to turn the discussion into suspicion of yourself, you've done a good job. Also, your statement here is a twisting of the truth since I never said or implicated anything of the sort. I think that's pretty scummy.

I totally cut you a break for the initial off the wall behavior because I know that. The whole Nightson/Bogre voting error thing is not something I'm going to ignore though. Also, your off the wall behavior at the start of games is likely not indicative of your alignment, so attempting to use it as some sort of proof that you're pro-town fails.

Rough translation: "I'm justifying my vote by re-stating why I think you're scummy. Also, I'm going to tack on another reason to 'believe' that you're being scummy or not-pro-town."

That is hardly what I call “tunnel vision”. Try comparing Ibby’s posts to InHim’s posts. Seriously. Click the “view all posts” function and tell me what you see. Ibby was by no means focusing on one person. Simply because she remained suspicious of one person, that does not mean she was focusing on one person.

I used "tunnel vision" as a fairly loose term. For Ibby, repeatedly going "I like my vote" while making a few side-comments (note: each of which, in some way, related to me) is pretty much being tunnel-visioned. She's going to stay where she is until the lynch she's pushing either goes through or she finds a more suitable candidate.

Yesterday, I only had about one or two real-life days to do anything. I was not “ignoring the situation”; I was very much aware of the situation. I was willing to hammer Bird1111 if it looked like the alternative was No-Lynch. There was pretty much no way I could have ever successfully got a competing wagon out of Nightson had I tried, and to think I would seriously try to “stop” the Bird1111 by employing such a weak strategy is bogus. I believe I have covered my explanation of this (so far as it is ‘necessary’) throughout this post.

I disagree with this completely. Both inHim and I decided we wanted to try to push MBL-lynches. We actually got a little bit of momentum before people went (back) to Bird. I would definitely say that, at the very least, I was trying to get MBL lynched

instead

of Bird. I guessed that you were doing roughly the same thing. Stir up some attention somewhere else and see if you can get people going elsewhere with this thing.

[Glork]

Oh, and

Vote: PJ

I meant to do that at the end of the last post.